[mctrials23]

Its another issue where we have backed ourselves into a corner. Same as with the manager. In both situations we are going into the summer with big decisions.

Will Amorim work when he gets some of the players he needs or should we cut our losses

Will Hojlund come good if he actually starts getting some proper service

The hope is that Amorim will have a good season when he gets the key players he needs but is a striker one of those? Gyorkores was scoring easy goals for the most part under Amorim. I know you have to be in the right place at the right time for those chances but I think Hojlund can do that. But its a massive risk to go into the season with only Hojlund as as proper striker. Proper strikers cost a lot of money though and we don't have much.

Its a bit of a mess really. Fingers crossed he can come into a bit of form in the last few games of the season.

 

[Jezpeza]

What? They're literally his two weaknesses, he's terrible at driving at goal and getting a shot off (the important bit). As for good poaching positions, you're just wumming at that point.

You can literally watch his first 4 or 5 goals for us. 3 poachers finishes, 2 against villa, ones a first time reaction shot, the other he anticipates where the header is going at a set piece, another one runs gets across his man at the near post against Wolves to finish a cross. Good driving run and finish against West Ham. And a nice finish vs spurs. Do you ever watch us?

 

[Jezpeza]

No, it’s really not. He’s the very bottom percentile player for shots per 90 minutes in all of Europe’s top 5 leagues for attackers. If you back that up with your own eyes when watching him play, you see how unnatural in looks inside the box. There’s no innate understanding to his game of getting shots off. It’s like having a central midfielder who doesn’t pass or a CB who doesn’t tackle. It’s like the absolute core stat.

If you create no chances as a team, why is your striker magically going to have had hundreds of shots? Bizarre

 

[Drainy]

Feel for the guy. Totally mismanaged by the club and left to suffer and rot.

He should have a senior striker ahead of him to take the pressure, learn from and get opportunities at the right moments at this stage of his development, instead he's having a horror season and is having to tank the criticism and pressure.

 

[Oranges038]

Yeah, it’s what a striker with no confidence does. Doesn’t know what to do on instinct, takes an extra touch, loses the chance.

A striker (even Højlund) on form gets the shot off.

Saw a stat during the game that he averages about 1 shot per game.

Obviously he doesn't help himself with his positioning at times, but we all know Utd don't create enough chances, mostly through poor decision making and crossing.

I'd like to see him come good, he showed glimpses last season of what he was capable of. But he could very well be just be another Forlan or Tomasson.

 

[Hip Hop]

There is no universe where this is so. Will be lucky to get half of that.

I think you guys focus too much on what he does at the moment but if you look at the bigger picture :

- He is young (22) so can improve drastically
- Has shown last year that he can score in a terrible team (10 league goals + 5 in CL)
- Narrative about the bad environment ‘’apparently all our flops flourish away from the club ’’
- The lack of strikers in world football, the worst I have ever seen since watching the game mean scarcity value
- Low wages + has a contract till 2028
- Valued at €60m in transfermarkt

We are such a mess as a club at the moment so it’s easy to hide behind the bad environment narrative, specially for our young players. They still have value in the market.

 

[Cwall22]

You can literally watch his first 4 or 5 goals for us. 3 poachers finishes, 2 against villa, ones a first time reaction shot, the other he anticipates where the header is going at a set piece, another one runs gets across his man at the near post against Wolves to finish a cross. Good driving run and finish against West Ham. And a nice finish vs spurs. Do you ever watch us?

Since then hes had the insane ability to never be in the right position or making the right run. The last straw was that sitter last night and he hasnt even got his shot away. If we say its because of a lack of confidence, how will he ever build his confidence if hes not burying those.

 

[Xeque_279]

His XG in the league is in the range of 2.3/2.7 dependant on stats platform, he has 2 goals. He’s devoid of confidence but the stats all show we just haven't made him any chances. We’ve only scored 34 league goals. As a team our attack is just shit. He hasn't missed bags of chances. I get people saying he should show other things, but I just dont think he is a hold up man and if he drops into deeper areas etc to get on the ball well hes going to be 40 yards from goal .

Not saying he's world class or disagreeing he's playing badly overall but I dont think its a full picture to pin the lack of goals on him

The chance that he fluffed yesterday was equal to 0 xG because he didn't get the shot away. So xG can be misleading.

 

[Olecurls99]

The chance that he fluffed yesterday was equal to 0 xG because he didn't get the shot away. So xG can be misleading.

There are huge problems with xG. It can be glanced at but no more

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

Perhaps the PL should credit him with two shots on target too to cheer him up and boost his confidence. It's come to the point where we blame the stats now for nor registering shots that never happened.

 

[Jezpeza]

The chance that he fluffed yesterday was equal to 0 xG because he didn't get the shot away. So xG can be misleading.

Which chance? The one where he took a touch which he shouldnt have taken which allowed Rice to tackle? I would say he should have shot first time, but he didnt. Stuff like that happens all the time in football. He also had a shot blocked by Gabriel when he got across the near post to the cross.

Is your expectation he turns every slight sniff into a goal?

 

[Mike Smalling]

I think you guys focus too much on what he does at the moment but if you look at the bigger picture :

- He is young (22) so can improve drastically
- Has shown last year that he can score in a terrible team (10 league goals + 5 in CL)
- Narrative about the bad environment ‘’apparently all our flops flourish away from the club ’’
- The lack of strikers in world football, the worst I have ever seen since watching the game mean scarcity value
- Low wages + has a contract till 2028
- Valued at €60m in transfermarkt

We are such a mess as a club at the moment so it’s easy to hide behind the bad environment narrative, specially for our young players. They still have value in the market.

Consider our bargaining power here though. We want to sell (I hope), and any buying club will know this. Unless there are multiple serious buyers, I can’t see the price being driven up to that level. And even then they would consider what other prospects are available for that price.

 

[Olecurls99]

Did everything right for that chance that was blocked by Saliva. Really unlucky there

 

[Jezpeza]

Since then hes had the insane ability to never be in the right position or making the right run. The last straw was that sitter last night and he hasnt even got his shot away. If we say its because of a lack of confidence, how will he ever build his confidence if hes not burying those.

Its not that much of a sitter. Hes on the edge of the box, the ball coming across him from his right, he is left footed. Saliba is to his left to close him down. He could let it roll across him and hit it first time with his left which I think he should have done - no guarantee it goes in though. Instead he takes a touch towards goal but then positions his body wrong in a way that makes it possible for Rice to tackle him without going through him and giving away a penalty and red card.

Its not like he is 4 yards out from an open goal, at all.

 

[pocco]

Which chance? The one where he took a touch which he shouldnt have taken which allowed Rice to tackle? I would say he should have shot first time, but he didnt. Stuff like that happens all the time in football. He also had a shot blocked by Gabriel when he got across the near post to the cross.

Is your expectation he turns every slight sniff into a goal?

I'm all for defending our players when they're getting battered from pillar to post, I think Hojlund is getting a lot of unfair criticism at the moment due to the shortcomings and habits of the team as a whole. But he should have at least got a shot off for that chance yesterday, he's been desperate for that sort of chance to come his way and he fluffed it. At this level you have to be an absolute killer, you can't be second guessing or miscontrolling in that situation.

 

[Xeque_279]

Which chance? The one where he took a touch which he shouldnt have taken which allowed Rice to tackle? I would say he should have shot first time, but he didnt. Stuff like that happens all the time in football. He also had a shot blocked by Gabriel when he got across the near post to the cross.

Is your expectation he turns every slight sniff into a goal?

No, I mentioned that to say how skewed xG can be. That chance was the biggest chance of the whole game and it amounted to zero xG.

 

[Redstain]

Would like to see him in a better functioning team. Maybe loan him with Antony to Betis next season.

He was axed by Denmark in the Euro's who have a decent team for a national tournament.

Hojlund is miles off it, I see many fans referring to his first season but he scored the majority of his goals in one calender month. It was a purple patch of form that has dried up the same thing many critique Rashford for in the past.

The reason he doesn't shoot isn't because of the team but his lack of athleticism. He can't drop his shoulder and pull off a shot, watched UCL game recently the goal Athletico Madrid scored wasn't providing service for their striker it was Alvarez shifting the defender the wrong way and he buried the ball into the back of the net.

Rasmus isn't agile enough to quickly change direction or be effective in possession. The aspect that players like Lukaku, Wood and Haaland have over over him is their physicality. Size doesn't always equate to strength, his stature is misleading.

 

[Jezpeza]

I'm all for defending our players when they're getting battered from pillar to post, I think Hojlund is getting a lot of unfair criticism at the moment due to the shortcomings and habits of the team as a whole. But he should have at least got a shot off for that chance yesterday, he's been desperate for that sort of chance to come his way and he fluffed it. At this level you have to be an absolute killer, you can't be second guessing or miscontrolling in that situation.

I think he should have too. A world class striker in good form turns that into a goal. But he isn't that. I dont think he should have to be our starting striker - this season or last. But I also dont think he is solely at blame for our dysfunctional attack or lack of goals as a team. On the commentary last night they said the stats have him at getting 1 shot a game. Unless he or any other striker we put in the side has a 100% conversion rate then we need to make more chances, get more players more shots in general.

 

[Shinjch]

Can't help but feel Obi would have been more likely to get a goal off the bench. Can understand why the manager brought Hojlund on instead, didn't want to totally kill him. That chance that was handed to him on a plate summed up Hojlund for me. Will never be good enough.

 

[Jezpeza]

No, I mentioned that to say how skewed xG can be. That chance was the biggest chance of the whole game and it amounted to zero xG.

I dont think its a whopper of a chance. He either lets it roll across him and takes a first time shot from the edge of the box or he has to take it closer to goal. His position after his touch allows Rice to make a good cover tackle.

I’d say if you put Harry Kane in that position he probably takes a touch but gets his body between the ball and Rice and puts it away. But we dont have a world class striker. Thats why they cost the big bucks - they turn these situations into goals

 

[Fortitude]

Rooney who knows a lot more than me about what it takes to be a good striker paints a better picture of Hojlund than the Caf. In fact he is pretty impressed by his movement while well aware of his lack of confidence - as reported by the BBC.

"There was one chance where his shot was blocked after he had shown fantastic movement to get to the near post," Rooney said. "He goes once, he checks back, goes again, got across Gabriel and got a good contact on his shot, so he had done everything right. It is only a great block that stops the goal."

I'm just a fan and have been for over 60 years and was glad to read this from one who knows rather than all the doom and gloom from other fans on the Caf where, I guess, our emotions and disappointment can cloud our judgement.

Good luck Rasmus, hang on in there mate, keep trying, keep making those runs and you will get on the end of something!

It is called positive reinforcement and it is nice of Rooney to do, but I doubt he would air his true feelings lest field Højlund if he were his manager and had to make a decision on who his #9 is.

This “doom and gloom” rhetoric is actually objective observation that has been building for months now. Some don’t want to read or see any of it because they have a romantic notion that things will turn around and this is all just a bad dream that the player will eventually wake up from; they also deem it disloyal to say anything but positive things about a player who wears the United shirt. The problem with that is it leads to a sinking ship wishing on a prayer, as we’re seeing whilst the club plummets to new depths.

Højlund is by no means the only problem, but he is a massive contributor to our woes by the very nature of being the only #9 of appropriate age to be a permanent fixture in the side. His predicament is not his fault and he had been horrendously handled here, but still, without a functioning #9, the team itself is in huge trouble with no bailout in sight, no moments of magic other strikers in the league routinely pull off for their sides, and no constructive way to build an attack around a point man his own teammates distrust by now because they have seen what he is capable of.

If I’m his boss or some legend of the club, I’m going to be trying to find the most encouraging words for him; it would actually be quite a c’ish thing to do for Rooney to lay the boot in on a kid whose already at rock bottom; public figures of such standing have no need to do so.

 

[tomaldinho1]

It is called positive reinforcement and it is nice of Rooney to do, but I doubt he would air his true feelings lest field Højlund if he were his manager and had to make a decision on who his #9 is.

This “doom and gloom” rhetoric is actually objective observation that has been building for months now. Some don’t want to read or see any of it because they have a romantic notion that things will turn around and this is all just a bad dream that the player will eventually wake up from; they also deem it disloyal to say anything but positive things about a player who wears the United shirt. The problem with that is it leads to a sinking ship wishing on a prayer, as we’re seeing whilst the club plummets to new depths.

Højlund is by no means the only problem, but he is a massive contributor to our woes by the very nature of being the only #9 of appropriate age to be a permanent fixture in the side. His predicament is not his fault and he had been horrendously handled here, but still, without a functioning #9, the team itself is in huge trouble with no bailout in sight, no moments of magic other strikers in the league routinely pull off for their sides, and no constructive way to build an attack around a point man his own teammates distrust by now because they have seen what he is capable of.

If I’m his boss or some legend of the club, I’m going to be trying to find the most encouraging words for him; it would actually be quite a c’ish thing to do for Rooney to lay the boot in on a kid whose already at rock bottom; public figures of such standing have no need to do so.

Or Rooney is just making some high level analysis of his game? What do you have an issue with from what he said? The movement for the chance versus Gabriel was superb, the chance blocked by Rice was poor.

 

[Fortitude]

I think you guys focus too much on what he does at the moment but if you look at the bigger picture :

- He is young (22) so can improve drastically
- Has shown last year that he can score in a terrible team (10 league goals + 5 in CL)
- Narrative about the bad environment ‘’apparently all our flops flourish away from the club ’’
- The lack of strikers in world football, the worst I have ever seen since watching the game mean scarcity value
- Low wages + has a contract till 2028
- Valued at €60m in transfermarkt

We are such a mess as a club at the moment so it’s easy to hide behind the bad environment narrative, specially for our young players. They still have value in the market.

He isn’t valued at €60m by any team in the real world. That’s an awful starting point for a defence of him because it already sets him up for failure. He was making his name in Italy, not England or even Spain, that knocks a lot off his value because Italian teams rarely go that high for players in this day and age. You cannot just transpose intra-PL fees to other leagues; a young, talented PL striker immediately presents with values you’re mentioning. PL clubs will also buy in from other leagues at those kind of rates, as we routinely see. You have to be an established talent for Italian teams to do similar and a special player for Spanish sides to entertain it. The Bundesliga is full of potential and potentially outstanding players; you’re going to have to stand out above what’s already there for them to even think about such a fee. By process of elimination the pool narrows to practically nought. Then there’s the aspect of which clubs routinely pay a lot to bring in talent, which will be PL clubs and a few clubs across Europe. Højlund hasn’t a prayer of being on any of their radars, even as a speculative punt.

There’s not much need to run through all of your points when the buck ends with which clubs would have the money and who would consider him in the first place. Højlund is going to have to go somewhere and rebuild his confidence, game and reputation from scratch, and from there, we can take a look at it again, but insofar as this summer, we’d be lucky to get €30m for him, and even that would likely be riddled with incentives.

 

[Fortitude]

Or Rooney is just making some high level analysis of his game? What do you have an issue with from what he said? The movement for the chance versus Gabriel was superb, the chance blocked by Rice was poor.

You may notice I don’t break down Højlund’s game in here anymore because by now it would be kicking a dead horse and it’s needless. His movement was PL standard, not superb - precisely what is a routine expectation in this league. If that was his baseline, this thread wouldn’t be what it is. With regard to Rooney, no, that’s not a high level analysis of his game because a high level analysis of his game would be a thorough analysis of all the things he does right and wrong and nobody of Rooney’s standing should be dragging an underperforming player over such coals like that.

You somehow object to me pointing out that Rooney is doing what is befitting of a club legend in offering positive reinforcement that someone like Højlund desperately needs right now; by no means does he want or need the unfiltered version to further compound his woes. Rooney pointing out all the things he’s doing right as well as all the things he is doing wrong would just be cruel and unnecessary.

 

[RuudTom83]

He isn't a lost cause by any means, but I do wonder what's the best way forward for him to improve.

Depends heavily on the summer transfer window, but a season away from Old Trafford might help him(?) At 22/23 years old he still has a lot of time to work on his game.

Or maybe United do what they should of done last summer and the summer before that...add an experienced CF to the squad for Rasmus to be an understudy/backup.

A few games on the bench might be the first option, sadly if that means starting a 17 year old, it probably does more damage to Hojlund that good.

Tricky one

 

[RedStarUnited]

Feel for the guy. Totally mismanaged by the club and left to suffer and rot.

He should have a senior striker ahead of him to take the pressure, learn from and get opportunities at the right moments at this stage of his development, instead he's having a horror season and is having to tank the criticism and pressure.

Blame his advisors more than the club. The club paid £70m for him, with the full intention of him being the main guy. His advisors should have told him 'Hey maybe you are not ready for this'.

 

[tomaldinho1]

You may notice I don’t break down Højlund’s game in here anymore because by now it would be kicking a dead horse and it’s needless. His movement was PL standard, not superb - precisely what is a routine expectation in this league. If that was his baseline, this thread wouldn’t be what it is. With regard to Rooney, no, that’s not a high level analysis of his game because a high level analysis of his game would be a thorough analysis of all the things he does right and wrong and nobody of Rooney’s standing should be dragging an underperforming player over such coals like that.

You somehow object to me pointing out that Rooney is doing what is befitting of a club legend in offering positive reinforcement that someone like Højlund desperately needs right now; by no means does he want or need the unfiltered version to further compound his woes. Rooney pointing out all the things he’s doing right as well as all the things he is doing wrong would just be cruel and unnecessary.

No you seem to be unable to accept Rooney is just giving his opinion and somehow had made it into another negative (a poster pointed out Rasmus had done something well according to Rooney which you dismissed as clearly Rooney is only saying that for positive reinforcement, it couldn't possibly be that Hojlund did well int his specific instance). That's just sad. Even in this response you've downplayed the run which Rooney called 'fantastic' because it doesn't suit how you view this subject. Take a moment and ask yourself why you have an issue with it?

Also the bolded is a contradiction and doesn't make sense.

 

[Mike Smalling]

Blame his advisors more than the club. The club paid £70m for him, with the full intention of him being the main guy. His advisors should have told him 'Hey maybe you are not ready for this'.

Maybe they did tell him that, who knows. But Højlund being a Man Utd fan was hardly going to pass up the chance. Usually agents are incentivized financially by such a move as well.

 

[11101]

With Rashford and Garnacho certainly but I do think there was instruction for Hojlund to make the space for them to run into.

I don't buy for a second buy that Amad, Zirkzee or Bruno wouldn't pick him out if he was in good space though. Every ex pro I've seen talking about Hojlund has highlighted he spends to much time fighting with defenders.

Bruno likes to play a certain kind of pass. Dinked balls behind the lines but rarely plays options for attackers to run the channels. Amad is currently too slow to release the ball.

Anyway, after yesterday I think I've given up on him. Losing that chance so easily was a turning point.

 

[Foolsgold21]

He isn't a lost cause by any means, but I do wonder what's the best way forward for him to improve.

Depends heavily on the summer transfer window, but a season away from Old Trafford might help him(?) At 22/23 years old he still has a lot of time to work on his game.

Or maybe United do what they should of done last summer and the summer before that...add an experienced CF to the squad for Rasmus to be an understudy/backup.

A few games on the bench might be the first option, sadly if that means starting a 17 year old, it probably does more damage to Hojlund that good.

Tricky one

It's quite obvious to me - if we buy someone like Mateta - ie around peak age now, and let them be the starting striker for a couple of years - and then let Hojlund be the back up.

At the very least if we improve as a team, his value should rise and then take stock in summer 2026 if it still isn't working out with him.

 

[UnitedSofa]

Clearly going through something, hopefully fans lay off him for a bit, it can’t help the situation

 

[klayton88]

Good luck Rasmus, hang on in there mate, keep trying, keep making those runs and you will get on the end of something!

He couldn't get on the end of a conga line.

 

[honirelandboy]

Is he after bulking up too much, maybe needs to slim down a bit, starting to remind me of when Torress went to Chelsea.
Anyway the talent is just not there, he's too slow with the ball at his feet, his acceleration is horrendous and his first touch is atrocious. His center of gravity is really bad as well. He has zero clue of what's happening around him as well. Compare him with someone like Isak and Watkins and he's so far behind. He needs to go on loan somewhere for a year like Diallo did with Sunderland. Maybe a year in the championship would do him the world of good.

 

[bosnian_red]

Clearly going through something, hopefully fans lay off him for a bit, it can’t help the situation

It's nothing to do with the fans, it's the pressure at the club... He needs a loan to a smaller league and he needs to develop as a player. Right now he isn't good enough for this league, and he won't ever be unless he moves elsewhere, develops and learns how to play as a CF.

 

[UnitedSofa]

It's nothing to do with the fans, it's the pressure at the club... He needs a loan to a smaller league and he needs to develop as a player. Right now he isn't good enough for this league, and he won't ever be unless he moves elsewhere, develops and learns how to play as a CF.

The purple patch and his run in europe last season, proves he can do it at United though.

 

[Doracle]

It's nothing to do with the fans, it's the pressure at the club... He needs a loan to a smaller league and he needs to develop as a player. Right now he isn't good enough for this league, and he won't ever be unless he moves elsewhere, develops and learns how to play as a CF.

This is spot on. Absolute priority to loan him out in the summer. He also needs to not be playing currently - and definitely not as a starter. Small sub appearances for the rest of the season, giving him a chance to build some confidence with less pressure before a loan to try and give him a chance to develop away from United.

 

[Fortitude]

No you seem to be unable to accept Rooney is just giving his opinion and somehow had made it into another negative (a poster pointed out Rasmus had done something well according to Rooney which you dismissed as clearly Rooney is only saying that for positive reinforcement, it couldn't possibly be that Hojlund did well int his specific instance). That's just sad. Even in this response you've downplayed the run which Rooney called 'fantastic' because it doesn't suit how you view this subject. Take a moment and ask yourself why you have an issue with it?

Also the bolded is a contradiction and doesn't make sense.

That’s your interpretation and it’s definitely not correct with regards to me. High level analysis doesn’t brush over anything as it is thorough and assesses the whole over what would essentially be cherry picking.

 

[Livewire1974]

I am happy to stick with him for now, he is a scapegoat for the other muppetry at the club. Even Rice admitted his tackle was lucky and could have just as easily been a pen and a red card. He has been getting very little service recently and still very young, he should not be bearing the burden of being our main striker. Get behind the lad and hopefully we see some of the same form he displayed last season.

 

[Hip Hop]

He isn’t valued at €60m by any team in the real world. That’s an awful starting point for a defence of him because it already sets him up for failure. He was making his name in Italy, not England or even Spain, that knocks a lot off his value because Italian teams rarely go that high for players in this day and age. You cannot just transpose intra-PL fees to other leagues; a young, talented PL striker immediately presents with values you’re mentioning. PL clubs will also buy in from other leagues at those kind of rates, as we routinely see. You have to be an established talent for Italian teams to do similar and a special player for Spanish sides to entertain it. The Bundesliga is full of potential and potentially outstanding players; you’re going to have to stand out above what’s already there for them to even think about such a fee. By process of elimination the pool narrows to practically nought. Then there’s the aspect of which clubs routinely pay a lot to bring in talent, which will be PL clubs and a few clubs across Europe. Højlund hasn’t a prayer of being on any of their radars, even as a speculative punt.

There’s not much need to run through all of your points when the buck ends with which clubs would have the money and who would consider him in the first place. Højlund is going to have to go somewhere and rebuild his confidence, game and reputation from scratch, and from there, we can take a look at it again, but insofar as this summer, we’d be lucky to get €30m for him, and even that would likely be riddled with incentives.

Yeah I wanted to say euros not pounds in my first post you quoted to be honest, my bad. But €40m to €50m (closer to 40 I reckon) for a striker is nothing in PL, he is a starter for his national side and club. Again has shown some form last year in PL and CL so not a unknown young striker with zero accomplishment.

Of course I’m not counting on Italian or Spanish sides but more on desperate PL sides like West Ham or even Chelsea because he fits their criteria of squad filled with young talents. But this is just an ideal outcome for me a loan is more on the cards I suppose.

 

[tomaldinho1]

That’s your interpretation and it’s definitely not correct with regards to me. High level analysis doesn’t brush over anything as it is thorough and assesses the whole over what would essentially be cherry picking.

So you ignore all analysis then? Because no analysis ever on bbc, sky etc. will go into a players every involvement in a game? They will pick key moments to analyse.