No he certainly doesn't. It will depend entirely on results.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
No he certainly doesn't. It will depend entirely on results.
I don't really see any "irrespective" about it, we're in a position where we spent £100m on two of the worst players in the team, and they aren't just one-off misses. I don't think Amorim could have any complaints if he got sacked, I just don't think that's what's going to change our fortunes next year. We might challenge for top-six by going back to playing to our squad's strengths on the counter, I guess, but I'm not excited at that prospect.
Agree on the second para though, we should be getting players that play the way we as a club want to play, and it's the manager's job to implement that. Absolutely shouldn't be about getting yet more players tied to the current manager.
He will. Don’t worry.
What will be the fallout from this season if we don’t win the Europa League?
It’s clear that at this point all our eggs are in that basket. I do think that there is something to be said for building confidence with some wins, and the opposite happening if we keep on losing these matches, but that’s just my opinion, so that’s whatever. I can’t see there being any hiccups against Bilbao, but there’s a strong chance we might end up meeting Spurs in the final and we get beat by any team that is PL level these days, never mind one that’s scored 20 more goals than us and has beaten us a few times this season
It’s clear that at this point all our eggs are in that basket. I do think that there is something to be said for building confidence with some wins, and the opposite happening if we keep on losing these matches, but that’s just my opinion, so that’s whatever. I can’t see there being any hiccups against Bilbao, but there’s a strong chance we might end up meeting Spurs in the final and we get beat by any team that is PL level these days, never mind one that’s scored 20 more goals than us and has beaten us a few times this season
Scouts would obviously identify lesser known players. The coaches will know the more established ones. I would imagine Amorim provides Wilcox and Berada with a list of preferences at each position in need and the latter two get to work to see which they can buy.
Do you think Dorgu and Dalot will play WB next season? Are they top 5 material?
But it is the exact same mistakes you’re advocating that we make. Is this not exactly what this supposed football structure was supposed to put an end to? Signing players tailored to a single manager’s specific needs, only to have the next manager come in and disassemble the squad and replace Yesterday’s signings with new expensive players who aren’t necessarily better, just of a different profile. That’s what got us into this mess. Imagine the money we could have saved if we’d just kept Smalling and Evans rather than buying a shitload of defenders who weren’t any better. The structure was supposed to protect us from that by having a set squad formation and an overarching philosophy that all signings should fit into, so that one manager’s signings didn’t end up as another’s deadwood. Yet now we have a manager who decided mid-season to change our club formation to one that evidently suits neither the team nor the league, and now you have fans wanting him to spend a fortune tailoring the squad to this specific system?
I had no issues with Rangnick, I quite liked him. He's long gone though.
I always wonder why we always difficult scoring goals? We can create good opportunities, not most of the time to be fair, but just failed to put the ball into the net. The goal opportunity either is blocked or just fly over the goalie.
Is it because our strikers or midfielders do not have the instinct knowing where the pass would go to and score? Or is it down to the system itself? Of course, we need a better commander upfront and a striker with killer instinct for sure.
Not to mention that the team always get out run by opponents. Seems like the team tend to wait for the passes rather than go forward and receive the passes. Most of the time, when we wait and receive the ball; the opponent has already putting pressure on us or overload us; resulting we lose our possession easily. This is something we need to improve.
Is it because our strikers or midfielders do not have the instinct knowing where the pass would go to and score? Or is it down to the system itself? Of course, we need a better commander upfront and a striker with killer instinct for sure.
Not to mention that the team always get out run by opponents. Seems like the team tend to wait for the passes rather than go forward and receive the passes. Most of the time, when we wait and receive the ball; the opponent has already putting pressure on us or overload us; resulting we lose our possession easily. This is something we need to improve.
Of course it is to with the system, with a proper functioning system we wouldnt be so exposed at the back.
Do you disagree ?
I actually liked Rangnick, but it was clear pretty early on that the squad had zero belief in him (something that, of our other managers, I've really only seen happen with Moyes) - and when that occurs, things will only end one way.
Exactly, even in being so stubborn in his formation Amorim could tweak it so the two 10’s were wide players instead and we’d have pace and width.
Right there in lies the problem at the club as just like before under the Glazer’s with Woodward we’re seeing non footballing people making footballing decisions and the worst part is we finally had someone in Ashworth who IS a footballing person and KNOWS how to put together a proper footballing structure and we ignored his advice to allow a fecking cycling coach in Brailsford and a sponsorship/commercial guy in Berrada to overrule Ashworth and go with their choices.
If as most likely based on how things look Amorim is gone by Christmas then Berrada should be told by Ineos he isn’t allowed in on any footballing decisions again as outside of the weakest Europa in years due to no CL teams dropping down into it Amorim has been a domestic disaster and that is 100% on Berrada, the first thing a new coach should do is improve what he has and Amorim has managed to make it worse.
Surely you can’t be serious ?
His record is genuinely embarrassing.
This is kind of a wild thing to say
1 ppm
6 wins in 24 premier league games
the idea that we would likely win isn’t rooted in reality
I think the feeling was mutual. Ralf was on a hiding to nothing and that's why he said some of things he did. I think it has been a shock for a few managers since Fergie when they found out how bad things were from the top down.
I mean we only lost by a single goal and we rotated about 6 or 7 players, so hardly a controversial opinion.
It would really suck, and it would hurt us significantly financially and in the transfer market, but that's about it IMO.
For me, a one-off match should never on its own define whether a manager is the right person to take us forward or not.
Given that we’re losing most of our league games regardless of who we play, then yes, it’s a silly, blanket statement based on nothing.
Surprise, surprise, all the posters who went missing after Bilbao, are back with full force.
Agreed, and IIRC he accepted the Austria job before he was told the consultancy was canceled, so I don't think he was too upset about not staying on.
On Ashworth: Suspect it was a matter of two many cooks in the kitchen. Having Berada, Ashworth, and Wilcox all simultaneously involved was a recipe for inevitable tension and conflict. The hiring and sacking of Ashworth and retention of EtH are two massive mistakes INEOS have made in less than a year.
Weekday vs weekend may have something to do with it. I was in the office Thursday and missed the match. Would not be surprised if other fans from the western hemisphere were in the same boat.
That's the first time I've heard a full league season is not enough to evaluate a team. If you watched our game against Forest, that's another game we "won" on xG yet on the eye test they deliberately set up shop after scoring, and bar some Maguire chaos ball, didn't look like scoring. We had a lot of high volume low probability shots against a team with several bodies behind the ball and already set in their shape. Another example of why xG is nonsense.
Or maybe we were simply happy with what was a really important win and didn’t want to waste a happy moment complaining, crazy I know.
Wolves.
Their manager joined them after Amorim joined us, plays a similar system - has done considerably better
Emery, Howe, Frank, Potter, Nuno and Silva. Can anyone make a serious case that Amorim is a better PL manager than of them? This is the depths of mediocrity we are at as a club and what supporters are prepared to accept. Sad times.
The truth is we made huge mistake to sack Ole! Rangnick is not a choice for head coach but his opinion on what to improve is great.
The real damages have been done by two transfer windows under ETH. The squad lost more physicality. That can only be fixed in the next two transfer windows.
Potter?! feck off
John Murtough and Richard Arnold were so weak they caved in to the pressure from ETH and got rid of Ragnick by paying his 2 years salary which i find it very strange, we lost close to 10 millions there for nothing instead of using Ralf's experience, the idea of giving him 2.5 years contract was to use him as a DOF in last 2 years, imagine what he could have done with 600M in 3 years.
Ralf said, TenHag didnt even accept the 30 mins call Ralf offered to explain his findings within the team. I know every manager like to start with a clean slate but we could have used Ralf's experience as a DOF rather easily giving him 2 years salary for free.
Amorim come across some one who likes to use the experience people like Ralf to build the team like he did at sporting.
That makes sense too. After a good performance / result there's not much debate, because everyone generally is happy. There's more back-and-forth with a negative result - reckon the same applies to most of the player performance threads.
You’re not wrong there, which ties back in to those ridiculous notions we’ve seen in the past of a manager having 2/3 games to save his job or something like that.
I suppose what I am more wondering, which we will obviously not ever know the answer to, is what was said to Amorim when he was hired in terms of what was expected of him this season.
Naturally when you replace an underperforming manager with someone new you expect an improvement of some sort, but we’ve gotten markedly worse in the league. The results in the EL have just about kept this season from being a disaster in every aspect, so it brings me to wonder what do the people in charge make of the season if we don’t win the EL. What do they then really have to go on to say that we are definitely going in the right direction? Or did they say to Amorim that this season was a free hit no matter what, and he would only be judged from next season?
What were the expectations laid out to him when he took the job, and how is he doing in the eyes of the ones in charge?
If he can't improve the results with 200 million than he has to go. I don't expect a title challenge but we should be up there in the top 5.
I think if he tweaks/changes his system then there are chances we see improvement. If we are just relying on summer recruitment, we will be in for the same rude shock as with Eth.
Which is why Ineos should be looking at replacements to come in if Amorim doesn’t win Europa as not being able to win the weakest Europa in years due to no CL teams dropping down added to our disgusting domestic season means he should be out of a job and it should be accepted as a disaster that didn’t work at all.
Then the kitchen should have split up with Berrada doing what he’s meant to do in his Gill/Woodward role on the business side of the club and Ashworth being in charge of everything on the actual football side of things with Wilcox reporting to both, Ineos allowed the business chief to overrule the football chief and make decisions the business side should never be allowed to do which is going to end up being the fourth massive mistake Ineos have made with the third being if Amorim is kept on if United don’t win Europa and the fourth when they DO fire Amorim before Christmas when things don’t change.
He has done nothing outside Portugal which has a weak league. Hiring such a manager is a huge gamble and then he wants to change our system. Huge huge gamble. But also very symptomatic of us, so much incompetence. Manager, scouts, DOF, CEO, owners.
Every manager we hired would want to change the system
It does, hence why I went on to give the context of the team today. There's holes opening up all over the squad, attack, midfield, defence whether that be players not really improving as hoped (e.g. Mainoo, Hojlund), depth players leaving (e.g. Eriksen, Lindelof) players that can't string games together (e.g. De Ligt, Mount, Shaw, Martinez) and players who just aren't good enough (Onana). Then you have Zirkzee, who has obvious quality but doesn't seem to fit, Casemiro who's not going to keep this up forever, Dalot who's had one really good season... So yeah, I see it's a big mitigating factor, churn is natural, needing to constantly tear things up isn't. But it's a neverending discussion and like I say, I'm tired of it.
But no, I don't blame Amorim for any of that, and I am probably on the kinder end of the spectrum towards him, but I'm also wary after the ETH experiment.