The “Ole In” Brigade

[romufc]

I think we need to disregard the lack of rotation issue here. This is very much an atypical run-in.

Even so, both McTominay and Fred started the game against Spurs, and both have had two further starts since the restart, which accounts for around a quarter of the matches we've played thus far - a reasonable amount considering they are squad players.

I remember watching the league last season when Liverpool and City were going at it. Int he first half of the season, you would see Pep do what he does and make changes, Liverpool too but to a lesser extent.

However; come March, you would see the same team put out by both week in week out, when you have an objective, you put your best team out.

If Ole rotates too much, you will see comments like, "Ole doesn't even know his best 11"

 

[rotherham_red]

I remember watching the league last season when Liverpool and City were going at it. Int he first half of the season, you would see Pep do what he does and make changes, Liverpool too but to a lesser extent.

However; come March, you would see the same team put out by both week in week out, when you have an objective, you put your best team out.

If Ole rotates too much, you will see comments like, "Ole doesn't even know his best 11"

Yep, his critics are always wise after the fact.

 

[Nicoseth]

Can we have a word about Lampard here? The Ole-outers jump on every misstep and hammer him for it, but Lampard seems to get praised to the hilt for his apparent style of play - the style of play that has seen them get absolutely hammered in some games this year. We beat them 3 times this year - twice in the league with a score of 6-0 over the two games. Sheffield U beat them 3-0, they just conceded 5 to Liverpool, lost at home to Bournemouth, West Ham and Southampton and have been utterly shambolic at times. We're a much bigger club, so I guess that must be the reason, but every mistake is scrutinized when Ole is involved. Lamps gets a free pass.

I also think that Ole has achieved more this year. We are now above them in the league and honestly, I think Chelsea have a better squad. We might have a stronger 11, but they have superior options off the bench.

I think we'll get top 4, hopefully more investment this summer in the squad and we'll be a lot closer to City and Liverpool next year.

 

[always_hoping]

My point is, City then built on this and won the league. So next season we need to push on and enhance expectations slightly.

Without thinking Ole will be a good as Klopp its worth looking back on how it started for him with Liverpool.

Arrived October 2015 and finished season in 8th

Klopps first full season they finished 4th 1 point ahead of Arsenal in 5th.

His 2nd full season was 4th again but that time finished 5 points ahead of 5th place Chelsea.

The signings they have made has allowed them to transform into the team they are now compared to 2015, 2016 and 2017.

Long story short I can't predict what's to come or will Ole will still be manager of United in the years ahead but the expectations among United supporters for next season should be 4th at least and secured CL football before the final day of the season.

 

[DFreshKing]

Yeah these upcoming 3 months are going to be different than the entire year he had managed the club in.

Then after this season ends the excuse will shift to : "He needs another full season", right ?

You're talking about "full season" as if it's a long time. There're only 3 months remaining in his first full season, 13 league matches only. We won 9 out of our first 25 games, how many are you expecting us to win out of the remaining 13 ?

Because Ole is at the Wheel!

No seriously, because we might have a decent midfielder for the rest of the season to help an improved Fred and Pogba shop windowing might turn up for 2 of those 3 months. Also the league is very congested with a lot of poor squads (relatively to title challengers) vying for CL spots. If we do not improve I have no issue with replacing Ole, he has to attain targets but while he is still close to those spots he should have our support. Do you think JM should get sacked, or Lampard? What about Arsenal, they don't seem to be doing to well.

So yeah. Took a lot of flak in this thread - interestingly some of them have not been seen for a while but I was probably mostly right.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

I honestly see us losing at Leicester, perhaps even heavily 3-0.

Surely those Ole in will have to think his position has become untenable then?

 

[MalcolmTucker]

Hey guys, just IMAGINE if LASK beat us 6-0 in the return leg? I just did!

Surely after that there is no coming back for Ole. Checkmate!

 

[pacifictheme]

Not sure if this has been posted..

 

[Bubz27]

Lamps is Ole in.

 

[Zlatan 7]

Always liked frank

 

[Hughie77]

Ole, is and every UTD manager under the spotlight, no matter if they do well or dont, after SAF. It's been 7 yrs since hes gone , and it's been ups and downs. This season is still a rebuild in terms of players in and out, also performances have been inconsistent, but it's not only UTD who are inconsistent lots of clubs are. Ole will be here till end of season no matter how he does. There is improvement it can be seen, it's now confidence the players need to push on, everybody is looking at the cup half empty, instead of half full.

 

[Foxbatt]

Ole, is and every UTD manager under the spotlight, no matter if they do well or dont, after SAF. It's been 7 yrs since hes gone , and it's been ups and downs. This season is still a rebuild in terms of players in and out, also performances have been inconsistent, but it's not only UTD who are inconsistent lots of clubs are. Ole will be here till end of season no matter how he does. There is improvement it can be seen, it's now confidence the players need to push on, everybody is looking at the cup half empty, instead of half full.

No, he won't be here no matter what he does. He will be here if the current trajectory is the way we go forward. If he starts to lose a lot of matches and we start to struggle and get to the bottom half he will get sacked.

 

[redcafe_reader]

For me, it's undeniable that this is the closest we are to the title since SAF. Jose finished 2nd but for most of the season, we are not challenging City. LVG maybe still in the race in April in his first season but he's never close, performance-wise or point-wise.

 

[devilish]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

 

[meamth]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

If we're talking about finishing fourth, you will be saying "Lowering expectations, what have we become".

Same shyte, really.

 

[devilish]

If we're talking about finishing fourth, you will be saying "Lowering expectations, what have we become".

Same shyte, really.

I think 4th is the best we can get given our circumstances (shit defence, unexperienced manager + coaching staff etc). Irrespective of that it's still 14 games in the league. There plenty of games coming through and every man and his dog knows that we're ridiculously flawed. Luck will carry us so far.

However don't let me stop you celebrating the league title in Christmas mate. I didn't stop Liverpool fans during the Houllier/Benitez doing that, let alone fellow fans.

 

[meamth]

I think 4th is the best we can get given our circumstances (shit defence, unexperienced manager + coaching staff etc). Irrespective of that it's still 14 games in the league. There plenty of games coming through and every man and his dog knows that we're ridiculously flawed. Luck will carry us so far.

However don't let me stop you celebrating the league title in December mate.

I don't think we're shit, far from it.

The squad age average is younger than any title contenders, they are learning and clicking to form.
Everybody talking about January signings, I'm just here believing the defense and attack can kick it up a notch. I'm sure they will.

When that happens, we'll see how far we can go.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

Not that I'm comparing ole to saf in any way, but for the longest time we were very slow starters under fergie we regularly didn't hit our stride till after Christmas and ground out results in the first half of the season. And fergies also had his share of getting his ass handed to him by smaller clubs, this is a topsy turvey crazy season, and anything and everything is possible. With the confidence from sunday we could very well go on a storming run now. Whatever happens, its going to be a fun ride.

 

[devilish]

I don't think we're shit, far from it.

The squad age average is younger than any title contenders, they are learning and clicking to form.
Everybody talking about January signings, I'm just here believing the defense and attack can kick it up a notch. I'm sure they will.

When that happens, we'll see how far we can go.

Please read again. I said shit defence, not shit team. Midfield and forward line are relatively fine. The problem lie in the defence unit which is incredibly error prone even when it gets all the protection it can get. Better coaching and better tactics can help, however they won't make Maguire/Lindelof fast (or intelligent) or push DDG to leave the comfort of his goal line. I still can't figure it out how on earth did we spent 80m on such average CB. He's got no pace, no leadership, little positioning and he constantly need to be nannied. Prime Wes, Johnsen, Bruce and Evans were better then him let alone Rio, Vidic, Pally and Stam.

 

[devilish]

Not that I'm comparing ole to saf in any way, but for the longest time we were very slow starters under fergie we regularly didn't hit our stride till after Christmas and ground out results in the first half of the season. And fergies also had his share of getting his ass handed to him by smaller clubs, this is a topsy turvey crazy season, and anything and everything is possible. With the confidence from sunday we could very well go on a storming run now. Whatever happens, its going to be a fun ride.

I wish I could share your confidence.

I've yet to see anyone win a league title with a shit defence. That include the great Sir Alex Ferguson himself. Our results are inconsistent and we've yet to find a way to break tough defences that drop deep.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

I wish I could share your confidence.

I've yet to see anyone win a league title with a shit defence. That include the great Sir Alex Ferguson himself. Our results are inconsistent and we've yet to find a way to break tough defences that drop deep.

All good points mate, but on the flip side you have also never seen weekends where utd and Liverpool lost by 6 and 7 goals in the same weekend, then in the same season both won by 6 and 7 goals in the same weekend, anything is possible

 

[devilish]

All good points mate, but on the flip side you have also never seen weekends where utd and Liverpool lost by 6 and 7 goals in the same weekend, then in the same season both won by 6 and 7 goals in the same weekend, anything is possible

Well let's see.

I am not completely Ole out. I've said it many times that I'd wish the guy got proper help. That doesn't mean a blank cheque to buy every British talent he sets his eye upon but more in terms of experienced coaches, a top DOF, a technical director etc. When you consider our structure (inexperienced CEO, inexperienced head of recruitment, inexperienced manager, inexperienced coaches etc), we're lucky we're not lingering in the bottom half of the EPL table. That's the sort of progress I'd like to see this season and not this rollercoaster.

Having said that there's plenty of games that will need to be played and that defence is diabolical.

 

[Longshanks]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

Yes what a disgrace that we are talking about possibly winning a title when we have got ourselves into a position to possibly challenge for a title I mean that would be as silly as writing the season off because of one or two bad results away from home in Europe, because big clubs never lose away in europe? Right?

Honestly let us enjoy the relative success of the season so far, I dont think anyone genuinely believes that we are gonna go on and win the title from this position but there's nothing wrong with talking about the possibility of it and in this season you just never know.

I mean I'm sure you will the one of the first to start up the doom wagon the next time we have the audacity to have a bad day and lose a game of football, but it wouldn't be contradictory of you to complain about other fans enjoying some positivity by getting carried away with some negativity would it?

 

[Tomics]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

I don't think people are getting carried away. Some of us are just positive and there is nothing wrong with that. What is the alternative really ? Give up since we won't win the league? Or give up since our arse was handled by tiny Istanbul and Leipzig ?

 

[devilish]

Yes what a disgrace that we are talking about possibly winning a title when we have got ourselves into a position to possibly challenge for a title I mean that would be as silly as writing the season off because of one or two bad results away from home in Europe, because big clubs never lose away in europe? Right?

Honestly let us enjoy the relative success of the season so far, I dont think anyone genuinely believes that we are gonna go on and win the title from this position but there's nothing wrong with talking about the possibility of it and in this season you just never know.

I mean I'm sure you will the one of the first to start up the doom wagon the next time we have the audacity to have a bad day and lose a game of football, but it wouldn't be contradictory of you to complain about other fans enjoying some positivity by getting carried away with some negativity would it?

I am sticking to facts mate ie the CL. We won't be in it due to defeats against 2 clubs with o e 10th of our budget. Now as said before. If you wish to celebrate the league title 13 games into the league then be my guest. I can't see us winning the league with that leaky defence (that Ole spent 145m on btw).aybe the EPL should issue a 3rd by Christmas trophy. God only knows how Ole needs a trophy

 

[lysglimt]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

One match means absolutely nothing during a season. I am not saying we will beat Liverpool this season, I still think we lack a few players. But even Ferguson had 1-2 matches almost every single season where we got hammered - but with that team you knew they would bounce back the next match.

 

[devilish]

One match means absolutely nothing during a season. I am not saying we will beat Liverpool this season, I still think we lack a few players. But even Ferguson had 1-2 matches almost every single season where we got hammered - but with that team you knew they would bounce back the next match.

Its actually 2 games and it costed us CL qualification. Oh well

 

[Flexdegea]

I wish I could share your confidence.

I've yet to see anyone win a league title with a shit defence. That include the great Sir Alex Ferguson himself. Our results are inconsistent and we've yet to find a way to break tough defences that drop deep.

His last title defence our defence was poor for huge chunks of the season. Our ability to score goals bailed us out, RVP I remember at the start of the season.

We still had big hitters but was slow bedding into the season was plenty of goals leaked lot of players in the down turn

 

[Withnail]

Well let's see.

I am not completely Ole out. I've said it many times that I'd wish the guy got proper help. That doesn't mean a blank cheque to buy every British talent he sets his eye upon but more in terms of experienced coaches, a top DOF, a technical director etc. When you consider our structure (inexperienced CEO, inexperienced head of recruitment, inexperienced manager, inexperienced coaches etc), we're lucky we're not lingering in the bottom half of the EPL table. That's the sort of progress I'd like to see this season and not this rollercoaster.

Having said that there's plenty of games that will need to be played and that defence is diabolical.

How are we lucky we're not in the bottom half of the table?

The pessimism is off the scale with you.

Yes our defence needs to improve but it's more from individual errors that we are out of the CL. I think we can shore things up at the back as the season progresses. We had one of the best defensive records in the league last year but we definitely need to strengthen that are as it doesn't appear that either of our pact CB can stay fit.

Regardless of our defensive issues, I honestly don't see how you can look around the league and say that there are three teams who will do better than us this year; Man City, Chelsea, Spurs all have their issues and have been worse than us so far.

The CL exit was disappointing but there's every reason to be optimistic about this season as this is our highest league position at this stage in years. It's certainly better than last season so there's undeniably progress and we've a much better squad.

A team doesn't pick up the most points or close to the most pts in a calendar year through luck.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Well let's see.

I am not completely Ole out. I've said it many times that I'd wish the guy got proper help. That doesn't mean a blank cheque to buy every British talent he sets his eye upon but more in terms of experienced coaches, a top DOF, a technical director etc. When you consider our structure (inexperienced CEO, inexperienced head of recruitment, inexperienced manager, inexperienced coaches etc), we're lucky we're not lingering in the bottom half of the EPL table. That's the sort of progress I'd like to see this season and not this rollercoaster.

Having said that there's plenty of games that will need to be played and that defence is diabolical.

what’s the % of British players he’s bought? How many foreign players has he bought since the last British player?

you need to change the record.

 

[Longshanks]

I am sticking to facts mate ie the CL. We won't be in it due to defeats against 2 clubs with o e 10th of our budget. Now as said before. If you wish to celebrate the league title 13 games into the league then be my guest. I can't see us winning the league with that leaky defence (that Ole spent 145m on btw).aybe the EPL should issue a 3rd by Christmas trophy. God only knows how Ole needs a trophy

It wont the defence that let's us down, it will be our habit of missing very good chances, it's the reason were no longer in the CL aswell.

Christmas is always a good point to see where the team is and then talk about what's its capable off, we are in the title race we might not be come March, but at the moment we are there are just about enough encouraging signs to suggest the team has a chance of mounting a title challenge but there also enough signs to suggest that we wont and will fall away. Noone is celebrating anything yet but I dont think I'm alone in saying I'm enjoying this season more than any of the previous 7, and its the first time since SAF left that at christmas its felt like we could be in contention for a title. We more than likely wont win it, but its nice to actually have a chance of it.

 

[shaky]

We're just 13-14 games in the league and we're already talking about winning the title. That despite having our arse handled to us by tiny Istanbul whatever and Leipzig. We really became small time.

Small time to discuss a league challenge, when challenging for the top at xmas time? I feel sorry for people who can't even allow themselves to enjoy the football when we are playing fairly well. Must be such a miserable existence.

 

[Lentwood]

Do you get any enjoyment whatsoever from Man Utd @devilish?

There’s a difference between posters getting their “PL Winners 2021” tattoo’s done and people just being happy that we’re actually not already 15pts behind the leaders like we have been in recent seasons at Christmas

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Small time to discuss a league challenge, when challenging for the top at xmas time? I feel sorry for people who can't even allow themselves to enjoy the football when we are playing fairly well. Must be such a miserable existence.

Exactly. Well put.

what I see is a team developing, and getting better, with some really exciting players.

we are at the right end of the table. We are inconsistent, but then 19 clubs in the league are either inconsistent or shit, so it’s a silly stick to get beaten with.

no matter where we finish, there is progress, and it’s we are in the best position we have been in since Fergie left.

am enjoying this, why wouldn’t you?

my standards haven’t dropped, and I’m not a “top red”.

 

[georgipep]

Do you get any enjoyment whatsoever from Man Utd @devilish?

There’s a difference between posters getting their “PL Winners 2021” tattoo’s done and people just being happy that we’re actually not already 15pts behind the leaders like we have been in recent seasons at Christmas

Can you not enjoy the team and football without thinking we are in the title race? Or is it a prerequisite?

 

[Fletchageddon]

1 Liverpool 14, +20, 40

2 Leicester 14, +24, 32

3 Manchester City 14, +23, 29

4 Chelsea 14, +8, 26

5 Tottenham 14, +3, 20

6 Wolverhampton Wanderers 14, +2, 20

7 Sheffield United 14, +4, 19

8 Arsenal 14, -1, 19

9 Manchester United 14, +4, 18


This was the table after 14 games last year. We are 8 points better off with a game in hand.

#oleout

 

[Dr Foo]

Please read again. I said shit defence, not shit team. Midfield and forward line are relatively fine. The problem lie in the defence unit which is incredibly error prone even when it gets all the protection it can get. Better coaching and better tactics can help, however they won't make Maguire/Lindelof fast (or intelligent) or push DDG to leave the comfort of his goal line. I still can't figure it out how on earth did we spent 80m on such average CB. He's got no pace, no leadership, little positioning and he constantly need to be nannied. Prime Wes, Johnsen, Bruce and Evans were better then him let alone Rio, Vidic, Pally and Stam.

I agree with this. All good teams and title winners are built from the back, and while our spirit and offence is promising & exciting, there is no way we can continue to come from behind every game. Let's hope the Leeds game sets a precedence for starting games better, but it is evident that our defence is still porous/error prone with each opposition attack or set piece.

I was thinking about this too - despite spending so much on new defenders, has our defence regressed or progressed? Even our previous supposed second stringers such as Wes Brown, Johnny Evans etc seem to inspire more confidence. Even the Blind - Smalling partnership seems more effective. Our full backs have errors in them too, and keep over tucking in for some reason.

If we can somehow be in contention this season it would be an achievement. Ole has done well to move us in the right direction despite his lack of high level credentials and other problems in the club.

It's good to be positive, whilst level headed amidst polarities with each short term run of results. I think it's premature and unnecessary pressure to even mention any thoughts of the title at this stage unless there are some concrete plans to sign top class additions in Jan, plus some radical uptick in defensive organisation. It is however more enjoyable to watch out team these days, and I will savour it over the festive period.

 

[Tom Cato]

I think 4th is the best we can get given our circumstances (shit defence, unexperienced manager + coaching staff etc). Irrespective of that it's still 14 games in the league. There plenty of games coming through and every man and his dog knows that we're ridiculously flawed. Luck will carry us so far.

However don't let me stop you celebrating the league title in Christmas mate. I didn't stop Liverpool fans during the Houllier/Benitez doing that, let alone fellow fans.

Do you ever stop to consider what kind of energy you bring into a room? Geniune question.

 

[youngrell]

Supporting a football team is all about the journey. If you can't enjoy the journey then you don't deserve to enjoy the destination.

 

[ReddBalls]

Supporting a football team is all about the journey. If you can't enjoy the journey then you don't deserve to enjoy the destination.

They won't anyway.