A night where they somehow scored three goals despite just two shots on target. In your dreams, basically.
PL L FA Premier League
Manchester United 0:1 Arsenal
Post-match discussion
Sun, 01 November 2020
People need to acknowledge that today's game was lost the moment we put out a midfield diamond that couldn't pass or keep position, against one of the better high pressing teams in the PL. It had fek all to do with character or not trying hard enough. We couldn't play our system. They could play theirs. It was obvious by minute two of the game.
Of course once that happens everyone looks like they are playing badly as individuals, because the team cohesion disintegrates. That's why it's called a press.
Of course once that happens everyone looks like they are playing badly as individuals, because the team cohesion disintegrates. That's why it's called a press.
They are. He’s putting Jose to shame.
Glad I’m not the only one who seems to have noticed this. How the hell can we play as badly as we did and Arsenal apparently played well, yet one of Arsenal’s only two shots on target was a penalty, gifted to then by Pogba being an idiot?
If you want to see what’s possible when we play that poorly, re-watch the Brighton and Palace games. Both of whom were infinitely more threatening and better to watch than Arsenal.
Because they weren’t strong enough to drop him. That’s their own fault
To be positive, we were good defensively. They created hardly anything and won because of one bad tackle in the box. Shit tackle but it doesn't represent the game. We were pretty solid at the back and we were in the game up until the goal.
We're awful when we need to come from behind, though. As soon as a defence sits back we don't seem to have anything against it. Martial might have helped, but probably not enough.
Thought it was odd that Ole took Bruno off and left Pogba on. I'd back Bruno to make something happen much more than I would Pogba.
We're awful when we need to come from behind, though. As soon as a defence sits back we don't seem to have anything against it. Martial might have helped, but probably not enough.
Thought it was odd that Ole took Bruno off and left Pogba on. I'd back Bruno to make something happen much more than I would Pogba.
We wanted to win - not sure about your players...
It doesn’t defend our performance but Arsenal had a grand total of one player start both games. Us having to play our first team on Wednesday was a significantly bigger burden.
a shot on the crossbar is not a shot on target yet more dangerous than a lame shot in the keeper’s hands.
Sorry mate you’re clutching at straws to justify your hyperbolic statement I reacted on in the first place.
I thought Arsenal defensive organization was pretty good. Ours too.
We were getting better in 2nd half until you know what happened. We still need good wingers in the squad. Playing without wingers while your FBs are not as good going forward will not make us go too far.
We were getting better in 2nd half until you know what happened. We still need good wingers in the squad. Playing without wingers while your FBs are not as good going forward will not make us go too far.
I’m still totally baffled as to what Ole was expecting to happen with that line up today.
Diamond formation... fine, but it’s crystal clear you need the right players to execute it.
Two defensive fullbacks, plus the two left and right midfielders not being suited to the position (Pogba ‘should’ be, but the less said about him right now, the better...), meant that our two forwards were forced wider and wider.
Not to worry, the man at the head of the diamond can become the false 9 right? Except Bruno is our primary creative player, meaning every time he got the ball in attacking positions, he had nobody to play the ball to as they were all either behind him or to the side.
I mean, surely even a man with debilitating cataracts could see that the better option was either VDB, or even Cavani, in the false 9 position with Bruno taking Pogba’s role.
Also, finishing the game with Matic and McTominay on the pitch... Jesus wept.
Diamond formation... fine, but it’s crystal clear you need the right players to execute it.
Two defensive fullbacks, plus the two left and right midfielders not being suited to the position (Pogba ‘should’ be, but the less said about him right now, the better...), meant that our two forwards were forced wider and wider.
Not to worry, the man at the head of the diamond can become the false 9 right? Except Bruno is our primary creative player, meaning every time he got the ball in attacking positions, he had nobody to play the ball to as they were all either behind him or to the side.
I mean, surely even a man with debilitating cataracts could see that the better option was either VDB, or even Cavani, in the false 9 position with Bruno taking Pogba’s role.
Also, finishing the game with Matic and McTominay on the pitch... Jesus wept.
I’m fairly certain both teams wanted to win. Pity they went about it in a way that was such a terrible spectacle. I guess you gooners are kind of numbed to it at this stage but that was really fecking grim to watch.
My likely unwelcome view on the game
1. To be honest after Leipzig mid week, I’d have given anything today for scraping a point
2. When I saw you started a Pogba, I wasn’t unhappy. He’s not a Man Utd player and he shouldn’t start with Fernandes. It blunts Bruno’s effectiveness.
3. Your full backs add nothing attacking.
4. Despite some of the negativity, I thought we played a lot better than some of you were willing to credit.
5. Elneny was great for us.
6. Partey is a real player.
7. Don’t blame Ole, how many managers do you want to sack before you realise (like Roy Keane) that some of your players are overpaid and not that very good?
Finally, I’m under no illusions, we are some way from getting back into the top 4.
We may not make this season but at least I feel after many disappointing years under Arteta, we are moving in the right direction
As for you lot, I’d get rid of Pogba before Ole.
1. To be honest after Leipzig mid week, I’d have given anything today for scraping a point
2. When I saw you started a Pogba, I wasn’t unhappy. He’s not a Man Utd player and he shouldn’t start with Fernandes. It blunts Bruno’s effectiveness.
3. Your full backs add nothing attacking.
4. Despite some of the negativity, I thought we played a lot better than some of you were willing to credit.
5. Elneny was great for us.
6. Partey is a real player.
7. Don’t blame Ole, how many managers do you want to sack before you realise (like Roy Keane) that some of your players are overpaid and not that very good?
Finally, I’m under no illusions, we are some way from getting back into the top 4.
We may not make this season but at least I feel after many disappointing years under Arteta, we are moving in the right direction
As for you lot, I’d get rid of Pogba before Ole.
We are currently relegation material and have a tragic home record.
We have better players than each of the teams we have lost to. Yes we lack a proper DM like Partey or Neves
but there is simply no excuse for the initial team selection and believing that fred and mctominay have the ability to either win the ball convincingly , keep the ball in tight situations or ditribute with accuracy or intelligence.Nor do they combine well. Whereas partey wins it by himself mctominay and Fred have to double up to win it. Pogba is not a left side attacker and he is being compromised by bad tactics and if our defence was on the ball he would not even have to be in that position
we are man Utd we have better attackers and midfielders then arsenal - go for it!
play the back 4 then play vdb with Pogba and Fernandes and tell them they all have to defend and attack. They can all keep the ball in tight situations plus it scares the opposition
the attack today was obvious
Cavani Rashford and greenwood
as for the in game management
Arteta is there on the ball directing and managing his players
solskaer looks like he couldn’t say boo to an effing goose
and the substitutions ? Who not to take off! Greenwood-he probably would have equalised and as for the matic for Fred again like for like
believing in a system that just doesn’t work
2 DMs give me a break
I’m very worried
We have better players than each of the teams we have lost to. Yes we lack a proper DM like Partey or Neves
but there is simply no excuse for the initial team selection and believing that fred and mctominay have the ability to either win the ball convincingly , keep the ball in tight situations or ditribute with accuracy or intelligence.Nor do they combine well. Whereas partey wins it by himself mctominay and Fred have to double up to win it. Pogba is not a left side attacker and he is being compromised by bad tactics and if our defence was on the ball he would not even have to be in that position
we are man Utd we have better attackers and midfielders then arsenal - go for it!
play the back 4 then play vdb with Pogba and Fernandes and tell them they all have to defend and attack. They can all keep the ball in tight situations plus it scares the opposition
the attack today was obvious
Cavani Rashford and greenwood
as for the in game management
Arteta is there on the ball directing and managing his players
solskaer looks like he couldn’t say boo to an effing goose
and the substitutions ? Who not to take off! Greenwood-he probably would have equalised and as for the matic for Fred again like for like
believing in a system that just doesn’t work
2 DMs give me a break
I’m very worried
I rather enjoyed it
You do realise our key tactic was to rely upon Pogba being Pogba?
I agree about Pogba but we were more dominant than you’re willing to concede
Extremely disappointing result and, for the most part, performance. Im home alone today so I watched most of the match again this evening. Funny how much better you can analyse a game when you know the result.
First half we were just outplayed. They knew exactly how to cut off our usual channels of passing and we had no answer to it. Its the clear achilles heel of this team and we simply won't win games consistently until we solve that. We just couldn't get out. Bruno was taking it upon himself to come back and make himself available. McTominay worked hard but didn't know how to play his role and Pogba was just doing his Pogba thing - next to feck all for the team. Having said that, it wasn't ever particularly dangerous for us. I was frustrated with the performance but also thinking we'd still win the game when we sorted ourselves out.
This is where the criticism of Ole starts to come in. He knew what we needed to do to get a hold on the game. We know that he knew, because he made adjustments at half time that worked, but he shouldn't have waited that long. It should have happened on 25 minutes. If you're going to start with Fred and McTominay (which we should do whenever possible) then use them in a way that works. 4231 or a back three. Im all for being adaptable but I dont think this team is mature enough yet to keep changing things outside of those two systems.
Second half we were far better. Looked like the only team that would win it, until we got Pogba'd. Im so angry with him for that mistake. Completely brain dead. He has to know better than that, but i just think he coasts through games. He doesn't suit this club and he's got to go. 2nd big criticism for Ole was keeping him on. I couldn't and still don't understand what he thought he was offering the team.
Obviously this place is going to be an Ole out bloodbath for another week, and he does deserve criticism for today, but its bigger than that. You don't beat Leipzig 5-0 on Tuesday and then produce what we did today because the team are badly coached. Today was a case of trying to fit too many square pegs into round holes and it has to be a lesson learned. No more diamond formation. No more feckin Pogba. I genuinely don't want to see him pull on our shirt again unless we have injuries and he has to play.
First half we were just outplayed. They knew exactly how to cut off our usual channels of passing and we had no answer to it. Its the clear achilles heel of this team and we simply won't win games consistently until we solve that. We just couldn't get out. Bruno was taking it upon himself to come back and make himself available. McTominay worked hard but didn't know how to play his role and Pogba was just doing his Pogba thing - next to feck all for the team. Having said that, it wasn't ever particularly dangerous for us. I was frustrated with the performance but also thinking we'd still win the game when we sorted ourselves out.
This is where the criticism of Ole starts to come in. He knew what we needed to do to get a hold on the game. We know that he knew, because he made adjustments at half time that worked, but he shouldn't have waited that long. It should have happened on 25 minutes. If you're going to start with Fred and McTominay (which we should do whenever possible) then use them in a way that works. 4231 or a back three. Im all for being adaptable but I dont think this team is mature enough yet to keep changing things outside of those two systems.
Second half we were far better. Looked like the only team that would win it, until we got Pogba'd. Im so angry with him for that mistake. Completely brain dead. He has to know better than that, but i just think he coasts through games. He doesn't suit this club and he's got to go. 2nd big criticism for Ole was keeping him on. I couldn't and still don't understand what he thought he was offering the team.
Obviously this place is going to be an Ole out bloodbath for another week, and he does deserve criticism for today, but its bigger than that. You don't beat Leipzig 5-0 on Tuesday and then produce what we did today because the team are badly coached. Today was a case of trying to fit too many square pegs into round holes and it has to be a lesson learned. No more diamond formation. No more feckin Pogba. I genuinely don't want to see him pull on our shirt again unless we have injuries and he has to play.
Sure. Whatever makes you feel better about watching such shit football, week in, week out.
Are you old enough to remember when Arsenal were consistently good to watch? Feels like a lifetime ago but it did actually happen.
Another performance where we had no answer against any sort of press. Newcastle are the only team that haven't pressed us thanks to Bruce's negative tactics.
I can't imagine Ole ever getting angry at anything. He's way too placid, it's irritating to watch and his post match interviews contain the same nonsense lines every week about our 'quality'.
I can't imagine Ole ever getting angry at anything. He's way too placid, it's irritating to watch and his post match interviews contain the same nonsense lines every week about our 'quality'.
I'm sure that's exactly what you were counting on. Ridiculous statement. But to be expected really. Gooners for life and all that.
Considering that Arsenal seem incapable of moving the ball quickly, that makes sense:
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
An important question for Ole: Is the sporadically inconsistent brilliance of Pogba a justifiable reason to keep him?
In my opinion he is a painful liability in our current set-up where we need true workhorses who flourish even when the chips are down.
In my opinion he is a painful liability in our current set-up where we need true workhorses who flourish even when the chips are down.
The first half was terrible. Formation wasn't working as we kept giving the ball away when we did finally manage to get it. Especially Fred. Bruno was blunted, not by the presence of Pogba, but because we hardly had the ball. Greenwood was horrid, his frustration showed when he got that yellow for lunging in to retrieve the ball after losing it. Don't remember much from Rashford save that KDB-esque pass to Mason that was saved.
I thought we defended well but couldn't keep the ball. Painful to watch.
I thought we defended well but couldn't keep the ball. Painful to watch.
1. You are not relegation material
2. Your players are not as good as you think they are
If you think Arsenal were good to watch that’s fine. I don’t care. I do disagree though.
We were poor today, no doubt about that. Too slow in our build up play, and clueless at breaking down a packed defence.
That said, Arsenal weren't any better. De Gea hardly had a save to make. In a match decided by a penalty award, the appalling performance of Mike Dean was a major factor. The number of tactical fouls made by Arsenal without a booking, the number of fouls by Arsenal not given, bottling giving a second yellow card to Gabriel, yet booking Fred and Greenwood. In a tight match, the referee had a major bearing on us not getting something out of the match.
That said, Arsenal weren't any better. De Gea hardly had a save to make. In a match decided by a penalty award, the appalling performance of Mike Dean was a major factor. The number of tactical fouls made by Arsenal without a booking, the number of fouls by Arsenal not given, bottling giving a second yellow card to Gabriel, yet booking Fred and Greenwood. In a tight match, the referee had a major bearing on us not getting something out of the match.
Awful, awful subs.
It's bad to move the ball slowly? Is this the first you're hearing about the concept of playing quickly?
Personally, I don't think Ole should go however, it's annoying were able to beat these European opponents who no one thinks we can win I mean I was going for a 2-1 United win vs Leipzig and we smashed them but against Arsenal we bottle it.
I couldn't agree more it's disgraceful that we are playing like were gonna get relegated. And Ole's substitution choice is ABSOLETULY disgraceful
Shambolic and pathetic from the whole team. Donny was motm and he came on for 15 mins shows how poor everyone else was.
Difference is that teams in PL have worked us out. Clueless tactics.
Pogba needs a stint on the bench. It's pretty obvious.
From the first minute when I saw our line up today I knew we were in trouble . Arsenal playing with width and we play a diamond.
Now anyone who knows anything about football knows the diamond system has one huge flaw and that's width.
So Ole decides to play that system and stick with it for way to long while Arsenal created chance after chance mainly due to the width they had on the pitch .
Mind boggling to say the very least . I coach 10 year olds and I saw the danger before the game started .
Now anyone who knows anything about football knows the diamond system has one huge flaw and that's width.
So Ole decides to play that system and stick with it for way to long while Arsenal created chance after chance mainly due to the width they had on the pitch .
Mind boggling to say the very least . I coach 10 year olds and I saw the danger before the game started .
mate why are you on this site. I don’t go on arsenals site. You are an embarrassment. United have a far better squad than arsenal. Individually man for man way better. Get back in your box. You havent won anything and you think you won the league bacause you beat us with a penalty.
get out of here with your junk. Up the arse
however I will say we should Not be relegation material
But we are at this moment in time
we can beat PSG and Leipzig both of which are better teams than yours but you have a better mansger
get back in your box pal and back
To your own site you loser
Meh...
It's not a mentality thing...a few poor performances, particularly in midfield, created a situation where we found it hard to retain and regain possession. It's that simple
We are 90s Liverpool under Souness. A great performance now and then some exciting young attacking players, and holding on to a club legend too long despite all the evidence they aren’t up for the job. Ole needs to go and probably will be sacked by December if we’re lingering out of the top 6.
Man of the Match
Runners-up
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15%
Luke Shaw
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13%
David de Gea
-
6%
Donny van de Beek
-
6%
Harry Maguire
-
4%
Mason Greenwood
-
4%
Nemanja Matic
-
3%
Fred
-
3%
Aaron Wan-Bissaka
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2%
Marcus Rashford
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2%
Bruno Fernandes
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2%
Scott McTominay
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2%
Paul Pogba
Player Ratings
Total Average Rating
Highest Rated Player
Lowest Rated Player
Compiled from 316 ratings.
Score Predictions
215,13,40
- Man Utd win
- Arsenal win
- Draw
Detailed Results
- 22% Man Utd 2:0 Arsenal
- 22% Man Utd 2:1 Arsenal
- 13% Man Utd 3:1 Arsenal
- 11% Man Utd 3:0 Arsenal
- 9% Man Utd 1:1 Arsenal
- 3% Man Utd 0:0 Arsenal
- 3% Man Utd 1:0 Arsenal
- 3% Man Utd 2:2 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 1:2 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 4:0 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 3:2 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 4:1 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 5:0 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 0:2 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 4:2 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 5:1 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 0:1 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 5:2 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 1:3 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 0:3 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 0:4 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 0:5 Arsenal
Match Stats
- Man Utd
- Arsenal
- Possession
- 53% 47%
- Shots
- 8 7
- Shots on Target
- 2 2
- Corners
- 6 3
- Fouls
- 12 12
Referee
Mike Dean
Man Utd Lineup
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-
-
-
-
-
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replaced by Donny van de Beek
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replaced by Nemanja Matic
-
-
-
replaced by Edinson Cavani
