Agbonlahor

[Sarni]

So according to you 10 goals in 37 matches is not a bad record for a 21 yr old striker who had been playing regular EPL football for the past 3 years? Are you on drugs or what? FFS even players like Yakubu had been able to score goals at his age, let alone true talent like Owen or Rooney.

You're looking like Mithun here, albeit less spasticated. Agbonlahor has never been used that much up front, Villa play a formation in which both him and Young are used more as wingers than strikers. It's Carew who they rely on in terms of scoring rather than Agbonlahor.

And where did get the image of Agbonlahor playing his 4th professional season at EPL confuses me a lot. Care to explain, devilish?

 

[Sarni]

Playing for Villa where he is very often wide right in only his second season at this level, 10 goals is an excellent record. I expect it's around as many as Rooney scored in his second season at Everton.

It's more. He scored 9 goals in 38 games in his first season at Villa playind wide right, not in a striker role. Rooney manager only 3 more than that in his first TWO seasons.

But I'd rather be silent, Mithun may use it in the other argument to give a further proof of being a spastic.

 

[Sylar]

Id like us to buy him, as long as we dont pay over 10m.

 

[Ekeke]

Playing for Villa where he is very often wide right in only his second season at this level, 10 goals is an excellent record. I expect it's around as many as Rooney scored in his second season at Everton.

Agbonlahor is a pretty decent striker. He's not just quick, he's also very strong and good in the air. I'd love him as 3rd choice striker, with the option of playing him in a front three, however he won't come cheap. There are better options for the £10+ mil we'd have to pay for him.

I think Rooney did get 10, but he was 17 not 21.

 

[devilish]

You're looking like Mithun here, albeit less spasticated. Agbonlahor has never been used that much up front, Villa play a formation in which both him and Young are used more as wingers than strikers. It's Carew who they rely on in terms of scoring rather than Agbonlahor.

And where did get the image of Agbonlahor playing his 4th professional season at EPL confuses me a lot. Care to explain, devilish?

Actually this is his third season who had been playing regular football. During the season 2005 - 2006 he scored 1 goal in 19 matches (with Watford, Sheffield AND Aston Villa). In 2006 - 2007 Villa's road runner scored 10 goals in 42 matches. This season he scored 10 goals in 37 matches. Wow a record. No wonder why they dont rely on this great talent in terms of scoring.

 

[devilish]

I think Rooney did get 10, but he was 17 not 21.

SSSSHHH.....you will spoil another Britain's next world class player in the making moment....

Ok guys ive been half serious, half joking throughout this entire thread but the Agbon guy is an average talent at best. No one in the right mind would invest more then 2- 4m on this guy (and Im being generous) and we all know that Villa would never sell him for less then twice that sum.

 

[Sarni]

Actually this is his third season who had been playing regular football. During the season 2005 - 2006 he scored 1 goal in 19 matches (with Watford, Sheffield AND Aston Villa)

Again, how 19 games for three various teams (only 1 of them in EPL) is a regular EPL football? It doesn't even help your development if you play two games for a second division outfit and then not play for another three months.

Last season was his first at this level, this one is his second. Don't try to put it different way because it's simply pointless. What you said is that Agbonlahor has three seasons of a regular EPL football which is absolute bollocks.

And yes, I'd say that ten goals a season for a player that is rotated between the right wing and attack, and is never a prime striker of his team, is a pretty good record.

I'm not saying he's a world beater, he certainly isn't at the moment. Nonetheless he's a talented lad and his record doesn't embarass himself, as you'd like. Villa are not a side like United who get 80 league goals a season, they are nothing like it.

 

[Sarni]

I think Rooney did get 10, but he was 17 not 21.

He's not the same class as Rooney. Rooney's example though shows that you don't have to score 30 a season to make yourself talented.

 

[devilish]

Again, how 19 games for three various teams (only 1 of them in EPL) is a regular EPL football? It doesn't even help your development if you play two games for a second division outfit and then not play for another three months.

Last season was his first at this level, this one is his second. Don't try to put it different way because it's simply pointless. What you said is that Agbonlahor has three seasons of a regular EPL football which is absolute bollocks.

And yes, I'd say that ten goals a season for a player that is rotated between the right wing and attack, and is never a prime striker of his team, is a pretty good record.

I'm not saying he's a world beater, he certainly isn't at the moment. Nonetheless he's a talented lad and his record doesn't embarass himself, as you'd like. Villa are not a side like United who get 80 league goals a season, they are nothing like it.

During season 2005 - 2006, Gabriel played 9 games with Villa where he scored 1 goal. He also played 10 games with two other clubs at an inferior divison and despite all, he wasnt able to score not even a goal. Anyway theoratically speaking he havent been playing 3 years of regular EPL football so I take your point.

Stating that, I have to disagree with you on this (bold part). Just because you play with a smaller club that doesnt mean that you cant score piles of goals. Recent football history is littered by strikers who had been scoring huge amount of goals with smaller clubs, from Lucarelli to Yakubu, from Forlan to our own Rossi.

The very fact that Agbonlahor had never managed to impose himself as a striker with a small team like Villa must be ringing the bells that maybe, he is not as good as a striker as youre potray him to be. I mean if he cant lead the line with Villa how the hell he can lead it with us?

 

[Sarni]

Again, I have to point out that Carew is their main striker and not Agbonlahor. Agbonlahor is used at wings a lot of times along with Young and they are there to create opportunities for Carew, so 10 goals a season is not really an embarrasing record for any of them.

Pricing him between 2 million and 4 million is insane when you look at current market, where players like Richardson and Chopra who have done very little compared to Agbonlahor's impact at Villa go for more than that. 7-8 million is probably a good price for a striker like him, players tend to be expensive nowadays.

 

[Sam]

Agbonlahor does not play as their main striker, Carew does.

10 goals from the wing is very respectable indeed.

 

[devilish]

Again, I have to point out that Carew is their main striker and not Agbonlahor. Agbonlahor is used at wings a lot of times along with Young and they are there to create opportunities for Carew, so 10 goals a season is not really an embarrasing record for any of them.

Pricing him between 2 million and 4 million is insane when you look at current market, where players like Richardson and Chopra who have done very little compared to Agbonlahor's impact at Villa go for more than that. 7-8 million is probably a good price for a striker like him, players tend to be expensive nowadays.

At 6m AC Milan got Kaka while Villareal got Rossi. Ok they were both bargains, stating that, spending 8m on a striker who isnt considered good enough to lead Villa's line up is insane. If clubs are so stupid to spend loads of money on Richardson then that shouldnt be our concern.

 

[Sarni]

At 6m AC Milan got Kaka. Ok it was a bargain, but spending 8m on a striker who isnt considered good enough to lead Villa's line up is insane. If clubs are so stupid to spend loads of money on Richardson then that shouldnt be our concern.

It's not like he's not considered to be good enough to lead Villa's frontline. It'd be like saying that Rooney wasn't worth the money because he's not considered to be good enough to lead the frontline and we have brought Tevez since his arrival. He's just a different type of striker, not the one that scores an astonishing amounts of goals but the one that causes a lot of fuss with his runs down the wing, pretty much like Aaron Lennon (who has failed to deliver on a higher scale too).

You cannot use Kaka as an example for anything, he came from Sao Paulo. You don't exactly see players from Brazil joining European teams for fees higher than that, they are cheap. How they turn out is a different case. If you are using Kaka as an example of a fair price, then United have overpaid for virtually everybody in the last 5 years, even for Ronaldo who isn't twice the player Kaka is. But that's not the point, Kaka was one off.

 

[Diver]

I rate Agbonlahor

I think it would be good to get another english striker as well.

 

[Scholesy]

I dont like his personality..

 

[Mainoldo]

Villa fans hate him..... They always say that his got nothing to his game expect for pace!! So no thankyou!

 

[devilish]

It's not like he's not considered to be good enough to lead Villa's frontline. It'd be like saying that Rooney wasn't worth the money because he's not considered to be good enough to lead the frontline and we have brought Tevez since his arrival. He's just a different type of striker, not the one that scores an astonishing amounts of goals but the one that causes a lot of fuss with his runs down the wing, pretty much like Aaron Lennon (who has failed to deliver on a higher scale too).

You cannot use Kaka as an example for anything, he came from Sao Paulo. You don't exactly see players from Brazil joining European teams for fees higher than that, they are cheap. How they turn out is a different case. If you are using Kaka as an example of a fair price, then United have overpaid for virtually everybody in the last 5 years, even for Ronaldo who isn't twice the player Kaka is. But that's not the point, Kaka was one off.

Rooney had been playing as a striker from day 1. We brought Tevez to partner Rooney (since Saha wasnt able to keep his place due to injury) and not to replace him. Agbonlahor's situation is different. He plays with a small club who has to take the best out of their talent. Yet, despite being a striker, he wasnt even able to hold keep his place and was relegated to a wingers role.

Anyway, the reasoning here is simple. Manchester United needs a striker. Now I cant see why we should spend 8m on a player who is not able to do that role at Villa. Whats next? Should AC Milan spend 8m on OShea because he happens to be 'a different type of player' then any defender (ie he is pretty shit in defending) and is therefore played in numerous positions?

Ive mentioned Kaka as the classic case of a great player who had brought at reasonable prices. I could mention others, players like Van Pierse for example. Cristiano is another example. Why should we spend 8m on a striker who is played as a winger because he will never score enough goals when we can add another 4m to that sum and bring in a potential world class talent? As stated before 4 - 5m is the realistic price of a player like Agbonlahor. If Villa refuses that, then tough luck. No wonder therefore why our last transfers where Anderson and Nani and not Agbonlahor and Young.

 

[Giggsy PO]

I dont like his personality..

And that is?

 

[Chris H]

No one in the right mind would invest more then 2- 4m on this guy (and Im being generous) and we all know that Villa would never sell him for less then twice that sum.

I think they'd want 12-15m, actually. He's 21, so you pay for what he might someday become. And he's English, so you pay twice that. He's not a bad player, but not nearly worth the price. Might never establish himself as United class, although he should have a decent career at Villa.

As for buying English, Ferguson has bought:
-Rio and Rooney. Best English players at their position. Seeing them as potential United players for a decade or more, we weren't afraid to pay huge fees to get them. Two excellent decisions in hindsight.
-Hargreaves and Carrick. Not the overwhelming best at their position, but established professionals well suited to fit a particular need in the squad, - and in Carrick's case, at a particular time. In both cases, we paid what many would consider over the odds to bring them in, but in Carrick's case at least, that decision has already been justified by last year's title.

Ferguson has avoided buying English players based on their potential, unless they have already shown that they're so good they can't possibly miss, as with Rooney. You have to pay ridiculous money to take a gamble on English potential, and far more often than not, it ends up not being worth the price. Not when your European contacts are good enough to get you a better player for less money - think Nani instead of Agbonlahor, or Anderson instead of Gareth Barry.

 

[devilish]

I think they'd want 12-15m, actually. He's 21, so you pay for what he might someday become. And he's English, so you pay twice that. He's not a bad player, but not nearly worth the price. Might never establish himself as United class, although he should have a decent career at Villa.

As for buying English, Ferguson has bought:
-Rio and Rooney. Best English players at their position. Seeing them as potential United players for a decade or more, we weren't afraid to pay huge fees to get them. Two excellent decisions in hindsight.
-Hargreaves and Carrick. Not the overwhelming best at their position, but established professionals well suited to fit a particular need in the squad, - and in Carrick's case, at a particular time. In both cases, we paid what many would consider over the odds to bring them in, but in Carrick's case at least, that decision has already been justified by last year's title.

Ferguson has avoided buying English players based on their potential, unless they have already shown that they're so good they can't possibly miss, as with Rooney. You have to pay ridiculous money to take a gamble on English potential, and far more often than not, it ends up not being worth the price. Not when your European contacts are good enough to get you a better player for less money - think Nani instead of Agbonlahor, or Anderson instead of Gareth Barry.

I agree. Stating that 15m for a striker who cant score is ridiculous expecially since we got geniune talent like Anderson and Ronaldo for less then that.

 

[Kaiketsu_Zorro]

If Agbonlahor wasn't English you lot wouldn't rave about him, I guess. I haven't seen much of him but when I saw him, he didn't look special in any way. And he wouldn't come on a cheap either.

 

[francobaresi]

Agbonlahor is not good enough for United. No thanks

 

[devilish]

If Agbonlahor wasn't English you lot wouldn't rave about him, I guess. I haven't seen much of him but when I saw him, he didn't look special in any way. And he wouldn't come on a cheap either.

Amen

 

[Rowem]

If Agbonlahor wasn't English you lot wouldn't rave about him, I guess. I haven't seen much of him but when I saw him, he didn't look special in any way.

I agree he wouldn't be cheap, but the English comment is just plain wrong.

/start rant (not aimed solely at you, btw)

It's so easy to assume people rate the likes of Agbonlahor, Bentley etc.. because they're young and English. It's also ridiculous.

It's correct to rate the likes of Agbonlahor and Bentley because they're performing in the strongest competition in the world. It's nothing to do with being English. Players who perform well in the PL get mentioned, doesn't matter what nationality. The likes of McCarthy, Pederson, Santa Cruz, Krancjar, Zarate, Yakubu, Cahill, Arteta, N'Zogbia and many more all get talked about when in a rich vein of form for lesser teams. Most people on here watch the PL regularly. It's obvious that the people who perform in the league are going to be noticed and discussed. It just so happens that Agbonlahor/Bentley/Young are three of the top performers in the bracket of good players at mid table Premiership teams.

How many times do frankly average players, who've had a couple good games, get talked about on here? Take N'Zogbia for example. He's been linked with us and Arsenal, when he can't even cut it with Newcastle. How many times do you see foreigners bought by English clubs who, despite their obvious talent, just don't cut it in the PL. The likes of Postiga, Forlan, Materazzi, Sissoko, Bellion, JD Tomasson, and many many more who I can't even remember because their impact in the PL was so small. To a lesser extent you have the likes of Veron, Kanoute and Rossi (omg controversial!) who look far better on foreign soil. It's one thing to look like a brilliant player in Spain or Italy, it's completely different looking like a good player in England. Fact is Agbonlahor has performed for two seasons, something that many more talented and technically able players have failed to do.

How many times does someone suggest some young, talented foreign kid with bundles of flair who is rated as the next big thing? You think that has more credibility than suggesting someone who has proved they cut it in the PL? A lot of technically brillaint foreigners aren't suited to the PL. It's too fast, too rough. The likes of Agbonlahor know what is expected of them, and you know they'll give 100% even when playing away at Bolton in the pouring rain.

/end rant

 

[devilish]

I agree he wouldn't be cheap, but the English comment is just plain wrong.

/start rant (not aimed solely at you, btw)

It's so easy to assume people rate the likes of Agbonlahor, Bentley etc.. because they're young and English. It's also ridiculous.

It's correct to rate the likes of Agbonlahor and Bentley because they're performing in the strongest competition in the world. It's nothing to do with being English. Players who perform well in the PL get mentioned, doesn't matter what nationality. The likes of McCarthy, Pederson, Santa Cruz, Krancjar, Zarate, Yakubu, Cahill, Arteta, N'Zogbia and many more all get talked about when in a rich vein of form for lesser teams. Most people on here watch the PL regularly. It's obvious that the people who perform in the league are going to be noticed and discussed. It just so happens that Agbonlahor/Bentley/Young are three of the top performers in the bracket of good players at mid table Premiership teams.

How many times do frankly average players, who've had a couple good games, get talked about on here? Take N'Zogbia for example. He's been linked with us and Arsenal, when he can't even cut it with Newcastle. How many times do you see foreigners bought by English clubs who, despite their obvious talent, just don't cut it in the PL. The likes of Postiga, Forlan, Materazzi, Sissoko, Bellion, JD Tomasson, and many many more who I can't even remember because their impact in the PL was so small. To a lesser extent you have the likes of Veron, Kanoute and Rossi (omg controversial!) who look far better on foreign soil. It's one thing to look like a brilliant player in Spain or Italy, it's completely different looking like a good player in England. Fact is Agbonlahor has performed for two seasons, something that many more talented and technically able players have failed to do.

How many times does someone suggest some young, talented foreign kid with bundles of flair who is rated as the next big thing? You think that has more credibility than suggesting someone who has proved they cut it in the PL? A lot of technically brillaint foreigners aren't suited to the PL. It's too fast, too rough. The likes of Agbonlahor know what is expected of them, and you know they'll give 100% even when playing away at Bolton in the pouring rain.

/end rant

I agree with you that the EPL is one of the strongest leagues in the world and thats mainly due to the immense amount of money thrown in it. Stating that, just because you happen to play in the EPL that doesnt mean that youre great. Let us not forget that mainly all English players happen to play in the EPL and yet they failed to qualify in the Euro despite having to face smaller nations (football speaking) like Russia, Israel and Croatia. Now Im not saying that they are shite. Im only saying that maybe other teams may have as many good players as we do.

Regarding commitment with all due respect, but it varies from player to player and not from nationality to nationality. I mean I cant remember many Italian players being caught red handed while binge drinking and spending the night out prior an important game. Can you say the same about the British talent? On the other hand would you put Gary Neville in the same bag of Gazza and co just because he is English? Would you consider Gaz as less proffesional then Cassano just because of his nationality? That would be pure madness.

There is no way to determine whether a player would make it or not and nationality has little to do with it. Ok being local would mean limiting the cultural shock to the bare minimum but its not as if we didnt had british failures (Britles for example) in the past. Let us not forget that the best talent in the EPL (which happens to be our best player) is foreign and he was brought for 12m, 3 m less then we would have to spend (according to some) to bring in Villa's striker/winger.

In my opinion we should spend the money wisely whether the talent concerned is English or foreign. For example spending 20 - 30m on geniune talent such as Rio and Rooney should be considered as money spent well as much as spending 12m on Ronaldo. On the other hand nothing will justify spending 8m on an average striker (and yes he had been average) who cant lead the line at a smaller club, whether that player is English, Italian, Chinese or from Timbuktu.

 

[Rowem]

You seem to be of the opinion that I said that English players are more committed and foreign players are not suited to the PL. I didn't. You seem to be saying I am basing my opinion on nationality, when that is the complete opposite of what I was saying.

I said, players who have actually played in the PL are better judged on whether they are suited to the PL. Naturally, this encompasses a fair amount of English players, but it also includes the likes of Arteta, Santa Cruz etc who I listed in my post. So yeah, I don't need to reply to your comments about nationality and commitment cos you're way off.

Regarding your comparison to Ronaldo, if that's the standard to judge transfers by then United should never sign anyone ever again because no signing will match that.

Regarding points you make about Agbonlahor...Firstly, that he's average. Well, if average to you is being one of the best players in a non top four club then okay, there's no real room for discussion. Secondly, that he doesn't lead the line at Villa. Villa pick a formation that works for Villa. They don't have much choice on the right wing, and they play one up front. Is Agbonlahor suited to play as a lone striker? No. Is Agbonlahor suited to leading the line in a two man strike force? Yes. Also, Rooney didn't lead the line at Everton either (and no, I dont want to enter a Rooney positional debate).

 

[devilish]

You seem to be of the opinion that I said that English players are more committed and foreign players are not suited to the PL. I didn't. You seem to be saying I am basing my opinion on nationality, when that is the complete opposite of what I was saying.

I said, players who have actually played in the PL are better judged on whether they are suited to the PL. Naturally, this encompasses a fair amount of English players, but it also includes the likes of Arteta, Santa Cruz etc who I listed in my post. So yeah, I don't need to reply to your comments about nationality and commitment cos you're way off.

Regarding your comparison to Ronaldo, if that's the standard to judge transfers by then United should never sign anyone ever again because no signing will match that.

Regarding points you make about Agbonlahor...Firstly, that he's average. Well, if average to you is being one of the best players in a non top four club then okay, there's no real room for discussion. Secondly, that he doesn't lead the line at Villa. Villa pick a formation that works for Villa. They don't have much choice on the right wing, and they play one up front. Is Agbonlahor suited to play as a lone striker? No. Is Agbonlahor suited to leading the line in a two man strike force? Yes. Also, Rooney didn't lead the line at Everton either (and no, I dont want to enter a Rooney positional debate).

Honestly I think that youre overrating him a bit. Anyway, what we need is a striker who can score goals. Now I cant see why we should spend 8 - 15m on a player who had been moved on the flank to give space to Carew. Thats all.

 

[Rowem]

He wasn't moved to the flank to make way for Carew.

 

[RedSky]

Agbonlahor?

Its all pace with him and he is not a natural finisher, far from it. He's been more wasteful than Rooney has this season and that says something!

Young is the far better player. He has a terrific end product, notice the amount of set piece goals Villa have scored this season. Young supplies all of the crossing. He also scores goals, he has pace and some trickery.

He's a far better player than David Bentley, Youngs only real weakness is he isn't strong enough. You're looking at the wrong Villa player lads

 

[Giggsy PO]

Agbonlahor.

 

[Feed Me]

Knee jerk.

 

[Ekeke]

Knee jerk.

Extremely. Almost every issue with Campbell is an issue with Agbonlahor.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Agbonlahor is a fantastic prospect. But he wouldn't work for us now because he lacks sufficient experience. Plus he is still very much like F. Campbell physically.

 

[giggs-beckham]

Agbonlahor is a fantastic prospect. But he wouldn't work for us now because he lacks sufficient experience. Plus he is still very much like F. Campbell physically.

Wrong, and wrong.





Yes yes, fine he'll do!

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Wrong, and wrong.





Yes yes, fine he'll do!

 

[RedRover]

I've watched this guy all season long and with the exception of early '08, he's been sensational. I believe he's going to be the future, along with other youngsters like Wellbeck/Lennon/Hart/Walcott, in the England national squad. If we're looking for some decent youngsters to buy up front, why not buy another future English superstar? We've done it before, buying great young talent from mid table clubs, and been successful at it so why shouldn't we put in a bid for him?

How much would the fee run to buy him I wonder?? 10m?? Why not 8m and Saha?? I'd be fine with that.

He certainly looks a good player. There's no substitue for raw pace and he has plenty.

Like all young english players he'd cost a fortune. Villa would likely point to the amount United paid for Rooney and ask any club to pay something similar.

 

[Raven Blade]

We have our own Agbonlahor. His name is Frazier Campbell.

 

[rotherham_red]

fecking muppets...

trust me, if the roles were reversed, and Agbonlahor was here and Frazier was there, we'd see it the total opposite.

 

[Giggsy PO]

Knee jerk.

Hardly.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

We have our own Agbonlahor. His name is Frazier Campbell.

Word. Both excellent talents.