The chance at the end for Gary (87:30) I thought was an attempt to handball it in. I vaguely remember him joking about it with Maradona once because Diego brought it up. But probably apt for this thread as it could be a myth
Biggest Myths in Football
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Exactly!
Is so pathetic when Arsenal fans talk about the 'Invincibles' they were so unbeatable that they finished the season with one trophy out of four!
The chance at the end for Gary (87:30) I thought was an attempt to handball it in. I vaguely remember him joking about it with Maradona once because Diego brought it up. But probably apt for this thread as it could be a myth
, I don't think he tried to handball that one, it was a fantastic defensive header BTW, easier to make an own goal than clear that chance"Fergie tore down his 1995 team and sold Ince, Kanchelskis and Hughes in order to clear the way for the younger players".
No, he didn't. Hughes decided to leave after his contract ended and we know the story with Kanchelskis. Fergie never planned for something so drastic.
No, he didn't. Hughes decided to leave after his contract ended and we know the story with Kanchelskis. Fergie never planned for something so drastic.
As a younger person who wasn’t alive for 1995, what happened with Kanchelskis?
He had a dispute with Fergie in the latter half of 1994/95, asked to leave and Fergie wrote in his book that his agent threatened chairman Martin Edwards that he'll be killed if he doesn't sell him. They they got rid of him.
The hand of god felt like beautiful and fitting revenge by Maradona, after he had already been cynically hacked down throughout the game and elbowed off the ball multiple times. I was happy to have my photo taken with the hand of god statue in Estadio Azteca !
Even accounting for the fact that players could get away with heavier tackles then, England shouldn’t have had 11 men on the pitch by that time that the incident happened, as Terry Fenwick had done enough to be red carded at least twice over.
Also just before it happened, Fenwick and Maradona both jumped for the ball, Fenwick led with his arm and knocked Maradona down.
The English players that were bitter about the incident for years or even decades afterwards, were just pathetic crybabies.
Also it mustn't be forgotten that in the build up to it, Maradona’s skill to dribble past a couple of England players like they were training cones and pass to Valdano was exquisite.
Even accounting for the fact that players could get away with heavier tackles then, England shouldn’t have had 11 men on the pitch by that time that the incident happened, as Terry Fenwick had done enough to be red carded at least twice over.
Also just before it happened, Fenwick and Maradona both jumped for the ball, Fenwick led with his arm and knocked Maradona down.
The English players that were bitter about the incident for years or even decades afterwards, were just pathetic crybabies.
Also it mustn't be forgotten that in the build up to it, Maradona’s skill to dribble past a couple of England players like they were training cones and pass to Valdano was exquisite.
What's the myth here?
I’m guessing the myth is that the hand of god goal wasn’t the biggest footballing injustice ever as it is made up to be ?
Nah, can't be that, nobody would think something so silly
The Thierry Henry handball is much worse, considering how UEFA rigged the draw beforehand with a seeding process. How it has been forgotten about since shows how corruption is tolerated.
They bought off the FAI afterward whilst 'Thierry' went back to being 'one of the greatest ever', which is another myth on our list.
Can't complain about England, would have bottled it even if Maradona goal was chalked off. Like in 2002, even with a man advantage still can't beat a decent side at the WC.
The Argies always been though ... and we saw it again in the last world cup. Clear second yellow missed on Parades blasting the ball in to the Dutch bench. Then Martinez should have got two yellows in the final shootout, not just one. Fifa got what they wanted.
Pogba during the 2018 WC.
Spoken about like he was Captain America.
Spoken about like he was Captain America.
I only mentioned the hand of god as it was brought up in several previous posts.
However the myth would be that England were robbed / cheated out of a place in the 1986 World Cup by Maradona, when their players were breaking the rules and downright cheating throughout the game including many times before the famous incident happened.
Terry Butcher for example saying that he could never forgive Maradona, and didn’t want to shake his hand when he was the Scotland assistant manager and they played his Argentina team in a friendly more than 22 year later, was pathetic stuff.
He was the second best midfielder at that World Cup and bailed out Kanté in the final, but another unnecessary excuse to kick the man then.
Sterling being a good player.Sterling
He's not going to give you money mate.
you’d have been lynched on here back then if you’d have suggested that him having a great tournament was a myth It was a good tournament but my word it's as if it's the greatest performance ever.
Even Paul Ince has claimed that Fergie tried to stop his move to Inter at the last min.
Yeah the Dutch were an 11 of Princesses...jeez. it was a tough old time sort of match with both parts annoying the other one and BTW teh ones that chose that path, were the Dutchies (more Lousi than many of the players) even before the match, nothing wrong with that, mind games will always be there in football, it almost worked.
Do you realize that almost every major team that had won the thing had to deal with instances that worked against or were to the very least dubious.
Even Diego's correct sent off in the 82 Cup against Brazil does not show that his reaction was in great part due to him being kicked all over the park (Argentina kicked Zico too BTW) without any sort of fair teratment and to sum up a penalty as clear as the sun was not given too him.
That in that 82 against Italy, the Gentile one, he received a yellow for correctly protest against the constant fouling with no cards shown, that Gentile received his yellow after easily three or four fouls with a couple that were more acceptable to sent him to prison than a red and after that card continue with his task the rest of the game.
That was way he was cheated time and again on every WC, imagine if a list like yours is made of the type of treatment and the cards rivals should had receive when Argentina had fellas running through entire teams like Kempes, Maradona and Messi just to name three while being hacked as hell and therefore cheated beyond rules time and again.
Come on, it just doesn't work that way, sometimes you receive the good stuff, sometimes the bad stuff, it's part of the process, fair or not.
When it doesn't go your way, you man up and try next time, it's how it works. Every team receives silly calls against in the path of this type of huge KO tournaments, like in CLs, or Libertadores too.
Anyway like it was said here, the way the English players avoid to talk about the treatment against Maradona in that game that with a correct ref job could have let them to the very least with two players less and choose to only focus on the fecking hand of god, it's silly...just take it, admit he was cunning (the best ever English trait in my book, the intelligence, adaptabilty and cunning nature of the people of the islands) and move on.
The invincibles thing is purely an aesthetic. The Chelsea team the following season losing only 1 game but getting 95 points is actually more impressive…then actually retaining their title.
United would rule PL if not for City money.
"You need a top class 'keeper/goal scorer to win anything".
Heard that repeated countless times over the years, if you've got a bang average 'keeper then you're not winning major trophies, or same goes for a lack of a killer number 9.
'Keepers who've who the Premier League include Tim Flowers, Jens Lehmann, Fabian Barthez ( also a Champions League and World cup winner), Tim Howard and Kasper Schmeichel. Liverpool cleaned up with Grobbelar.
Dortmund won the Champions League with Chapusat up front and France won the World Cup with Guivarch their starting striker.
A brilliant 'keeper or striker obviously helps but no more than top quality centre halfs, midfielders or wingers.
I'll edit to say " bang average" is harsh. But Barthez was no Schmeichel or Kahn, and Chapusat no Ronaldo or Batistuta
Heard that repeated countless times over the years, if you've got a bang average 'keeper then you're not winning major trophies, or same goes for a lack of a killer number 9.
'Keepers who've who the Premier League include Tim Flowers, Jens Lehmann, Fabian Barthez ( also a Champions League and World cup winner), Tim Howard and Kasper Schmeichel. Liverpool cleaned up with Grobbelar.
Dortmund won the Champions League with Chapusat up front and France won the World Cup with Guivarch their starting striker.
A brilliant 'keeper or striker obviously helps but no more than top quality centre halfs, midfielders or wingers.
I'll edit to say " bang average" is harsh. But Barthez was no Schmeichel or Kahn, and Chapusat no Ronaldo or Batistuta
Steven Gerrard.
And conceding only 15 goals.
I was 12/13 during that season and I remember everyone my age thinking Cech was basically unbeatable in goal.
Jose was so young, Cech and Terry were young, they had unlimited money, I thought it would never fecking end. Felt like Jose was going to be their SAF and just win nearly everything year on year forever. That summer after they waltzed to retaining to their title then immediately added Shevchenko and Ballack had me in despair.
And Ashley Cole.
The best team in the country and they sign the best striker in Europe, one of the best midfielders, and the best LB in the world.
I remember those days too, and just thinking the same, no one else has a chance anymore
Then came the omelet story, and Shevchenko was compared to a bad egg that had been floating around and would spoil the recipe
I agree the literal saying doesn’t wash but then again, we probably should ignore literal things about sporting ability. What history shows us is you can win the league with some great, some good players when the stars align… Forest, Villa, Leicester.
Flowers was a decent goalie, part of a very good defence but they were a very good all round team (a bit like Leicester or Villa) and they did have a decent goal scorer? SAS were fantastic.
Barthez was part of two teams with the best defensive record so he couldn’t have been that bad.
Schmeicel was very dad-like that season.
Etc, etc.
Yes, they weren’t Schmeicel (proper), VDS or Cech but who is?
I think the saying would be better reversed … you can win a league without a great goalie or no.9 but (1) they still need to be decent and (2) the team/squad needs to be good to compensate.
You can’t win with a rubbish goalie/no.9 though
That’s why 06/07 remains my favourite United season (after 98-99 of course).
I think the first goal they conceded was against Villa at home or something in a match they went on to win.
My cousin was mad as hell thinking "ffs why can't they just lose" and I told him let's just thank God they've conceded a goal maybe they'll concede more in the next games.
James Beattie scored inside a minute in a home game against Southampton in their 4th game. The next goal they conceded was in their 11th game.
Only game they lost was 1-0 away to City who scored from the penalty spot.
The highlights tell a very different story to the one you are here. Argentina dished out as many fouls as England, and have never been shrinking violets, they also started shithousing and time wasting once the goals went in. Plus, if you really want to be bitter then you could argue there was a foul on Hoddle in the build up to the second goal. All semantics now though, the match is long gone.
The myth as you claim it may be wrong, but it is less of a stretch to say it isn't in my opinion. Argentina were probably the better side, but we'll never know how it would have turned out because of the goal that shouldn't have stood.
As for holding a grudge being pathetic? People hold grudges for centuries on slights, perceived or otherwise, that in reality do not affect them in the slightest. Butcher also freely admits how good Maradona was, and that he couldn't get anywhere near him, so who cares if he didn't want to shake his hand, he paid him the ultimate respect on his actual ability rather than offer false, weasel words on what he thinks people would want to hear.
Who thinks that? You can just look at the table from each year and see who was 2nd when City have been 1st.
I've actually been thinking about that Jose team alot in context of City's sterile possession. It felt like that Chelsea team would simply not let a lead go, but they didn't do it by being dull and passing around. I genuinely don't remember now how they managed to be structurally sound. Obivoulsy they had a great team, but what was the strategy? I remember Jose's 'house' around Drogba but that's it.
That's the one. They ended up winning 2-1 at home. Such an annoyingly well drilled side, prime Mourinho.
It did come from nowhere. Carrick wasn't a very highly regarded player at that time, there were huge question marks about signing him to replace Keane, and we added no one else while Chelsea added two (on paper) world beaters to a team that was already probably the best team in the world. Then Ronaldo exploded, Vidic and Evra turned out to be world class etc.
Is that the best “on paper” window in the history of the Prem. Can remember thinking Utd had massively fecked it letting Ballack go to Chelsea for free when they still hadn’t replaced Keane
Summer window in 2016 under Jose is up there.