g = window.googletag || {}; googletag.cmd = googletag.cmd || []; window.googletag = googletag; googletag.cmd.push(function() { var interstitialSlot = googletag.defineOutOfPageSlot('/17085479/redcafe_gam_interstitial', googletag.enums.OutOfPageFormat.INTERSTITIAL); if (interstitialSlot) { interstitialSlot.addService(googletag.pubads()); } });

Maguire | he stays!

pratyush_utd

Can't tell DeGea and Onana apart.
Joined
Aug 30, 2017
Messages
8,440
It will end when we stop giving out moronic contracts.
I’d demand exactly the same in his situation. You want me to leave? Fine I will but make sure I’m paid what I would have earned if I had stayed.
Not unreasonable in my view.
Sure. Not unreasonable. But not unreasonable also that we make an example of you and stop you from playing. Nothing in contract suggest that Maguire should be playing.

Its not like he is going to earn peanuts. 70k per week drop aligns with his recent performance. Maybe he should think why nobody is paying him that money. He can stay and let his career go down for few extra millions on top multiple millions he already has. Would instantly validate the decision of the club to dump him
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,664
Guy I responded to said 50M but the point still stands that we are not getting quality replacements at those prices so why force a sale.
Amrabat is quoted at 25m pounds, Pavard around 30-35 at most. Both are better.
 

Fridge chutney

Full Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2016
Messages
8,981
So if Maguire is sidelined for 2 years, not playing competitive football, with questionable physical attributes at 30, let alone at 32 he’ll command 80k per week? Only in dreamworld.

we see players completely out of form for 2 months during summer break, let alone 2 years..
Who said 80k? Even if he only gets 20k/week he will likely come out ahead vs. forgoing 50% of his salary for 2 years. He is making the smart and right decision.

Anyway looks like ETH wants him so the vitriol he is receiving for his "decision" is misplaced. The club created this scenario and need to love with the consequences of their own decisions.
 

jeff gurr

Full Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2018
Messages
1,281
Location
Canada
Supports
Leicester City
He could sit on his arse all season and he'd still be Southgate's first choice next summer.
I'm not too sure about that anymore. With all the attention the Maguire saga has created it will put Southgate in a very embarrassing position.
The press will hound him relentlessly if he carries on playing him when he isn't a regular starter.
 

The Purley King

Full Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Messages
4,309
it is the consequence and price to pay for
1. Bad scouting
or
2. Change of manager, and then change of tactics.
or
3. Player lost form, like Sanchez. (it is just pure bad luck sometimes)

Like many have said before Maguire is still a good player for England which doesn't play a high line, and that's why west ham is interested in his service.
Agree entirely.
We made a mistake and cannot blame the player for sticking to the terms of his contract and sitting it out.
 

Plastic Evra

Full Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2023
Messages
1,865
I'm not sure it's very productive to linger too much on it now. Maybe another offer comes this summer (doubt it but heh who knows). He'll be easier to move next year -at a reduced fee-.
I'd rather he was out and replaced this year but what can you do. From the little we really know about all this, I'm not sure I understand the stance of the club.
 

Crashoutcassius

Full Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2013
Messages
10,326
Location
playa del carmen
Well, it's our mess and we didn't quite manage to clean it up. Not sure fault can be attached to the player for not conveniently moving aside to his own financial detriment. As long as he gets on with his job to the best of his ability we just have to accept we made a huge mistake with Maguire. Booing him etc is only going to be self defeating.
If we made a mistake we made a mistake years ago. In that time city and Chelsea have blew about 10x what we blew. City signed about 5 defenders for 50-60m and just forgot about them and nobody seems to care. People act like this should hang over us forever for some reason but it is just out of touch with football today... The money we spent on a squad player years ago is absolutely irrelevant today
 

Shane88

Actually Nostradamus
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Messages
35,358
Location
Targaryen loyalist
Maybe they offer £20 million again and the extra £5-10 million they would've spent on the fee gets structured into his wages instead.

I'm grasping at straws.
 

The Purley King

Full Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Messages
4,309
Sure. Not unreasonable. But not unreasonable also that we make an example of you and stop you from playing. Nothing in contract suggest that Maguire should be playing.

Its not like he is going to earn peanuts. 70k per week drop aligns with his recent performance. Maybe he should think why nobody is paying him that money. He can stay and let his career go down for few extra millions on top multiple millions he already has. Would instantly validate the decision of the club to dump him
Harry has a decision to make about £7m and his future England career.
Which is worth more?
If he stays he’ll be mocked relentlessly, most likely lose his England place, but he’ll trouser an extra £7m.
It’s his decision at this point unless we budge, which I think we should, but don’t think we will.
 

Reditus

Lineup Prediction League Winner 2021-22
Joined
Aug 10, 2019
Messages
5,637
Maybe they offer £20 million again and the extra £5-10 million they would've spent on the fee gets structured into his wages instead.

I'm grasping at straws.
Nah it’s over

have to accept it and move on
 

zenith

Full Member
Joined
Apr 24, 2013
Messages
1,790
He's really unlikeable character. The greed he's shown in staying 5th choice only driven by money, complete lack of ambition in thinking that west ham is below him, being sorted for life and still holding us to a settlement.

I don't believe in booing our player but there is no way that as a fan I can bring myself to like him as a player and a professional.
 

baskinginthesun

Full Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2014
Messages
1,118
Sure. Not unreasonable. But not unreasonable also that we make an example of you and stop you from playing. Nothing in contract suggest that Maguire should be playing.

Its not like he is going to earn peanuts. 70k per week drop aligns with his recent performance. Maybe he should think why nobody is paying him that money. He can stay and let his career go down for few extra millions on top multiple millions he already has. Would instantly validate the decision of the club to dump him
Somebody is paying him "that" money though. For another 2 years as well. That's a lot of cash to give up and get paid less.
 

Luffy

Gomu Gomu
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
1,843
Location
Mauritius
He isn’t being (and shouldn't be) forced to take a pay cut under any circumstances. That is a decision he has the right to make. If I were in his shoes, I would probably do the same thing if I’m thinking of securing the most amount of money for my and my family’s future. Assuming I’m not playing for my beloved team, of course. Of course. Sure, my wife and kids won’t starve without the 7 millions, but if I want only the best things money can buy for them and for myself, then it makes sense to not give up on that.

So what if Slabhead doesn’t mind soaking up all the vitriol from the fans and the press while his hands are superglued cupping his ears the whole time? What if he’s ready to warm the bench and miss out on not winning anything with England for at least the next two years or so? If he wants to handle it then there’s not much I could blame him for. Speaking of blame, I think the club should shoulder the burden of it on this one due to the ridiculous wages we’ve offered him.

I do feel for us fans though, because we (alright, mostly, you) are paying for this this man’s lavish lifestyle. It’s like getting a tv subscription because you want to watch the crême de la crême football has to offer, but also having to pay for channels you’ll watch only when high or drunk, or if reincarnated as house cat, or something. He’s basically the shopping channel among footballers. It’s unfair, but we can’t do much about it. Them Glazers are rich enough to inject those 7 millions into the club, but we know they don’t do that. Maybe we could have gotten West Ham to pay for the wall of a defender he is?

Anyway, I wonder if this will set the precedent of players who are reluctant to move asking to be paid a fee by the selling club. Slippery slope fallacy?
 

StamsShinyHead

Full Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
1,543
Location
"SAF you're an old dick, but I respect you."
Well, it's our mess and we didn't quite manage to clean it up. Not sure fault can be attached to the player for not conveniently moving aside to his own financial detriment. As long as he gets on with his job to the best of his ability we just have to accept we made a huge mistake with Maguire. Booing him etc is only going to be self defeating.

This is more or less how I see it too. Granted, he's not needed by us, but he's under no moral obligation to just lose out on millions he would otherwise be entitled to.
 

Chairman Steve

Full Member
Joined
May 9, 2018
Messages
7,157
New owners could have quickly nipped this in the bud but we’re stuck with the gremlins from Florida pennypinching.
 

Gandalf

Full Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2018
Messages
4,855
Location
Alabama but always Wales in my heart
Amrabat is quoted at 25m pounds, Pavard around 30-35 at most. Both are better.
Amrabat has been quoted at various prices but the brief all along has been that he is the replacement for Fred and Donny once those deals are done, we will see if that is what happens. Bayern slapped a 50M tag on Pavard over the weekend and at that price we would not have had anywhere near enough money from the Maguire sale to bring him in.
 

ErikElevenHag

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 24, 2023
Messages
276
Fair play to the lad if that's what he wants to do, we only have ourselves to blame by giving him so much for so long.

Honestly thought he'd take the lure of being a regular starter for a decent premier league club, but obviously he values getting the remainder of his contract above it.

Hopefully he's left to rue the decision and finds himself out in the cold and out of the England squad come summer, I say that purely out of spite, but it probably will be of benefit to us he has a good euros in the eventuality he finally decides to leave.
 

ThierryHenry14

Full Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
4,341
Supports
Arsenal
Agree entirely.
We made a mistake and cannot blame the player for sticking to the terms of his contract and sitting it out.
I really don't understand what the fuss is about for the payout. Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang, Mesut Ozil, Shkodran Mustafi and Sead Kolasinac have all been paid to leave the Emirates in the past three years. Pepe will be next.
 

Abraxas

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2021
Messages
6,107
If we made a mistake we made a mistake years ago. In that time city and Chelsea have blew about 10x what we blew. City signed about 5 defenders for 50-60m and just forgot about them and nobody seems to care. People act like this should hang over us forever for some reason but it is just out of touch with football today... The money we spent on a squad player years ago is absolutely irrelevant today
What is the point you're making within all this? It's not about whether it's "hanging over us" in some metaphorical sense, it is the financial element that was the problem which comes back to the original decision making.

I'm not sure what your point is about City.
 

Plastic Evra

Full Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2023
Messages
1,865
Just get Pavard and play Maguire in the reserves
All seems to point that United has no money left to put upfront. Maybe that's just them being conservative or not flaunting... Maybe we'll see some usual panic signings on August 31. But the line has been that additional recruits will only come in to replace outgoings 1:1.
 

dubplate warrior

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jul 24, 2015
Messages
998
Yeah, EtH fecked up big time with that one. The man needs no encouragement whatsoever. He's like the dude who misconstrues momentary momentary eye contact from a girl as genuine interest. EtH could beat him like a red-headed stepchild and Maguire would find tough love in it.

feck sake.
:lol:
 

Borussia Teeth

Full Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2019
Messages
566
We should not be booing ANY of our players. The best thing to do is accept that he'll be here for this season at least and use him in the odd cup game when we need to rotate.

Hopefully Southgate grows a pair and picks players that actually play every week: Colwill, Guehi and Tomori are all good options, even Shaw as CB with Chilwell lb will do.

Maguire is within his rights to dig his heels in about his contract. We're the fools who dished it out. Next season his amortization will be about 13/14m; hopefully we can sell around that figure and lower clubs may give him a bit more wages. Doubt it though.
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,664
Who said 80k? Even if he only gets 20k/week he will likely come out ahead vs. forgoing 50% of his salary for 2 years. He is making the smart and right decision.

Anyway looks like ETH wants him so the vitriol he is receiving for his "decision" is misplaced. The club created this scenario and need to love with the consequences of their own decisions.
Nah with 20k after 2 years the math doesn’t add up.

WHU most likely will have offered him 4 years contract. If he played well and got a one year extension then he’s ahead. 4 years contract equals his United pay. He will be 34 at the time and considering nutrition and fitness levels, preserving his value he could get 1-2 years at least at lower level probably at around 50-60k.

if he’s marginalised at United, he’d be 32, zero form, zero credentials anymore, most likely forgotten and getting pay as you play, don’t see any PL team touching him apart from recently promoted and Luton for example are paying their star players 10k per week?

if he was banking on him and keeping shape and prolonging his career then getting playing time should be his goal. If he’s unsure of his qualities but still want to get the bag - then yeah getting the promised bag sitting in a corner seems the safe option.
 

red.knight

Full Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2023
Messages
594
He isn’t being (and shouldn't be) forced to take a pay cut under any circumstances. That is a decision he has the right to make. If I were in his shoes, I would probably do the same thing if I’m thinking of securing the most amount of money for my and my family’s future. Assuming I’m not playing for my beloved team, of course. Of course. Sure, my wife and kids won’t starve without the 7 millions, but if I want only the best things money can buy for them and for myself, then it makes sense to not give up on that.

So what if Slabhead doesn’t mind soaking up all the vitriol from the fans and the press while his hands are superglued cupping his ears the whole time? What if he’s ready to warm the bench and miss out on not winning anything with England for at least the next two years or so? If he wants to handle it then there’s not much I could blame him for. Speaking of blame, I think the club should shoulder the burden of it on this one due to the ridiculous wages we’ve offered him.

I do feel for us fans though, because we (alright, mostly, you) are paying for this this man’s lavish lifestyle. It’s like getting a tv subscription because you want to watch the crême de la crême football has to offer, but also having to pay for channels you’ll watch only when high or drunk, or if reincarnated as house cat, or something. He’s basically the shopping channel among footballers. It’s unfair, but we can’t do much about it. Them Glazers are rich enough to inject those 7 millions into the club, but we know they don’t do that. Maybe we could have gotten West Ham to pay for the wall of a defender he is?

Anyway, I wonder if this will set the precedent of players who are reluctant to move asking to be paid a fee by the selling club. Slippery slope fallacy?
This lad was done for me when he said "I have nothing to prove at United." All footballers have something to prove, it's professional sport, proving yourself is the name of the game, competing to win and to earn respect from your team mates. He should've been stripped of the captaincy after that statement and now this over money just proves he's already retired mentally. He's a waster with a weak mentality. He's been a failure at United and England will do nothing with him too. West ham better off without players like him.
 

red.knight

Full Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2023
Messages
594
We should not be booing ANY of our players. The best thing to do is accept that he'll be here for this season at least and use him in the odd cup game when we need to rotate.

Hopefully Southgate grows a pair and picks players that actually play every week: Colwill, Guehi and Tomori are all good options, even Shaw as CB with Chilwell lb will do.

Maguire is within his rights to dig his heels in about his contract. We're the fools who dished it out. Next season his amortization will be about 13/14m; hopefully we can sell around that figure and lower clubs may give him a bit more wages. Doubt it though.
He's going to do the same as Hazard and say he wants to fight for his place. Knows well that no other club will pay him what United do. Hope they leave him to rot in the reserves for the remainder of his contract.
 

Jacob

Full Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Messages
25,579
Nice knowing we will be stuck with Maguire and Scott until 2026. For the fans mental health, exclude them from any social media and give them no minutes to play. Least they can do is let us forget about them, Maguire in particular.
 

Abraxas

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2021
Messages
6,107
I really don't understand what the fuss is about for the payout. Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang, Mesut Ozil, Shkodran Mustafi and Sead Kolasinac have all been paid to leave the Emirates in the past three years. Pepe will be next.
Well, probably the financial element of the payout is the fuss.

The club has been very clear that all incomings are facilitated by outgoings at this point. Either due to FFP or the owners or both, which makes your Arsenal comparison largely irrelevant. So at some point during this Magure deal it has broken down on account of that equation. That being the modest fee we're receiving from West Ham against his book value versus having to pay Maguire off a huge chunk and then having to get someone else in. All of that was being explored concurrently, considering Pavard and Tobido were looked at.

I don't think it was a matter of moral principle or whether Harry is being a cheeky boy.
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,664
Amrabat has been quoted at various prices but the brief all along has been that he is the replacement for Fred and Donny once those deals are done, we will see if that is what happens. Bayern slapped a 50M tag on Pavard over the weekend and at that price we would not have had anywhere near enough money from the Maguire sale to bring him in.
I think the brief for Amrabat is 2 out of three (Donny, Fred, McT) as we might not be able to shift Donny.

still he’s cheaper than both Maguire/ McT at the quoted figures.

The Pavard quote is probably negotiation stand point. Mount was quoted at 70-80m at the beginning of the window…
 

TheLord

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2018
Messages
1,718
He's not as his lowest ebb yet. If he stays and is kept on the bench he'll fall further out of favour and jeopardise his England career. He has every right to negotiate and in most cases there will be a compromise between all 3 parties (United, West Ham and Maguire) with each taking a hit. But its not like Maguire has nothing to lose by holding out, he has limited time left in the game.
Maybe the England career no longer excites him. He will be 31 by then and probably not be a starter for England whether or not he plays regular football henceforth.
People are making too much of the England role to convince themselves that Maguire should leave for West Ham.
 

TheLord

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2018
Messages
1,718
Well, probably the financial element of the payout is the fuss.

The club has been very clear that all incomings are facilitated by outgoings at this point. Either due to FFP or the owners or both, which makes your Arsenal comparison largely irrelevant. So at some point during this Magure deal it has broken down on account of that equation. That being the modest fee we're receiving from West Ham against his book value versus having to pay Maguire off a huge chunk and then having to get someone else in. All of that was being explored concurrently, considering Pavard and Tobido were looked at.

I don't think it was a matter of moral principle or whether Harry is being a cheeky boy.
It is not a matter of moral principles or being cheeky. Harry is doing what is best for him.
 

quadrant

Full Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2023
Messages
446
If he is sold, the write off is the book value (£26m) less the sale proceeds (say £23m after his payoff). So the net write off is £3m.

If he is kept there is a £13m amortisation cost.

So the charge to our accounts this year would be £10m more if he is kept than if he is sold (before even taking his wages in to account which would be another £11m+).
Ah, with you.