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Rossa

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If we buy Maguire we will get in him the only stand out attribute that Smalling offers, heading ability, plus a lot more. Between his very poor passing and general footballing ability and VAR exposing his hands on approach to defending, i think he is done for, if we buy Maguire.

Very overrated player by some IMO. A top lad by all accounts and i'm glad we had him in the time where better players then him let us down in terms of fitness. He just has to be replaced ASAP in the first 11 if we are to be an attacking team that can deal with the opposition pressing without bringing back the entire midfield to collect passes.
He's played plenty of VAR matches to disprove that myth. I love it when our fans bash our players for hypothetical things. Smalling also has recovery pace that Maguire can only dream of.
 

arnie_ni

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He's played plenty of VAR matches to disprove that myth. I love it when our fans bash our players for hypothetical things. Smalling also has recovery pace that Maguire can only dream of.
The whole champions league and fa cup campaigns last year had var for example.

Its a bollocks argument
 

jackal&hyde

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He's played plenty of VAR matches to disprove that myth. I love it when our fans bash our players for hypothetical things. Smalling also has recovery pace that Maguire can only dream of.
I'm not bashing him ffs, i'm saying what i've seen over the last few years. LVG got 2 CD when he came, Mourinho the same, by all accounts Ole is also desperate for at least one, the England manager does not rate Smalling either; on top of that during the last 2 years we were all desperate for at least one new defender. But now, during summer, all of a sudden Smalling is a good defender? I don't know of any neutral fans that rates him (or Jones) and i had no idea that part of the CAF does. It seems very strange to me. It is what it is though.

It's the Smalling thread so i'm discussing him, but i have similar feelings about most our defenders. Jones and Rojo are also not good enough IMO and Bailly although is a good player i think, he needs to stay fit to gain confidence otherwise he is just a big of a problem.

His defending is ok, not great as some want to think, but the fact of the matter is you can't play attacking football with defenders that are poor on the ball. It's no coincidence that our best defensive record came in a season in which we parked the buss and our GK was man of the season still (and we had major problems scoring and creating by playing so deep). As soon as we looked to attack more, the house of cards that is Smallings "good defending" fell apart and we became exceptionally weak to the opposition pressing.

I think the bigger picture here is that in modern football it's not enough to be just good at defending, you also need to be good at making play and even fast 1-2s and the odd dribbling to bypass pressing, just as it's important for attackers to defend by pressing and cutting passing lanes. Players that can't do this put the team at a big disadvantage. The time of when defenders just need to defend and attackers to attack has passed.
 

Denis79

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Still our best CB imo, think the criticism he gets is over the top.
 

Rossa

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I'm not bashing him ffs, i'm saying what i've seen over the last few years. LVG got 2 CD when he came, Mourinho the same, by all accounts Ole is also desperate for at least one, the England manager does not rate Smalling either; on top of that during the last 2 years we were all desperate for at least one new defender. But now, during summer, all of a sudden Smalling is a good defender? I don't know of any neutral fans that rates him (or Jones) and i had no idea that part of the CAF does. It seems very strange to me. It is what it is though.

It's the Smalling thread so i'm discussing him, but i have similar feelings about most our defenders. Jones and Rojo are also not good enough IMO and Bailly although is a good player i think, he needs to stay fit to gain confidence otherwise he is just a big of a problem.

His defending is ok, not great as some want to think, but the fact of the matter is you can't play attacking football with defenders that are poor on the ball. It's no coincidence that our best defensive record came in a season in which we parked the buss and our GK was man of the season still (and we had major problems scoring and creating by playing so deep). As soon as we looked to attack more, the house of cards that is Smallings "good defending" fell apart and we became exceptionally weak to the opposition pressing.

I think the bigger picture here is that in modern football it's not enough to be just good at defending, you also need to be good at making play and even fast 1-2s and the odd dribbling to bypass pressing, just as it's important for attackers to defend by pressing and cutting passing lanes. Players that can't do this put the team at a big disadvantage. The time of when defenders just need to defend and attackers to attack has passed.
I was talking about you claiming he would be found out come VAR. He hasn't.
 

TwoSheds

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Still our best CB imo, think the criticism he gets is over the top.
Agreed, although I think Lindelof is a better all round player but he couldn't do it consistently without a bruiser like Jones or Smalling next to him IMO. Not that I rate any of them super highly but shitting on our best players, regardless of whether they're top players or not, is not particularly helpful. Shit on them when we've signed a better one and they're rotation players. Except people (largely) wouldn't because they're good enough to play that role.
 

Adam-Utd

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For all the stick he gets, he's probably handled Kane the best out of every defender in the premier league.

Had a great half.
 

podurban2

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He's a good defender but he can't pass the ball and it has shown to really hurt us in high-intensity games, imo.
 

Rifer

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Tend to defend vs Kane well, and the reason why he play.

Did one very good tight aerial defense vs Kane. Crucial defend there.

Annoying passing quality but we know that already, and he did what he expect him to do --> defend. No complain from me.
 

SteveW

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He's a good player. The treatment he gets is just bizarre
 

Quinzaine

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He's a good player. The treatment he gets is just bizarre
He's a good defender* but he's so poor on the ball that I couldn't categorize him as a good player. His ability on the ball is so limited that it's going to cost us if we have any kind of ambitions of playing out from the back like all the top clubs do.
 

Isotope

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The only defender i have faith on marking world class striker.
 

Nick7

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He's a good defender* but he's so poor on the ball that I couldn't categorize him as a good player. His ability on the ball is so limited that it's going to cost us if we have any kind of ambitions of playing out from the back like all the top clubs do.
He'll cost us far less than a centre back who can't defend but is decent on the ball.
 

yamo123x

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If we bring in Harry which i hope we do, Smalling should be kept along with Victor, Axel and Bailly( DESPITE him being the most injury prone of all our defenders)

Jones Rojo and Darmian can all go.
 

el3mel

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I see many defend Smalling by saying he's our best defender but the standard isn't that high to start with. Of course he's better than the likes of Bailly, Rojo and Jones. It doesn't say much. He's someone very upgradable if we want to. Currently he's the best of the bad lot, that's it.
 

Tapori

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People go on and on about Smallings limitations. But even as a squad player he provides a pure defensive option against certain styles of play and teams. Solid.
 

Andersons Dietician

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Was Harry Kane playing today? Usual service resumed of living his life in Smallings pocket.
 

Hammondo

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As far as putting a defender onto a striker hes great, he will deal with anyone.
 

MikeKing

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Thought he looked rusty today, not very sharp and for that reason his lack of ability on the ball was too obvious this game. He managed to keep Kane out like always, so I guess it was not all bad.. and made the defence look some what structured even with Rojo in it, which is not easy.
 

AshRK

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People go on and on about Smallings limitations. But even as a squad player he provides a pure defensive option against certain styles of play and teams. Solid.
I don't think many will have problem if he is just used as a squad player but as things stand he is our first choice CB and that doesn't bring a lot of confidence. My main problem with him is he has been here for almost 10 seasons and yet he has not convinced many as a top defender who can trusted to be a leader for your defense.
 

arnie_ni

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I see many defend Smalling by saying he's our best defender but the standard isn't that high to start with. Of course he's better than the likes of Bailly, Rojo and Jones. It doesn't say much. He's someone very upgradable if we want to. Currently he's the best of the bad lot, that's it.
How's he upgradeable? We are struggling to bring in 1 cb let alone the 3 we would need to justify selling him (that would leave us 3 new cbs, lindeloff and tuanzabe)
 

jackal&hyde

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Good defensive display, some great headers in our box, bad passing at times, some unnecessary fouls. Typical Smalling with both the good and the bad.
 

red woppit

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My main reservation about him is the way he sometimes bear hugs an opponent when marking at corners, free kicks etc, that aside, he is a decent defender, has the ability to pass the ball reasonably well ( think he gets a bit complacent sometimes), and can be a goal threat for us, saying that, I think that he could possibly be on his way next summer, with the club possibly looking at the two youngsters from Stoke and Norwich.
 

Bwuk

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Maguire will be the end of him. He barely featured in pre season.

Wouldn’t be surprised if we try to offer him to Newcastle to lower Longstaffs price.
 

red woppit

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Maguire will be the end of him. He barely featured in pre season.

Wouldn’t be surprised if we try to offer him to Newcastle to lower Longstaffs price.
You could be right. I think one or possibly two CB's could be on their way.
 

el3mel

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Finally it's time for him to become a squad player. He'll be good in that role.
 

Gomes

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Even Ed wouldn't be that dumb. It's much more likely that he will maintain his place in the first 11.
 

RedPed

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The way I see it, £80m not to have him starting is money well spent. He's a cup player now thank goodness but he should probably move back to Fulham or a top Championship side. It's going to be Maguire/Lindelof/Tuanzebe and Bailly (when fit) this season. Jones has been decent pre-season.
 

ChaddyP

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Maguire will be the end of him. He barely featured in pre season.

Wouldn’t be surprised if we try to offer him to Newcastle to lower Longstaffs price.
Chris Smalling is much better than this current Newcastle in my opinion.
 

Crimson King

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I did consider him to be better than Jones, and at least he's not injured as much.

However, with VAR coming in he'll give away a penalty every match with his WWE performances when trying to mark at set pieces...
 

Isotope

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As season goes by, he'll be back in starting line up cementing his place. It's been proven historically, regardless of any new shinny signing.
 

Red_toad

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I did consider him to be better than Jones, and at least he's not injured as much.

However, with VAR coming in he'll give away a penalty every match with his WWE performances when trying to mark at set pieces...
Yet historical eveidence of this occurring when he's played in games where VAR is present is none existant. Complete bulls that's circulated as a truth...
 
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11101

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Glad that we won't have to see him so often but we sell him at our peril. If Lindelof or Maguire get injured we will still need Smalling. None of Jones, Bailly or Rojo have shown they can be relied on to be fit when needed.