The John Murtough Era

[NK86]

He's deserving of plenty of blame sure, but I also have to blame ETH a lot too.

ETH has got 3 players he knows very well and been supported in that sense, however he has decided to be a moron and spend the summer chasing FDJ and it has held up our transfer window completely.

He has literally put all his eggs in the one basket and it seems no one else will suffice other than FDJ and now he has been mugged off by him and possibly on his way to a rival after a summer of "assurances".

I've echoed these sentiments time and time again over the summer on the FDJ thread and mocked, but its looking ever more likely I'm right on it.

If we get another CM in it'll be a panic buy or someone simply not good enough either that actually improves us.

It is never ever supposed to be the manager's job to find players. What the feck do the scouts and DOF do if everything is to be lumped into ETH's head.

Issue is we are dependent on ETH to find us the perfect guys to play his brand of football and being a head coach, it's normal he is favouring players he has coached earlier.

How can anyone blame ETH for this mess is beyond me. Get him the players which will suit his philosophy and he will make it work. Waiting on him to identify players for his playing style will just lead to the window we are having.

Any other big company with such a poor performance for a decade would have sacked its entire Board by now, let alone a DOF. Yet here we are again, with the same issues as the last 10 years.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Rangnick should have been taking this fraud's job. No doubt about it.

At least with Rangnick, he knows for sure that this bunch is not good enough. He will make sure we sign min 6 players this window. But this is not the company line.

Remember in January he can name 3 good strikers (snatched up by all big clubs soon after that) for reinforcement to replace Greenwood and Martial but our Dear Murtough and his scouts can't and refused him any signings.

In the end, he was the one got sacked but the incompetent team still in place to run the club because they are yes men.

 

[yumtum]

Remember a few days ago when the blinkered positivity lot said we'd basically brush aside Brighton and Brentford and have all our signings done for the Liverpool game - the continued arrogance of some is genuinely amusing, many saw this coming, we'll struggle against Brentford next week too, but there will still be excuses for the incompetence.

 

[Seij]

Has he ever been a "been"?

Barca who are on the edge are going for better players than us.

Barca got
- Lewandowski
- Rafinha
- Kounde
- Kessie
- Christensen

Not much of a comparison here.

 

[Oldtraffordboy]

I'm really surprised a former Everton coach running our football operations isn't working out as planned.

 

[I’m loving my life]

He really needs sacking before he damages the club even more. It’s like letting a bull off in a china shop. This inexperienced mediocre football charlatan is so far out of his depth, he can’t be allowed to set the club back further. Arnold is on borrowed time too.

 

[Telsim]

I'm really surprised a former Everton coach running our football operations isn't working out as planned.

How do you mean? Murtough improved youth and women teams, and was Woody's fixer. He is also a "cultural fit" according to Solskjaer.

How could someone like Luis Campos or Ralf Rangnick possibly compare to such staggering achievements?

 

[sugar_kane]

Murtough is out of his depth entirely, I’ve felt this ever since the leak to the press (probably by him…) about how he, Fletcher and Arnold were left in complete shock by their interview with Ten Hag and that it felt like they were being interviewed by him.

This story exposed a few things that worried me - first of all that one of that party though it appropriate to share that info during a critical interview process. Unprofessional behaviour and hardly a good start with the potential new manager.

Secondly - that they thought that would reflect well on them, rather than portraying than as a bunch of wide eyed amateurs.

Thirdly you can see that whole power dynamic playing out right now - they are in awe to this man and letting him call all the shots. What’s the point of having a Director of Football or Technical Director if that’s the case?

Don’t get me wrong, I rate Ten hag, but he doesn’t have the benefit of having seen first hand what a disaster this squad is or having received feedback from the coaches who worked with them about what was happening behind the scenes.

Murtough should have absolutely put his foot down about this but also about their own transfer targets rather than letting Ten Hag call all the shots when he has no Director of Football experience. They should have also put their foot down about Rangnick remaining as consultant, which was the only silver lining of his disaster period as manage

If Murtough thinks it’s okay to let all the above happen (ie. Ten Hag calling the shots on pretty much everything) then he should be asking why United even need a Director of Football. This is just a repeat of the model we’ve had in place since the club was founded, not a modern football set up.

Funny thing is I’m fairly certain we had the same leaks about Fletcher/Murtough being left stunned after interviewing Rangnick. Maybe you’re in the wrong job then eh lads?

 

[Mickeza]

“These are questions for John Murtough, who led the overhaul under Ed Woodward and appointed Steve Brown as head of recruitment.”

This is a key point for me in Whitwell’s recent article bemoaning how we are only going after players ETH knows. Murtough overhauled the recruitment system - this is his recruitment system that can’t be trusted and has completely failed. It now needs yet another overhaul apparently. Any idea he hasn’t been involved in the utter ineptitude over that last decade is just a blatant fallacy - he was a key part of this recruitment mess and was a key footballing advisor to Woodward. Woodward loved him so much he’s gotten numerous promotions during his time here.

 

[oz insomniac]

Seriously, anyone in any way connected to the Woodward regime , has no place in the running of th club in any capacity. That coupled with the shopping centre idiots, underlines what a task the clunb has to climb out of the mess created by the previous incompetents.

Unbelievably sad where the club is currently positioned , and the fan base will shrink expotentially as young fans look for more successful clubs playing a much better style.

 

[Skills]

Starting to feel like him and Arnold have come in and just scrapped anything Woodward had done since 2013. So we've basically moved 10 years back as a club.

 

[Infra-red]

Judging by this summer's transfer activity (or lack thereof), it would appear that Murtough and Arnold still believe that last season's squad is fundamentally a top 4 squad and that all that is really required is better coaching and management.

Yesterday's performance was unfortunately one that is very familiar to United fans - these players simply aren't good enough and Rangnick will likely be proven right in his assessment that 10 new players are needed (even though that assessment reportedly left him barely on speaking terms with Murtough).

 

[jamesjimmybyrondean]

It's all part of Murtough madness . Say that we're after Arnautovic so that when we bring out reports of targeting Rabiot, it sounds believable and Barca are pressured to sell De Jong

 

[Bebestation]

If we are linked tonArnautovic then I see that more as Ten Hag’s fault than anyone else’s

 

[elmo]

“These are questions for John Murtough, who led the overhaul under Ed Woodward and appointed Steve Brown as head of recruitment.”

This is a key point for me in Whitwell’s recent article bemoaning how we are only going after players ETH knows. Murtough overhauled the recruitment system - this is his recruitment system that can’t be trusted and has completely failed. It now needs yet another overhaul apparently. Any idea he hasn’t been involved in the utter ineptitude over that last decade is just a blatant fallacy - he was a key part of this recruitment mess and was a key footballing advisor to Woodward. Woodward loved him so much he’s gotten numerous promotions during his time here.

The Murtough fanboys will tell you he hasn’t had time to implement his changes despite him briefing the press as early as May that the revamp was underway and how agents and players were impressed with him compared to Woodward

 

[TrebleChamp99]

I can see Murtough being removed post this window he really has been shocking.

 

[sugar_kane]

If we are linked tonArnautovic then I see that more as Ten Hag’s fault than anyone else’s

The bigger problem is that the Director of Football didn’t question it - same with the strategy on doggedly pursuing De Jong or nothing even though our midfield is clearly a disaster.

Murtough’s strategy as DoF appears to be “do as Ten Hag says”

Any idiot could bloody do that job.

 

[Chaky_Best]

He will be judged on De Jong's deal only.

If he misses this, he will be the new Woodward and the principal guilty of all this mess.

 

[PedroMendez]

If we are linked tonArnautovic then I see that more as Ten Hag’s fault than anyone else’s

Murtough is the DOF. He is not a subordinate to the manager. Its his job to look for a suitable manager and to get the right players.

 

[Bastian]

Looks about as scattergun as is possible.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Surprise surprise and other con man. There’s no surprise we only hire internally. If we hired externally they’d be shocked how we’re run.

 

[leontas]

Going after Arnautovic and Rabiot...is this guy serious?

If we don't get FdJ and instead we end up with these two, he should get sacked.

The fact we had to start the season with McFred in midfield is a sackable offence alone, when the likes of Bissouma, R Sanches, Palhinha, Kamara, Roca etc. where all available for reasonable amounts.

It doesn't seem like we had a clear plan for rebuilding this squad.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

He acts like he's still at Everton.

 

[BlueHaze]

Rubbish left and were replaced by trashcans. A chimpanzee would run the club better than any of these Glazer puppets.

 

[gica_7]

Yeah, all those articles that pumping his reputation makes whole a lot of sense now.

 

[pocco]

It's not something that should come as a surprise to anybody really. Woodward left us with a legacy of issues, epitomised by handing out critical roles to people that completely didn't deserve them. This is Manchester Untied, we should have the best in class throughout or at least go the Bayern route and hire ex players that have proven competency ie the likes of Edwin van der Sar, but implement a strict ethos of class and quality into the club.

What we shouldn't do is fast track Fletcher from coaching school kids to being integral to the first team functions. I recently read he is also a coach now too? Honestly, it's like we're trying to make a name for ourselves for doing things completely different to everybody else, but is is failing.

Make no bones about it, these are very worrying times for us. This is the furthest away we have been from a top team since Fergie left, even with a very good coach at the top. Alarm bells should have been absolutely ringing with the way it played out with a proven great manager in Jose - somebody that had never failed to win top trophies at any club prior. Instead the fans happy clapped fecking Pogba, Martial, Shaw and fell over themselves to hire fecking Ole. We can't complain when we are a big factor in enabling this shite to go on.

 

[Devil_forever]

So this guy have passed up on Dybala and Belotti on frees to only bid for Arnautovic. Has passed up on Kamara and Kessie on frees only to bid for Rabiot. Passed up on Sanchez who went for €15m to PSG. Needed an attacking right back and allowed a young English one like Spence join spurs for £15m. Whilst proper DoFs like Campos and Paratici have signed great players on a budget.

 

[Andersonson]

A complete fecking farse. How a midfielder wasnt signed in June is a tragedy no matter how you look at it.

They forgot or something and now panic buys Rabiot?

 

[slored1]

Murtough and Arnold are somehow managing to be worse than whatever the structure under Woodward was. Didn't know that was possible.

 

[Bastian]

Murtough is out of his depth entirely, I’ve felt this ever since the leak to the press (probably by him…) about how he, Fletcher and Arnold were left in complete shock by their interview with Ten Hag and that it felt like they were being interviewed by him.

This story exposed a few things that worried me - first of all that one of that party though it appropriate to share that info during a critical interview process. Unprofessional behaviour and hardly a good start with the potential new manager.

Secondly - that they thought that would reflect well on them, rather than portraying than as a bunch of wide eyed amateurs.

Thirdly you can see that whole power dynamic playing out right now - they are in awe to this man and letting him call all the shots. What’s the point of having a Director of Football or Technical Director if that’s the case?

Don’t get me wrong, I rate Ten hag, but he doesn’t have the benefit of having seen first hand what a disaster this squad is or having received feedback from the coaches who worked with them about what was happening behind the scenes.

Murtough should have absolutely put his foot down about this but also about their own transfer targets rather than letting Ten Hag call all the shots when he has no Director of Football experience. They should have also put their foot down about Rangnick remaining as consultant, which was the only silver lining of his disaster period as manage

If Murtough thinks it’s okay to let all the above happen (ie. Ten Hag calling the shots on pretty much everything) then he should be asking why United even need a Director of Football. This is just a repeat of the model we’ve had in place since the club was founded, not a modern football set up.

Funny thing is I’m fairly certain we had the same leaks about Fletcher/Murtough being left stunned after interviewing Rangnick. Maybe you’re in the wrong job then eh lads?

I've absolutely been thinking about this too.

 

[Castia]

We’ve been shite for 10 years but it’s never been so obvious how clueless we are off the pitch than now.

What the feck have we been doing for 3 months?

 

[ChippyTea]

Come on here and see ETH is somehow at fault for asking for a singular player and the club not acting on it. That's enough Redcafe for me today.

 

[Suv666]

Why don't we hire externally and get a couple of reputed names in for recruitment and DOF

 

[justsomebloke]

Murtough is out of his depth entirely, I’ve felt this ever since the leak to the press (probably by him…) about how he, Fletcher and Arnold were left in complete shock by their interview with Ten Hag and that it felt like they were being interviewed by him.

This story exposed a few things that worried me - first of all that one of that party though it appropriate to share that info during a critical interview process. Unprofessional behaviour and hardly a good start with the potential new manager.

Secondly - that they thought that would reflect well on them, rather than portraying than as a bunch of wide eyed amateurs.

Thirdly you can see that whole power dynamic playing out right now - they are in awe to this man and letting him call all the shots. What’s the point of having a Director of Football or Technical Director if that’s the case?

Don’t get me wrong, I rate Ten hag, but he doesn’t have the benefit of having seen first hand what a disaster this squad is or having received feedback from the coaches who worked with them about what was happening behind the scenes.

Murtough should have absolutely put his foot down about this but also about their own transfer targets rather than letting Ten Hag call all the shots when he has no Director of Football experience. They should have also put their foot down about Rangnick remaining as consultant, which was the only silver lining of his disaster period as manage

If Murtough thinks it’s okay to let all the above happen (ie. Ten Hag calling the shots on pretty much everything) then he should be asking why United even need a Director of Football. This is just a repeat of the model we’ve had in place since the club was founded, not a modern football set up.

Funny thing is I’m fairly certain we had the same leaks about Fletcher/Murtough being left stunned after interviewing Rangnick. Maybe you’re in the wrong job then eh lads?

Well said.

Ultimately, the proof of a good DoF is that largely, good things are happening and in the right way and at the right time. And they clearly aren't.

 

[bucky]

Remember in January, when the line was that we were't going to sign anyone to save money for the summer. Now we are in a situation where we are bargain shopping and panic buying, trying to sign Rabiot and Arnautović, since we are unsure whether the manager's main target is going to sign. A better dof would have signed Bruno Guimarães and completely avoided this situation alltogether. I don't give a flying feck whether our head scouts were sacked before the summer, the club should still have scouts and analysts at their disposal that could have made better suggestions fitting of the manager's ideas. That Murtough is so heavily reliant on ten Hag's targets is farcical.

 

[devilish]

If we truly sign Arnautovic and Karen's son then we should have them both unveiled by Murtough at the same time with the Benny Hill theme running at the background

 

[justsomebloke]

Remember in January, when the line was that we were't going to sign anyone to save money for the summer. Now we are in a situation where we are bargain shopping and panic buying, trying to sign Rabiot and Arnautović, since we are unsure whether the manager's main target is going to sign. A better dof would have signed Bruno Guimarães and completely avoided this situation alltogether. I don't give a flying feck whether our head scouts were sacked before the summer, the club should still have scouts and analysts at their disposal that could have made better suggestions fitting of the manager's ideas. That Murtough is so heavily reliant on ten Hag's targets is farcical.

He has now put himself in an impossible situation. The combination of a bad start, the obvious need to strengthen the squad, widespread fan unrest and the lateness of the window puts him in a maximally bad negotiating position, and his options are fewer: The signings don't merely have to strengthen the squad, they have to contradict the perception of lack of foresight and ambition that has been created by the club's lacklustre response to last year's disaster. The bar for strengthening the squad isn't high in many areas, so achieving that is comparatively easy. But if that's being done by acquiring short term patchwork solutions who doesn't really advance us towards the top, that's not good enough. It's not what we should be trying to do. Rabiot: Would he strengthen Spurs, or Arsenal? Would he see much playing time at Chelsea? Would Liverpool or City be interested in him at all? If the answers to those questions are no, then he's probably not moving us up towards them. With Arnautovic, it seems ridiculous to even ask the questions.

I can't believe they don't see the disastrous optics of pursuing someone like Arnautovic - a player well past his prime who was a marquee name for a smaller and weaker club than us back when he was in his prime. Nothing could be better designed to confirm that we've backed ourselves into a corner and can't think of a way out. It's the sort of thing Everton might have done last season. And everyone understands that when you make signings like that from a position of weakness, it means you've not managed to address your problems. If we were already set with two strikers everyone was happy with (and who was happy to be here), and then brought in someone like Arnautovic as third-choice insurance, it would be different.

Earlier in the window they could get positivity from signings like Malacia, now it'll take much more if they want to come out of it with their credibility intact.

Maybe we should take up Malcolm Tucker's proposal from TTOI and introduce a new logo: A kitten in a box in the middle of the motorway, crying "help me, help me, I don't know what to do!".

 

[DevilRed]

Not sure if its him or ETH, but we really should have got our signings done much earlier instead of this panicky shite.

By all means wait for FDJ, but in the meantime we SHOULD have signed Rabiot/Neves and a forward.

Not wait until we fecking lose the first game of the season. Now we're fecked. Every club is going to reject our first/second bid because they know we are DESPERATE.

feck the glazers for not spending the money on at least two centre mids this summer. We NEED to rebuild the midfield as our top priority.

 

[bucky]

He has now put himself in an impossible situation. The combination of a bad start, the obvious need to strengthen the squad, widespread fan unrest and the lateness of the window puts him in a maximally bad negotiating position, and his options are fewer: The signings don't merely have to strengthen the squad, they have to contradict the perception of lack of foresight and ambition that has been created by the club's lacklustre response to last year's disaster. I can't believe they don't see the disastrous optics of pursuing someone like Arnautovic - a player well past his prime who was a marquee name for a smaller and weaker club than us back when he was in his prime. Nothing could be better designed to confirm that we've backed ourselves into a corner and can't think of a way out. It's the sort of thing Everton might have done last season. And everyone understands that when you make signings like that from a position of weakness, it means you've not managed to address your problems. If we were already set with two strikers everyone was happy with (and who was happy to be here), and then brought in someone like Arnautovic as third-choice insurance, it would be different.

Earlier in the window they could get positivity from signings like Malacia, now it'll take much more if they want to come out of it with their credibility intact.

Maybe we should take up Malcolm Tucker's proposal from TTOI and introduce a new logo: A kitten in a box in the middle of the motorway, crying "help me, help me, I don't know what to do!".

Well said, I agree.

 

[Kevin]

Rabiot and Arnautovic assembled. City are toast.