Bruno Fernandes against the Premier League Top 6 sides

[romufc]

So true. It’s like it’s a negative.

“Oh ffs he’s so good at pens and free kicks, I hate him”

Yet, I hear pundits and people who have played the game at the highest level saying.. these big games hinge on a moment of brilliance or set piece...

If these people think set pieces are not counted... go have a look how many semis / finals have been won via a set piece.. the number will be higher than people think.

 

[RUCK4444]

Bottler... Scoring all those pens where bottle is paramount... Bottler

How dare he show so much composure and reliability in such high pressure moments! Disgrace.

 

[RedDevil@84]

Funny theory. He was one Allison's foot away from scoring the winner.

 

[Random Task]

Fun theory:

Bruno the Bottler shrewdly bottled the chance for later use. Only to be opened in the event of an emergency, such as the title decider against City near the end of the season.

 

[Mike Oxard]

He’s a significant improvement on what we had, but he’s not in the very top category of creative midfielders in my view. He has too many misplaced passes and gets caught in possession too often, particularly against the better sides - probably why RM, Barca et al didn’t go in for him a few years ago.

 

[cyberman]

That Chelsea side is a top side?!!

 

[Infra-red]

How well are the rest of our attacking players doing against the top 6?

Shaw and Lindelof were our best performers on Sunday - it's hard for the attacking/creative players to shine when we don't have much of the ball.

 

[Borys]

How well are the rest of our attacking players doing against the top 6?

Shaw and Lindelof were our best performers on Sunday - it's hard for the attacking/creative players to shine when we don't have much of the ball.

It's hard to get any momentum going. It is not clear to me why Ole sets up the team like this. We're uncomfortable, nervous, and we seem to have no shape.

 

[eire-red]

No the challenge is for Ole to continuously emphasize to him when and where to take those risks. Bruno himself has to realize within the flow of the game how to adjust his own style as well. If we are struggling to get into the oppositions half, then the first time we break successfully Bruno decides to have a go from 30 yards out, then it's just as bad of a decision as when Rashford runs himself into an alley. But if we are camped in a team's half, then by all means Bruno should pull out all of his tricks needed to break down a team.

If Bruno himself can't see the difference between the two situations though, then he'll always be at a level slightly below the true top players in the world. Personally, I don't think he's this ignorant, but I do think it's a bit of ego and that feeling that as our talisman he has to be the one to create the defining moment, and that causes the stupid giveaways.

Fair enough, I cannot fault you with your analysis, he does lose posession quite a lot.

The only problem I would have with what you're saying is that risk taking is a huge part of Bruno's game. In your scenario, that final ball he's being told not to play could be the defence splitting pass.

I don't think it's as cut and dry as you're making it out, as in Ole can just pull Bruno to one side and say, 'listen, you need to cool down on your risk taking' or something along those lines. That's his game, who he is as a player.

He looks to hurt the opposition at every opportunity. He's a gambler, and why would he change? He's the talisman of one of the biggest clubs in the world, and arguably the best player in the PL. He might be the character that can take criticism from the manager, but it's a fine line because you're trying to change what's a fundamental part of his game, and something that's transformed us from woeful to title challengers.

No player is perfect, even KDB gives the ball away all the time. City average 70% posession or something though, so maybe it's not as noticable. The question is, does the pros of having Bruno in the team outweigh the cons of his play style? The answer is absolutely yes.

 

[Bristol_Red_87]

Get the criticism of Bruno, he's been poor for a while now and needs a rest, along with Rashford.

He definitely takes on too much responsibility (something he can hopefully start to relinquish a little now Pogba looks born again) and in the big games, it gets to him a little, as those "25%" passes are reduced further due to the caliber of opposition.

Recharge the batteries and get him off the bench tomorrow and Sunday if required.

 

[McTerminator]

What I am more surprised about is since when did set pieces stop becoming important in football games?

Exactly. For years we have been distraught at how poor our set pieces were, including penalties! In fact didn't we miss a painful number of penalties last season before we signed Bruno which really hurt us?

Bruno has been brilliant since coming in and even if he drops off a little from the standards he has set for himself, he is still going to be one of our best players.

 

[lsd]

Funny theory. He was one Allison's foot away from scoring the winner.

The problem is he didn't score though

 

[SadlerMUFC]

I think when someone is at the top there will always be others who are looking to knock him down. Bruno is our best player and the main reason why we are where we are right now. Not only is he a great player, but he makes everyone around him better. Everyone has lifted their game since his arrival. Everyone. And for pundits to look for reasons to knock him down is one thing, but to see our own supporters knocking him is (to quote Jimmy Lidell) bang out of order...

 

[wrepdrep]

I don't watch United games, but from what I'm reading it sounds like the classic case of overdepending on a player against strong opposition.
We had this problem with Zlatan in his first spell with us in 2010-2012. Great teams would just man-mark him out of the games. Our entire attack nullified.
This problem was reduced through Kevin Prince Boateng who took advantage of all eyes being on Zlatan.
For his 2nd spell this problem never existed because we do not overdepend on Zlatan. If you man-mark Zlatan then you're falling into the trap. Rebic, Theo and Hakan would destroy you for leaving them unmarked.

Liverpool used to have a similar problem with Suarez. He became known here as a flat-track bully because he wasn't nearly as effective in big games. But that changed with the arrival of Sturridge who allowed Suarez to take a deeper, playmaking role in the big games. Suarez wasn't scoring the goals, but he was dominating the games and assisting the goals.

This is often the case with players who are referred to as "big game bottlers". Some of them are bottlers, but for quality players it's usually tactical.

Looking at your lineup against Liverpool and seeing Martial and Pogba in the wings, I can see why you would struggle. You're putting too much responsibility on Bruno to create and provide balance, with an out of position Pogba on the right wing, and an undependable winger such as Martial in the other.
Any world class CAM will struggle without the support of wingers that know what they're doing. Martial has poor awareness and Pogba is not a winger.

 

[RedDevil@84]

The problem is he didn't score though

That has nothing to do with theory OP put out. Unable to put in a performance against top 6.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Fair enough, I cannot fault you with your analysis, he does lose posession quite a lot.

The only problem I would have with what you're saying is that risk taking is a huge part of Bruno's game. In your scenario, that final ball he's being told not to play could be the defence splitting pass.

I don't think it's as cut and dry as you're making it out, as in Ole can just pull Bruno to one side and say, 'listen, you need to cool down on your risk taking' or something along those lines. That's his game, who he is as a player.

He looks to hurt the opposition at every opportunity. He's a gambler, and why would he change? He's the talisman of one of the biggest clubs in the world, and arguably the best player in the PL. He might be the character that can take criticism from the manager, but it's a fine line because you're trying to change what's a fundamental part of his game, and something that's transformed us from woeful to title challengers.

No player is perfect, even KDB gives the ball away all the time. City average 70% posession or something though, so maybe it's not as noticable. The question is, does the pros of having Bruno in the team outweigh the cons of his play style? The answer is absolutely yes.

My point is more that Bruno himself just has to be smarter about "risks" especially in games in which we aren't having the majority of the ball. Not all "risks" are created equal. It's one thing if Bruno tries an early cross to a runner that gets cleared away, or a defense splitting pass that's well cut out. But it's an entirely different thing when he's having poor efforts from 35 yards out or attempting numerous long balls over the defense from well inside our own half after we've worked so hard off of the ball to get it back from a team like Liverpool or City.

He's shown that he can play more towards the "smart" risks, but the bad side of him tends to come out when he's having an off game.

 

[U.N.C.L.E]

Anyone critiquing Bruno has full permission to borrow my de Lorean, go back in time, and alter the transfer so he never came here.

In my 50 years plus watching United I’ve only seen a handful of players with that talismanic quality to transform a side. Cantona was one. Bruno is another.

He’s not perfect. But for eff’s sake - I’d rather he was IN the side than not.

 

[lsd]

That has nothing to do with theory OP put out. Unable to put in a performance against top 6.

He had a terrible game and missed a sitter

 

[HowieC]

I think its fine if hes a flat track bully. We need match winners even against the lower clubs

 

[MrSingh2002]

We don't attack enough in the games against the top 6.

I think that's more down to Oles tactics than Fernandes's ability.

 

[TMDaines]

Another chance for both him and United to sort out this funk on Sunday in the cup.

 

[Adnan]

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[ROFLUTION]

It's simple really:

We sit back therefore he has less time on the ball to make his mark.

 

[lsd]

It's a difficult one to understand whether it's a case of opposition being harder or just less opportunities.

Ruud was always called out as a flat track bully Ronaldo too until he put it to bed.

Then you have players like Vardy and Drogba who seen to score more against the top teams than the teams in the bottom half.

 

[georgipep]

Better opposition will naturally do a better job of containing him.

Playing in front of our least progressive midfield duo will naturally lead to him dropping deeper and further from his danger zone.

Less chances in front of him will naturally push him to take even further risks and thus become even less successful.

None of the above are bad things, just consequences.

Also:

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[0le]

Bruno stats since he joined against the big clubs:

EL 2019/20 Season:
Sevilla - 1G (pen)

PL 2019/20 Season:
Chelsea - 1A
Man City - 1A
Spurs - 1G (pen)
Leicester - 1G (pen)

FA CUP 2019/20 Season:
Chelsea - 1G (pen)

======================

UCL 2020/21 Season:
PSG - 1G (pen)
RB Leipzig - 1A
PSG - X
RB Leipzig - 1G (pen)

PL 2020/21 Season:
Spurs - 1G (pen)
Chelsea - X
Arsenal - X
Man City - X
Leicester - 1G, 1A
Liverpool - X

EFL CUP 2020/21 Season:
Man City - X

2019/2020 Total: 6 Games, 4 goals, 2 assists (includes 4 pen)
2020/2021 Total: 11 Games, 4 goals, 2 assists (includes 3 pen)
Combined: 17 Games, 8 goals, 4 Assists (includes 7 pen)

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During same time period KDB against the big clubs:

CL 2019/20 Season:
Real Madrid - 1G, 1A (pen)
Real Madrid - X

PL 2019/20 Season:
Spurs - X
Leicester - X
Arsenal - 1G (pen)
Chelsea - 1G (FK)
Liverpool - 1G, 1A (pen)

FA CUP 2019/20 Season:
Arsenal - X

======================

PL 2020/21 Season:
Leicester - X
Liverpool - 1A
Spurs - X
Man Utd - X
Chelsea - 1G, 1A

EFL CUP 2020/21 Season:
Man Utd - X

2019/2020 Total: 8 Games, 4 goals, 2 assists (includes 3 pen)
2020/2021 Total: 6 Games, 1 goals, 2 assists (includes 0 pen)
Combined: 14 Games, 5 goals, 4 assists (includes 3 pen)

=====================================================================================

Bruno: Combined: 17 Games, 8 goals, 4 assists (includes 7 pen)
KDB: Combined: 14 Games, 5 goals, 4 assists (includes 3 pen)

 

[TMDaines]

Somewhat put this to bed! Just needs that goal from open play now.

 

[0le]

This thread will be the gift that keeps giving for years to come.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

Close this now

We weren’t scoring, so if the club isn’t scoring or performing, how can Bruno? It was a collective problem against the top 6, not a Bruno problem.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

That goal and THAT cross, the entire performance in fact, best player on the pitch in his time.

 

[horsechoker]

There you fecking go!

 

[thegregster]

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[The Firestarter]

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Basically bottler

 

[Harry190]

Beautiful ratface.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

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Oh yes. So sweet as I was having this debate with a few City fans today.

Humble pie time.

 

[SAFMUTD]

He was kind of okay today I guess.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Well feck me then.

 

[Jonno]

\\Thread

 

[Inigo Montoya]

It’s not how you start out, it’s how you finish.

 

[Chief123]

He’s a significant improvement on what we had, but he’s not in the very top category of creative midfielders in my view. He has too many misplaced passes and gets caught in possession too often, particularly against the better sides - probably why RM, Barca et al didn’t go in for him a few years ago.

If he’s not in the very top categories of creative midfielders, then I honestly don’t know who is. How on earth does he have such high stats for “key chances” created if he’s not creative.