I think the players that will form a bone of contention aren't those nearing the end of their United careers like Mata, Matic or Pogba but the real flagship players of Ole's reign like Rashford, Shaw, Bruno and Maguire. Would the club accept selling Maguire for say £20m and having to replace him with a £50m signing? This is why they have always preferred Pochettino to Ten Hag or any other manager who would look to assert their authority or style on the team.
Erik ten Hag - Ajax Manager
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Just patently not true though is it. Some don't, correct, but others like Ornstein, do.
Klopp has it at Liverpool, Pep has it at city, SAF had it here. It is what needs to happen. Giving the board the authority to sign players is what has led us to this day. We need to run like a football club not like a commercial club
Shaw is perfect for Ten Hag. He just needs to make him work hard 
He might as well ask for prime ronaldo and maradonna because even if promises are made to him I do not trust this awful club to make the right calls. Forget the manager we need the scouts, the board all the back room staff to do the best possible job they can for 3 years running for us to get anywhere near it.
if I were the glazers those ugly rich vultures I’d be asking who has made these decisions as to where we are now.Woodward Matt judge sorry but your work has not been satisfactory in terms of performance. Scouts bringing in talent there has been one promoted to the first team and he is a vile human being who’ll be sacked accordingly soon. Where are all the rest?
coaches where are the triangles and the running off the ball movement and pressure, sorry not good enough goodbye. Bring in people with proven pedigree,get a team who can unearth gems and make players better and better.
and if ten Haag wants to get rid of rashford let’s just back him, because it’s a shower of shit, let’s embrace a change and glazers get it right for once
if I were the glazers those ugly rich vultures I’d be asking who has made these decisions as to where we are now.Woodward Matt judge sorry but your work has not been satisfactory in terms of performance. Scouts bringing in talent there has been one promoted to the first team and he is a vile human being who’ll be sacked accordingly soon. Where are all the rest?
coaches where are the triangles and the running off the ball movement and pressure, sorry not good enough goodbye. Bring in people with proven pedigree,get a team who can unearth gems and make players better and better.
and if ten Haag wants to get rid of rashford let’s just back him, because it’s a shower of shit, let’s embrace a change and glazers get it right for once
I don't think that is true of klopp and while less sure I doubt pep is responsible for signing players either. Saf was clearly, in a model that hasn't worked outside of saf in 20 years
Klopp has a huge command on who to buy and who not. Do you think Liverpool under klopp would go and buy a Ronaldo when they would need a cb. Pep gets his players more often than not and if not you won't see them spending crazy money on back up choices unless Pep says so.
Point is what ETH is demanding is not unreasonable. If he says he doesn't want to keep Rashford or Ronaldo then he should be backed. Like pep was backed when he joined. I would say even Arteta gets that authority at Arsenal. He says let us sell Auba, the board rips his contract up. He doesn't like Ozil, same thing happens. Again we have to let the manager have the control in transfer matters or else we are going to be in the same cycle.
Obviously this is dependent on whether the reports are true, but it seems like what Ten Hag is asking for is exactly what this club needs. Therefore, if he doesn't get the job it'd be safe to assume the club didn't want the same, which would be most disheartening.
Think he means that they sign who he wants, not who they fancy. Like any manager he will give them a list of options and like any manager he will expect them to be competent enough to deliver off that list. He will want to be consulted regarding who he wants to keep regarding contract extensions etc. He will not do the negotiations he will leave that to the club. All he wants really is to coach, but wants the club to give him the tools to do it successfully. If they will not do that we are well and truly fecked.
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The board is hardly giving anyone 10-15 new players at once, let alone someone who hardly has a CV like Klopp or Pep.
And from what I have read from Ajax fans here Ten Hag’s transfer record is not that good anyway.
If he wants to succeed - and this is the realistic approach despite a lot of people claiming how we should get rid off almost every player - in the summer the club needs to get rid off players who are absolutely not needed any longer and / or who are absolutely not in the manager’s plans (3-6 players), at the same time get him 3-4 new players he would like in the summer.
He then needs to show some success (improve our football on the pitch, get decent cup runs, a decent league finish) and slowly with every following transfer window get rid off 1-2 more players if needed and replace them with 1-2 new players.
And from what I have read from Ajax fans here Ten Hag’s transfer record is not that good anyway.
If he wants to succeed - and this is the realistic approach despite a lot of people claiming how we should get rid off almost every player - in the summer the club needs to get rid off players who are absolutely not needed any longer and / or who are absolutely not in the manager’s plans (3-6 players), at the same time get him 3-4 new players he would like in the summer.
He then needs to show some success (improve our football on the pitch, get decent cup runs, a decent league finish) and slowly with every following transfer window get rid off 1-2 more players if needed and replace them with 1-2 new players.
Pep and Klopp don't have 100% control. If they want a player the rest of their recruitment team don't then they can be overuled. As it should be.
Thus far I haven't seen any reports that he wants full control. If he did then that should be unacceptable to us. No manager should be allowed unfettered control over transfers. It doesn't happen at our rivals' clubs and it shouldn't happen here.
What he should have though is an ability to veto any transfers, no obligation to keep players he doesn't want and guarantees that recruitment will actually be tailored to the needs he sets out. Not being able to get a player you want is one thing, being lumbered with players you don't is much worse.
Sounds like he wants what every manager has then, media nonsense probably.
Media are trying to cause panic, because they know the fans are vulnerable.
We have taken the right approach and it hasn't worked. No need to panic and revert back to a model that nobody uses. There is a reason idiot fans like this aren't running clubs or running anything of importance for that matter
This. I’m sure he’s not asking for anything like full control but more in the lines of what you’re saying plus some assurances on transfer spend I’d guess.
Manager wants an assurance to have control and power to fix a messy team. What a shocker! Ornstein must be a genius to come up and/or report that. Its almost as if ETH has only two options now, its between yes or no. Groundbreaking journalism. Can never be wrong journalism. I never thought it was between yes or no.
Complete control isn’t a good idea but surely it’s a team job. If the manager has no decision making power that’s absolutely mental.
Pep is indeed, and he was influenced by LVG, Cryuff's and even Koeman's legacies, he just added more to the template. The genpress high line aggressive approach is what what most succesful clubs are utilizing these days, forgoing as much emphasis on possession as Pep does. Even smaller clubs like Southampton and Brighton have moved in this direction (Southampton since the days of Pochettino). That's all I was saying
For the part in bold, none of the Dutch managers that have managed in England bar Hiddink during his two interim spells at Chelsea have been successful, and a good number of them had a penchant for possession football or saw it as a key part of their approach. Gullit, Koeman, Frank De Boer, Mulensteen and Advocaat are the other managers I was referring to.
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If you are the manager tasked with rebuilding this club, knowing what we all know about how this decline is self inflicted due to recycling of old scouts into new glorified roles and how the job has chewed up four prwdecessors before you wouldn't you be making these type of demands? There is a reason why any serious coach who isn't on the decline hasn't touched us even with a barge pole over the past 9 years.
As Rangnick has found out, its very difficult to exert authority on this pampered bunch because our executive is too cosy with them for marketing reasons. If I am Ten Hag I am demanding the authority to get rid of who ever, no ofs or buts. He is an upcoming coach and the risk he is taking will be immense - just look at how long it took Moyes to come back to a decent level, he had to go and retrieve West Ham from the jaws of relegation and they still shat on him.
The recruitment team cobbled up by Woodward still has the jury out on its competency and/or effectiveness. He doesn't have to risk his career unless of he knows we are willing to back him and his ideas all the way. Otherwise he could just sit it out at Ajax and wait for Bayern to call again, they did once and may do so should Naggelsman jump ship or needs to replaced.
The sample size is extremely small, it's basically just LVG and Frank de Boer. The latter is just a terrible manager, his failure had nothing to do with possession football.
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Dont mind them spoofers. It’s in the bag.
There’s gotta have been about 7/8 Dutch managers
would he even leave Ajax for them? Bit of a sideways move at best
They read the caf ridiculing that they couldn't even name the German club and then named Leipzig 
Completely unrealistic. We are not owned by Saudis and I doubt even Newcastle will make a complete overhaul just in one or two transfer windows.
And as much as I want Ten Hag, let’s hold off giving a manager who with 52 hasn’t done anything outside Netherlands (I am not counting Bayern, he was hardly the manager/head coach of the first team) complete trust. There is no guarantee his transfers will be better than the current players.
Conte managed to win the title with Chelsea just after they finished 10th in the league under their Jose disaster season.
And everyone knows what Tuchel achieved last season with a team who prior to his arrival were losing 3-1 to Arteta’s Arsenal.
The more likely scenario is that while we need to get rid off some players and get some new ones, some of the current players will also be needed and respond to good coaching if they see some progress.
8 dutch managers but only those two were obsessed with possession football.
If it’s meant to be it will happen. I still think we have too much bad energy around United. Can’t help but thinking we have many years of mediocrity left in us.
At the very least he should have enough control to reject players being forced on him. For example if the board come to him and say we want to buy an over the hill star player as it'll boost our commercial appeal, he should be able to say no thanks, he's a bad fit for the team.
He'll go to RB after our board tell him that they are extending Pogba's contract and the other players who make great roaring faces for our billboards, and we'll end up with another manager who does what they're told. And then we all fall into a depressive heap whilst Klopp collects our tears to use as a bonding agent for those special injections his players get once a month.
There’s big potential to kick on massively if Red Bull decide they want to win a Bundesliga or Champions League
If this next appointment goes badly I think it will persist until the Glazers are gone and even then it will only be remedied if the new owners care about the football side and are willing to make the massive changes required.
The only reason I have any hope is because we have made some vague moves to focus more on the football setup in the past 6 months and create something that thinks beyond the end of the season and might actually be a viable long term plan. I have almost zero faith in our ability to pull it off though.
Well yes, don’t buy anyone he can’t use, no star/marketing player who he doesn’t want, etc. I think stuff like this is realistic.
But getting rid off every player he wants, if it’s too many, that’s not going to happen at once.
For that progress to be seen there are going to be some big calls that will need to be made, Klopp had to make them abd Pep certainly did. These are system managers and if they don't get the required tools they fail.
He is a bit unproven, I'd grant you that but we all know that and we are taking the gamble that he will rise to the demands of his new role. But for that to happen we need to give him some assurances because, like I said, our decline has largely been self inflicted.
I don't think we will replace ten players in one window either as that is not feasible financially and from a team bonding perspective. But he is right in asking whether the club will back him if he says he wants Maguire/Ronaldo out, for example.
Yep.
The crucial thing he shouldn't have is the ability to sign players the recruitment team don't approve. But that should work in reverse as well. All incomings should be need to be agreed to by both the manager and the broader recruitment team. If he doesn't agree to that set-up then he's being unreasonable.
I suspect the more crucial issue is outgoings.
There's Hiddink, Advoccat, Martin Jol, Koeman and Mulensteen. Not all possession based but only one success story in Hiddink during two interim spells
Huge step down I’d say, Ajax are a huge club with European pedigree and rich history. Leipzig were founded what, 10 years ago?
Ten Hag just feels like the first right managerial appointment since SAF retired.
United's problems are much deeper than the manager though, so for this to work, we do need to give him the control he wants. If we believe he's the right man, then we need to trust his decisions... It cant get any worse than it has anyway.
Fans need to accept this is a big job and can easily take 2-3 years to get anywhere like we want to be. I'll back him all the way, as long as I feel we are progressing in the right way.
When Klopp took over Liverpool, it was rocky, but you could clearly see what he was building towards, and that patience has paid off.
First thing he needs to do is weed out the bad apples. Too many of our players are on big money, and massively underperforming, so getting rid may not be easy, but no player should be safe. If he's not in the plans, move him on, or drop them.
This'll be a process, but we need to accept progression and not expect instant results
United's problems are much deeper than the manager though, so for this to work, we do need to give him the control he wants. If we believe he's the right man, then we need to trust his decisions... It cant get any worse than it has anyway.
Fans need to accept this is a big job and can easily take 2-3 years to get anywhere like we want to be. I'll back him all the way, as long as I feel we are progressing in the right way.
When Klopp took over Liverpool, it was rocky, but you could clearly see what he was building towards, and that patience has paid off.
First thing he needs to do is weed out the bad apples. Too many of our players are on big money, and massively underperforming, so getting rid may not be easy, but no player should be safe. If he's not in the plans, move him on, or drop them.
This'll be a process, but we need to accept progression and not expect instant results