Couldn’t agree more. It’s saddening that Ole isn’t getting the team to win but we have to be ruthless. I hear a lot of people say we have a small club mentality but do the big clubs let a manager who isn’t winning games stay around? Do people really think if City were free falling towards the relegation places under pep that they owners would wait that long to sack him? And if Klopp has started the season at Liverpool the way he did his last at Dortmund would FSG keep him around? We (regardless of what’s happening at board level) need to change our manager now.
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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They may be our most hated rivals, but do not discredit the work FSG have done. They had a plan and stuck to it. More than what Glazer's have.
Also, Chelsea have won the league twice since saf retired, it wasn't by luck and nor is there current set up by luck.
Ok, let me ask you this - Ed goes, who do you think replaces him?
Would it be again some finance guy considering this is a CEO position?
Would that make Ole less incompetent at managing the team?
Few things: firstly, our football was shite even with a full strength team, go back to last season and the beginning of this season. Once teams realised we have no idea how to play football outside of counter attacking, both the quality of our play and the results took a nosedive and hasn't recovered since.
Secondly, as I've already pointed out, with examples, might I add, you don't need a squad of great players to play good, progressive stuff. Unless you think this squad is no better than relegation fodder as even those teams play better stuff than we do.
Players like Fred etc. looked much better playing for lesser teams, so no, I don't agree with that rubbish either. He looks shite, because we are shite. He's supposed to be a progressive midfielder, but is more often than not isolated, with no movement around him. Is he a great player? Maybe not. Is he much better than what we've seen of him here, if utilised and coached properly? Not a doubt.
Pep's City are struggling, but it's in part down to the defence. They are still playing great stuff and the movement, link up play, passing etc. is in a completely different universe to ours, it's not even comparable, even with all those injuries.
You're arguing a straw-mans argument bringing up winning games. That was never even mentioned. This has nothing to do with winning games, this has to do with seeing any semblance of progress when if anything, the longer we seem to be under Ole, the worse we are getting. Players may win games, but it's managers who improve players both collectively and individually and there has been no signs of that at all under Ole, with our football and our players both seemingly regressing under his tutelage. Simply put, we aren't getting the results OR seeing any signs of progress, we are going backwards if anything. There is nothing to suggest he's even remotely close to good enough for us.
Yeah I didn't think we'd look quite this pathetic either - but there's been some bad luck (missed penalties and clear-cut chances) and also a lot of injuries. These last games have seen us fielding our reserves pretty much - in half the positions at least. De Gea and Maguire are the only top-class players out there these days - and even though I rate Rashford, James and McTominay quality prospects with great futures ahead of them - we should be honest enough to say that ten years ago they'd be considered little more than squad players. It's telling of this side how much we have to rely on still developing youngsters to carry us. So yeah under these circumstances I'm not puzzled at all as to why our game collapses in the final third - if anything I'm actually surprised of how solid we've been in possession and also how structured our defense is considering Maguire and DeGea being our only real first team players.
That being said though - and this is where Solskjaer baffles me a bit - Fred? What the feck? Why does he keep fielding this guy? He's as useless as they come - he's disruptive of play and contributes little except mind-baffling blunders game out and game in. I mean Matic may not be ideal - a bit past it sure but he's never looked as hopeless as Fred. I'm pretty sure anyone is better than that guy. The same with Mata - even though I won't call him useless - it's also clear he's no longer cut for this level. He's not producing - plain and simple despite trying his hardest - and I'm convinced any youngster would make for a better option (yeah once more it's telling of this side how much we have to rely on newly promoted kids).
So yeah I am not sold on Solskjaer and his crew being shit - I believe it's circumstances dictating our misfortune more so than the coaching staff - but like I said I am starting to think he might be a tag too gullible - naive even - to administer this clean-up operation (as that's what it is). Too concerned with player personalities and being everyone's friend - and always looking for positives even when we're neck-down buried in feces. I'm not seeing a lot of pragmatism and this worries me because you can actually achieve that without becoming a toxic influence. You don't have to go all Mourinho to call a spade a spade - it can be handled more maturely. I see this during games too - you see him distraught and you see him resigned - but I've yet to see him angry even when it's clear to everyone his players are completely off their game letting him and everyone present down. For someone occupied with the legacy of Ferguson - you'd think assertiveness was a bigger part of his repertoire.
But then again I guess you can't change personality either because if it feels forced people will consider you a fraud and not take you serious anyways. One must either be true to oneself or a really good liar - and I doubt Ole is a very good liar so he needs to be true to himself. And I can't fault him for it - I can't fault anyone for being a good person - but it could be his undoing. I believe his principles to be sound - and I believe he's acted quite competent when it comes to most decisions so far - but whether or not I'm right about these things and whether or not our current state is more down to circumstances or his influence - I also believe he definitely needs to nut up if he is to make it.
There are simply too many people in this squad who shouldn't be here - and it's not his job to befriend them it's his job to get us winning again.
Wonder who we'd have got if Ole didn't do so well initially as interim?
Liverpool up next and the team and the crowd should be up for it. A 2-0 win shouldn't mean the pressure is off, nor should a 2-0 defeat mean he is out. A 4 or 5 goal defeat worries me and that could only mean one thing.
How on earth can David Moyes` entry as United manager be compared to that of Ole brought in after 3 managers and upheaval plus too many questionable signings of mercenaries and players that could not cohere as a team in the real sense under Mourinho?
Moyes didn`t have Sanchez for a start, he didn`t have that list of players collected by Mourinho, many of whom had no resemblance to the successful United teams of the recent past. Completely different context for Ole.
Are you though? Judging by the rest of your comments calling people spoilt princesses it seems that you infact are in denial mate.
The fact of the matter is that our players are not league 2 players. Some of our players were world beaters when they’re up for it, some are average at best, and some are definitely still good enough eventhough they might be a little older now. This group of players should still be able to compete even at the mid table level. We made Newcastle look a mid table team when they were in the bottom 3 before we played them.
we simply have too many players who have no character, no fight, no care for playing for our club, and when going gets tough, hide behind the sacking of the manager. Some would even leak stories to help to move the sacking along. We have too many rotten players in the dressing room.
all the above in addition to a naive, inexperienced manager and coaching staff.
we simply have too many players who have no character, no fight, no care for playing for our club, and when going gets tough, hide behind the sacking of the manager. Some would even leak stories to help to move the sacking along. We have too many rotten players in the dressing room.
all the above in addition to a naive, inexperienced manager and coaching staff.
We need a caretaker, and hope Poch comes available.
I don't think they'll sack Ole unless pressure piles too high - in fact I'm starting to think this is exactly why the board decided to hire him. They knew getting us back on track again would leave us trailing through a shitstorm - as the mess we're in that's piled up from years of poor decisions is just too massive for anyone to plow through without getting filthy in the process - and Ole is considered a nobody by most so if the going gets too tough they can always just throw him under the wheel placing all blame on him while at the same time if he succeeds they'll appear geniuses. Also - if the process is moving along slower than expected but there's signs he's definitely getting us there - eventually - they'll be able to appear generous by granting him their support while he at the same time absorbs all the heat off them.
I have no clue why Solskjær would allow himself to leave the comfort of building a title-winning side in Norway only to once more get duped into playing the scapegoat in England though - I mean he already did that once with Vincent Tan and Cardiff. Maybe he really is gullible - or maybe it's the money talking and the opportunity to prove himself by succeeding at a near impossible task driving him into these career-breaking decisions. One thing is clear either way - Manchester United is turning into the place where talents go to die - whether it be players or managers alike. There are many variables across these last years of failures - Solskjær among many - so if you want to place blame you should look to the constants.
If I was a manager there's no way in Hell I'd take this job unless I was either desperate or greedy. As far as furthering one's career goes - this club is poison at present.
I have no clue why Solskjær would allow himself to leave the comfort of building a title-winning side in Norway only to once more get duped into playing the scapegoat in England though - I mean he already did that once with Vincent Tan and Cardiff. Maybe he really is gullible - or maybe it's the money talking and the opportunity to prove himself by succeeding at a near impossible task driving him into these career-breaking decisions. One thing is clear either way - Manchester United is turning into the place where talents go to die - whether it be players or managers alike. There are many variables across these last years of failures - Solskjær among many - so if you want to place blame you should look to the constants.
If I was a manager there's no way in Hell I'd take this job unless I was either desperate or greedy. As far as furthering one's career goes - this club is poison at present.
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Ummmm! I wonder if the constants are glaziers and Woodward,the leeches.
In control of my emotions as in not knee-jerking and demanding the Manager, Mourinho excepted, is sacked like most on here just because we've been piss poor for a few weeks/months.
And spoilt/spoiled Princesses is apt for anybody that wants Ole sacked, and also wanted the previous three Managers sacked as well.
De Nile is in Egypt mate.
Well contrary to popular belief it was not Fellaini at least - as getting rid of him did nothing to improve our fortune. So if the rot doesn't stem from the board then surely it must be Fred the Red. What do we know about that dude anyways? Is he even a dude? Where does he go between games? Why is he always smiling and dancing about cheerfully even when things are utter crap? I think we should get rid of him first just be sure - before taking on the higher ups
That doesn't mean spoilt. It just means they don't believe he's the right manager to be patient with. I've said it for all of our managers, I'm not worried about results. I want United to play attacking football and I want to see evidence on the pitch that the side is being coached to do this. Why should I have faith in Ole, when he hasn't provided this basic ingredient in months?In control of my emotions as in not knee-jerking and demanding the Manager, Mourinho excepted, is sacked like most on here just because we've been piss poor for a few weeks/months.
And spoilt/spoiled Princesses is apt for anybody that wants Ole sacked, and also wanted the previous three Managers sacked as well.
De Nile is in Egypt mate.
Howe has gotten his side to score 4 more goals than United this season. He only had his side with 9 less goals than United last season despite having inferior players. You can see that the results aren't there, but they're coached in attacking football. Who knows how much better they would be if he was allowed to spend money on Maguire, AWB, Lindelof, etc...
I don't know why this is ignored and simply reduced to "only care about the results." It's not the results, at least in the first season. I do want to see them coached though so that I can believe year 2 or 3 or 4 sees them improve in results.
800 mil spent since Fergie and we have the weakest squad since the PL begun. Not Ole’s fault, the owners and the guys making the footballing decisions are to blame. We can bring any manager in and it wouldn’t make a difference. Glazers should be ashamed but as long a they make bank nothing will change. Let’s pray for United
I changed to sack cus I don't believe our players are as bad as they are being made out to be. Lesser teams with worse talent plays more exciting and with a game plan. We don't so I'm putting the responsibility on Solskjær. It seems Woodward will give him a chance to sort it out. I really hope Solskjær makes me change my mind but I've got zero faith in our current project at the moment. There's not been a lot to be positive about since he was made permanent.
Exactly, look at the way the Brighton players passed and moved on Saturday.
Now before some genius points out Brighton's position in the table, remember that these are fairly limited players earning a fraction of what United players are earning, yet they are able to do the basics right. They move to create space, they move into space, the striker makes runs into the box, they don't persist with a free-kick tacker like Rashford, they don't have floating corners, they don't endlessly pass sideways. Basics. Damned basics. Damned basic coaching.
Strongly disagree with this, he is shit.
These posts sum it up well. I don’t think anyone here just wants Ole sacked for the sake of it but to some it is just very clear that he isn’t a good coach.
Smaller teams on much smaller budgets quite simply play better football than us. Watching MOTD you can see patterns of play that are clearly what is worked on in training. Where’s the evidence of what we work on?
Ole has to go. It makes mensadntonsay it but he is not up to this huge task. There are a lot of much better manager out there.
In control of my emotions as in not knee-jerking and demanding the Manager, Mourinho excepted, is sacked like most on here just because we've been piss poor for a few weeks/months.
And spoilt/spoiled Princesses is apt for anybody that wants Ole sacked, and also wanted the previous three Managers sacked as well.
De Nile is in Egypt mate.
you make yourself look dumber with the whole princess thingIncluding Mr. Moyes who made Ferdinand and Vidic watch videos of Jagielka?In control of my emotions as in not knee-jerking and demanding the Manager, Mourinho excepted, is sacked like most on here just because we've been piss poor for a few weeks/months.
And spoilt/spoiled Princesses is apt for anybody that wants Ole sacked, and also wanted the previous three Managers sacked as well.
De Nile is in Egypt mate.
It’s true though, a lot of United fans are spoilt & entitled.
The last three managers were not able to recover from their slump. I blame the board and players, while Ole also has to take some of the blame.
The only way Ole can save his job is to play like he did in his first three months but that seems like a distant memory. I have no idea why he cannot go back to that.
The only way Ole can save his job is to play like he did in his first three months but that seems like a distant memory. I have no idea why he cannot go back to that.
If you want to build something sustainable you've got to get the framework right first and that usually takes time, it might take 6, 12 or 18 months and possibly even longer if your predecessor's ideology/philosophy differs greatly to your own, then and only then can you allow the players freedom to properly express themselves - and we all want United to play attacking football but till we get the shape right and the players are confident in that shape it's unlikely to happen as every team in the Premier League now can punish you(home or away)if you haven't got the balance between attack and defence right. And at the minute we haven't.
Eddie Howe is safe as houses, it's his Gig as long as he wants it, he'd probably keep his job if Bournemouth got relegated so it's a lot easier for him to get his ideas across safe in the knowledge that even if they get shown their backsides a few times whilst he's trying things he isn't going to come under pressure from the fans, or the powers that be.
Wanting someone sacked for poor performances does not equate to being spoiled. Neither does wanting the team to win. Neither does wanting the team to play effective and/or exciting football. People who think that are either old as feck with some holier than thou attitude or have a small club mentality and have a holier than thou attitude.
Spoiled fans are the ones expecting us to sign 5-6 world class players every summer and having a meltdown if we don't. I don't fall into that category.
Many would have thought the same if they'd seen SAF's first 14/16 months at Old Trafford as most of the football was worse than anything we've seen since he retired. True story.
They might play better football(at times), but there is next to no pressure on the players, playing for United with the expectations is a whole new ball game.
Yeah to those of you that can't handle the truth, but cheers anyway.
Maybe the senior players shouldn't have tried it on and moaned about being drilled on the training pitches then.
We're in 12th place. So name call as much as you want to make yourself feel superior. You may be old in age but have the mentality of a small child.
What truth?
The fact that you've resorted to insulting people suggests you are struggling to articulate your reasons.
Ole is not the man for this rebuild. There is no evidence of any kind of playing style or tactics in his 10 months in charge. He's talked a big game but delivered on none of his promises. We look a million miles off clubs like Wolves and Leicester, let alone the top two.
Ole is the perfect foil for Woodward. A manager the fans adored and who wouldn't rock the boat publically like his predecessor. All the talk of doing it the United Way is PR talk and spin to keep naive fans happy. We are being run into the ground from the top and Ole has been made the fall guy because he was never good enough for the role full time.
To those who have an opinion on the matter, do you see sacking Ole as a solution to the problem or as a sort of punishment for how bad his team has been playing?
I woke up today thinking of our failures (as usual) and thought about where would we go if Ole got sacked.
I think we'll just stagger into another bound to fail appointment, a manager who'd look good on paper and would probably have a fighting chance at improving our fortunes were in not (and this is the most important part) for the fact that Woodward/Judge/the board are incompetent fools.
I've changed my vote. I personally want Woodward gone before sacking a club legend. If we're gonna be shite, at least let us be so shite that Woodward's position becomes untenable or the Glazers decide to cash in on us.
I think we'll just stagger into another bound to fail appointment, a manager who'd look good on paper and would probably have a fighting chance at improving our fortunes were in not (and this is the most important part) for the fact that Woodward/Judge/the board are incompetent fools.
I've changed my vote. I personally want Woodward gone before sacking a club legend. If we're gonna be shite, at least let us be so shite that Woodward's position becomes untenable or the Glazers decide to cash in on us.
Tell you what’s a shite storm Chelsea. Lose their best player, lose their manager and aren’t allowed to buy any new players. Guess who’s in a better position than us and are also a big club that have big problems. So it’s all rubbish at the end of the day. If we chose a competent manager we would have been fine.
When I see Ole referred to as Man Utd manager, I get the same alternate universe feeling I get when I am reminded that Trump is president.
Those are two separate issues. People need to stop confusing the two issues at hand here. Woodward needs to go but so does Ole. United should be aspiring to much more than those two. People using this vote as a soap box to talk about the owners need to understand we all know the issues at a boardroom level but Ole is causing issues at a dressing room level. A nice guy and a club legend regardless of this stint, but way out of his depth and sinking fast.
Sacking Ole will absolve Woodward of any blame again. Jose Mourinho was the best manager we employed post Fergie and he imploded after he wasn't fully backed.
Sacking Ole will also mean the same bunch of overpaid players will be kept on, be given raises and extensions by the geniuses that are Woodward and Judge. We'll be stuck in the same cycle we've been in the past 3 managers.
Let Ole burn the whole thing. Hell, I don't mind getting relegated. Maybe United can learn something from it and rise from the ashes like Juventus did.
You're letting your emotions get the better of you.
Sacking Ole does not absolve Woodward, it shines a bigger spotlight on his recruitment policy. That will be his 4th full time manager. We all know what the common denominator is but he will never be held accountable by the board.
Whether we like it or not Woodward is an asset and Ole is a liability. And seeing as our club is currently run like a fortune 500 company it won't be Ole that bites the bullet and for his managerial display he deserves that.
The club needs a full restructure. Ole needs to go and Woodward needs to be moved away from footballing decisions, but anyone saying they want to see us relegated are being over emotional and not thinking straight.
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