Anyone else feeling desensitised to our decline?

[AXVnee7]

Following todays result it's not that I didn't care, I just felt the way we played was reminiscent of what we've seen over the past 3 years. Worryingly, I just seem to be accepting it now and despite my efforts, I can't be as bothered to try and delve deeper into the game to see where we went wrong.

I definitely think we have stabilised somewhat as a club, and we can see our current level is anywhere from 4th-7th. I haven't seen sufficient decline or progress to suggest we will finish outside of this range this season. This stability is probably one of the contributing factors.

I still really anticipate every game, but if it goes wrong like it did today it's just "ah well, let's just see what happens next". It used to be, "Wtf was that? Now how do we go about getting back in this?"

I think by far the biggest predicament though, is the sheer number of 'false dawns' we've had over the last 3 years, and even to some extent this season. It just feels like every time we find a solution, a formation, the right midfield partnership, something else has to go wrong. Whether that's an injury, a drubbing, inconsistent performances or mental capitulations, it's just we never seem to progress. One can only get his hopes up so many times... Let's hope Jose can be the end of this in the long term.

Edit: Born in '95, by the time I was actually capable of beginning to understand football the club had already undergone its transitional periods under Fergie, and was now going from strength to strength on the back of some historical moments. So someone like me has only ever known success. Even what you'd consider the worst periods under Fergie's time were relatively quiescent compared the situation we are in now. This is a first for me, and I must say it is definitely taking me time to adjust to it.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Yep. I've actually started taking defeat fairly well, which 4/5 years ago would have been shocking to me. I'm very competitive and hate losing anything, when united lost I used to get stress headaches and really feel down about it for ages.

Perhaps I've just got older and wiser, but the season under Moyes really got me prepared for it. The loss against Chelsea recently really pissed me off for a few hours, but you soon move on.

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

It still hurts for days for me, to the point where i'm questioning if my relationship with Man Utd is healthy

Sick and tired by the lack of direction from the club. We make decisions in east and west, no clear plan.

 

[whatwha]

Yep, I'm much less affected by Man Utd playing like shit now. It doesn't surprise me.

 

[Roger777]

Following todays result it's not that I didn't care, I just felt the way we played was reminiscent of what we've seen over the past 3 years. Worryingly, I just seem to be accepting it now and despite my efforts, I can't be as bothered to try and delve deeper into the game to see where we went wrong.

I definitely think we have stabilised somewhat as a club, and we can see our current level is anywhere from 4th-7th. I haven't seen sufficient decline or progress to suggest we will finish outside of this range this season. This stability is probably one of the contributing factors.

I still really anticipate every game, but if it goes wrong like it did today it's just "ah well, let's just see what happens next". It used to be, "Wtf was that? Now how do we go about getting back in this?"

I think by far the biggest predicament though, is the sheer number of 'false dawns' we've had over the last 3 years, and even to some extent this season. It just feels like every time we find a solution, a formation, the right midfield partnership, something else has to go wrong. Whether that's an injury, a drubbing, inconsistent performances or mental capitulations, it's just we never seem to progress. One can only get his hopes up so many times... Let's hope Jose can be the end of this in the long term.

Oh god...... We are about as stable as Trevor Berbicks legs, after he'd been hit by Mike Tyson.

 

[AXVnee7]

Oh god...... We are about as stable as Trevor Berbicks legs, after he'd been hit by Mike Tyson.

I was thinking over the last few seasons. Our past 3 seasons we got 64, 70 and 66 points respectively. We all know how much difference each point can make, but that is relatively consistent considering we used to get around 80-90 points quite consistently.

 

[Will Absolute]

I've become inured to bad nights. Unless you're a masochist, you don't want to be crushed by every defeat. You have to emotionally distance yourself a little from the club.

 

[shamans]

I'll be honest. I don't care if this makes me a bad fan that just stays happy when we're winning but I have questioned supporting Man United. Past three years, have I been getting any joy? Time invested in these games for what? I'm getting a little sick of it. We string a few results, and then we just crash and burn. Everyone on here overrating our players and thinking we're hot shit but just low on confidence/need time/excuse # whatever.

I just keep asking myself that. Have I enjoyed any bit of Man United for the last 3 years? Has it been worth it?

 

[Attila]

I do sometimes think we are cursed

 

[fishfingers15]

I have newfound respect for Liverpool fans and Arsenal fans under Wenger. To go on like that for an extended period of time without being desensitized is a bit brilliant.

 

[dwd]

I'll be honest. I don't care if this makes me a bad fan that just stays happy when we're winning but I have questioned supporting Man United. Past three years, have I been getting any joy? Time invested in these games for what? I'm getting a little sick of it. We string a few results, and then we just crash and burn. Everyone on here overrating our players and thinking we're hot shit but just low on confidence/need time/excuse # whatever.

I just keep asking myself that. Have I enjoyed any bit of Man United for the last 3 years? Has it been worth it?

I hear you but it is times like this that the fans get separated from supporters. There is a difference.

 

[Roger777]

I'll be honest. I don't care if this makes me a bad fan that just stays happy when we're winning but I have questioned supporting Man United. Past three years, have I been getting any joy? Time invested in these games for what? I'm getting a little sick of it. We string a few results, and then we just crash and burn. Everyone on here overrating our players and thinking we're hot shit but just low on confidence/need time/excuse # whatever.

I just keep asking myself that. Have I enjoyed any bit of Man United for the last 3 years? Has it been worth it?

No problem.... Get yourself down to the ethihad. There's plenty of seats there for the likes of you .

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

Yep. I've actually started taking defeat fairly well, which 4/5 years ago would have been shocking to me. I'm very competitive and hate losing anything, when united lost I used to get stress headaches and really feel down about it for ages.

Perhaps I've just got older and wiser, but the season under Moyes really got me prepared for it. The loss against Chelsea recently really pissed me off for a few hours, but you soon move on.

Yeah same, it just happens so regularly now that you have to take it well and move on for your own health and sanity.

If I got as down and upset now after shitty performances and let downs as I did under Fergie I'd be a manic depressive.

I hoped bringing in Jose would restore that winning mentality but I see now that the club has too many deep rooted problems for one man to come in and immediately turn things around. There's now a culture and acceptance of losing that's ingrained in the club.

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

I'll be honest. I don't care if this makes me a bad fan that just stays happy when we're winning but I have questioned supporting Man United. Past three years, have I been getting any joy? Time invested in these games for what? I'm getting a little sick of it. We string a few results, and then we just crash and burn. Everyone on here overrating our players and thinking we're hot shit but just low on confidence/need time/excuse # whatever.

I just keep asking myself that. Have I enjoyed any bit of Man United for the last 3 years? Has it been worth it?

Under Moyes it was Januzaj who was the clear high light for me. First season under LvG we did alright without being impressive, i could live with that after one shite season under Moyes. Second season under LvG it was Martial, Rashford and the FA Cup as the highlights.

This season nothing has made me really happy from watching Man Utd so far. I was quite relieved to miss a few games due to various plans, as i wouldn't have to go through another embarrassment.

I have lost a bit of faith in Utd this season tbh.

 

[El Zoido]

I do sometimes think we are cursed

Feels that way doesn't it? Good players turn to shit here, constantly.

 

[Offside]

If only we had Ryan Giggs as manager or somebody to really back and symbolises United, I could enjoy watching us.

 

[Utdstar01]

I've been used to us being shit since the "Moyes Era". With the exception of that brief win streak we had under Van Gaal towards the end of the season before last when we beat City and Tottenham and a few other teams but other than that...I just shrug it off now.

 

[yumtum]

I hear you but it is times like this that the fans get separated from supporters. There is a difference.

Nothing really wrong with being a fan of United instead of a supporter, I'll never have an affiliation with another football club and if anyone asks me who I support it will always be United, but I've been watching less games for about 7 years now, work has pretty much taken most of my weekends, so the little time I do have I couldn't bring myself to watch United (even the latter years of Fergie was a chore to watch at times if when winning!).

I admire the supporters in the stands chanting at every game, but equally I can't blame people for passing up the opportunity to watch crap football for a high price (or even for free on TV).

My bet would be if the football was entertaining and we scored a few goals then fans/supporters would get far more enjoyment than seeing us play tumescent football with us constantly being kept at bay by the likes of Burnley!

Also the fact that so many players show no emotion or hunger to play is really disheartening and no one likes to see that.

 

[Scholsey2004]

Under Moyes I was hugely frustrated. Under van gaal I had gradually diminishing expectations as it became clear that the change of manager wasn't the cure-all we were hoping for. Now it's just '*sigh* well, we've lost again'. The money's going to start drying up with a couple more seasons like this. Sponsors aren't going to continually fork out huge fees for a team competing with Everton, Southampton and West ham in Upper mid table every season.

 

[predator]

Not really because it shouldn't be like this. We have just broken the world transfer fee for Pogba and have spent many more millions on other players. If we had the same squad as we did at the start of the decline (19th May 2013 - our last game under SAF) then it would be understandable and easy to accept. The fact is we should be right at the very top level of football given our recent history and the money spent in the past 3 years.

 

[Scholsey2004]

Feels that way doesn't it? Good players turn to shit here, constantly.

Yeah, I've thought for a while that the underperforming of a conveyor belt of players who were excellent elsewhere hints at something toxic in our setup.

 

[Green_Red]

Why is it a decline? we were smashed 3-0 away at AC Milan under Fergie. We were handed our arses at the Nou Camp when Romario tore us a new one back in the day. Defeats on the road happen. What sort of team would Fenerbache be if they rolled over just because Man Utd came to town. Its football. We have a manager and the players to turn this season into a successful one. People need to catch a grip and realise that losing football matches is part of the game.

 

[Needham]

I guess most fans of other clubs

 

[AXVnee7]

Why is it a decline? we were smashed 3-0 away at AC Milan under Fergie. We were handed our arses at the Nou Camp when Romario tore us a new one back in the day. Defeats on the road happen. What sort of team would Fenerbache be if they rolled over just because Man Utd came to town. Its football. We have a manager and the players to turn this season into a successful one. People need to catch a grip and realise that losing football matches is part of the game.

Can't be serious? The decline is because we have gone from consistently challenging (and winning titles) and being formidable to Europe, to now considering it successful if we get top 4 in addition to no longer being considered a strong force in Europe.

The context is the key part of the discussion here. I'm only using todays result as an example.

 

[Green_Red]

Can't be serious? The decline is because we have gone from consistently challenging (and winning titles) and being formidable to Europe, to now considering it successful if we get top 4 in addition to no longer being considered a strong force in Europe.

The context is the key part of the discussion here. I'm only using todays result as an example.

So youre basing 'decline' on one result?

Weve had a few bad years but had CL one out of 3. We had shite seasons under Ferguson when we looked done and dusted and cane back. We have the players and the manager.

 

[Scholsey2004]

Why is it a decline? we were smashed 3-0 away at AC Milan under Fergie. We were handed our arses at the Nou Camp when Romario tore us a new one back in the day. Defeats on the road happen. What sort of team would Fenerbache be if they rolled over just because Man Utd came to town. Its football. We have a manager and the players to turn this season into a successful one. People need to catch a grip and realise that losing football matches is part of the game.

Its an increasingly regular part of the game. It's a decline by definition, our final league positions haven't recovered since Fergie left and were in our fourth post ferguson season now. That's a consistent trend. I'm not throwing a tantrum or anything but you need to be realistic, the wheels fell off a few years back and as of yet nobody, even with the vast resources we've thrown at the problem, has managed to get us going again.

 

[AXVnee7]

I guess most fans of other clubs

True, and I don't mean to come across as spoilt or entitled. But the reality is probably only Liverpool fans can relate to our situation. It is otherwise pretty unique. Not many English clubs have experienced such sustained success where it just becomes the norm to win silverware year after year. Possibly Arsenal for a while.

 

[Champagne Football]

Once Jose offloads Felliani/Rojo/Darmian/Rooney/Blind/Smalling/Jones/Valencia/Schneiderlin/Schweinsteiger/Memphis and replaces them with Tiemoue Bakayoko/Greizmann and Van Dijk then we will be a force to be reckoned with again next season. Jose needs 2 more transfer windows to turn us into a team of winners again. Far too much scrap metal in the team currently. Jose was not ruthless enough last summer with his cull but when you see how well Herrera and Mata are playing more often than not then you can understand why he needed to give everyone a chance before deciding who stays and who goes. Jose will get it right next season but it will be more Thursday night football next season to look forward to

 

[Green_Red]

Its an increasingly regular part of the game. It's a decline by definition, our final league positions haven't recovered since Fergie left and were in our fourth post ferguson season now. That's a consistent trend. I'm not throwing a tantrum or anything but you need to be realistic, the wheels fell off a few years back and as of yet nobody, even with the vast resources we've thrown at the problem, has managed to get us going again.

Maybe Im an optimist but I look at it as a team in transition. We had bad seasons under Ferguson when we had a serious turnover of players. Some weve never really managed to replace.

 

[AXVnee7]

So youre basing 'decline' on one result?

Weve had a few bad years but had CL one out of 3. We had shite seasons under Ferguson when we looked done and dusted and cane back. We have the players and the manager.

?

I just said we used to consistently win titles, and now we tend to go for top 4 at best. Is that not a decline? I'm talking about the past 3 years overall, not one result. Again, I just used todays result as an example.

 

[Scholsey2004]

Maybe Im an optimist but I look at it as a team in transition. We had bad seasons under Ferguson when we had a serious turnover of players. Some weve never really managed to replace.

What you've just described is a decline. We were consistently challenging for honours and now we aren't. Decline.

 

[Carolina Red]

What you've just described is a decline. We were consistently challenging for honours and now we aren't. Decline.

I've posted this in another thread, but in SAF's first several years we finished 11th, 2nd, 11th, 13th, and 6th before we began the run of 20 years inside the top 3.

 

[Scholsey2004]

I've posted this in another thread, but in SAF's first several years we finished 11th, 2nd, 11th, 13th, and 6th before we began the run of 20 years inside the top 3.

Yeah, everyone knows that, what's your point? I'm not against the manager if that's what you're suggesting, he's the best man available and we're lucky to have him but it's a simple fact that we've dereriorated in terms of success since Ferguson left which is a decline and so far this season there hasn't been much to suggest that trend is reversing.

 

[Shane88]

The Moyes season helped create a thick skin against slagging from opposition fans and helped grow accustomed to shite results.

We had 20-ish years of near enough constant success. I think we're going to be taking a back seat for a good few years now and I can handle it.

 

[Carolina Red]

Yeah, everyone knows that, what's your point? I'm not against the manager if that's what you're suggesting, he's the best man available and we're lucky to have him but it's a simple fact that we've dereriorated in terms of success since Ferguson left which is a decline and so far this season there hasn't been much to suggest that trend is reversing.

My point is that people are overreacting. If we don't pick a guy and give him time, we won't ever get out of the transition phase. That's what we are in.. It isn't "decline", just as we weren't in "decline" in SAF's first 5 seasons. We were transitioning into a team of his creation.

 

[justboy68]

Yep, I can barely muster up the energy to be angry these days. It's just a fecking joke at this point.

 

[ManUchosenbosslvg]

When Rooney's shot flew in I barely raised an eyebrow, brilliant strike but very much undeserved.

 

[puNANI]

Got used to it midway through the Moyes season. There's still some games that leave me angry for a couple of days after like West Ham away last season, the last game of our group stage in the CL last season (don't remember against who) and Chelsea this season, but for the most part once we lose I get over it immediately.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

Once Jose offloads Felliani/Rojo/Darmian/Rooney/Blind/Smalling/Jones/Valencia/Schneiderlin/Schweinsteiger/Memphis and replaces them with Tiemoue Bakayoko/Greizmann and Van Dijk then we will be a force to be reckoned with again next season. Jose needs 2 more transfer windows to turn us into a team of winners again. Far too much scrap metal in the team currently. Jose was not ruthless enough last summer with his cull but when you see how well Herrera and Mata are playing more often than not then you can understand why he needed to give everyone a chance before deciding who stays and who goes. Jose will get it right next season but it will be more Thursday night football next season to look forward to

Schweinsteiger and Jones have not played at all. Depay and Schneiderlin barely played. Rojo has only played because of injuries. Felliani and Rooney have been mostly dropped recently. And Valenica has been one of our few consistent performers. Getting rid of those players would not magically solve anything.

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

The Moyes season helped create a thick skin against slagging from opposition fans and helped grow accustomed to shite results.

We had 20-ish years of near enough constant success. I think we're going to be taking a back seat for a good few years now and I can handle it.

It would be easy to handle if we hadn't spend a shite load of money these last 4 years.

The fact that we are still struggling even with all that dough spend, just goes to show that we are a poorly run club, which is very frustrating.