[All 3 United]

The issue with Smalling on the CAF is he’s either over rated or under rated and all this leads to is over the top counter arguments from each side of the fence (and I have been suckered into this in the past).

He’s an OK defender, great as a backup option. Would he be starting under SAF? I very much doubt it. My only concern is paying him £120k per week, that isn’t a backup players salary and if that takes up a first team players budget, then we really do have to accept that the club are content with top 4.

 

[Mcking]

No. They won’t. Whoever Mourinho is ALLOWED to sign will replace him. Notice how I capitalize “ALLOWED”. He won’t be forced to play this shambles of a defender for much longer if they splash the cash on Alderweireld or Koulibaly hopefully.


So I’m not allowed to criticize a player and want somebody better? Get off your high horse. Watching City buy top class player after top class player while we’re stuck playing Smalling and Young every week makes me sick. You might be content with coming 6th or 7th again, I’m not.

Or maybe coming 2nd again. Which position would you be content with? Do you think Koulibaly will make us achieve that?

 

[MadDogg]

The Juventus goal in the 1-0 loss. Failed to block the pass which led to Dybala’s goal.

Gave away a stupid penalty against Everton. Absolutely no need to slide in like that when the player wasn’t even facing goal.

Slipped on his arse against Bournemouth (I think it was) which led to a one on one chance in the first half. Only De Gea saved it.

He recently had a shaky three game period which was the worst he's had in a couple of years. Those were the three games. Even then he did block the pass which Dybala scored from, which is more than any other player on the pitch did in that attacking move. He was just unlucky he bounced out to Dybala, who our entire midfield had just watched wander into a completely free area.

Before that three game period he was our best, and he's been our best again since.

Just last week he jumped for a header with his hands in the fecking air.

He was pushed which led him to being unbalanced and his arm came up. It's not like he made contact with the ball.

Let’s not ignore all the time he shirt pulls and grabs players around the neck during corners and free kicks. The man is a liability.

How many times in his entire career has he actually given away a penalty for that?

Once.

No. They won’t. Whoever Mourinho is ALLOWED to sign will replace him. Notice how I capitalize “ALLOWED”. He won’t be forced to play this shambles of a defender for much longer if they splash the cash on Alderweireld or Koulibaly hopefully.

We play with two central defenders. If we sign one, chances are it'll be the new guy and Smalling who end up settling in as our first choice. Mourinho will probably try to use Lindelof and maybe Bailly first on the off chance that they come good (and then have the superior on the ball-ability), but more likely than not they'll end up dropping out and Smalling will come in as he's our best at actually defending.

 

[Ekeke]

The issue with Smalling on the CAF is he’s either over rated or under rated and all this leads to is over the top counter arguments from each side of the fence (and I have been suckered into this in the past).

He’s an OK defender, great as a backup option. Would he be starting under SAF? I very much doubt it. My only concern is paying him £120k per week, that isn’t a backup players salary and if that takes up a first team players budget, then we really do have to accept that the club are content with top 4.

Worse CBs than Smalling started for us, so yes I think he would

 

[Fergietime@99]

If Smalling is on the market tomorrow, which top club do you think would go for him?

 

[Mcking]

If Smalling is on the market tomorrow, which top club do you think would go for him?

He is good, he is loyal and he is our top defender. He won't be on the market anytime soon. We are not that daft.

 

[Ekeke]

If Smalling is on the market tomorrow, which top club do you think would go for him?

The same ones that would take Lovren, Toby, Cahill or Sokratis from Arsenal

 

[Johan07]

The same ones that would take Lovren, Toby, Cahill or Sokratis from Arsenal

Add to that clubs like Everton, West Ham, Newcastle, etc, who would bite our fingers off to acquire Smalling. And/or Jones for that matter. This narrative that we should give those two players away for nothing or that no club would pay decent money for them is just plain stupidity.
If we give Smalling a 4-year contract at 125k a week that is a total wage cost at around 25m for that period. The second he signs his asset/transfer value will rise to at least that amount. Same accounting principle applies to Jones.
And if anyone thinks that clubs like the ones mentioned above in todays market would not pay at least 25m for Smalling and/or Jones and happily put them on the same wages are blinded by some kind of hatred towards our own players that is very difficult to comprehend. Especially Jones, who is just 26 and an England international (WC this summer), actually has an even greater transfer value than Smalling.
Its a no-brainer to offer both new contracts. If they both will be at United in two years is another matter entirely.

 

[Fergietime@99]

The same ones that would take Lovren, Toby, Cahill or Sokratis from Arsenal

When Liverpool signed Lovren, they were finishing 7th if I am not wrong.

Alderweireld was the best defender in the league 2 seasons ago. Cahill was brilliant around the time Chelsea won the Championship League.

Now, coming to Arsenal. When was the last time they won the League or CL.

If by top team you meant top 6 in the premier league then you may be right. For me top teams are the one competing for titles. That's my ambition for us. And smalling is not good enough for that.

 

[Fergietime@99]

Add to that clubs like Everton, West Ham, Newcastle, etc, who would bite our fingers off to acquire Smalling. And/or Jones for that matter. This narrative that we should give those two players away for nothing or that no club would pay decent money for them is just plain stupidity.
If we give Smalling a 4-year contract at 125k a week that is a total wage cost at around 25m for that period. The second he signs his asset/transfer value will rise to at least that amount. Same accounting principle applies to Jones.
And if anyone thinks that clubs like the ones mentioned above in todays market would not pay at least 25m for Smalling and/or Jones and happily put them on the same wages are blinded by some kind of hatred towards our own players that is very difficult to comprehend. Especially Jones, who is just 26 and an England international (WC this summer), actually has an even greater transfer value than Smalling.
Its a no-brainer to offer both new contracts. If they both will be at United in two years is another matter entirely.

Where were your accounting principles when we had to offload Nani. The second they sign a 4 year contract worth 125k per week, why would these players leave? They won't get better pay anywhere else. We will not have squad space for better players/ upcoming defenders.

And you are right Everton would love him. He will help keep them around mid table which is his level.

We should be looking for signings like Umtiti before he went to Barca.

 

[RedSky]

The issue with Smalling on the CAF is he’s either over rated or under rated and all this leads to is over the top counter arguments from each side of the fence (and I have been suckered into this in the past).

He’s an OK defender, great as a backup option. Would he be starting under SAF? I very much doubt it. My only concern is paying him £120k per week, that isn’t a backup players salary and if that takes up a first team players budget, then we really do have to accept that the club are content with top 4.

I think its less about Smalling and more about the lack of quality of the CBs in our squad. Most people here who defend Smalling appreciate he is the best of a bad bunch and yet the bad bunch aren't getting moved on. Jones and Rojo take the piss every season with their injuries and we still keep them. All they're doing is stopping us from signing two players who can actually compete with Smalling for a starting place.

Baillys gone backwards since his bad injury and going through a very bad patch of form while Lindelof who's been garbage for a season might finally be showing signs of potential. Our only consistently fit players are Smalling and Lindelof. From 5 fecking players! Madness.

 

[Leftback99]

The issue with Smalling on the CAF is he’s either over rated or under rated and all this leads to is over the top counter arguments from each side of the fence (and I have been suckered into this in the past).

He’s an OK defender, great as a backup option. Would he be starting under SAF? I very much doubt it. My only concern is paying him £120k per week, that isn’t a backup players salary and if that takes up a first team players budget, then we really do have to accept that the club are content with top 4.

He already was starting under SAF and would have done even more so once Vidic and Rio retired. We also would never have sold Evans , another player like Smalling who people thought it was a great idea to get rid of but is better than Rojo, Bailly and Lindelof.

 

[Johan07]

I think its less about Smalling and more about the lack of quality of the CBs in our squad. Most people here who defend Smalling appreciate he is the best of a bad bunch and yet the bad bunch aren't getting moved on. Jones and Rojo take the piss every season with their injuries and we still keep them. All they're doing is stopping us from signing two players who can actually compete with Smalling for a starting place.

Baillys gone backwards since his bad injury and going through a very bad patch of form while Lindelof who's been garbage for a season might finally be showing signs of potential. Our only consistently fit players are Smalling and Lindelof. From 5 fecking players! Madness.

Mourinho offered a very honest and interesting input on the CB-situation in the embargoed part of the presser yday. It can be found here: I dont know if I embedded it correctly, it can be found in the presser thread otherwise.
EDIT
guess I did....

 

[RedSky]

Mourinho offered a very honest and interesting input on the CB-situation in the embargoed part of the presser yday. It can be found here: I dont know if I embedded it correctly, it can be found in the presser thread otherwise.
EDIT
guess I did....

Hard to disagree with anything he says there in relation to the CB issue. Thanks for the video.

 

[Johan07]

Hard to disagree with anything he says there in relation to the CB issue. Thanks for the video.

Yeah, I dont understand people that wants Mourinho to shut up and dont talk to the press and do interviews. When he is relaxed and not in conflict-mode he more often or not offers some real insight in how he is thinking regarding the squad. Probably the closest we as fans can ever get.

 

[Johan07]

Where were your accounting principles when we had to offload Nani. The second they sign a 4 year contract worth 125k per week, why would these players leave? They won't get better pay anywhere else. We will not have squad space for better players/ upcoming defenders.

And you are right Everton would love him. He will help keep them around mid table which is his level.

We should be looking for signings like Umtiti before he went to Barca.

Because they are professional footballers who actually wants to play football over anything else? And be important to their team. Ever thought of that? There are not many players in the world that would stay at a club if the manager does not want them or tells them that their playing time will be limited. And both Smalling and Jones would easily be paid over 100k by anyone of the club I mentioned. Today.

 

[Ekeke]

When Liverpool signed Lovren, they were finishing 7th if I am not wrong.

Alderweireld was the best defender in the league 2 seasons ago. Cahill was brilliant around the time Chelsea won the Championship League.

Now, coming to Arsenal. When was the last time they won the League or CL.

If by top team you meant top 6 in the premier league then you may be right. For me top teams are the one competing for titles. That's my ambition for us. And smalling is not good enough for that.

2 seasons ago? VVD was better. Otamendi was better. Hell even Bailly was better.

 

[Ekeke]

One of the cleanest performances we've had from a CB this season (not that its saying a lot) but he didnt hobble about injured so nobody is talking about him.

He won the ball a lot on the floor with 4 tackles, 2 interceptions, 3 clearances, 1 blocked shot. 5 balls won in the air being aerially dominant. And although Palace certainly had chances to score it wasnt his man. Hard work.

 

[Meep]

Played well today. It's good that Victor has started to steer up his placing on the pitch. He did what was expected.

 

[MikeKing]

Yeah, he had a great game. Unbelievable to me how some people still cant differentiate between a good and a bad performance when it comes to defending. Remember that period when Rio was so invisible and he didn't get a lot of talk in that period. After a while some people thought he had become a worse CB, then the statistics dropped and he had gone like a year without making a free kick or something silly like that. Makes the term 'Silent domination' not so ironic. Not to say Smalling is as good or as "silent" as Rio was, but a lot of his defensive work gets taken for granted by our fanbase. Its like they only notice tricks, flicks, passes, some offensive play or hard action style defending.

 

[Foxbatt]

He played a good game today. Whether it is good enough for a top team is another question. We are not a top team anymore but a midtable table.

 

[FootyGirl88]

2 seasons ago? VVD was better. Otamendi was better. Hell even Bailly was better.

This season Leicester won the league and the season after when they finished 2nd. I think that's what he's talking about.

 

[Mcking]

When it is this quiet, then know that Smalling have had a very good game.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

When it is this quiet, then know that Smalling have had a very good game.

He was part of a defence that never looked comfortable with Palaces attack and in general looked unorganized... So I can't say he had a good game.

However he did have a better game then Lindelof, yet he's the one people are praising for some reason. Go figure.

 

[Mcking]

He was part of a defence that never looked comfortable with Palaces attack and in general looked unorganized... So I can't say he had a good game.

However he did have a better game then Lindelof, yet he's the one people are praising for some reason. Go figure.

Individually, he was good. He was always at the right place, and tidily dealt with every threat that came his way. Matic and Lindelof were a big reason why we looked disorganized.

 

[yardieUnited]

Main player causing confusion in our defence.

Watch him closely when the opponents have the ball in our half.
He constantly leaves holes in the defence because he runs after opponents,which tends to make his cb partner panic.

 

[Isotope]

As a CB myself (in many moons ago), I love watching him doing the defending. You can see clearly he had to babysit Lindelof and Darmien, and sometimes got caught up because these later two just everywhere when needed.

I honestly think that even the best CB would look worse playing in Smalling position with these teammates. It's like T. Silva with Luiz with Brazil in the past, that made Silva look like half the player he was.

 

[Loublaze]

Main player causing confusion in our defence.

Watch him closely when the opponents have the ball in our half.
He constantly leaves holes in the defence because he runs after opponents,which tends to make his cb partner panic.

Im guessing you didn't see Lindelof getting turned over by a simple flick by Townsend and several times easily beaten by Zaha

 

[MadDogg]

People talk about his lack of passing ability hurting us going forward (and it does), but one thing I rarely see mentioned is how often our best counter-attacks come directly from him winning the ball. The opposition get the ball, try to bring it forward (whether on the ground or with a long ball to the striker) and Smalling just steps in and wins it and we're suddenly on the attack again. Two or three of our best attacks came from that happening today, and it does happen pretty much every match.

 

[RedPed]

As I said before, outside of a few deluded fans on here, Smalling is a laughing stock and not rated at all by oppo fans. No way would he get into any of the top 6. Probably wouldn't make the bench.

 

[RonaldoVII]

Main player causing confusion in our defence.

Watch him closely when the opponents have the ball in our half.
He constantly leaves holes in the defence because he runs after opponents,which tends to make his cb partner panic.

Disagree. He was clearly told to go with Zaha today and stay tight to him as he was their main threat. He dealt with Zaha well.

 

[Mcking]

Im guessing you didn't see Lindelof getting turned over by a simple flick by Townsend and several times easily beaten by Zaha

Zaha had to leave their left wing because he couldn't get the better of Smalling.

 

[Mcking]

As I said before, outside of a few deluded fans on here, Smalling is a laughing stock and not rated at all by oppo fans. No way would he get into any of the top 6. Probably wouldn't make the bench.

Nice one. Some wonderful points there.

 

[Ekeke]

As I said before, outside of a few deluded fans on here, Smalling is a laughing stock and not rated at all by oppo fans. No way would he get into any of the top 6. Probably wouldn't make the bench.

Yes, people who dont watch him laugh at him because United fans who have no idea what defending is use him as a punching bag.

 

[Ashley R1+O]

One of the cleanest performances we've had from a CB this season (not that its saying a lot) but he didnt hobble about injured so nobody is talking about him.

He won the ball a lot on the floor with 4 tackles, 2 interceptions, 3 clearances, 1 blocked shot. 5 balls won in the air being aerially dominant. And although Palace certainly had chances to score it wasnt his man. Hard work.

Beast of a performance.

 

[SiamDevil]

As I said before, outside of a few deluded fans on here, Smalling is a laughing stock and not rated at all by oppo fans. No way would he get into any of the top 6. Probably wouldn't make the bench.

I think you need a better reference for your points. McKola's ridiculously anti-Smalling. One of the prime users of the "X was poor but it was because Smalling unsettles him" argument.

 

[11101]

Zaha had to leave their left wing because he couldn't get the better of Smalling.

Smalling was solid today but that bit is as much down to Darmian as anything. It's the first time we've had someone who knows how to position themselves defensively at full back this season.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

Smalling is the least of our problems. Put a world class guy with leadership qualities next to him and he'd do a fantastic job as 'the beast'.

Most great CB pairings are a Beauty and the Beast pairing. One footballing man with organisational skills and great reading of the game, one guy to do the dirty work. Is he world class? Of course not. But pair him with a Rio, and he'd be very good.

 

[OnlyTwoDaSilvas]

Who gives a shite what opposition fans think anyway? Plenty of them thought Rio and Vidic were shit at their peak. City fans bleated about Hart being better than De Gea for years. Couldn't give a stuff what non United fans think about any of our players.

Smalling could be improved on if big money is spent, but he's still significantly better than the rest of the centre backs we have. If Smalling is a "laughing stock", then what are these opposition fans, who are now deemed as a barometer of whether or not we should rate a particular player, saying about Rojo, Jones, Bailly and Lindelof?

Before Smalling gets pelters, the rest of them should be taking even more pelters, except maybe Lindelof, who is among our most improved players, but still overall not quite as good as Smalling, yet. Rojo and Jones practically don't even exist anymore, and Bailly can't even head the ball, which is shocking for a central defender. Like him or not, Smalling's top of the pecking order of what we have, and it's not particularly close.

 

[Loublaze]

As I said before, outside of a few deluded fans on here, Smalling is a laughing stock and not rated at all by oppo fans. No way would he get into any of the top 6. Probably wouldn't make the bench.

Why would you care about the opinion of opposition fans most of whom don't have an inkling about our players? Smalling would start alongside the dutch player at Liverpool easily, and Spurs and Arsenal would snatch him off us no matter what their fans think. Wenger chased Smalling at every chance over the years. Lesser players have been given chances at the top 6 sides.