Klopp won back to back leagues with Dortmund. Not comparable.
United’s next manager
- Thread starter Mainoldo
- Start date
So everytime a decent ( havn't won anything yet) manager comes along, Sack the existing manager. That's the way to go.
So we should entirely base ourselves on what managers have done in other clubs? Jose had won 10x more than Poch have, and that didn't turn out to great now did it. Poch earning his stripes in London would mean feck all to our impatient and entitled fans and you both know it.
Poch has done a decent job at Spurs, nothing more. He took an up and coming squad and cemented them in the top 4 at the expense of us and/or Arsenal and Liverpool, but that was about as much about us being shite as them being brilliant.
Is he a great squad builder? No, that honor goes to Levy since he handles the transfers
Does he bring trophies? No, not so far anyways
Does he handle the pressure at big clubs? Seems not. Every time Spurs seems to be onto a trophy they collapse. Last years UCL final wasn't even a contest
Poch needs a break from managing and taking over us now would be stupid. If he fails to improve us do we sack him in May? What kind of precedent do we set then?
If we had a straight up choice between Pochettino and Rodgers who would people choose ?
“We feel the players we have signed this summer demonstrates this approach is the right one. Returning to the roots of our club’s ethos of youth led, attacking football is the right way forward and everyone at the club remain resolute in our desire to get Manchester United back to the top of English football.
“We will continue to make the necessary investments to make this happen. This long-term approach to building a squad is the right one.”
I'll stick with Ole at the moment.
Not overly convinced by Poch.
Not overly convinced by Poch.
A big portion of our expectations and patience should be based on what have managers done at other clubs - it's how it works. If you have credentials and you are proven enough you will get more time to try get your ideas across. It's basic notion and implies not only in football but any kind of management.
Is Poch better than what we have and would he be an improvement to Ole? This is the question you need to ask yourself, because Ole is neither a good manager, coach and also a squad builder considering his transfer business in the Summer.
probably Rogers, we need more time with Ole, if it doesn't work out then go in for Rogers. Poch would probably want to be back in a club soon.
I'd pick Warnock over Rodgers. I just cant stand him as a person.
I can't agree with that. He won titles in a one horse race. He didn't win the PL and Pochettino has, in my view achieved more here.
It's right to make the point that he didn't win the league with Spurs - especially when they couldn't do it the year Leicester did which was clearly a massive opportunity. That notwithstanding, its very difficult to win the PL without massive resources. He has massively overachieved on a small budget and that deserves respect and in my view, will get him a move to a top club (although whether it's here is another question).
He's taken Spurs to a new level on a shoestring and the fact that the wheels have come off is in my view largely due to under investment in the squad over the last few years. Other clubs have improved whilst they have stood still and along with that he's had to deal with players whinging about being underpaid, players running down contracts and (if the press are to be believed) issues in the squad completely outside of his control.
He's a manager who players seem to like playing for, who plays attractive football, can manage on a sensible budget and promotes and develops young players. He's been loyal to Spurs in the face of other offers as well.
You would only know if he can step up to the challenge here if he was given the chance, but if I was a club owner He's exactly the sort of manager I'd be after.
I’ve wanted Poch since his Southhampton days, however Ole deserves at least this season to see where we are at but I would think Poch will be elsewhere by then.
Pochetinno to united
Mourinho to spurs
What a cruel twist of fate. The likes of glaston would explode.
Mourinho to spurs
What a cruel twist of fate. The likes of glaston would explode.
Can’t see them going for Jose. He isn’t hipster enough for them. It’ll be some new up and comer surely.
Spurs were on the road to ruin when Poch went there. They were not up and coming at all. Far from it. The year before, they had sold Bale for record money and blown it all on duds. They had big earners willing to sit out and collect their paychecks, Adebayor ring any bells? They were full of flops who came on big money. Paulinho, Soldado, Lamela.
He got rid of all the big earners & players who didn't want to fight, brought in potential on a shoestring budget and got to work coaching them day in, day out to fulfill their potential.
They spent over £100m the season before and spent under £30m the summer he arrived, making a net profit after selling over 12 players.
For the first 2 years, the club made a net profit on transfers, whilst Poch was turning the club around, building the squad.
The club Poch walked into was nothing like the club he's just left behind.
You can't be serious? So everyone shouts from the rooftops about what a good job Ole is doing in clearing the squad, but you are suggesting Levy is to be given credit for building Spurs?
What's next, Woodward is actually a football mastermind and is the one behind the squad building here too?
You are severely discrediting Pochettino's achievements at Spurs, to say the least.
It's a done deal
That's not how the world works mate. If you do a great job one place and get hired in a new one to a similar job, you cant skate by on previous accolades. Maybe you personally would give Poch more rope than Ole, but that does not mean everyone else would. Jose and LvG had much more impressive CV's than Poch has and that did not save them
Whether Ole is a good manager or coach remains to be seen. He is a good squad builder though. Molde is still reaping the benefits of the squad he built and our transfers this summer has been the best since Fergie. Quality players, addressed key weaknesses and most importantly: All of them are young. He also started clearing out some unwanted elements.
So far hes 3/3 on good signings, LvG was 3/11 and Jose was 3/10
If we should have gotten anyone from Spurs it should be Levy. The man clearly has a nose for good transfers
Dont you know. Jose is already hired.
I am really looking forward to the match between Spurs (Jose) and United (Ole), wednesday December the 4th.
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Okay, you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.
How does the CEO have a good nose for transfers? Are you wumming right now?
Did Levy have a 'good nose for transfers' when the club wasted over £100m the season before Pochettino came?
Why does Ole get all the credit for the supposed squad building, yet Levy gets all the credit for Spurs' squad building?
Can you not see how you are completely contradicting yourself?
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Why are we so unlucky? We always seem a step behind. Why did Spurs sack Poch right now? What if they waited until end of March? He may well have been our next manager. Now we will stick with Ole and probably end up midtable and Poch will get hired by another club before the end of the season and we will be stuck as usual.
Better CV opens more doors and gives you more rope anywhere in the world mate. Ole didn't get the job based on merit.
Ole has been in management in 10 years and no one has stepped up for him apart from Cardiff and you saw how that ended. His record at United is pitiful and this is enough sample to draw a conclusion whether he's a good manager or not.
The transfer business during the summer left the squad in worse position than he took over. In terms of transfer business James was recommended by Giggs, Maguire was wanted by Jose for less last Summer and AWB was paid in full for what Palace wanted and established as one of the best RB in the league - hardly something groundbreaking in terms of business.
Our squad was left wanting in CM, RW and CF position which was clear for everyone to see.
If you credit Levy for Spurs's business then really how much of the credit should be given to Ole for those dealings? Should or not you credit Woodward then for getting those players and Woodwards is the main man everyone wants out?
Im not making this up.Spurs were on the road to ruin when Poch went there. They were not up and coming at all. Far from it. The year before, they had sold Bale for record money and blown it all on duds. They had big earners willing to sit out and collect their paychecks, Adebayor ring any bells? They were full of flops who came on big money. Paulinho, Soldado, Lamela.
He got rid of all the big earners & players who didn't want to fight, brought in potential on a shoestring budget and got to work coaching them day in, day out to fulfill their potential.
They spent over £100m the season before and spent under £30m the summer he arrived, making a net profit after selling over 12 players.
For the first 2 years, the club made a net profit on transfers, whilst Poch was turning the club around, building the squad.
The club Poch walked into was nothing like the club he's just left behind.
You can't be serious? So everyone shouts from the rooftops about what a good job Ole is doing in clearing the squad, but you are suggesting Levy is to be given credit for building Spurs?
What's next, Woodward is actually a football mastermind and is the one behind the squad building here too?
You are severely discrediting Pochettino's achievements at Spurs, to say the least.
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...rs-job-title-tranfers-real-madrid-gareth-bale
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/49175446
https://talksport.com/football/580352/tottenham-news-mauricio-pochettino-transfers/
Pochettino "building" Spurs is demonstrably false, hes not the guy in charge of transfers, he does not even have an input
We do things differently though, while Ed does negotiate contracts and deals, its mostly up to the managers to pick targets. Thats why the title here has been "manager" and Poch himself insisted he should be refereed to as "head coach"
And how was Spurs heading for ruin? Their league finishes before Poch took over was 4th, 5th, 4th, 5th, 6th and then 5th in his first season. When Poch took over in 14/15 Kane also broke though and became their top scorer with 31 in all comps. Not saying Kane alone is the reason they took a step up, but having a prolific player like that break through certainly helps
Now is the time, United need to step up and SEIZE THIS MOMENT. They had dithered over making the right move(s) ever since SAF retired. Unless they have plans on making a play for Nagelsmann or another top guy they know will be free shortly, United must act to get Poch.
Unfortunately, they almost certainly won't and we'll most likely be looking back in the not to distant future on this as another missed opportunity.
Unfortunately, they almost certainly won't and we'll most likely be looking back in the not to distant future on this as another missed opportunity.
He got the job because he went on a 12 game winning streak and everyone was losing their fecking minds after all the Jose toxicity. Knee jerk? Maybe, but the job didnt just fall into his lap either. He got approced by Aston Villa and some unnamed German club while he was at Molde, but did not want to move again to unsettle his family
His record (currently) is better than both Moyes and Van Gaal and only slightly worse than Jose. A couple of more wins he will even go past him
And regarding transfer
Lukaku: Unpressional and did not want to be here. What sense was there in keeping him?
Herrera: Not his choice or his fault
Darmian, Sanchez, Valencia: Deadwood
All of his incomings have been good. Just because Maguire was wanted by Jose does not make him off limits does it? James and AWB have been great. You cant deny that
I don't really care what Poch said in the media the last few months when he was beginning to feel disillusioned and fed up.
When he went there, they had just had Villas-Boas as coach, who they had given significant resources to, who had wasted those resources and left a bloated squad, with low morale and not much potential. Then Sherwood came to try and lift the spirits.
They finished 6th the season before Poch came, their worst finish after record spending too, so they were on the downward slope.
Think about it, there wasn't much resources left, but the squad still needed an overhaul. It was a very tough job for anyone.
The fact that Poch came, managed to overhaul the squad, brought through youth, instilling belief along with excellent coaching, find excellent players for cheap, on a shoestring budget, is testament to him and the job he done there. Nothing was handed to him on a plate there. Having a player like Harry Kane in the youth ranks ready to break out obviously helps matters but he still had to turn the club around and coach them properly.
A player like Kane would never had developed the way he has, if was still around the dysfunctional set-up before Pochettino. That's the biggest compliment anyone can give to Poch.
So now Allegri and Pochettino are available. I think Ed is going to stick with Ole though..
This last point has been acknowledged by Kane
I hear what you're saying and this seems to be the common narrative but Spurs only achieved what they achieved in a time when United, Arsenal and Chelsea have been going through major transition. All things considered, Spurs would have still been the 5th or 6th best team in the league if the other clubs hadn't dropped the ball.
Also, all the players Pochettino 'brought through' were there when he joined. He had a slight clear out and didn't have the money to spend so he had no option to trust the likes of Kane, Ali and Dier. He's got lucky with a couple of them but the rest aren't much to shout about.
The only reason I think Rodgers is a better fit than Pochettino is because of the experience he has in a title run-in. Moyes had a similar profile to Pochettino (most people are forgetting this) and he was handed a title winning side that were certainly not on the decline. We all know how that turned out.
If you've won titles you know what it takes to win titles and you know how to deal with key situations that happen throughout the season. I'd even be happy to bet that Rodgers wins the PL, or equivalent before Pochettino does. I have a feeling he's going to really struggle in his next role if it's at a big club with big expectations.
I didn't know that. Thanks.
It's the same way Martial's development was halted the past few years with the arrival of Mourinho and is now only just taking off again, through Solskjaer's coaching and belief in him.
Unless there’s a massive downturn, I’d say yes.
However, I think the coaches will be looking over their shoulder now, Ole in particular.
He can no longer (if ever) think that there’s no one out there that will fill his shoes immediately
Agreed with this, we see it so often, once the first manager goes, in a new season, other clubs tend to follow suit.
Very nice but what the hell are we beating on? We are doing something that is clearly not working. Just because it’s never been done in the History of football doesn’t mean it’s the right thing to do.
Shall we try and build a squad filled of Championship players and try and contest for the league because we’ve tried signing world class players; European players and Prem proven players and we are still where we are?
You wouldn’t see that as a good ideas would you?
That's the most painful part in all of this. Its been pretty tiresome being on this forum the last few months, with all the posters on here that have made their minds up already. With the recent upturn in results there has been little to feed on and its been a far more objective place to read and to post on. Now all of sudden Pochettino is available and its back to square one, even though this makes absolutely no difference to any perceived improvement or lack of at United.
The post match threads tend to average about 5/6 pages if we win and at least double that if we lose, which surely strengthens the point about objectivity and the desire to moan amongst our fanbase on here. God help us if we lose to Sheffield United on Sunday. It'll be 20+ pages by Sunday night!
Spurs have ended up with the best manager out of the 3 of them. A serial winner.
We need Levy.
We need Levy.
Come on man. No matter how badly you want to believe that or how many times you repeat it does not make it any more true. Its not like there is conflicting reports on the matter or this is just hearsay from dubious sources.
Poch himself said this: “I am not in charge and I know nothing about the situation of my players. I am only coaching them and trying to get the best from them. Sell, buy players, sign contract, not sign contract – I think it is not in my hands, it’s in the club’s hands and [chairman] Daniel Levy. The club need to change my title and description. Of course I am the boss deciding the strategic play, but in another area I don’t know. Today, I feel like I am the coach.” Can it get any more clear than that?
Yeah we have done for the past 6 years. The rebuild really should have started with Moyes, but he failed miserably in that. Then came LvG and Jose and for whatever reason they ignored all the obvious signs that this was a long term project that had to be done carefully and strategically with long term planning, but both of them was so caught up in their own ego they failed. LvG had his head to far up his own arse with his whole philosophy nonsense and Jose as the instant success merchant he is failed because he tried just that and then had a meltdown when things did not go his way. What is clearly not working is changing managers every one-two years either
Moyes got sacked because he took the champions to 7th and it was clear as day he had lost the dressing room. To be fair though, Moyes had an "impossible" job and i think the only ones who could have followed Fergie would have been Jose, Pep, Klopp or Ancelotti
LvG got sacked because he did worse in his second season than he did in his first
Jose got sacked because he had a full meltdown. If he had acted like an adult he would still be managing us
Despite the results being pretty arse in the league (16 points in 12 matches is fecking terrible) there are some positive signs as well. We are harder working, squad seems happier and more harmonious than it has in a while, transfers both ways have been good and young players are getting plenty of chances. Every manager that has achieved something of note in the league has had time to do so. Some do it faster than others, but that often depends on where they start. Pep won the league his second year and Klopp (if they pull it off) will win in his fourth year. The difference here is not the quality of the managers, but rather that the City team Pep inherited was vastly superior to the Liverpool squad Klopp took over so naturally it would take more time to get them up to standard
And just for the record. If it was Poch we hired last December and not Ole and they had identical results my stance would be exactly the same. Who they are and what they have done in the past means almost nothing. Simply because i think its ridiculously unfair to expect anyone to bring us back to the top with only one preseason and one window
Rodgers would have won the league had it not been for Slippy G
So winning a league title with Celtic is a bigger achievement than consistently finishing top 4,in the most competitive league in the world,competing against teams that are outspending you season after season??Wow....As for his struggles this season,Jurgen Klopp finished 13th in his final season at Dortmund.Unfortunately Liverpool didn’t come to the conclusion that he’s rubbish because he finished 13th....
I’m confused? Hasn’t Ed delivered us Mourinho already or did I dream that.
I just came in to write an edit. Hadn’t checked the news. Crazy!! Didn’t think they would go for him.
Poch did well at Espanol initially as pointed out by a poster in the know. Did very well for Southampton and did extremely well for Spurs. It is a no brainer as Poch is in a different stratosphere in managerial ability to Ole. Different planet. We're just incompetent and dithering to pull the trigger and do what's right.
I think its irrelevant whether Poch bought the players or not. Whats more important is that he got them playing good attacking football while spending (net) considerably less than other clubs.
His Spurs side challenged for a title and reached a CL final (where they were the better team), achievements which one would scarcely believe to be possible in 2014 when he was hired.
Spurs have improved their squad, profile and standing in the league because of him. One cant hail the players when Spurs win and blame only the manager when the team loses. He's one of the best coaches in the world and theres no doubt about it.
However, his demeanor strongly suggests that he needs a break. He will definitely have a job by summer 2020. I highly doubt we are smart or brave enough to fire Ole and hire him in the summer.
His Spurs side challenged for a title and reached a CL final (where they were the better team), achievements which one would scarcely believe to be possible in 2014 when he was hired.
Spurs have improved their squad, profile and standing in the league because of him. One cant hail the players when Spurs win and blame only the manager when the team loses. He's one of the best coaches in the world and theres no doubt about it.
However, his demeanor strongly suggests that he needs a break. He will definitely have a job by summer 2020. I highly doubt we are smart or brave enough to fire Ole and hire him in the summer.