Because you weigh up the benefits of them staying vs leaving on loan.Legit didn't understand our approach to the window. I can rationalise not making substantial moves and/or even not bringing an attacker and waiting for the summer/not panic buy. Fine
but why allow players to leave? you still need the bodies/a squad - as the possibility of injuries and suspensions are always looming
He's beyond help, he's been shit for multiple managers, what's the point in keep paying a premium for a player who doesn't offer a premium output?I'd have preferred the manager and the club not push the nuclear option button and give it to the end of the season to see what could be done. And if there's a mutual parting of the ways in the summer? Fine. We are not in a position to not do everything possible to try to turn him around. Clearly stuff has gone on behind the scenes and they decided being left short would be better than trying to rehab him. We'll see.
Because you weigh up the benefits of them staying vs leaving on loan.
If the loans go well, clear benefits. Plenty of extra millions added to the player.
If they stay? I'm not sure. A few more points at the end of the season possibly?
Millions can be added to the player if they stay as well. I mean, we are in a few competitions still - and as stated in the post you quoted - we have a decent shout at the Europa, which would grant us entrance to the CL and alleviate some of our financial pressure - that amounts to more than just a few points, but to even go for it you need bodies, even if the players aren’t of great quality, you still need the bodies
I'd have preferred the manager and the club not push the nuclear option button and give it to the end of the season to see what could be done. And if there's a mutual parting of the ways in the summer? Fine. We are not in a position to not do everything possible to try to turn him around. Clearly stuff has gone on behind the scenes and they decided being left short would be better than trying to rehab him. We'll see.
They weren't playing though. Nor have they performed for a long time. Another half a season of that and their value is only going down. Very difficult to move them on in the summer etc. All stuff we know.
Keeping them doesn't really make a difference. A few points maybe. I don’t think anybody really believes those two could be the difference between winning Europa and not.
According to my limited knowledge you need more specialist players in a 3421 than in a 4231, and that's part of the reason why change of manager had almost no effect. But maybe the club thought Amorim could transform our team by just adding a player or two?He's fecked. Squad was shit when he came in and they made it even worse in Jan.
Even the summer they are saying sell to buy. Considering hes gonna need like 6+ players to have a chance we are fecked because he is never gonna get that in the summer.
Club is absolutely shite
Fair. I just wanted to see a redemption story. That's all.So just do what we’ve always done, give him a clean slate then when it goes wrong we’ve just kicked the can down the road.
The whole point of loaning him and Antony out is for them to play well so we can sell actually sell them in the summer and rid ourselves of their financial burden. It’s something that’s actually going to plan, maybe the only thing.
I don’t know if I’m not articulating something particularly well or something. You don’t plan a first team squad simply with your first eleven in mind - you will always have players that play less - they however still need to be around to account for the variables I’ve mentioned. We are in multiple competitions still.
The suggestion that keeping them doesn’t make a difference is readily proven false seeing as these same players would be here to step-in for the ones we have just lost to injury. Players form can also change quickly - these same players have done alright elsewhere so far.
And of course they could be the difference between winning the Europa or not, because to be able to compete at a base level - as low as it may potentially be - you still need first team bodies. Antony and Rashford are capable of coming up with moments - even if not consistently - and that’s important in cup competitions.
They haven't exactly covered themselves in glory with some of their decisions, but they knew he was not the right choice for this squad in the summer, or was that Ashworths influence. In which case he is being proven right. Amorim could work, but if he is tied to that formation and is not capable of tweaking it, signings were needed in certain positions to make it work. Which means either not keep ETH and spend that money then with Amorim or get him in next summer. There seemed to be a bit of a power struggle and Berrada seems to have won the battle, even if it has been detrimental to the manager and the team. You wonder if SJR will get seriously annoyed with what is happening and go on a mad sacking spree, then god knows what will happen.According to my limited knowledge you need more specialist players in a 3421 than in a 4231, and that's part of the reason why change of manager had almost no effect. But maybe the club thought Amorim could transform our team by just adding a player or two?
United seem to do that to managers.Poor bloke looks like he hasn’t had a decent nights kip in weeks
Fair. I just wanted to see a redemption story. That's all.
So you just wanted us to do the same thing that we have done every year. So you wanted us to spend the whole summer trying to find buyers for these players before we could get our own window in order? Did you not see how hard it was to find a buyer for McTominay and only then we could afford Ugarte?Players had to leave because the goalkeeping coach is a better player than Rashford and despite the flashes he showed under him apparently Antony wasn't good enough also.
I don’t know if I’m not articulating something particularly well or something. You don’t plan a first team squad simply with your first eleven in mind - you will always have players that play less - they however still need to be around to account for the variables I’ve mentioned. We are in multiple competitions still.
The suggestion that keeping them doesn’t make a difference is readily proven false seeing as these same players would be here to step-in for the ones we have just lost to injury. Players form can also change quickly - these same players have done alright elsewhere so far.
And of course they could be the difference between winning the Europa or not, because to be able to compete at a base level - as low as it may potentially be - you still need first team bodies. Antony and Rashford are capable of coming up with moments - even if not consistently - and that’s important in cup competitions.
I'd say your approach is only concerned about this very moment. The here and now. In a season where nothing is really happening for us. So we keep these guys just in case there are injuries. The problem of how to move them on not thought of.
Those who agree with loaning players are looking at the bigger picture. What do we do in the summer, next season. Because that's more important than this disaster of a season. With that in mind it makes sense to loan them out.
Rashford wasn’t getting on the pitch even with injuries and I don’t think it’s certain Antony would even start tomorrow if he were still here. As for moments in a Cup game there is every chance a youngster can do whatever Antony could.
We always complain about not being able to sell players or having to sell them for peanuts and that’s exactly the situation we’d be in if we didn’t let Antony and Rashford go. It’s not ideal of course but the prospect of selling both in the summer massively outweighs one being on the bench and one being on the stands for majority of this season.
That would be career suicide. Getting a big job and quitting is just about the worst thing you can do for your rep.Momentum is everything in football. The club hasn’t set him up for success.
I’d resign if I were him.
Your rep isn’t worth sacrificing for INEOS or the glazers
These were managerial choices. Plenty of reports came out stating that reintegrating Rashford had not been ruled out - in our current circumstances - both of those players would be a plus.
Antony and Rashford are bonafide first team players - even if not of the quality we want to compete at a consistent level. They are better options than “youngsters” all things considered
It's that "34 year old" part that really breaks the camel's back.A 34 year old rapist? Yeah, no thanks.
Even Ruud was able to arrest the decline, albeit temporarily. I think any PL manager could come in and get at least the shit results that Amorim is getting, if not better them by playing players in familiar positions, even that means a return to the dreaded 4231.The manager question is so irrelevant right now. Unless Ratcliffe is about to turn into Boehly and sanction £300m+ spending this summer, no manager will be able to arrest the decline.
Antony hasn’t been a plus all season, he’s barely played whoever was manager. 130 odd minutes in the league in over 20 games is not a first team player. He’s offered virtually nothing so it’s a very low bar for a youngster to match.
Rashford has had his chances and made his choices, again he want getting picked so keeping him was pointless.
Both are doing well on loan, it was the right choice, it has the biggest potential benefit. It think a lot of people would be happier to see them both playing badly still but then complaining when we can’t get rid in the summer.
Same. The financial crisis is a great talking point for the media and fan channels but despite how pathetic the club is right now, generating revenue isn’t one of our problems.I could be wrong obviously but I think hel get a major backing in the summer and we will be OK with spending.
I don’t know if you didn’t read “managerial choices”. Those tend to change when the circumstances change/call for it. Players form isn’t a static thing - that’s the reasoning behind loaning them - if they’re capable of turning it around elsewhere, there’s no real reason as to why they wouldn’t be able to do so here. Antony has been a bonafide first team player for years - it’s best to avoid the suggestion that he isn’t just for argumentation sake.
“Rashford wasn’t getting picked” - please refer to “managerial choices”. The same manager also was vocal about potentially reintegrating him.
Yes, they are doing well - our current injury crisis with the fact we sanctioned their exits without replacements is the crux of my posts here.
Yeah we always brief that it's a really tough summer and then spend close to 200m.Same. The financial crisis is a great talking point for the media and fan channels but despite how pathetic the club is right now, generating revenue isn’t one of our problems.
We generate a lot of revenue, unfortunately not as much as we spend. It’s all out in the public domain, I’m not sure why this is even a debate.Same. The financial crisis is a great talking point for the media and fan channels but despite how pathetic the club is right now, generating revenue isn’t one of our problems.
Our most technical players in the front line and back line are injured with Amad and Martinez for the rest of the season. Not to mention that Amad has been involved in 43% of our goals this season. Mount and Shaw will have another niggle and be out for the rest of the season, so you can’t count on both to cover Amad and Martinez positions.
Our rivals in the relegation battle as gaining form too.
Too many things are going wrong. We may ACTUALLY be in regulation battle. Look at our remaining fixtures ffs.
Some of you really need to read the room. Or just some of the financials.Same. The financial crisis is a great talking point for the media and fan channels but despite how pathetic the club is right now, generating revenue isn’t one of our problems.
This. It's no secret our financials are absolutely fecked.We generate a lot of revenue, unfortunately not as much as we spend. It’s all out in the public domain, I’m not sure why this is even a debate.
The club has been losing significant sums each year since covid, despite fairly high premier league finishes and European football. We will lose about £30 million just for finishing 10 places lower than before. No european football tv money and the subsequent lack of match revenue could cost another £40million. Add to that the sacking of ten hag and hiring of Amorim and other appointments.
That’s almost £100 million on top of the general losses that we’ve sustained every year recently. You guys are delusional.
Don't we lose a chunk of the Adidas money as well?We generate a lot of revenue, unfortunately not as much as we spend. It’s all out in the public domain, I’m not sure why this is even a debate.
The club has been losing significant sums each year since covid, despite fairly high premier league finishes and European football. We will lose about £30 million just for finishing 10 places lower than before. No european football tv money and the subsequent lack of match revenue could cost another £40million. Add to that the sacking of ten hag and hiring of Amorim and other appointments.
That’s almost £100 million on top of the general losses that we’ve sustained every year recently. You guys are delusional.
