Chris Hughton leaves Brighton

Nickosaur

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Thats a ridiculous decision by Brighton. A Premier league club because of the great work by Chris Hughton and thats the thanks he gets?
That makes it a tough decision.

It is in no way a 'ridiculous decision'.
 

Enigma_87

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Club record signing Jahanbakhsh didn't have a good season, and there weren't enough goals from the forwards (apart from Murray).
That's putting it generously. 24 games - 0 goals. :lol:

Another one from the Dutch league who took it by storm and failed spectacularly elsewhere.
 

adexkola

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Can’t agree, they will not get anyone to improve if the rumours about the transfer policy are true. The Moneyball theory doesn’t translate to football that well. It works in games where you have a sport of mostly set plays and clear periods of attack and defence. I’m football there are far to many variables to take into consideration. I would bet money on them getting destroyed next season.
This is nonsense by the way. I assure you that human beings have modeled systems and things way more complex than a 90 minute football match.
 

Spiersey

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This is nonsense by the way. I assure you that human beings have modeled systems and things way more complex than a 90 minute football match.
You're correct. The owner Bloom is (arguably) the best gambler in the world, he's made hundreds of millions betting on top level matches with his algorithms and data. The amount of data they use is incredible. They have some of the best analysts and statisticians in the world and are incredibly good at predicting accurate ratings of players and how valuable they are and exactly what they offer to a team. Moneyball is definitely a feasible option in football. The two biggest issues probably are that most owners wouldn't be willing to try it and the ones that have tried it, have operated on small budgets.
 

FootballHQ

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You're correct. The owner Bloom is (arguably) the best gambler in the world, he's made hundreds of millions betting on top level matches with his algorithms and data. The amount of data they use is incredible. They have some of the best analysts and statisticians in the world and are incredibly good at predicting accurate ratings of players and how valuable they are and exactly what they offer to a team. Moneyball is definitely a feasible option in football. The two biggest issues probably are that most owners wouldn't be willing to try it and the ones that have tried it, have operated on small budgets.
Brentford do it aswell, think their owner used to be pro gambler aswell.
 

Chipper

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Been seeing Tony Bloom's name all day and it just clicked with me - he used to regularly be on the televised UK poker scene along with the likes of Devilfish, The Hendon Mob, Jac Arama, Clive Sinclair of ZX Spectrum fame etc.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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I love how people look down on defensive managers.

'Ya let's go all out and attack with our squad full of nobodies'.
 

Keeps It tidy

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Southampton in a middle of a relegation battle were able to sign Hassenhuttl as a manager who took Leipzig to the CL. With the money in the PL even mid and lower table sides can attract good managers. Heck Championship clubs are recruiting good managers. They have no reason to think Hughton is the best they can do.
 

The Boy

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Brighton fan here.... really sad to see Hughton go, but totally understand it. He has been a great manager and I always felt with him and Bloom running the club it was in safe and stable hands. but for all those here saying our squad is trash, it’s much better than 17th place. I don’t know what happened in the second half of this season but Hughton couldn’t fix it. There are plenty that say it’s was Blooms algorithms that bought our players etc, dunno if that is true or not, Tony Bloom is one the most secretive people on earth, google his company star lizard and you’ll see what I mean, but given out history of chairmen, him and Dick Knight. Score him have also been brilliant for this club, so I will trust him on this. Our run since Christmas has been atrocious and something had to change. But I’d wish Chris Hughton all the best, a fantastic man and the next club that gets him will be very lucky.

Tony Bloom has a habit of picking good managers though, Poyet, Garcia were both excellent, only mistake was Hyppia. If we get Moyes or Neville though i’ll be unbelievably fecked off!
 

Nickosaur

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Will very much be a ridiculous decision if his replacement gets Brighton relegated next season.
What makes you say that? How much of Brighton did you watch in 2019?
It's so easy to criticise a smaller clubs board but maybe "let's avoid relegation at all costs!" Isnt the only thing they should be aiming for. Hughton is a legend but he would have relegated the club next season.
 

Nickosaur

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You're correct. The owner Bloom is (arguably) the best gambler in the world, he's made hundreds of millions betting on top level matches with his algorithms and data. The amount of data they use is incredible. They have some of the best analysts and statisticians in the world and are incredibly good at predicting accurate ratings of players and how valuable they are and exactly what they offer to a team. Moneyball is definitely a feasible option in football. The two biggest issues probably are that most owners wouldn't be willing to try it and the ones that have tried it, have operated on small budgets.
This is a great point btw. Bloom has a good grasp on gambles. Getting rid of hughton is no sure thing, but it's the right move.
 

Ducklegs

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He is a championship level manager not cut out for sustained success in the premier league.

Theres no shame in that, There are loads of managers that have made solid careers at that level.

Next time he gets promoted with a club he is better off resigning the very next day and sorting himself a new gig for the next season early.
 

always_hoping

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What makes you say that? How much of Brighton did you watch in 2019?
It's so easy to criticise a smaller clubs board but maybe "let's avoid relegation at all costs!" Isnt the only thing they should be aiming for. Hughton is a legend but he would have relegated the club next season.
I wouldn't criticize small clubs matter of fact i would praise them. Especially the good work that Hughton,Howe and Dyche have done the last few seasons. Leeds for example a much bigger club are over a decade out of the Premier League and gone through numerous managers in an effort to reach the Premier League again.
 

SambaBoy

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Depends on the next appointment whether this was the right move.

If they appoint someone of the usual PL conveyor belt i.e. Allardyce, Moyes, Pardew etc then it's a pointless appointment. They won't progress Brighton any further than they are now.

An out the box appointment like Southampton have done in the past with Pochettino, Koeman, Hassenhuttl would work better. It seems Brighton follow the moneyball system which has it risks. Brighton seem to have a lot of potential to develop into an established Premiership side with a new academy and ground, decent investment and it seems they want to play football the right way which hasn't happened lately. It will probably prove to be the right move in the long term albeit a tough one now.
 

KM

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You're correct. The owner Bloom is (arguably) the best gambler in the world, he's made hundreds of millions betting on top level matches with his algorithms and data. The amount of data they use is incredible. They have some of the best analysts and statisticians in the world and are incredibly good at predicting accurate ratings of players and how valuable they are and exactly what they offer to a team. Moneyball is definitely a feasible option in football. The two biggest issues probably are that most owners wouldn't be willing to try it and the ones that have tried it, have operated on small budgets.
Whilst I think it's a right decision to sack Hughton but I do think the praise for Brighton's analysts and statisticians is overblown by you. I was looking at their transfer window for last season and they spent around 75m odd and I don't think even one of the player they've signed can be called a success.
 

Spiersey

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Whilst I think it's a right decision to sack Hughton but I do think the praise for Brighton's analysts and statisticians is overblown by you. I was looking at their transfer window for last season and they spent around 75m odd and I don't think even one of the player they've signed can be called a success.
It was mainly praise of StarLizard and more of proving that it is possible to predict how a 90 minute game will go. Definitely agree their signings haven't been a success. They've made the mistake of trying to buy multiple cheaper players instead of buying more quality. I'd imagine this is probably a by product of using their method as in theory you'd be buying players for 10/15 mil which you believe will perform like a 25/30 mil signing.
 

poleglass red

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Funny thing is Hughton gets sacked again, yet his reputation is pretty much intact. I actually like him. I think it's a tough job at clubs like this, so much financial pressure to the club to remain in PL yet not much money to spend on players and wages. I hope they look outside the box on their next appt, none of the usual bollocks that are usually associated with these clubs
 

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Bit of a tragedy on a personal level as Brighton lose their captain and manager in 24 hours.

BHA had hardly been able to score from open play all season though, 50% to do with the injury to playmaker Pascal Groß. Recruitment in the summer was not very good as BHA had to settle for second best and a few apparently expensive third raters.

Swansea deserved to beat City in the FA Cup and it really should have been Millwall v Swansea at Wembley!

CH not my cuppa tea but he grew on me.
 
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Perseus

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It was mainly praise of StarLizard and more of proving that it is possible to predict how a 90 minute game will go. Definitely agree their signings haven't been a success. They've made the mistake of trying to buy multiple cheaper players instead of buying more quality. I'd imagine this is probably a by product of using their method as in theory you'd be buying players for 10/15 mil which you believe will perform like a 25/30 mil signing.
More likely, the first choice players had a choice and did not want to go to Brighton. New recruits did not seem to be ready for the Premier League, in fitness, technique and awareness, and those that did get games made mistakes.
 

ti vu

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They have probably looked at Wolves and are thinking well why can't we make the same impact
That would be stupid. Wolves has this connection with Mendez for some kind of scheme.
 

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He's worked miracles for Brighton.

As a manager he would be the same level as David Moyes.

Brighton obviously have some Portuguese or Spanish guy lined up who can come in and raid La Liga and the Portuguese league for bargains, and hopefully do a Wolves/Watford
 

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I initially thought this sacking was harsh, but now I agree with it.

Obviously no-one can take away the excellent job he did there, taking them from 21st in the Championship and in relegation danger (with 1 win in 18 under Sami Hypia) to securing a 3rd consecutive season in the Premier League. They also had decent FA Cup showings over the past couple of seasons. He’d should have no problem getting a decent level Championship job, and overall I think he has done well in 3 out of his 4 previous jobs (the exception at Norwich).

But he had reached the end of the road, and I think fresh ideas are needed there. The players clearly turned against his cautious tactics a couple of months ago. There have been quite a few occasions when teams have ended seasons in terrible form and survived fairly narrowly, but have then continued that terrible form into the following seasons.
 

Boneli

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It’s possibly slightly harsh, but I don’t think you could say it’s a wrong decision. They just didn’t look like turning things around, and were relying too heavily on Murray for goals - he’s not going to keep doing it for much longer. They need some new ideas, and if the rumours are true about Graham Potter, he’s exactly the type of manager they should be looking at.

Saying that, I think Celtic could do a lot worse than hire Chris Hughton. Surely he’s got to be a better option than Neil Lennon or Moyes?
 

Dancfc

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Will this be as astute as when Charlton decided Alan Curbishley had taken them as far as he could?

Or when Sunderland said the same about Peter Reid?
Or when Southampton said the same about Nigel Adkins and Mark Hughes?

Or when Watford said the same about the managers they've sacked since promotion?
 

Dancfc

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Will very much be a ridiculous decision if his replacement gets Brighton relegated next season.
Not really, it's worth a roll of the dice because history suggest they would be certainly doomed if Hughton stayed.
 

GaryLifo

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Or when Southampton said the same about Nigel Adkins and Mark Hughes?

Or when Watford said the same about the managers they've sacked since promotion?
They really said that Hughes had done a great job but had taken them as far as he could? Hughes was awful at Saints.

Adkins - maybe fair enough, though we will never know if he would have matched what Poch did as he wasn't given the chance. Let's also not forget that Poch inherited a bunch of very good players players who had come through several promotions under the reign of Adkins. I'm not sure how many great signings Poch added to that squad either.

I also think you have missed my general point entirely. I'm talking about managers who were doing as well as or better than could be expected for clubs of that stature. In the case of Charlton it was being in the premier league for many consecutive years and for Sunderland it was finishing 4th. The owners and fans assumed that all that was preventing further or greater glory for these clubs were the limitations of their current managers. These clubs then replaced them only to be relegated soon after.

The same will happen to Brighton IMO. They are a small club who have been punching above their weight under a manager who got them where they currently are. They have a squad who have just finished one place higher than you'd expect them to finish given their very average quality players. They clearly think that a new manager will take these same average players to greater heights. I think they are wrong. I would back them to go down next season and that's before I even know who comes in to manage them.
 

Dancfc

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They really said that Hughes had done a great job but had taken them as far as he could? Hughes was awful at Saints.

Adkins - maybe fair enough, though we will never know if he would have matched what Poch did as he wasn't given the chance. Let's also not forget that Poch inherited a bunch of very good players players who had come through several promotions under the reign of Adkins. I'm not sure how many great signings Poch added to that squad either.

I also think you have missed my general point entirely. I'm talking about managers who were doing as well as or better than could be expected for clubs of that stature. In the case of Charlton it was being in the premier league for many consecutive years and for Sunderland it was finishing 4th. The owners and fans assumed that all that was preventing further or greater glory for these clubs were the limitations of their current managers. These clubs then replaced them only to be relegated soon after.

The same will happen to Brighton IMO. They are a small club who have been punching above their weight under a manager who got them where they currently are. They have a squad who have just finished one place higher than you'd expect them to finish given their very average quality players. They clearly think that a new manager will take these same average players to greater heights. I think they are wrong. I would back them to go down next season and that's before I even know who comes in to manage them.
Yeah Hughes was a pretty bad example but i do remember the odd "what do clubs like that expect" when they sacked him.

Brighton were very lucky not to go down this year, when teams stay up due to early season form being their viagra (so to speak) or other teams blowing it they almost always go down with a whimper the following season, (mainly because they do what people think Brighton should now and fail to rectify the situation because they technically achieved their objective) in Brighton's case they benefited from both. They have probably learned from similar cases to them like Hull in 2009 or Huddersfield last season.

I would probably as of now predict a Brighton relegation but not as confidently as a few days ago, if Chris stayed i was that convinced they were doomed i was going to stick a lump sum on it and i said that from their thumping at home to Bournemouth onwards.
 
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Perseus

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I initially thought this sacking was harsh, but now I agree with it.

Obviously no-one can take away the excellent job he did there, taking them from 21st in the Championship and in relegation danger (with 1 win in 18 under Sami Hypia) to securing a 3rd consecutive season in the Premier League. They also had decent FA Cup showings over the past couple of seasons. He’d should have no problem getting a decent level Championship job, and overall I think he has done well in 3 out of his 4 previous jobs (the exception at Norwich).

But he had reached the end of the road, and I think fresh ideas are needed there. The players clearly turned against his cautious tactics a couple of months ago. There have been quite a few occasions when teams have ended seasons in terrible form and survived fairly narrowly, but have then continued that terrible form into the following seasons.
It is a hell of a gamble on two and a half fronts

1) whether Potter wants to come ?
2) whether Potter can produce a side that can attack enough and still be defensively solid to avoid relegation ?
1a) Swansea manage to fob off advances ?

BHA have past form for headline grabbing deals twice in my time in the 20th century. Also sacked a Manager just after a Cup Final.

PS: New players could not defend properly when it mattered. Old guard (50% CH signings) put the brakes on.

A bit like Burnley who tried to play football, and then reverted when results deteriorated.
 

Perseus

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Bissouma is good and then the rest of their decent players are in attack.

An attacking group of Izquierdo, Jahanbakhsh, Locadia, Andone, Knockaert, Glen Murray and Groß should not be finishing 17th.
This is WRONG.

It is the Old Guard at the back that are the only ones fit to be on the pitch against the top 6: Bruno, Duffy, Dunk, Bong.

The rest of the team are deficient, not even as good as Southampton in midfield and attack.
 

FootballHQ

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They did try to upgrade their full backs. Signed Martin Montoya who's been at Barca and played a fair few games for Valencia and Bernardo who was highly rated at Leipzig.

No idea if either have looked good or flopped.
 

Perseus

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They did try to upgrade their full backs. Signed Martin Montoya who's been at Barca and played a fair few games for Valencia and Bernardo who was highly rated at Leipzig.

No idea if either have looked good or flopped.
Montoya and Bernardo looked quite good players, but not good full backs in Houghton's deep defence. And this is what failed in home defeats against Southampton, Burnley and Bournemouth.

Oh for a full back like Ashley Young!