Shaw confirms ref bottled the penalty

[Rightnr]

We played awful today and we didn't really deserve to win more than Chelsea but that was a stonewall penalty. It sure as hell would have have been a pen if it was against us.

 

[GwilDor]

It was obviously a penalty.

If the ref said something stupid then the Premier League should remind him of his duties and potentially sanction him. There's no reason for a referee to be justifying his decisions to players anyway.

Shaw should've kept his trap shut.

Why should he keep his trap shut? Do you live in a dictatureship?

To offer some bit of balance, I wonder was it a badly articulated way of saying that the offence involved an inadvertent handball and giving a penalty for it would be a judgement call (which would get people arguing). I dunno. I don't agree with it, but it seems such a nakedly daft thing to say to a player, that I sort of assume that it couldn't have been as watery as it sounds.

I think we are pretty much aligned in opinion. I’ll accept a decision i desagree with if you tell me why. I’ll still disagree, but i’ll know why.

 

[redshaw]

Sad thing is the title chase could be somewhat alive if we didn't get fecked over in the past few weeks. We're capable of getting a win away to City but little will come of it now and City can go for us. I mean it's City's title but it could've been a closer run in instead of this runaway train.

It's crazy the amount of inspection and scrutiny on our games, even when 6-0 up yet Leicester have had more. I don't think many know or care out there how many Leicester have, they've could've had 20 and it would be a footnote only.

If defenders make fouls and handballs in the box every game then it's a pen every game. It's up to defenders to stop rather than refs only giving some now and again and being wary of some media circus surrounding our games.

 

[Rightnr]

Sad thing is the title could be somewhat alive if we didn't get fecked over in the past few weeks. We're capable of getting a win away to City.

It's crazy the amount of inspection and scrutiny on our games, even when 6-0 up yet Leicester have had more. I don't think many know or care out there how many Leicester have, they've could've had 20 and it would a footnote only.

If defenders make fouls and handballs in the box every game then it's a pen every game. It's up to defenders to stop rather than refs only giving some now and again and being wary of some media circus surrounding our games.

I am sorry but this is some laughable clutching at straws.

We've scored one goal against the traditional top 6 all season which was a penalty again Spurs where we got smashed 6-1. We've gone negative against these teams EVERY SINGLE time.

How can you people that have been brought up with SAF's football and mentality of risking it for the win be sitting here crying we weren't given a controversial handball against Chesea?

 

[GwilDor]

I am sorry but this is some laughable clutching at straws.

We've scored one goal against the traditional top 6 all season which was a penalty again Spurs where we got smashed 6-1. We've gone negative against these teams EVERY SINGLE time.

How can you people that have been brought up with SAF's football and mentality of risking it for the win be sitting here crying we weren't given a controversial handball against Chesea?

Straying from the thread, but still. Last year we were reactive, playing on the counter in most, if not all our top 6 games. It was effective, but it affected our play against bottom half teams. Now we have progressed so far that Oke thinks its time to take our game to the top teams, and stop playing like underdogs. That will not get us the same amount of points(against top 6 teams) short term, but it is the right direction to return us to the Manchester United playing the Jnited way and getting glory down the road.

 

[::sonny::]

 

[Compton22]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Believed? Don't they record the refs? Let's have this definitively answered.

I'm pretty sure he'd double check with Maguire first before speaking publicly about it as well.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Believed? Don't they record the refs? Let's have this definitively answered

So has Ole just gone off what Luke has said or has he spoken to Harry. If the latter, did he mishear what Harry said as well?

 

[Red00012]

It was obviously a penalty.

If the ref said something stupid then the Premier League should remind him of his duties and potentially sanction him. There's no reason for a referee to be justifying his decisions to players anyway.

Shaw should've kept his trap shut.

Why would he keep his mouth shut ?
There’s a been a few dubious VAR’s decisions against us since Klopp decided to open his trap . It needs to get out that refs are been influenced by outsiders instead of applying the rules .

 

[Brophs]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Believed? Don't they record the refs? Let's have this definitively answered.

I'm pretty sure he'd double check with Maguire first before speaking publicly about it as well.

The John Terry defence. "DID YOU JUST SAY I DEFINITELY WON'T GIVE THAT PENALTY BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT IT TOMORROW?"

 

[croadyman]

Why would he keep his mouth shut ?
There’s a been a few dubious VAR’s decisions against us since Klopp decided to open his trap . It needs to get out that refs are been influenced by outsiders instead of applying the rules .

Yeah just look at what they put in an article on their official site, if that was us who had done that it would be all over SSN tonight and the press tomorrow but because it's them will get brushed under the carpet

 

[Sassy Colin]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Believed? Don't they record the refs? Let's have this definitively answered.

I'm pretty sure he'd double check with Maguire first before speaking publicly about it as well.

Believed, or made up to suit his agenda? What does this even mean?

 

[Champagne Football]

I've seen those peno's not given zillions of times. Some fans are clutching at straws. We've gotten decisions our way plenty in other games. It balances itself out over the season.

 

[dogwithabone]

I’m struggling to see what box wasn’t ticked with that penalty;
Inside penalty area ? Yes.
Hit hand or arm ? Yes, hand.
Hand or arm in unnatural position ? Yes, 100%.
Ball change direction ? Yes, 100%.
I mean, how come f****** VAR can’t see it and which of the above is the referee not seeing ?

 

[acnumber9]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Believed? Don't they record the refs? Let's have this definitively answered.

I'm pretty sure he'd double check with Maguire first before speaking publicly about it as well.

Did Solskjaer mishear him as well then? Or do they mean Maguire misheard? They’ll need to get their ducks in a row on this.

 

[Ajr]

Sad thing is the title chase could be somewhat alive if we didn't get fecked over in the past few weeks. We're capable of getting a win away to City but little will come of it now and City can go for us. I mean it's City's title but it could've been a closer run in instead of this runaway train.

It's crazy the amount of inspection and scrutiny on our games, even when 6-0 up yet Leicester have had more. I don't think many know or care out there how many Leicester have, they've could've had 20 and it would be a footnote only.

If defenders make fouls and handballs in the box every game then it's a pen every game. It's up to defenders to stop rather than refs only giving some now and again and being wary of some media circus surrounding our games.

I agree, we have 5 points stolen from bad ref decisions between this game and Sheffield. Regardless of how we performed in both, that is correct and we would be only 5 points off city with them to play next week which is a lot different outlook than now.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

I’m struggling to see what box wasn’t ticked with that penalty;
Inside penalty area ? Yes.
Hit hand or arm ? Yes, hand.
Hand or arm in unnatural position ? Yes, 100%.
Ball change direction ? Yes, 100%.
I mean, how come f****** VAR can’t see it and which of the above is the referee not seeing ?

VAR did spot it. That's why the play was called back. The ref decided it's still not a pen after watching the replay.

VAR did its job here, the ref fecked us.

The ref HAS to come into question now. But knowing the FA, they'll ask some newspaper to say something racist towards Sterling and it'll all be forgotten.

 

[alexthelion]

It was obviously a penalty.

If the ref said something stupid then the Premier League should remind him of his duties and potentially sanction him. There's no reason for a referee to be justifying his decisions to players anyway.

Shaw should've kept his trap shut.

If what Shaw said is correct, then he absolutely did the right thing by highlighting the ref's ineptitude.

 

[tomaldinho1]

We have to avoid becoming RAWK.

There’s every chance he misheard or didn’t get full context, there’s no conspiracy here, refs are just crap for everyone. VAR wanted to award a peno, the ref thought the evidence was inconclusive.

 

[Sassy Colin]

I've seen those peno's not given zillions of times. Some fans are clutching at straws. We've gotten decisions our way plenty in other games. It balances itself out over the season.

Don't you understand what happened? The play was called back, why would the play be brought back if the VAR didn't report that there was an infringement? If there's no handball, then the play continues.

VAR did its job, the ref bottled it.

 

[Compton22]

We have to avoid becoming RAWK.

There’s every chance he misheard or didn’t get full context, there’s no conspiracy here, refs are just crap for everyone. VAR wanted to award a peno, the ref thought the evidence was inconclusive.

It's not being RAWK to think that he would not make such an allegation against a referee unless he was absolutely sure that this is what was said. Bare in mind that Ole didn't even know that Luke had said it and was also going off what Harry told him so to come out and say it was a case of mishearing what was said is just bizarre.

 

[Will Singh]

I don’t like to loan about refs but today was absolutely shocking, our players especially James was getting battered and even on the half time whistle but the ref just ignored it. I really hope what he says to Maguire is picked up on the mic and he gets he’s ass handed to him.

This season has been shocking overall for refereeing decisions and that’s with VAR. I’ve never ever said to a Liverpool fan that the refs wrong but this season I’ve had to agree with those cnuts too about a pen that was awarded against them!

 

[Amarsdd]

We have to avoid becoming RAWK.

There’s every chance he misheard or didn’t get full context, there’s no conspiracy here, refs are just crap for everyone. VAR wanted to award a peno, the ref thought the evidence was inconclusive.

Who is talking about conspiracies here? We're talking about the refs being influenced by outside influences i.e. other managers moaning, and the media narrative. And if what Shaw said was anywhere near the truth, then that influence was clearly the case and we've felt that for a while.

 

[Foxbatt]

We have to avoid becoming RAWK.

There’s every chance he misheard or didn’t get full context, there’s no conspiracy here, refs are just crap for everyone. VAR wanted to award a peno, the ref thought the evidence was inconclusive.

Even Joe Cole agreed that it was a penalty. If that was inconclusive after seeing on the monitor then he should go to get his eyes tested. Did the ball hit his arm? Yes. Was his arm in an unnatural position? Yes. In the old days it may not have been a penalty. But now it's a penalty. Today was daylight robbery.
The referee didn't make a mistake. He refused to give us a stonewall penalty. He refused to caution anyone when they kicked the hell out of James.

 

[OldSchoolManc]

The whole idea that any team has had too many penalties, so they shouldn’t get more, is a disgrace.
Penalties are earned by an attacking team being disrupted illegally in the box.
To even have a reason of ‘they’ve had plenty this season’ is corrupt.
Better that Ole and the players put their foot down now than let it continue any longer

 

[Champagne Football]

Don't you understand what happened? The play was called back, why would the play be brought back if the VAR didn't report that there was an infringement? If there's no handball, then the play continues.

VAR did its job, the ref bottled it.

So what your saying is that every time a ref goes to a monitor now, he absolutely 100% has to give a penalty whether he is certain or not?

Didn't you see the statement from The Premier League after the game? ........."The VAR asked the referee to look at the incident again but he stuck to his on-field decision as he felt that Hudson-Odoi didn't move his hand towards the ball."

It was not a clear cut penalty regardless of what some rose-tinted glasses fans are saying. There's been times this season those kinds of decisions have gone in our favour. We accept and move on.

 

[dogwithabone]

VAR did spot it. That's why the play was called back. The ref decided it's still not a pen after watching the replay.

VAR did its job here, the ref fecked us.

The ref HAS to come into question now. But knowing the FA, they'll ask some newspaper to say something racist towards Sterling and it'll all be forgotten.

the problem here is that when a ref is asked to take a second look if he decides to reverse the decision he’s basically saying “I messed up in the first instance by not spotting it” ..... I don’t know enough about it but how come VAR over rule some decisions but in others refer it back to the referee ? I thought they were there to assist the ref ? It’s not exactly assistance if you’re handing it back to the ref.

 

[Sassy Colin]

the problem here is that when a ref is asked to take a second look if he decides to reverse the decision he’s basically saying “I messed up in the first instance by not spotting it” ..... I don’t know enough about it but how come VAR over rule some decisions but in others refer it back to the referee ? I thought they were there to assist the ref ? It’s not exactly assistance if you’re handing it back to the ref.

But that's the whole point of it, surely. Have you seen the review system in cricket? The umpire changes his decision all the time.

 

[Foxbatt]

So what your saying is that every time a ref goes to a monitor now, he absolutely 100% has to give a penalty whether he is certain or not?

Didn't you see the statement from The Premier League after the game? ........."The VAR asked the referee to look at the incident again but he stuck to his on-field decision as he felt that Hudson-Odoi didn't move his hand towards the ball."

It was not a clear cut penalty regardless of what some rose-tinted glasses fans are saying. There's been times this season those kinds of decisions have gone in our favour. We accept and move on.

He doesn't have to move his hand towards the ball if his hand was in an unnatural position. It was raised.

 

[Compton22]

So what your saying is that every time a ref goes to a monitor now, he absolutely 100% has to give a penalty whether he is certain or not?

Didn't you see the statement from The Premier League after the game? ........."The VAR asked the referee to look at the incident again but he stuck to his on-field decision as he felt that Hudson-Odoi didn't move his hand towards the ball."

It was not a clear cut penalty regardless of what some rose-tinted glasses fans are saying. There's been times this season those kinds of decisions have gone in our favour. We accept and move on.

No, no one is saying every time a referee goes to the screen he has to give a penalty.

Only just seen that statement and that is already a fundamentally flawed reason as his arm is in an unnatural position from the offset so intent does not come into it. To the letter of the modern day law, that's as clear cut a penalty as you are likely to get.

Also, this idea that a team shouldn't get a stone wall penalty because they have had some questionable ones before needs to feck off. Officiate and rule on the incident at hand! People would have infinitely more respect for referees if they did this.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

I am sorry but this is some laughable clutching at straws.

We've scored one goal against the traditional top 6 all season which was a penalty again Spurs where we got smashed 6-1. We've gone negative against these teams EVERY SINGLE time.

How can you people that have been brought up with SAF's football and mentality of risking it for the win be sitting here crying we weren't given a controversial handball against Chesea?

He didn't say we'd be top or even close, he just said it'd be a closer race? That's not ridiculous.. today's decision could have seen us with two more points, the Sheffield Utd decisions (both ends) could have seen us with three more points (poor performance aside) so that's 5 points... hence closer because 7 points is closer than 12.

You don't have to be so confrontational to every post and negative just because you hate Ole.

Just today, you've called Ole a coward, said he only picks players on his birthday list (?), called McTominay "Scotty McFraud" and "Scotty McRugbyplayer" (hilarious), called Maguire atrocious/a fridge, Rashford lazy, called posters "clowns" or "you people" and told one to "piss off" (* post not poster?).

 

[RedDevil@84]

As a club, we can't just allow this kind of blatant influencing of referees. This kind of pre-match analysis should be punished. For example, we can't put a pre-match analysis saying "We would be facing Liverpool whose both forwards have been controversially blamed for falling way too easily, whenever near the box"

 

[Ish]

Thanks Jurgen.

 

[DOTA]

If what Shaw said is correct, then he absolutely did the right thing by highlighting the ref's ineptitude.

I disagree and I think that's looking a very big 'if' right now.

 

[Brightonian]

Sad thing is the title chase could be somewhat alive if we didn't get fecked over in the past few weeks. We're capable of getting a win away to City but little will come of it now and City can go for us. I mean it's City's title but it could've been a closer run in instead of this runaway train.

I don't know about a title chase, exactly. We'd be closer. Two results have been decisively taken away from us by egregious refereeing decisions - the defeat to Sheffield United and this draw against Chelsea. There have been bad decisions in other games but those were more in line with the usual 'you win some you lose some' nature of refereeing.

So that's five extra points we should have, which would leave City a comfortable seven points ahead. I'm not defending the refereeing, just pointing out that it would be stretching it to claim we could still be in the title race with fair refereeing.

 

[pocco]

Between this and Ole saying the referees/VAR were confirmed to be wrong in the other game (first time I've ever heard a manager discuss this report), we come across a bit desperate at times.

Talking about that pen as though we'd even created any sort of a chance that was denied. I just barely relate with Ole and our players these days.

 

[NM]

Between this and Ole saying the referees/VAR were confirmed to be wrong in the other game (first time I've ever heard a manager discuss this report), we come across a bit desperate at times.

Talking about that pen as though we'd even created any sort of a chance that was denied. I just barely relate with Ole and our players these days.

Relate more to Ole and this team than any team since Fergie left. Callong out BS should be encouraged. The refs have skrewed us recently.

Does that mean we played well? No but it would be a different game and title race if we had got the right decisions recently.

 

[Champagne Football]

He doesn't have to move his hand towards the ball if his hand was in an unnatural position. It was raised.

That's fair enough. 7 times out of 10 that will be a penalty and 3 times out of 10 it won't be given. We've had some of those decisions go our way this season.

Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink, Souness and Tuchel all said on Sky afterwards that they didn't think it was a peno, obviously they are all gonna say that. Roy Keane and Ole said it was. I think if it was a super clear cut stonewall peno, then the likes of Souness and Hasselbaink may have reluctantly agreed with Keano.

 

[Acole9]

We have to avoid becoming RAWK.

There’s every chance he misheard or didn’t get full context, there’s no conspiracy here, refs are just crap for everyone. VAR wanted to award a peno, the ref thought the evidence was inconclusive.

Definitely, all the slagging off the refs is getting boring.

The club needs to be very careful about what they say on this and make sure what was heard is correct as we could get into a lot of trouble.

 

[pocco]

Relate more to Ole and this team than any team since Fergie left. Callong out BS should be encouraged. The refs have skrewed us recently.

Does that mean we played well? No but it would be a different game and title race if we had got the right decisions recently.

If we played well and battered down their door then I'd be more reticent to these sort of arguments. Not when we've barely created a chance in 90 minutes and the pen incident wasn't even denying a chance or altered the events that followed. We actually saw the outcome of that attack and it resulted in nothing. Just screams desperate to me.

For what it's worth, I've not related since Fergie either.