Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

[Raoul]

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Hopefully this will finally cause the international community to stop treating this guy like he's a naughty, rebellious western leader who has strayed a bit and can be reigned in through diplomacy and sanctions and start looking at him as being far closer to Hitler than he is your average European leader of the present. His entire MO is based on control, deception, invasion, and conquest of neighboring lands, much as one might expect from a KGB operative masquerading as statesman.

 

[harms]

Not that anyone had expected anything different, but Putin just said that Russia considers the borders of both DNR & LNR to be the same as those of Donetsk' and Lugansk' regions. Which gives him the cause for invasion (for which he had already got himself an "approval").

 

[Revan]

UK is the 51st

Hmmm, true. Then the other 29 NATO countries, Japan, and North Korea. I guess we can be US' 83rd state.

I'll take that.

 

[The Firestarter]

Looked the right decision back then, but giving up nukes proved to be a fatal mistake. With a few thousand nukes (more than the rest of world combined except the US and Russia), no one would have tried to invade them.

Blunder in hindsight, however I doubt Ukraine would have gotten any aid had that not happened. They probably wish they secretely saved a couple aside, although with several pro Russian leaders I think there would have been no case that Russia couldn't get any wind of this. Or the US for that matter.

 

[TMDaines]

Completely the same.

Just checking the sarcasm is present on this one.

 

[spiriticon]

The world should head toward nuclear disarmament for all our own sakes, but doing that just gives Russia more strength because they will never disarm. They will only laugh as we make ourselves weaker.

 

[Revan]

Blunder in hindsight, however I doubt Ukraine would have gotten any aid had that not happened. They probably wish they secretely saved a couple aside, although with several pro Russian leaders I think there would have been no case that Russia couldn't get any wind of this. Or the US for that matter.

Yup, it definitely was the right move back then, especially with Yeltsin who had shown signs of the democratization of Russia. Hard to predict that a monster will succeed him, and would send Russia back to Brezhnev's, if not Stalin's times.

 

[FootyGirl88]

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[The Firestarter]

Yup, it definitely was the right move back then, especially with Yeltsin who had shown signs of the democratization of Russia. Hard to predict that a monster will succeed him, and would send Russia back to Brezhnev's, if not Stalin's times.

Yeah he sees himself as either a version of Stalin with the fear he induces in his inner circle or as some czar before the USSR.

 

[sun_tzu]

Do they have the capacity to do that? Ukraine is not a small country.

Yes ... They have capacity to achieve that very quickly given the resources they have positioned

 

[VorZakone]

Not that anyone had expected anything different, but Putin just said that Russia considers the borders of both DNR & LNR to be the same as those of Donetsk' and Lugansk' regions. Which gives him the cause for invasion (for which he had already got himself an "approval").

So this isn't ambiguous anymore? Peskov was flip-flopping.

 

[The Firestarter]

So this isn't ambiguous anymore? Peskov was flip-flopping.

Peskov is Schrodinger 's spokesperson.

 

[Cardboard elk]

The world should head toward nuclear disarmament for all our own sakes, but doing that just gives Russia more strength because they will never disarm. They will only laugh as we make ourselves weaker.

This will never happen, unless more powerful weapons are developed. The sad thought is that if we humans manage to destroy ourselves through a climate crisis then we will assure total destruction of all life on earth through all the crap we have made. We really are a cancer on this world.

 

[Revan]

Yeah he sees himself as either a version of Stalin with the fear he induces in his inner circle or as some czar before the USSR.

He seems to be more nationalist, rather than for a cause, so he seems to hate Soviet Union, or at least what became of it, in the end. As a czar, definitely yes.

I guess his long-term goal is to fully annex Ukraine and Belorussia, while making as satellite states, some of the others (Moldova, the central Asian countries, etc).

 

[Revan]

This will never happen, unless more powerful weapons are developed. The sad thought is that if we humans manage to destroy ourselves through a climate crisis then we will assure total destruction of all life on earth through all the crap we have made. We really are a cancer on this world.

Of course not. Some of the asteroids that hit Earth released significantly more energy than millions of nuclear weapons. And it is very possible that Earth was hit by a gamma ray radiation when some not far away star went supernova.

Life survived. It will survive for another few billion years regardless.

Humans though? Who knows.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

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If he says "all your base are belong to us" then we're fecked.

 

[Dante]

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Why would he stop at double the price? He could raise it 100 times.

The only question is whether there is a suitable Plan B for Europe.

Qatar.

But the UK is going to be at the end of the queue for any imports from the east. And the infrastructure simply doesn't exist yet.

 

[WI_Red]

If he says "all your base are belong to us" then we're fecked.

Don't joke, I just screen captured this from RT

 

[The Firestarter]

Peace can't be buy.

 

[Mickeza]

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He also told a bunch of porkies as to why Roman hasn’t been sanctioned yet.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....-roman-abramovich-sanctions-b2020535.html?amp

 

[Revan]

If he says "all your base are belong to us" then we're fecked.

 

[harms]

So this isn't ambiguous anymore? Peskov was flip-flopping.

Yeah, it's as official as it can get. It was obvious that only Putin would be allowed to officially proclaim Russia's position on the matter — and so he did.

 

[Fully Fledged]

Well then, let's welcome the Russian empire with open arms.

All hail Emperor Putin.

The Soviet Kingdom of Britain. I like that name.

Edit: hahahahah https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5031175/Soviet-maps-drawn-Britain-turned-Communist.html

 

[Revan]

What does Ukraine do now? Try to defend the parts of the regions (2/3) that they control, or retreat? Although, in all likelihood, retrating would give them just another few extra days before Putin decides to invade the other parts of Ukraine.

They are really between a rock and a hard place.

 

[MTF]

Blunder in hindsight, however I doubt Ukraine would have gotten any aid had that not happened. They probably wish they secretely saved a couple aside, although with several pro Russian leaders I think there would have been no case that Russia couldn't get any wind of this. Or the US for that matter.

Presumably the Russians also had inventory of every warhead and installation related to nuclear weapons in Ukraine, making it extra hard for them to hide anything, even excluding the possibility of leaks.

 

[harms]

I'm listening to people that are way more informed on the matter at the time (political correspondents of Meduza — one of the few independent Russian media that actually have their sources in Russian ruling elite, something that's almost inconceivable at this point). And they focus on how brutal Putin's behaviour was towards his own elites during the already infamous "counsel meeting", and how unwilling many of them acted when Putin asked them whenever they were in support of his decision.

It's all speculation, of course, a slightly more informed speculation on their part but they're hinting towards the biggest internal crisis in Putin's own regime since at least 2010. Interesting.

 

[VorZakone]

I'm listening to people that are way more informed on the matter at the time (political correspondents of Meduza — one of the few independent Russian media that actually have their sources in Russian ruling elite, something that's almost inconceivable at this point). And they focus on how brutal Putin's behaviour was towards his own elites during the already infamous "counsel meeting", and how unwilling many of them acted when Putin asked them whenever they were in support of his decision.

It's all speculation, of course, a slightly more informed speculation on their part but they're hinting towards the biggest internal crisis in Putin's own regime since at least 2010. Interesting.

Perhaps Putin wanted everybody on camera agreeing with him so that they can't change their rhetoric later. But yeah, it looked bad.

 

[Revan]

I'm listening to people that are way more informed on the matter at the time (political correspondents of Meduza — one of the few independent Russian media that actually have their sources in Russian ruling elite, something that's almost inconceivable at this point). And they focus on how brutal Putin's behaviour was towards his own elites during the already infamous "counsel meeting", and how unwilling many of them acted when Putin asked them whenever they were in support of his decision.

It's all speculation, of course, a slightly more informed speculation on their part but they're hinting towards the biggest internal crisis in Putin's own regime since at least 2010. Interesting.

Aren't all those guys, except the minister of defense, essentially Putin's crookies? That they come in those positions cause of him.

And when it comes to Shoygu, he will win a lot by a war that Russia will win, with him being minister of defense. With a bit of luck, might ensure him being the successor.

 

[harms]

What does Ukraine do now? Try to defend the parts of the regions (2/3) that they control, or retreat? Although, in all likelihood, retrating would give them just another few extra days before Putin decides to invade the other parts of Ukraine.

They are really between a rock and a hard place.

It's really an unimaginable situation. I can't imagine Zelensky giving up Mariupol' with almost half a million citizens... but the only alternative is a devastating war with tens if not hundreds of thousands deaths in immediate future! If I was a betting men I'd think that they'd chose the latter option though — simply because at this point if you start giving stuff away, Putin won't stop until you perish from existence.

I'm shell-shocked, really. How can something like this happen in this day and age.

 

[TMDaines]

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[Sir Matt]

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[VorZakone]

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[Dans]

Isnt Aeroflot our airlines partner? What will happen to that deal?

Give them their money back.

As if the Glazer's would do such a thing.

 

[harms]

Perhaps Putin wanted everybody on camera agreeing with him so that they can't change their rhetoric later. But yeah, it looked bad.

That would make sense but then why weren't they ready with their speeches (that all of them usually write in advance), why there were so many discrepancies including one guy being cut out in edit altogether... You'd expect them to be fully in agreement with him beforehand — and you'd expect some trust from Putin in return, which they usually get.

Aren't all those guys, except the minister of defense, essentially Putin's crookies? That they come in those positions cause of him.

And when it comes to Shoygu, he will win a lot by a war that Russia will win, with him being minister of defense. With a bit of luck, might ensure him being the successor.

They are, literally all of them, that's why it's so surprising.

As for Shoygu — I'm not so sure. Unless this whole thing goes along swiftly and with little-to-no losses in personnel, like Crimea, he probably will. But I can't imagine it going that way if Ukraine decides to step up (and they will) — and losing a lot of soldiers in a pointless war, even if he wins it, isn't going to earn him much popularity.

 

[The Firestarter]

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So it begins in earnest then

 

[Raoul]

It's really an unimaginable situation. I can't imagine Zelensky giving up Mariupol' with almost half a million citizens... but the only alternative is a devastating war with tens if not hundreds of thousands deaths in immediate future! If I was a betting men I'd think that they'd chose the latter option though — simply because at this point if you start giving stuff away, Putin won't stop until you perish from existence.

I'm shell-shocked, really. How can something like this happen in this day and age.

If someone were to move against him from within, who do you think it would be ?

 

[VorZakone]

If someone were to move against him from within, who do you think it would be ?

You mean against Putin? Would be interesting if it'd be Medvedev.

 

[VorZakone]

That would make sense but then why weren't they ready with their speeches (that all of them usually write in advance), why there were so many discrepancies including one guy being cut out in edit altogether... You'd expect them to be fully in agreement with him beforehand — and you'd expect some trust from Putin in return, which they usually get.


They are, literally all of them, that's why it's so surprising.

As for Shoygu — I'm not so sure. Unless this whole thing goes along swiftly and with little-to-no losses in personnel, like Crimea, he probably will. But I can't imagine it going that way if Ukraine decides to step up (and they will) — and losing a lot of soldiers in a pointless war, even if he wins it, isn't going to earn him much popularity.

Maybe this was a hidden move by Putin to do it on the spot?

 

[Revan]

If someone were to move against him from within, who do you think it would be ?

Nowhere as much informed as him but from all I've read, Shoygu and Lavrov are the only ones that were somebody before Putin. But then Shoygu is a general, and they love wars, while Lavrov is a civil servant, not a politician. Which kinda makes no one.

Unless Medvedev has has enough of Papa Putin.

 

[Dans]

Unfortunately, there will be only one winner here and it's neither the Ukraine, nor the West.