Well if he doesn't move this summer, let's see how much Dortmund get for him next summer.
Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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The numbers he is quoting have been widely accepted as genuine.
United want to pay £70 million.
Dortmund wanted £108 million.
Inlies the problem.
Sure, that can be said about literally any player. What I wonder is how you come up with that very specific valuation of Sancho yourself?
Im just trying to say one thing so the opposite happens
All this is a bit silly, it all boils down to what United will spend and what Dortmund want. There is no fixed calculation pre or post Covid.No it hasn't!
In a normal market, with full stadiums and big broadcasting contracts/sponsors, he's worth about £70m - £80m. In a COVID market, which won't recover until the 3rd quarter of 2023 he's worth about £50m - £60m
The highest transfer fee pre Neymar was about £90m for Bale to Madrid so I'm not sure where these figures are coming from. Prices only go up when there's more money in the market, they go down if no one has any.
That said in no world is Sancho worth only £50 - £60 million. There could be another world war and he'd still command more than that.
There's a difference between what a buying club is willing to spend and the price a selling club place on their asset. Dortmund want a minimum of £100 million, if we pay it then that becomes what he is 'worth.'
Like the old saying, something is only worth what somebody is willing to pay. Let's wait and see.
It has been just as widely reported that we're willing to pay 70+30+20, though, which is 120.
Until Sancho comes out and says he will play there next season this is not over. They have got everyone else in the squad to come out and say it but not him.
I guess it won't be so entertaining when we sign him.
And Barcelona will end the season trophy less despite having the best footballer I've ever seen. Super logic.
Of course there are other players. But it's better to get the best, if you can. Signing Eden Hazard or Malcolm as your winger can make a huge difference to your success.
Point is the data does not support this so far.
I gave up to talk seriously inhere. A lot of great posters which follow the BuLi and/or know BVB have given the thread a lot of serious informations and opinions based on facts and intelligent reflections about the whole case. They were at least not heard or worse, were attacked by a lot of posters. Then by pointing that out, they were told its only ironic and so on, then after droping some more arguments they were told they shouldn't be so thin-skinned cause they are on a United forum. The other way around is funny, cause every little serious insight or information which doesn' fit the agenda that Sancho will come to United caused outraging answers, which are the definition of thin-skinned.
Now i decided its maybe better to just follow the thread, having a laugh here and there, and commenting one of the most undeliberated posts. I mean we should take care of this thread so that it doesn't loose its steam.
Monaco wanted 180m-190m (I give you a spanish report) from both PSG and Real Madrid, one paid the other didn't, so no there was no little extra for PSG. The difference was that PSG convinced Mbappé to pick them.
Hi salary was not increased this summer though and that 190k figure has been handed around tabloids since last year. Sancho was not getting that kind of salary and he is not getting it now. He has come closer to it though but I think the only ones making that much money at Dortmund are Hummels and Reus at the moment. Additionally it isn't some brilliant Dortmund idea to work with bonuses, every club does that.
And once in a while you chime in to get on everyones nerves. It is super frustrating to try and give some insight from the standpoint of a Dortmund supporter when you always come here to gloat and make fun of people. That gives Dortmund supporters a bad name here even though I would hope that people were able to differentiate (oftentimes they are not).
I feel more like a saint now as I have refrained myself from posting on the Sancho saga for a week. A week before I used to keep on looking for updates every hour and since August 10th, I casually look up on this thread twice a day. I feel this transfer saga will drag on until the mid of September and will end when we sign him for whatsoever money BVB wants from us. The transfer discussion will get heated up again once the Europa league ends.
PS: Muppetry gives me heart break when it goes wrong.
PS: Muppetry gives me heart break when it goes wrong.
Well said.
They have no idea what we've agreed or haven't with the player. It's pure guess work.
Manchester United, Real Madrid, Barcelona etc don't usually have issues agreeing wage deals with players. So when journalist say it's all agreed they are clearly just assuming so and it's a good assumption to make clearly. Wages aren't the issue with the Sancho deal. Nobody ever thought they would be.
Fabrizio Romano didn't know that the contract was extended till 2023 and he's also said the deal was close a few times and it doesn't seem close whatsoever right now. These guys are 90% full of a crap and football fans jump at everything they say.
Ok, tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at nightYeah, of course
as tell me so, why are you're lot in the rags and on twitter everyday talking about a deal that is suppose to be dead and buried according to a lying fool who once also claimed others wouldn't be sold and a few weeks later they be gone to a Barca or The Arsenal.Why the "desperation" in getting him to release a statement , or have players rolled out daily singing his praises if you're so confident of him staying or the club not looking to sell
Dortmund getting their players and his friends to publically state he is staying is trying to pressure Sancho into not leaving by feeling guilty.
They obviously know he wants out and they're manipulating him into feeling bad about it
They obviously know he wants out and they're manipulating him into feeling bad about it
AFAIK most of the numbers quoted have been saying £70 million up-front, then installments for the rest.
The negotiations seems to be how far ahead in time the installments will be paid , and if there is a possibility of add-ons instead of some of the installments.
I'd love for us to sign Sancho but it is worth remembering that United have missed out on lots of players in the past and it has mostly not stopped us being successful. It is also not really a reflection on Woodward or the current negotiation team. A lot of it is economics, politics, bureaucracy and what the player wants. Here are a few examples:
- Gascoigne [source]:
- Shearer [source]:
- Ronaldinho [source]:
- Toni Kroos [source]:
- Fabregas [source]:
- Robben [source]:
- Gareth Bale [source]:
- Sneijder [source]
- Patrick Kluivert [source]:
- Gary Lineker [source]:
- Eden Hazard [source]:
- Lewandowski [source]:
- Gascoigne [source]:
Paul Gascoigne has said one of the greatest regrets of his playing career was to have turned down Manchester United. On the other side of that coin, United's manager, Sir Alex Ferguson, has long maintained that "not getting Gazza" was the biggest disappointment of his managerial career. Gascoigne, 41, said he was shown around United's training ground as a young player but when he left Newcastle United in 1988 it was for Tottenham instead.
- Shearer [source]:
"I sat down with both Kevin Keegan and Sir Alex on the same day, in a house in Cheshire, believe it or not," said Shearer. "I spoke to Kevin Keegan in the morning, talks had gone really really well, very positive."....And Sir Alex's first question was 'am I seeing you first, or second?'. And I said I saw Kevin this morning, and he said 'basically I've got no chance, then'. In other words he wanted to see me first and he was disappointed he didn't do that. But I thought the talks went extremely well, I was really impressed with what he had to say." Shearer then revealed he made the demand about penalties, which was met with a stony-faced Ferguson.
- Ronaldinho [source]:
“I remember two or three that were possibly coming,” Scholes recalled on the BBC’s Savage Social podcast earlier this week. “I think the one that stands out is Ronaldinho. He was away on pre-season and we were as close as announcing him and giving him a number but I think he ended up changing his mind at the last minute and signing for Barcelona".
- Toni Kroos [source]:
"I knew before that Manchester wanted me," Kroos said. "And Moyes underlined that absolutely. It was a really nice afternoon with very nice people. We talked a lot about United's footballing plan which convinced me. In the end, we agreed to do it. We agreed verbally.".
- Fabregas [source]:
"After the week I had to take my chance, I had Manchester City, United and then I spoke to Mourinho – which I didn’t think would ever happen."
- Robben [source]:
"I had a very good conversation with him (Ferguson) over dinner in Manchester and we spoke about football and life. I also went and had a good look around the training ground and everything was good, but after I went back to PSV nothing happened. There was no real contact and the deal didn't happen....Had Manchester United offered me a deal straight after I met them, I would have signed there, but it didn't happen and I have got no regrets."
- Gareth Bale [source]:
And Ferguson claims that Bale would have been a United player in but for Southampton’s decision to reject their bid for the youngster in January 2007. “We were disappointed in Southampton at the time because we were first there, but they never came back to us,” Ferguson said. “It was not the boy who turned us down, it was Southampton, then a few weeks later he signed for Tottenham Hotspur".
- Sneijder [source]
On United's interest in his services, the Dutch playmaker told Galatasaray Dergisi: "We had some talks with Alex Ferguson back in 2010. "They [United] contacted the club after our Treble season but too much money was asked for. And I was also happy at Inter so I decided to stay. Manchester United are a fantastic club and they kept showing interest after that year but not as determined as before."
- Patrick Kluivert [source]:
"It won't be the last time this kind of thing happens but players we really want we usually get," Ferguson said. "We were led to believe he wanted to speak to us, but you know what agents are like. Maybe he doesn't know how big a club Manchester United is."
- Gary Lineker [source]:
"Right at the 11th hour it suddenly appeared that Spurs might not be able to do the deal, financially," his answer read. "That's when my agent spoke with Alex Ferguson, who was keen to take me to Old Trafford. "It was close to being done, but then Tottenham came back and said they could do it".
- Eden Hazard [source]:
“I had a chance to sign for Manchester United, Man City, Tottenham, but I made the right decision,”
- Lewandowski [source]:
Dortmund managed to keep Lewandowski for another two seasons, but he admits he was interested to move to Old Trafford after they Ferguson had shown interest. “I was speaking with him [Ferguson] after two years at Dortmund and at that time I was really thinking about a move to Manchester United,” Lewandowski told The Guardian. “Because of Ferguson and because of Manchester United. Borussia Dortmund said: ‘No, that’s that.’ That was the first time I was thinking about the move because if you get a phone call from Sir Alex Ferguson, for a young player it was something amazing. That was a special day for me.”
Journos can get news from sources without knowing the entire ins and outs of the move?
If hes told the move is close then he reports its close. To fill out an article he pads it with accepted news ie contract length. The source doesnt write the article for him.
Like Pogba last summer. Madrid were after him, that was clear. Their accepted sources reported as such but also didnt know about our 1 year option so you saw incorrect points about 1 year left after this summer in their articles.
They arent releasing the minutes of negotiations here.
Hell we signed Pogba and the big story was agent fees. Turned out Juve paid it without fuss.
The stories still ended up heing true.
I did this too, and i wasn't the only one. But these standpoints weren't heard and didn't lead to a good debate, just like i wrote above. You can count posters in here which wants to talk seriously by one hand. But respect for you for still trying.
Like I said 90% full of crap. They get little snippets here and there but they are just feeding their egos most of the time. They aren't daft. They know how football fans operate and are very emotional beings during transfer windows. Hahahaha
United will get him if we agree to the fee Dortmund want is basically what's he been saying? Well no shit. I could write that.
Good post @0le. I think people will loose their shit if we don't get him, but it may open the door for someone we never even thought of.
I understand your frustration but you have to remember where you are. You are writing in a forum dedicated to Manchester United and you have to be aware that for example the sentiment that the Sancho transfer won't happen this summer is not really what people want to hear. You basically have to be extra careful not to step on people's toes if you actually want them to listen to you. And if you think no proper discussion can be had just don't post because what you are doing now is simply counterproductive and agitates people even more so they won't listen at all to "the brigade of german fans invading the caf". There is a reason I don't have a lot of posts because I feel a proper discussion usually takes time and oftentimes I don't think it is worth it. So if all you can contribute is "you're all a bunch of idiots haha" maybe just think it to yourself, however warranted it may be.
Ah, you are one of those who didn't recognize posters here, who explained that they are in Bad Ragaz for training camp, and gave interviews the first 2 days. Just like all the years before. I count youre post in the "conspiracy theory" drawer, with some honorable mention of the "knows nothing about BVB but still..."-drawer. Inform yourself. There are great post in this thread which set your suggestions in the right light, its up on you to read them or not.Ok, tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at night
Why the "desperation" in getting him to release a statement , or have players rolled out daily singing his praises if you're so confident of him staying or the club not looking to sell
What if we can't agree on a structured deal and he says he wants to go but Dortmund don't sanction the transfer?I don't see how Sancho benefits trying to agitate for a move if Dortmund don't budge from their valuation.
If it's not serious enough for you, just stop logging in. I'm sure we will survive.
You realise that SAF was the manager and our squads during those times were full of some of the best players in the world.
You are totaly right. But if there is no substancial senseful core in here, at least we all should get some entertainment out of this thread. And if they are honest, they enjoy it a little bit too. But stoping for today (thanks for your clever suggestions), i think there won't be an intelligent or wise discussion, all facts have been already discussed.
cause it wouldn't work. Dortmund are renowned for ignoring the player's plea and stick to their own guns.
Where’s that poster who called someone a whore?Yeah, of course
Find it a bit weird that the two clubs don’t just sit down and talk.
United do by the sounds of things but Dortmund are unwilling because they don't want to be drawn into negotiations
Would be good to get some insight into why. All we can do is speculate... maybe they don't want to deal with the Woody special add ons.
Being close on a fee with only the structure being the issue is huge news though
Dortmund have said we have to go through the agent, I guess that is their way of saying the price is non negotiable
Mikhi, Auba and Dembele all kicked up a fuss and got a move.
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