Are we a CDM short of being an elite team?

[UnitedFire]

Yeah we are. A top class DM would allow us to drop Pogba into CM and go with a full on attack with Bruno and a front 3 of Rashford/Greenwood Ronaldo Sancho

I'm not going to moan though Ronaldo, Sancho and Varane is a crazy summer, the best I've ever seen in my 30 years of support.

It's definitely in the debate for best ever window! A couple of tough competitors below.

05/06
Vidic, Evra, Park, VDS, Ben Foster!
07/08
Anderson, Nani, Hargreaves, Tevez, Kuszczak!, Possebon, Manucho. Last 2 didn't achieve much, but exciting anyway.
12/13
Van Persie, Kagawa, Zaha, Powell, Henriquez, Buttner. Most didn't amount to much, but still exciting talent at the time
14/15
Di Maria, Shaw, Herrera, Rojo, Blind, Falcao, Vanja Milinković-Savić!
16/17
Pogba, Mkhitaryan, Zlatan, Bailly

13/14
Mata, Fellaini



Ha ha just kidding!

 

[Mr PG]

Too much hyperbole in here. Finished 2nd last season with that midfield. Main problem against Soton was everyone playing so slow and defenders especially Maguire back to his old habit walking up the ball allowing Soton to set their press.

 

[Mr PG]

I have heard numerous times from credible sources Ole doesn’t want a specialist dm but a cm who can basically do it all which is what United have always had in the past.

 

[Pscholes18]

I have heard numerous times from credible sources Ole doesn’t want a specialist dm but a cm who can basically do it all which is what United have always had in the past.

Okay....who would that midfielder be? Who can do it all?

 

[Jaae]

Okay....who would that midfielder be? Who can do it all?

Rice, Rice, baby

 

[tjb]

Push Pogba deeper and force him to play in the two man midfield as our chief ball Progresser. Play him with Fred. Risk a a more open midfield, but allow AWB to stay further back to support the defence.

 

[NewGlory]

Totally agree, just can’t see it happening, one more player and then it’s more squad management over the next few years, clearing players out and planning for replacements again instead of a scatter gun approach.

Yeah, if we were bringing a DMF in, we should be in complete rush to immediately clear dead weights like Dan James and Martial, as well as marketable but unnecessary asset like Lingard. Pulling that, plus DMF signing will take extreme levels of effectiveness. The kind United still unfortunately doesn't seem to have. Maybe they decided January is when they will finish some of these movements... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Watching Liverpool - Chelsea right now, EPL will be insanely competitive this year, so we better get our shit together because we have spectacular squad but we need it to be perfect

 

[hobbers]

DM and upgrading AWB to someone who isn't terrified of the ball.

 

[Grylte]

DM was the most important this window, in my opinion.
Anything we can put behind Bruno and Pogba is too weak.

Also an* elite side :P

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

The club prioritised a RW, CB and even an additional CF to a DM. The club clearly is not of the view that we need a DM. In fact we are trying harder for a RB then a DM. The funds issue is not a problem either considering what we are paying Ronaldo.

 

[MrSingh2002]

The issue I believe is who do you sell to get the CDM?

We can't have Fred, Matic and McTominay in the squad AND sign a CDM surely.

Hoping that VdB isn't sacrificed and it's Fred who is transferred away if one has to go. Matic is the best on the ball out of the 3 and McTominay is homegrown.

 

[UnitedSofa]

The club prioritised a RW, CB and even an additional CF to a DM. The club clearly is not of the view that we need a DM. In fact we are trying harder for a RB then a DM. The funds issue is not a problem either considering what we are paying Ronaldo.

Don’t think they prioritised a CF to a DM.

Ronaldo became available and they had to pounce, simple as.

The two other positions were/are more problematic & those positions have now been solved.

If we get a DM great, if not there’s always Jan/next Summer.

Rice/Haaland next summer.

Neves this summer/January

 

[choccy77]

United need to forget about RB cover and just get a solid and decent CDM in now and we could have a very good season!

 

[Sandikan]

These threads

Why don't we at least wait until Vafane and Sancho have at least started their first premier league game, and Ronaldo plays his first league game here for 12 years before we talk such stuff eh?

 

[Flying high]

These threads

Why don't we at least wait until Vafane and Sancho have at least started their first premier league game, and Ronaldo plays his first league game here for 12 years before we talk such stuff eh?

When was the last time our squad looked filled in all areas? With two or more good options for every position?

With a decent DM and Trippier we would finally have that. It would have cost us roughly £200m, which is quite high, but we spent virtually nothing last year and have taken quite a lot off the wage bill in recent years. It's really not unreasonable to think that we could get a 30 year old full back and just about any DM to complete the job. We might still be a little light when it comes to being the very best. But if any 2 of Sancho, Greenwood, Martial, Rashford or even Amad reach the heights we expect of them, then we'll be a hell of a force.

Then we can plan for 1 or 2 signings per year. Next summer a CF might be all we need, add a CM if Pogba leaves. The year after? Most of our squad would be a good age still, so our need would hopefully be based more on upgrades when possible, rather than filling gaping holes.

 

[Sandikan]

When was the last time our squad looked filled in all areas? With two or more good options for every position?

With a decent DM and Trippier we would finally have that. It would have cost us roughly £200m, which is quite high, but we spent virtually nothing last year and have taken quite a lot off the wage bill in recent years. It's really not unreasonable to think that we could get a 30 year old full back and just about any DM to complete the job. We might still be a little light when it comes to being the very best. But if any 2 of Sancho, Greenwood, Martial, Rashford or even Amad reach the heights we expect of them, then we'll be a hell of a force.

Then we can plan for 1 or 2 signings per year. Next summer a CF might be all we need, add a CM if Pogba leaves. The year after? Most of our squad would be a good age still, so our need would hopefully be based more on upgrades when possible, rather than filling gaping holes.

It's just names on a page for now, until we see how the 3 signings pan out.

Don't get me wrong, I'm as excited as the next fan, but I want to at least see how these players slot in first.

 

[Flying high]

It's just names on a page for now, until we see how the 3 signings pan out.

Don't get me wrong, I'm as excited as the next fan, but I want to at least see how these players slot in first.

So..... don't fill the other gaps in the squad until we know how these guys will work out?

I'm not sure I get your point.

 

[Highfather_24]

If it does I might have to stop hating the Glazers. Which would frankly be traumatic.

What did Rio say?

 

[Sandikan]

So..... don't fill the other gaps in the squad until we know how these guys will work out?

I'm not sure I get your point.

My point is how can anyone say we're a DM short of an elite side, when we haven't even seen any of our new signings play a 90min game yet!?

 

[Highfather_24]

Our signing a DM has zero to do with Pogba. If we play an upgrade on Matic, it wouldnt suddenly make Pogba a CM.

Whether he's playing next to McT or Rice, he will lose the ball under pressure in CM, becuase he is not a CM. His defensive ability is alright for a CM, but he is simply a far superior player closer to goal. Its like buying Ndidi and playing Bruno alongside him at CM. Its stupid.

Stop trying to force him into one. If we get a DM, we will play him alongside McT/Fred. So I hope we get someone good on the ball like Neves/Camavinga.

 

[Bulldog United]

I think we have a fair chance of winning the title with what we've already got now.

Put a world class CDM in that team and Ole would almost have to win the title to keep his job.

I don't see us signing anyone else, but tbh, when I heard the rumours on Friday morning about Cristiano coming back - I laughed them off too. Maybe the Glazers have decided they want to win some trophies over here again at last, after tasting success in the NFL.

 

[bonothom]

New signings you say?

I’d like to see the latest signings like Varane get a fecking start first if that’s ok…..

Ole will probably have Dan James and Mata as his front line tomorrow with Phil Jones partnering Maguire. Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

 

[OLLY ORANGE]

I wish we had prioritised a DM before signing a centre back

 

[Maurice Setters Training]

It's definitely in the debate for best ever window! A couple of tough competitors below.

05/06
Vidic, Evra, Park, VDS, Ben Foster!
07/08
Anderson, Nani, Hargreaves, Tevez, Kuszczak!, Possebon, Manucho. Last 2 didn't achieve much, but exciting anyway.
12/13
Van Persie, Kagawa, Zaha, Powell, Henriquez, Buttner. Most didn't amount to much, but still exciting talent at the time
14/15
Di Maria, Shaw, Herrera, Rojo, Blind, Falcao, Vanja Milinković-Savić!
16/17
Pogba, Mkhitaryan, Zlatan, Bailly

13/14
Mata, Fellaini



Ha ha just kidding!

98/99 was pretty good as well-Yorke, Stam, Blomqvist.

 

[NewGlory]

The issue I believe is who do you sell to get the CDM?

We can't have Fred, Matic and McTominay in the squad AND sign a CDM surely.

Hoping that VdB isn't sacrificed and it's Fred who is transferred away if one has to go. Matic is the best on the ball out of the 3 and McTominay is homegrown.

This feels biased. When playing his best (for 4 months last season) Fred was the best out of the three. Matic is beyond done and should retire. McT is horrible as a single DMF. He can barely do it in pair with Fred. We cannot afford to have a pair of DMFs, that would make it impossible to play Pogba-Bruno pair, which would be insane.

 

[reddevilz007]

Bissouma, Neves or Tchouameni and we’re actually title challengers. None of them are considered elite just yet, but they would probably do a better job than Matic or McFred at sitting deeper.
I don’t think we need to spend crazy fees for Rice this window.

 

[Spoony]

I find it odd that we've not bought one. A quality DM makes us a challengers for the PL and CL.

 

[MrSingh2002]

This feels biased. When playing his best (for 4 months last season) Fred was the best out of the three. Matic is beyond done and should retire. McT is horrible as a single DMF. He can barely do it in pair with Fred. We cannot afford to have a pair of DMFs, that would make it impossible to play Pogba-Bruno pair, which would be insane.

You're not wrong but Fred's passing is horrible. There will be no point in having so many talented attackers on the pitch if we're losing the ball getting it forward.

I really want us to get a CDM that can pass well. Someone in the mould of Carrick or Fabinho.

Height and a destroyer with a good passing range is what we want. I think the closest thing to that is Matic despite him naturally now slowing down.

Tough calls have to be made. Lingard, Mata, Martial and one of the CDMs have to be sold immediately or ASAP.

We are simply too big of a squad for a manager that hardly rotates and only makes substitutions in the last 10 minutes of games.

It's impossible that Ole will keep enough players happy now. Or he has to change his approach to rotation and making earlier substitutions. Given his tactics over the past 3 years I'd say he won't change and we'll end up with half a squad having cobwebs on them.

 

[NewGlory]

You're not wrong but Fred's passing is horrible. There will be no point in having so many talented attackers on the pitch if we're losing the ball getting it forward.

I really want us to get a CDM that can pass well. Someone in the mould of Carrick or Fabinho.

Height and a destroyer with a good passing range is what we want. I think the closest thing to that is Matic despite him naturally now slowing down.

Tough calls have to be made. Lingard, Mata, Martial and one of the CDMs have to be sold immediately or ASAP.

We are simply too big of a squad for a manager that hardly rotates and only makes substitutions in the last 10 minutes of games.

It's impossible that Ole will keep enough players happy now. Or he has to change his approach to rotation and making earlier substitutions. Given his tactics over the past 3 years I'd say he won't change and we'll end up with half a squad having cobwebs on them.

Agree. I think Dan James should be added to the list of people to sell. He's been given too many chances and has been failing to deliver for us. Time to go. Wish him the best elsewhere. VdB needs to also be given real chances or sold, his situation is beyond ridiculous.

 

[sp_107]

--------------------- DDG --------------------
AWB - Varane - Maguire - Shaw
---------- New DM - Pogba -----------
-- Sancho - Bruno - Rashford ---
--------------- Ronaldo ------------------

We got a pretty decent bench too: Henderson, Lindelöf, Telles, Fred, McTominay, Greenwood, Cavani

The missing link is really obvious.

Looks Great, what to do with Martial / Mata / Matic / Jesse / James

 

[NewGlory]

Looks Great, what to do with Martial / Mata / Matic / Jesse / James

SELL all of them except for Mata. Mata should retire and become a coach for the club. He's a United man and a great guy who loves us.

 

[Newtonius]

Hey long time lurker, always wanted to get involved but they never allowed a free email at one point which always stopped me.

For me if we played the right system and added a quality deep lying playmaker and a new RB to support Sancho will go toe to toe with City for sure. McFred isn't very press resistant and can't hold the ball very well. You will notice in our build up play they rely heavily on the CB's to find the creative players, where by they almost bypass the midfield entirely. Rashford is going straight in at the left wing spot when he gets back too and 5 years of evidence vehemently states that Pogba cannot play in the double pivot.

-------------------De Gea-----------------
Trippier--Varane-Maguire-Shaw
-----------------Neves-------------------
--------Bruno----- Pogba -----------
-- Sancho - Bruno - Rashford ---
--------------- Ronaldo ---------------

 

[Godfather]

Bit strange we aren't even linked to one at the moment

 

[OutlawGER]

Feels so greedy wanting one more but it would really be the icing on the cake.

I think Ronaldo is already the icing on the cake.

 

[mancan92]

Why do people think you need top players in every position to win? It isn't normally the case. There is always one or two weaker positions that care covered by great coaching. If we fail it won't because of the players it will be the manager and coaching staff.

 

[RedorDead21]

Why do people think you need top players in every position to win? It isn't normally the case. There is always one or two weaker positions that care covered by great coaching. If we fail it won't because of the players it will be the manager and coaching staff.

even when you’re up against squads that do have that with proven superior managers?

 

[rotherham_red]

If I was to rate the window as it is, it's 7.5/10.

We had 3 (arguably 4 including the long-term striker) glaring weaknesses in the squad as we finished the season: DM, RW, CB, and striker. We also seemed to be prioritising Trippier as the RB/RWB option.

What ended up transpiring was that we got *the* perfect buys for the RW and CB, and Ronaldo but the biggest need was the DM. While Varane and Sancho will undoubtedly improve us markedly, they won't transform us like a proper DM would. Likewise, Ronaldo's X factor of guaranteed goals will likely ensure we win more games than we would otherwise, but the issue of actually getting the ball into him often enough without a steady supply to our attackers remains.

Also, we seemingly planned for players to be sold in order to get the RB in at the very least, but it looks like we're going to be frustrated on that front.

The worry for me (and it has already been realised with Scott's injury) is that if either one of McFred are out, we are absolutely screwed. We badly needed a midfielder, and for our owners to immediately release funds for a vanity purchase of Ronaldo when that particular element of the team is so below par, is such a kick in the teeth.

I hope that the added goals work out and ensure we can properly challenge for both the league and the CL, but that nagging feeling of the DM and injuries situation really scares me.

 

[mancan92]

even when you’re up against squads that do have that with proven superior managers?

None of the teams we are talking about have an absolutely top class player in every position.

City don't have a striker or left back
Chelsea have 1 top cb and a average goal keeper and 1 striker
Liverpool have no attacking midfielders at all and no back up for their front 3

All teams have clear weaknesses ours are no worse. We have equal strength to them all over the pitch.

I agree 100% with the management and coaching though. That's why in my original post I said the management and coaching have no excuse

 

[Tiber]

We didn't even play today and it still showed how badly we need a cm

 

[#07]

It's not an excuse @mancan92. Everyone rates Klopp as a coach but he couldn't turn Klavan and Karius into Van Dijk and Alisson. There comes a point where, with the best will in the world, even the greatest coaches can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Our midfield is a problem. If we had something remotely comparable to Carrick and Scholes it wouldn't be. Even Carrick and Cleverly to be honest. But Matic is done, Fred can't pass consistently over distance and that kills our transitions from back to front. We're dependent on the fitness of McTominay to have a functioning middle third. As much as I like the kid he's not exactly Roy Keane is he?

If, in the next few days, the Glazers buy United a top midfielder. Then, by all means, hold the coach accountable if we don't win the title. But, even with Ronaldo, our inability to move the ball quickly through midfield is going to see us drop points we shouldn't. Don't see how we can blame that on coaching. We have misused club funds on players who aren't upto it and made that worse by renewing contracts we didn't need to.