That ship sailed before you signed up here a few weeks ago, didn't it? You seem very anti Lampard in most of your posts.
Which is fine, we're all allowed an opinion of course.
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Chelsea 2020/21 - General discussion
- Thread starter duffer
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Which is fine, we're all allowed an opinion of course.
Yeah, I was never going to be critical of him last season and the job he done was excellent. However there are no excuses this season. He has the same squad as last with an additional £200m worth of players. He refuses to drop his favourites despite looking exhausted or out of form.
I hate being critical of Lampard. It just doesn’t feel right.
His in-game management is just so so poor. There are people on the forum pointing out the same errors we do as fans. It’s bewildering that the manager cannot identify these obvious changes required. The 4231 formation suits the squad so well.
Really? I don't get that from your posts at all.
What, from the multiple times I’ve mentioned it? Or the multiple times I’ve mentioned why this situation proves it is never a good idea to hire a club legend as manager?
Do you think Lampard should remain in charge?
Yes to all the above.
Good point. It would seem that Lampard has been taking notes from Jose with that particular tactic.
They seem to have generally tightened up at the back, but he now needs to sort the attacking blend out because they don’t look all that threatening truth be told.
We have the squad to achieve something this season but we also have a rookie manager and what we're seeing is sort of thing you could expect from a rookie manager who is essentially learning on the job.
Any chance you’ll give us Rudiger on loan.
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Hopefully Roman doesn’t get an itchy trigger finger.
the longer Lampard stays, the better. They are going nowhere under him.
the longer Lampard stays, the better. They are going nowhere under him.
Which is exactly what everyone is saying about United and Solskjær, ironically.
Out of curiosity, what is it you see in Lampard that makes you want to keep him?
As a rival fan looking in, I still struggle to see what Frank is trying to achieve either in style or team structure. I’m not sure whether they’ve progressed since last season. If anything, I’d argue they’ve gone backwards despite spending so much. I’m sure his plans this season were probably heavily focused on Werner, Havertz and Ziyech. I don’t think Werner was ever brought in to play left wing. Havertz just hasn’t worked so far. Ziyech has been good but limited in appearances.
With the players at his disposal, he should surely at least be performing better than this. Yes they aren’t far off the top of the league but performances like Arsenal should not be happening. Not with the players he has. Arsenal were there for the taking but were made to look like a team bang in form.
I think they won't finish top 4 and Lampard will get sacked. I look at them and honestly see nothing but them struggling to get it.
They probably aren’t wrong. Under Ole we have been a moments club. We have periods of great form then fall off a cliff, then turn it around. We’re in a decent spell now but you just feel a bad spell is right round the corner. It’s happened about 4 times now.
Ole has made some absolutely baffling decisions this season. People just don’t talk about it because we’ve been pretty good for the most part. Everton in the cup was the best he’s ever been as a manager, then he went & ruined it picking Lindelof & James as our right side at Leicester. With a top manager we’d be about 6 points clear at the top right now.
It's Frank Lampard.
It's sentimental of course but that's what football is for fans, isn't it? It is for me at least.
I can understand the sentiment to an extent, but ultimately you want your team to progress and succeed more than any sentiment right?
I’m not an Ole in or Out. My view has always been if he performs and shows signs of progression than he deserves to keep going. If we show signs of regressing or no clear direction then he deserves to go. The club always comes first.
Right now I just don’t see any real progression with Lampard. There are certainly better candidates out there who are attainable who would be able to get a better tune out of this squad.
Is he still trying to play attacking football? It's much easier to stick behind a manager like that, Jose was unbearably boring when we weren't winning (as were Moyes and LVG)
Sentiment wins you nothing. He isn’t good enough to be manager of Chelsea. I hope you keep him because you won’t be a threat for as long as he’s there.
I think Ole is a bad manager but I wouldn’t dream of swapping him for Lampard. He’s nowhere near good enough. You will win absolutely nothing with him in charge & you will get nowhere near a title race. Yet the Chelsea fans will back him because he’s Frank Lampard. It’s a beautiful situation. Long may it continue.
#LampardIn #TrustTheProcess
If, by the end of the season we look shite and miss out on the Champs League, I'll probably want him gone.
He did (at least) as well as expected last year and we're currently 2 points off of 2nd, not even halfway into the season.
I'd not want anyone sacked at this point, let alone someone who has earned a bit of leeway.
Ole's transfers and culture change are also the reason we are here in the first place. Like you said, under Ole for the most part we've been good. In fact, 2020 we've been fantastic considering where we were after Jose left. Yet somehow we are the ones who are always doubted.
Do you think any Chelsea fans would want Ole as Chelsea manager? Of course not. That's not a dig but you not wanting Lampard at Man United is hardly worth mentioning.I think Ole is a bad manager but I wouldn’t dream of swapping him for Lampard. He’s nowhere near good enough. You will win absolutely nothing with him in charge, and the fans will back him because he’s Frank Lampard. You love to see it
It's the Man United fans doing the doubting!
I swear that Lampard gets shit on here because Chelsea fans are not as shitty to him as some Man United fans were to Ole.
What's funny for me is this. If Ole were a manager with proven track record prior to coming that performed exactly the way he has done so far, he would have been considered a good manager. Like under LVG, fans would have been holding on to our initial form or the post lockdown decimations and had complete faith in him.
His tactics would have been considered good, especially in big games prior to this season. His subs wouldn't be as questioned and his transfers would have been considered fantastic. People were comparing him with arteta 2 months ago despite their records being polar opposites , with ole having a far better record.
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Neither are good enough. Gary Neville said it on sky, big clubs need to drop the sentiment & hire the best in class.
Still waiting for them to show they're a level above us like so many on here thought.
No doubt you'll find a growing section of Chelsea fans who agree with you, but the problem with this view is that people (not you, or maybe you, don't know) were saying the complete opposite when Chelsea were scoring goals and winning games, and what you just said was said about United several weeks ago (in fact at the time Chelsea were being held up as some kind of example that United should have followed) so it (both sets of views) comes across as nothing more than reactionary.
Nothing is as absolute as the way you put it. We're not as bad as current form suggests, but we do have a rookie manager, so maybe there is a ceiling in how the far team can go but ultimately, it's going to be an up and down season for a lot of teams.
You should take that up with the Man United fans on here who thought that.
I'm not sure why it always boils down to Ole v Frank. Yes there's very obvious similarities but Ole was a caretaker brought in to steady the post Mourinho ship. He did pretty well and was given the job. Frank was brought in totally fresh and seen as a change in approach kind of cut appointment - a sign that Chelsea were going to do things differently.
Both arrived where they are in very different circumstances.
Both arrived where they are in very different circumstances.
I know I've said it before but when Ole was seen to be struggling, a lot of people on here used Frank's decent start at Chelsea as a stick to beat Ole with.
That's turned into "feck Frank Lampard, the fat fraud".
As with all things, I blame Man United fans.
They both rode the new manager wave, Ole more than Frank in that sense. Its only when it starts settling like it has already for Ole and it is now for Frank you start to see beyond that.
I would just like to see Chelsea either go all in and back Frank and a fresh new project or cut him loose and revert to type. Would seem pointless hovering around the two.
Agreed with this. Also, closet Chelsea fan wanting what's best for our club???
I'm actually beginning to think the job is beyond him - the starting XI today was what did it for me. Pulisic and Kante have suffered from recurrent hamstring injuries yet they're starting again 48 hours after the last game? Jorginho plays for some godforsaken reason over Gilmour? Both starting CBs and Havertz don't play so we have no threat on set pieces? Is Lampard aware that midfielders run more than defenders - how else can starting Mount and Kante (out of position) while swapping out both CBs be justified?
If Lampard hides behind the players when he's not putting them in the best position to succeed then he's gotta go. Give me Tuchel.
I think the worrying thing is Frank is starting to get a little bit arsey in his interviews too. If he starts to lose the dressing room at Chelsea it can be very unforgiving.Agreed with this. Also, closet Chelsea fan wanting what's best for our club???
I'm actually beginning to think the job is beyond him - the starting XI today was what did it for me. Pulisic and Kante have suffered from recurrent hamstring injuries yet they're starting again 48 hours after the last game? Jorginho plays for some godforsaken reason over Gilmour? Both starting CBs and Havertz don't play so we have no threat on set pieces? Is Lampard aware that midfielders run more than defenders - how else can starting Mount and Kante (out of position) while swapping out both CBs be justified?
If Lampard hides behind the players when he's not putting them in the best position to succeed then he's gotta go. Give me Tuchel.
Will be interesting to see what the club do in January in the market. I've seen a few Chelsea fans complain about the line up and tactics lately which can't be a good sign. I have to say on the outside looking in I find it odd we've not seen more of Gilmour and also don't get the reluctance to use Giroud.
I'm still not really sure who buys your players either and what Frank's involvement is?
Chelsea have the best defenders in the league alongside Liverpool, but their attack is underwhelming. About 7 to 8 set of attackers I would take ahead of theirs. Havertz and Werner are getting exposed outside the Bundelisga.
It's a transfer system by committee - no one has the ultimate authority, but Marina, Cech, and Frank (among others) can all push for signings. Lampard in particular wanted Chilwell and Ziyech, and he and Cech were involved in convincing Werner, for instance. Essentially the setup ensures that no one person has too much sway over our transfers; everything is vetted and evaluated in the broader context of the club. Certainly there are transfers that are made without Frank's express involvement - I believe Havertz falls into this category as he was viewed as a unique opportunity by the club to sign a world class talent in the absence of serious competition.
Totally agreed re: Gilmour, though to be fair he's coming back from a fairly serious knee injury. I think you and I have talked about Giroud on here previously, but I'd just reiterate that he's a wonderful weapon but that he has to be used in specific situations against low block teams. His presence disrupts our pressing against any team that actually tries to play out from the back, in my opinion.
That bold one is what I never understand about the club’s fans. A month ago they said good and positive things what their own manager done and bring to the the team. And within 5-6 games, it’s enough to turn those good and positive things disappear from the exact same Chelsea fans said about the manager. I heard this a lot from Chelsea fans particularly, some in this forum, some in YouTube and even my mate Chelsea fans.Agreed with this. Also, closet Chelsea fan wanting what's best for our club???
I'm actually beginning to think the job is beyond him - the starting XI today was what did it for me. Pulisic and Kante have suffered from recurrent hamstring injuries yet they're starting again 48 hours after the last game? Jorginho plays for some godforsaken reason over Gilmour? Both starting CBs and Havertz don't play so we have no threat on set pieces? Is Lampard aware that midfielders run more than defenders - how else can starting Mount and Kante (out of position) while swapping out both CBs be justified?
If Lampard hides behind the players when he's not putting them in the best position to succeed then he's gotta go. Give me Tuchel.
Not like I ever agree with every single those good and positive things you lot said because I never see it with Frank even last season but if lot of you last month talked about the positivity what he brings to the team and hyping him up then surely it’s fair to stick with those positivity and trust the manager’s process. How is one month of football is enough to make the positive things disappear. Otherwise, you lot were just lying to yourself last month.
As much of a bellend DT from AFTV is, he's actually spot on about Lampard - he took Derby county from 4th to 4th in the Championship, and doesn't seem (so far) to be progressing this Chelsea side beyond their last season finish despite Roman opening the checkbook like its 2004 again.
The worrying thing is, even if he still secures top 4 I don't think his job would be safe. I get the impression Roman was expecting the spending spree to materialise into a title challenge, not another scrap for top 4. Tuchel being available and a new stream of hipster managers entering the fray such as Nagelsmann, Hasenhüttl, Rose etc, might just tempt him to swing that hammer again, sentiment be damned.
The worrying thing is, even if he still secures top 4 I don't think his job would be safe. I get the impression Roman was expecting the spending spree to materialise into a title challenge, not another scrap for top 4. Tuchel being available and a new stream of hipster managers entering the fray such as Nagelsmann, Hasenhüttl, Rose etc, might just tempt him to swing that hammer again, sentiment be damned.
The derby is not really something fair to judge the manager, that could be learning process but whether he’s making progress or no to the team right now is the only way to judge him.