Coronavirus Champions League - QF - Sjor/Invictus vs Moby

[GodShaveTheQueen]

............................................SJOR/INVICTUS.........................................................................................................MOBY

TEAM SJOR/INVICTUS

Formation: Up-tempo 4-3-3 with fluid inter-changing flanks in attack.

DEFENSE

Ciro Ferrara, Velibor Vasović (Ajax's captain for the first European Cup in club history), Gianluca Zambrotta and Ruud Krol form an accomplished and diverse platform for the team, with three or the quartet winning the European Cup and the fourth the World Cup. The instructions are fairly straight-forward — Krol is well positioned to provide a supplementary attacking threat on the left flank while being secure in the defensive phase and Vasović will organize the defense — in our opinion, their chemistry while at Ajax will be an added bonus:

What stood out most about Vasović - and it is a trait possessed by the game's greatest sweepers - is a confidence that not only bordered on arrogance it actively invaded and settled there. In his more subdued moments he claimed to be the central architect behind the totaalvoetbal philosophy, but it is undeniable that his pace and intelligence allowed Michels to implement the ruthlessly efficient offside trap that became a hallmark of Ajax's defensive strategy.

To their right is Ferrara (a tough centerback who emerged as the leader of the vaunted Juventus defense under Lippi), and fellow Italian Zambrotta:

Unfancied when the first ball of the tournament was kicked and champions just after the last was hit with fury, Italy had made history in the German capital. On the fringes at Juventus, Zambrotta played his part brilliantly and his performances were rewarded with a place in FIFA’s All-Star team. He would later make it into the FIFPro World XI – a worthy accolade for a player at the peak of his powers. Despite his shift into management, his career as a player will take some beating. Widely regarded as one of the best Italian full-backs of the modern era, his versatility was important to every manager he worked under, ensuring he was a vital cog at the major clubs he represented. An excellent crosser, tireless runner, all-round winner and intelligent defender, there are few full-backs like Gianluca Zambrotta left in the game today.

In goal, Sepp Maier was the core of Germany’s World Cup and European Championship winning defense and Bayern’s trio of European Cups — and was voted 4th in the World Keeper of the Century poll.



MIDFIELD

Paul Scholes, De Bruyne and Valery Voronin offer an exquisite blend of technique and up-tempo playmaking ability in the central portion of the pitch. Scholes reprises his fabled clockwork regista role — allowing him to regulate the proceeding in inimitable fashion and form an exhilarating axis for the forwards.

He is the complete midfielder. Scholes is undoubtedly the greatest midfielder of his generation. If he was playing with me, I would score so many more. Scholes is a great man — Pelé

To his right is De Bruyne — who will seek to serve as a supply line for the attackers. A quick and elegant player on the ball, his positional sense, tactical intelligence, movement, workrate and direct style of play enables him to take advantage of spaces in the opposition's defense, and subsequently create chances and goalscoring opportunities for himself or his teammates. What he lacks in all All-Time stature according to some, he makes up for in terms of fit — in this setup, he should be able to explore the full extent of his simple yet remarkable playmaking skill set through the half-spaces as someone who is adept as co-existing with other playmakers without hogging the ball, and he should positively thrive in the presence of Seeler, Ronaldo and Cristiano further up the pitch as they will gobble up a fair percentage of the chances he invariably creates.

And supporting the base is Voronin, performing the holding role he perfected in his peak — capable of being a factor in possession as well as negating the influence of the likes of Eusébio, allowing Scholes and De Bruyne the freedom to exert maximum creative influence on the match. Here he will play a significant role in curtailing the influence of Zidane.



ATTACK

Up top is Uwe Seeler. The greatest striker Germany has ever produced behind Gerd Müller, he possessed the unique ability to form a telepathic understanding with his co-attackers and involve himself in the deeper or wider game to a point where he was almost a dual striker-winger/forward — all while establishing himself as one of the best examples you'll ever see of aerial prowess at the position, working hard on and off the ball and being an extraordinary natural goalscorer — to date, Seeler boasts the second highest goal tally of a German footballer with 575 scored in competitive matches. In our opinion, the ideal pivot for the attackers wide of him.


On either flank is the man, the myth, the legend — Ronaldo. An extremely powerful, fast, and technical player, with excellent movement, as well as being a composed finisher, Ronaldo was highly regarded for his technical ability, and was able to use both feet, despite being naturally right footed, and is considered one of the most skilful dribblers in the game overall. Here he has the freedom to attack the opposition defense from all sorts of angles — a scary proposition given his ability to beat several players when dribbling at speed, and excellence in one on one situations, due to his ball control, acceleration, agility, balance and nimble footwork in his prime.

Coaches recommended a second defensive line against him because everyone had the impression that Ronaldo would be able to lose his marker, whether it was with a sprint, or facing a defender directly — Marcelo Lippi

And mirroring him on either flank, is Ronaldo II, Cristiano. Arguably the greatest European footballer ever and a versatile attacker, Ronaldo is capable of playing on either wing as well as through the center of the pitch, and, while ostensibly right-footed, is very strong with both feet. He also ranks among the world's fastest footballers, both with and without the ball.

He has magic in his boots. The first thing you notice about him is that he is incredibly quick and very, very powerful. He has great, close control and his technique is excellent. He believes he can do anything with the ball, and that confidence makes him very special indeed — Eusébio

That's aside from all the goals, and Cristiano forms a drool-worthy scoring partnership with Seeler and Ronaldo — especially with De Bruyne and Scholes's pin-point deliveries (in open play as well as from set pieces with Cristiano being arguably the greatest header of the ball ever)...

List of footballers with 500 or more goals

1. Josef Bican: 805+ goals
3. Pelé: 767 goals
7. Cristiano Ronaldo: 725 goals
9. Uwe Seeler: 575 goals

TEAM MOBY

• Daniel Passarella comes in to lead and marshal the defense with is legendary leadership and defensive skills. He is the most unique among all GOAT defenders that while he made an outstanding impact going forward especially goalscoring, he was an absolute rock in defense, who would put his body on the line to keep out the threat and pulled off miraculous performances in adverse circumstances. He is partnered by one of La Liga's best defenders at his prime in Ayala who would be bringing in similar intensity and no nonsense defending on the pitch.
• Camacho and Gerets both defensively sound fullbacks who complete the watertight defense. Both are excellent markers and defenders along with their ability on the ball. Also note that Gerets had Cristiano in his pocket in the previous draft and he has no problem in doing it again.
• Falcao controls the game from the middle of the pitch, putting in quality quick and decisive transitions into play. Combined with Passarella and Ayala at the back, the out-ball will be incisive and deadly. He is partnered by Marcel Desailly who takes up the role of the defensive midfielder, shielding the defense brilliantly closing down all the space around that area and allowing the attacking players the freedom to run the game. He spent the peak of his career playing as a DM at Milan and he's absolutely phenomenal in that role, capable of shutting down any threat.
• Two deadly dribblers out wide who can take out a defense by themselves, with the creativity from the middle they will be played in with great opportunities to run at the defense and cause havoc.
• Zidane's creativity and penetration from the #10 spot in tandem with that of Falcao's making sure the attackers get the perfect amount of quality service without wasting any time.
• Finally, Batigol up front to smash these chances into the goal.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Good luck @Šjor Bepo @Invictus @Moby

 

[DVG7]

Scholes, De Bruyne and Voronin against Desailly, Falcao and Zidane? complete and utter mismatch.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Scholes, De Bruyne and Voronin against Desailly, Falcao and Zidane? complete and utter mismatch.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

good luck @Moby , team looks more stable with a proper destroyer in that midfield, still not sure if Desailly and Falcao can carry the front 4 that wont contribute much defensive wise.

Where we think we have the advantage:

• There is only one thing that we can all be sure of in this game, portuguese princess will score at least once
• In general the delivery from both in game and set pieces are a big strength of this team and as we know, tight games are often decided by a set-piece. De Bruyne delivery for both Seeler and Cristiano, both absolute GOATs when it comes to headers and there arent many better then De Bruyne when it comes to delivery. Fenomeno will win shit loads of fouls specially with his favorite centerback in Ayala being on the pitch.
• Workrate of the team, apart from the princess all are willing runners, Seeler specially which makes him a great fit for pretty much any GOAT forward.
• Voronin vs Zidane, while its not a individual battle nor a man marking job it does help to have a great defensive specialist in that zone that has proved himself against the players of similar quality(Eusebio). Think we are in better place to stop moby key players then he is to stop ours.
• Ferrara great record against Batistuta(ofc clubs where they played play the part but Ciro is a good fit for Batistuta), Fenomeno impressive performances against Desailly, Ayala

 

[Synco]

Nice to see that Ayala gets a run. Loved that player to bits when he played.

And Desailly may be the best possible answer to the Effenberg quarrels from last round.

 

[2mufc0]

Shame Moby's defence got broken up from the last game.

Cristiano will likely score here with those passers behind him but Dzajic vs Zambrotta looks an accident waiting to happen. I haven't watched much of Seeler, did he work the flanks?

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Shame Moby's defence got broken up from the last game.

Cristiano will likely score here with those passers behind him but Dzajic vs Zambrotta looks an accident waiting to happen. I haven't watched much of Seeler, did he work the flanks?

Yeah, Dzajic vs Zambrotta is a threat though he was a good defender, WC player in his time so its not Dzajic is facing some average scrub but granted, we accept its a good route for moby. Given Camacho offers very little offensive wise, Desailly is on the left side of midfield and offers feck all offensive wise it allows De Bruyne a bit of freedom to help congest areas around Dzajic and Zidane(it helps also Zizou loved to drift towards left).

Seeler played on the right wing for Germany when Muller was up front, did it brilliantly. You have lots of footage in the match compilation thread if you interested or need proof, dont want to bomb the thread with videos, saving that for Fenomeno vs Ayala
One of the reasons we went for Seeler is that he could also cover defensive wise for Garrincha at the time.

 

[Synco]

@Šjor Bepo @Invictus
Can you say a bit more about the way you plan to occupy the right wing? Formation suggests some scheme involving Seeler, L. Ronaldo, and I guess De Bruyne, Zambrotta. How will they interact?

@Moby
How do you expect your central defense to fare against the aerial threat of Cristiano / Seeler? I have Passarella down as similar to Seeler - quite short, but a monstrous leap. What do you expect from Ayala (1.77m) in that regard? (As much as I admired that player, I don't remember this aspect well. Wiki says aerial duels were a strength, but it's not a prime source.)

 

[Moby]

Good luck @Šjor Bepo . Just a few points here:

- Dzajic vs Zambrotta in a 1v1 match up is bound to be a huge advantage for my side. With little defensive help from anyone else on that flank, he is up against one of the greatest dribblers of all time who generally had to be double marked to have any chance of stopping him. He will create massive in-roads from that side.

- My team looks set to dominate the midfield battle here. Desailly and Falcao are two tremendous presence in the middle of the pitch, and especially Falcao who is not only the best midfielder on the pitch when it comes to ability on the ball as a playmaker, but also has far better workrate and defensive ability compared to Scholes. With Voronin having to give a lot of his attention to Zidane, Desailly and Falcao will overrun Scholes and KDB when we are on the ball. Can't see anyone stopping Falcao defensively there.

- I also have the best defender on the pitch in Passarella, whose leadership and organisation will play a huge part in terms of marshalling that unit for 90 minutes. Your attack is obviously gonna score, but with someone like him leading a unit of what are all quality defense first players, he will be able to run a tight ship for a lot of the game and limit the damage to something we can overcome on the other side of the pitch - especially with the freedom that Falcao and Dzajic - two of the most dangerous players on the pitch will enjoy.

Overall I think the mismatch for the two players mentioned above is bigger than anything else on the pitch and should be something that should decide this game more often than not.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

@Šjor Bepo @Invictus
Can you say a bit more about the way you plan to occupy the right wing? Formation suggests some scheme involving Seeler, L. Ronaldo, and I guess De Bruyne, Zambrotta too. How will they interact?

Fenomeno has a free role like he had at Inter, will move all over the place so when he isnt on the right Seeler will move there if needed as most of the time Zambrotta in a balanced role and De Bruyne should be enough.

 

[Moby]

How do you expect your central defense to fare against the aerial threat of Cristiano / Seeler? I have Passarella down as similar to Seeler - quite short, but a monstrous leap. What do you expect from Ayala (1.77m) in that regard? (As much as I admired that player, I don't remember this aspect well. Wiki says aerial duels were a strength, but it's not a prime source.)

Ayala was excellent in the air, not just in terms of the leap but also he had excellent reading of the game which allowed him to usually get to the crosses before the attacker and clear the danger. In terms of a physical battle he will enjoy that and was always up for contesting aerial duels - that is pretty much one of his main strengths.

That defense would anyday prefer the balls coming in the air and would be happy to defend them. Ayala also scored against Germany in the 06 WC from a header, no? :P

 

[Himannv]

I actually expected a 4-4-2 here with de Bruyne playing wide right, Scholes and Voronin as CMs and CR7 playing on the left. Seeler and R9 up front, but Seeler closer to CR7 so that he can also create space when CR7 decides he wants to play more centrally. The current setup is harder to visualize, especially the dynamic between R9 and CR7.

 

[2mufc0]

@Šjor Bepo @Invictus
Can you say a bit more about the way you plan to occupy the right wing? Formation suggests some scheme involving Seeler, L. Ronaldo, and I guess De Bruyne, Zambrotta. How will they interact?

@Moby
How do you expect your central defense to fare against the aerial threat of Cristiano / Seeler? I have Passarella down as similar to Seeler - quite short, but a monstrous leap. What do you expect from Ayala (1.77m) in that regard? (As much as I admired that player, I don't remember this aspect well. Wiki says aerial duels were a strength, but it's not a prime source.)

From what i recall he was pretty physical and decent in the air.

 

[Moby]

Time to give some love to one of the greatest defenders of all time - who is both metaphorically and literally head and shoulders above the rest on the pitch here.

Passarella was born in Chacabuco, Buenos Aires Province. He started his career at Sarmiento of Junin, Buenos Aires province. From there he joined River Plate, where he became one of the best Argentinian defenders of his period, and started to be chosen in the Argentinian national team.

After his good performances in the world cup, in 1982 he joined Fiorentina of Italy, where he scored the goal record for a defender in one season (11 in 1986) in the Italian Serie A; his record remained until 2001, when he was beaten by Marco Materazzi.

In 1986, he joined Internazionale, where he ended his Italian playing career in 1988. After his successful spell in the Serie A, he returned to River Plate, where he played until his retirement.

He was called "El Gran Capitán" (the Great Captain, nickname of Argentine independence hero José de San Martín),"El Kaiser" (an allusion to Franz Beckenbauer) or "El Caudillo" (the Chief) because of his leadership ability, his passion, and his organisational prowess on the field. He was a defender who often joined the attack, and helped generate and finish offensive plays. He was the top scoring defender, with 134 goals in 451 matches, a record since broken by Dutch defender Ronald Koeman.

His aerial game was effective both defensively and in attack. He scored frequent headers in spite of his average height (1.73 m). He was an excellent free kick and penalty shooter. He was also noted for using his elbows against rivals whilst managing to avoid the referee's gaze. Passarella and Chilean Elías Figueroa are considered the best defenders in the history of South America.

One of the pillars of the Argentine national team, he eventually captained the side during the 1978 World Cup held in Argentina. He was the first Argentine player to hold the World Cup, as it was handed to him first when Argentina won the final. During the qualifying rounds of the 1986 World Cup, Passarella contributed to the goal which ensured Argentina's qualification in the final minutes of their match against Peru by allowing teammate Ricardo Gareca to score.

A bout of enterocolitis meant that he missed the 1986 World Cup in Mexico. He was replaced in the first team by defender José Luis Brown. Passarella had a fractious relationship with captain Diego Maradona and coach Carlos Bilardo during the tournament; he later claimed Bilardo and Maradona made sure that he was sidelined. Even so, by being a part of the squad, he became the only player to feature in both Argentina's World Cup-winning teams.

Prior to his departure from the 1986 squad, it was revealed by Maradona that Passarella, while playing for Fiorentina, would go to Monaco to carry on an affair with the wife of another player, then boast about it in the changing rooms.

 

[2mufc0]

Yeah, Dzajic vs Zambrotta is a threat though he was a good defender, WC player in his time so its not Dzajic is facing some average scrub but granted, we accept its a good route for moby. Given Camacho offers very little offensive wise, Desailly is on the left side of midfield and offers feck all offensive wise it allows De Bruyne a bit of freedom to help congest areas around Dzajic and Zidane(it helps also Zizou loved to drift towards left).

Seeler played on the right wing for Germany when Muller was up front, did it brilliantly. You have lots of footage in the match compilation thread if you interested or need proof, dont want to bomb the thread with videos, saving that for Fenomeno vs Ayala
One of the reasons we went for Seeler is that he could also cover defensive wise for Garrincha at the time.

Might sound strange for an Italian but i rate Zambrotta's attacking abilities more than his defensive, he's not a poor player by any means and I've picked him quite a few times, he's just not as tight in the defensive phase, something you need against this winger.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Good luck @Šjor Bepo- My team looks set to dominate the midfield battle here. Desailly and Falcao are two tremendous presence in the middle of the pitch, and especially Falcao who is not only the best midfielder on the pitch when it comes to ability on the ball as a playmaker, but also has far better workrate and defensive ability compared to Scholes. With Voronin having to give a lot of his attention to Zidane, Desailly and Falcao will overrun Scholes and KDB when we are on the ball. Can't see anyone stopping Falcao defensively there.

Im honestly not sure you will, our team/midfield is also brilliant on the ball and that part of the game is just a part of what you need to dominate the pitch or a midfield battle. As a team im more confident in us winning the ball back which plays a huge part to the initial battle for dominance.
Saying that, even if we dont win the battle(expect an even share of the possession) team is quite comfortable on the counter. Scholes and Ronaldo shined in a counter-attacking setup, De Bruyne while playing in a different system has all the qualities to shine even more in a more direct setup, Fenomeno is Fenomeno.
To sum it up, dont expect us to lose the battle but in the same time if we need to defend more and exploit counters we down for that.

- I also have the best defender on the pitch in Passarella, whose leadership and organisation will play a huge part in terms of marshalling that unit for 90 minutes. Your attack is obviously gonna score, but with someone like him leading a unit of what are all quality defense first players, he will be able to run a tight ship for a lot of the game and limit the damage to something we can overcome on the other side of the pitch - especially with the freedom that Falcao and Dzajic - two of the most dangerous players on the pitch will enjoy.

Overall I think the mismatch for the two players mentioned above is bigger than anything else on the pitch and should be something that should decide this game more often than not.

True, Passarella is the best defender but im not sure how he matches against two Ronaldos. I just dont know enough but from what i read he wasnt really a Thuram/Maldini type that would have a chance against peak Fenomeno(lets not forget what he did to Nesta who is a even better defender then Passarella) and even if he has a huge leap that could only work against Seeler as he is short as well, imagine Ronaldo in the air against midget Passarella, would be a slaughterhouse.


So not really sure your two players will have the biggest impact as both Ronaldo's will have their say given the fact both are liking their particular matchups and in your defensive case those matchups will happen as you dont have attackers that are willing to defend.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

For me Voronin and Vasovic make this midfield battle anything but one sided despite the absolute Goat's on the other side. Voronin provides the cultured presence alongside Scholes/KdB and you could see them starve the more direct opposition midfield off the ball for long durations. No pressers in the opposition front 4 also mean Vasovic will have an excellent influence on the midfield battle.

Don't think Passarella will get to be that involved in the midfield battle considering Fenomeno and CR will rip them on the counters if space is left.

On the other hand, Dzajic against Zambrotta also has at least 1 goal in it. Voronin also might be a bit overworked off the ball against Zizou and Falcao. I know Scholes' case has been made by Sjor often but I have seen him all my life to say his defensive contribution won't be anywhere as good as required against Zizou and Falcao.

I do think Moby missed a trick by going for Ayala in the reinforcements. I don't know who was available, but I'd have started Desailly alongside Passarella with a DM picked instead of Ayala.

 

[Moby]

As a team im more confident in us winning the ball back which plays a huge part to the initial battle for dominance.

That's the area I think you will fail to implement as well as it is required here. KDB is a hard working player, but he often has moments of getting absolutely rinsed when facing skillful players and isn't someone who can put hard stops in 1v1 duels. At City in Pep's system the whole team presses and generally compresses the space all over the pitch to win possession, I don't see that being possible here which will expose his defensive game massively.

In terms of overall body of work he is not upto the level of the rest of the midfielders here, tbh. Nothing to take away from what he has done, but with not much to show in CL and having a few bad outings in big games (along with some really good ones as well), him being up against the combination of Zidane and Falcao will be a mismatch here for sure, especially when we have the ball and he is up against it defensively. Expect Falcao to have a great game here and run the show in midfield.

 

[Synco]

Ayala was excellent in the air, not just in terms of the leap but also he had excellent reading of the game which allowed him to usually get to the crosses before the attacker and clear the danger. In terms of a physical battle he will enjoy that and was always up for contesting aerial duels - that is pretty much one of his main strengths.

That defense would anyday prefer the balls coming in the air and would be happy to defend them. Ayala also scored against Germany in the 06 WC from a header, no? :P

He did, but scoring against Klose is still different to defending against Cristiano

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

The current setup is harder to visualize, especially the dynamic between R9 and CR7.

I actually think it has a lot of similarities with CR-Benzema.

Ronaldo was also known for his selfless game very often and I'd think he'd bring CR a lot into the game in the final third like Benzema did.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

On the other hand, Dzajic against Zambrotta also has at least 1 goal in it. Voronin also might be a bit overworked off the ball against Zizou and Falcao. I know Scholes' case has been made by Sjor often but I have seen him all my life to say his defensive contribution won't be anywhere as good as required against Zizou and Falcao.

Scholes produced a masterpiece at Nou Camp in a midfield two against the likes of Xavi, Deco and Iniesta. Guy played in a midfield two at highest level for majority of his career yet is always questioned for his defensive game yet players that play in midfield three for majority of their careers get fecking credit for being defensively sound. Last part has nothing to do with moby team, just a general rant and for those players you can include De Bruyne as well.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

I actually expected a 4-4-2 here with de Bruyne playing wide right, Scholes and Voronin as CMs and CR7 playing on the left. Seeler and R9 up front, but Seeler closer to CR7 so that he can also create space when CR7 decides he wants to play more centrally. The current setup is harder to visualize, especially the dynamic between R9 and CR7.

We thought about it but wanted to keep the midfield three because of Zidane. Fenomeno will play all over the pitch, Seeler will provide balance as he always did for the national team while we use the "old" version of Cristiano, clutch phenomenon that matured, stoped doing silly flicks and tricks, stopped shooting from 35+ meters and focused on what he was actually great at - movement in the final third, intensity in the same movement and finishing.

 

[2mufc0]

De Bruyne has stepped up a level defensively this year imo, I've watched almost all their games and surprised not only with his work rate but showing strength and tackling skill, on top of that after he wins the ball he's great at going on a run or picking out a dangerous pass to start the counter. Also, when he does lose the ball he busts a gut to get it back, i think he's brilliant in all facets and rate him as the best in the world atm so i am biased so can understand if everyone does not agree.

 

[Moby]

Also having Desailly in midfield alongside Falcao means I will have a monstrous defensive midfield presence, and a player like Cristiano who relies on constant service can be starved from that here. Both Falcao and Desailly especially will put in huge shifts off the ball, and should be able to curb the amount of outball that can be provided to that attack.

Having Desailly to shield that defense will plug in any spaces between the lines that someone like KDB usually likes to exploit, and that is a critical zone for team Sjor. If they cannot get the ball often in that area, that would isolate that attack and reduce the danger they can cause in here.

That is in addition to the fact that I expect my midfield to dominate possession and have majority of the ball in the middle of the park without much resistance. Sure we can still expect one of the counters to be executed correctly but over the course of 90 minutes, having someone as assured and defensively rock solid as Desailly there is a massive bonus in terms of shutting down the opposition creative engine.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Scholes produced a masterpiece at Nou Camp in a midfield two against the likes of Xavi, Deco and Iniesta

Yea, that is exaggeration. It wasn't a midfield two. Park was on the pitch as well. Rooney almost played as deep as the midfielders. Tevez worked his ass off.

 

[Moby]

De Bruyne has stepped up a level defensively this year imo, I've watched almost all their games and surprised not only with his work rate but showing strength and tackling skill, on top of that after he wins the ball he's great at going on a run or picking out a dangerous pass to start the counter. Also, when he does lose the ball he busts a gut to get it back, i think he's brilliant in all facets and rate him as the best in the world atm so i am biased so can understand if everyone does not agree.

Absolutely, and I have massive respect for him and think he's absolutely fantastic and among the best players in the world. My only contention is that he is against Falcao here, who is one of the greatest playmakers the game has seen, as well as one of the most skillful and trickiest midfielders who absolutely rinsed opponents (in the brutal 80's Serie A no less which was littered with absolute thugs with little protection from referees) and was a master at using quick interplay and creative passing to cut through the defense. To curb someone like him you need an absolute juggernaut defensive presence (someone in the league of Matthaus, Davids, etc). KDB is not bad by any means but he's up against the best in here, so that's where I have to argue that it gives me a good advantage going forward and I expect Falcao to take that battle home.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

That's the area I think you will fail to implement as well as it is required here. KDB is a hard working player, but he often has moments of getting absolutely rinsed when facing skillful players and isn't someone who can put hard stops in 1v1 duels. At City in Pep's system the whole team presses and generally compresses the space all over the pitch to win possession, I don't see that being possible here which will expose his defensive game massively.

In terms of overall body of work he is not upto the level of the rest of the midfielders here, tbh. Nothing to take away from what he has done, but with not much to show in CL and having a few bad outings in big games (along with some really good ones as well), him being up against the combination of Zidane and Falcao will be a mismatch here for sure, especially when we have the ball and he is up against it defensively. Expect Falcao to have a great game here and run the show in midfield.

He isnt man marking anyone, he is there to provide help and as you said in your last draft final - he is the type of player that never stops running.
Disagree on Falcao, not that he wont have a great game but so will Scholes. As i said, expect an even match in terms of dominance.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Yea, that is exaggeration. It wasn't a midfield two. Park was on the pitch as well. Rooney almost played as deep as the midfielders. Tevez worked his ass off.

Griezmann and who ever his partner was up at Atletico worked their socks of yet they always played 442, i honestly dont know what kind of point that is, strikers working hard....Park i acknowledge and at times they were switching to 433 but more often then not it was a classic case of defending deep in a two banks of four.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Griezmann and who ever his partner was up at Atletico worked their socks of yet they always played 442, i honestly dont know what kind of point that is, strikers working hard....Park i acknowledge and at times they were switching to 433 but more often then not it was a classic case of defending deep in a two banks of four.

Point being Park offers a lot more off the ball than KdB against the players at the highest level and Rooney/Tevez offer a lot more than Fenomeno/Seeler. So Scholes doesn't have the level of support here that he had there. I'd laud the system there against Barcelona, not Scholes' defensive presence.

And two bank of four is not exactly a midfield two. That's be like saying Pirlo won the WC from a midfield two

 

[Moby]

He isnt man marking anyone, he is there to provide help and as you said in your last draft final - he is the type of player that never stops running.
Disagree on Falcao, not that he wont have a great game but so will Scholes. As i said, expect an even match in terms of dominance.

I would say having a ball winner like Desailly as well as Falcao was a proper box to box player, we have a better defensive midfield here which is set to cut off the service to that front three. If we were facing a proper #10 then it would have been different but against a #8 and a DLP Scholes, it completely plays into their zone and like I mentioned, your final third passer in KDB will have a mountain to climb against someone like Desailly who is not only a physical juggernaut but also a fantastic reader of the game and should be able to cut off the final ball which is critical for your attack to function.

 

[Synco]

Seeler played on the right wing for Germany when Muller was up front, did it brilliantly.

Seeler played in a wide-range CAM role behind Müller in 1970. RW was occupied by Libuda or Grabowski (and maybe someone else I've forgotten, Germany had truckloads of wingers back then).

As I see it, you have three attackers who all were at their best in some sort of free role. That means they occupied different position over a game, yes - but I'm not sure the result of playing them together is a situation were all positions are reliably covered as they should.

Maybe a primary balance player instead of one of them would have been better for the team shape. Someone whose main task is to react to the alphas and their movement, which in turn frees up the main players as well. Seeler was an exemplary teamplayer, so he's the natural fit there, but I'm not sure that's really the answer.

 

[2mufc0]

Absolutely, and I have massive respect for him and think he's absolutely fantastic and among the best players in the world. My only contention is that he is against Falcao here, who is one of the greatest playmakers the game has seen, as well as one of the most skillful and trickiest midfielders who absolutely rinsed opponents (in the brutal 80's Serie A no less which was littered with absolute thugs with little protection from referees) and was a master at using quick interplay and creative passing to cut through the defense. To curb someone like him you need an absolute juggernaut defensive presence (someone in the league of Matthaus, Davids, etc). KDB is not bad by any means but he's up against the best in here, so that's where I have to argue that it gives me a good advantage going forward and I expect Falcao to take that battle home.

I love Falcao just look how i rated him in the play makers list! And i agree he is a threat imo the best CM on the pitch, but you've placed him as RCM so he won't be directly up against Kevin most of the game. Although your point still stands vs Scholes, i don't think KDB is a weakness at all here.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

As I see it, you have three attackers who all were at their best in some sort of free role. That means they occupied different position over a game, yes - but I'm not sure the result of playing them together is a situation were positions are reliably covered as they should.

Maybe a primary balance player instead of one of them would have been better for the team shape. Someone whose main task is to react to the alphas and their movement. Which in turn frees up the main players as well. Seeler was an exemplary teamplayer, so he's the natural fit there, but I'm not sure that's really the answer

I thought it had Ronaldo-Tevez-Rooney all over it. Loved it at first sight

 

[Šjor Bepo]

@Himannv

I dont see any similarities between this animal and old goalscoring machine Cristiano.

Fenomeno vs Desailly

Spoiler: France

Spoiler: vs Milan(home)

Spoiler: vs Milan(away)

Fenomeno vs Ayala

Spoiler: vs Argentina

Spoiler: even the Fat One was killing him.

 

[Synco]

I thought it had Ronaldo-Tevez-Rooney all over it. Loved it at first sight

Counting Seeler as ~Rooney, I can't really see the Tevez part - but I'm open for unusual (and therefore perhaps brilliant) setups in these draft games, so I'm gonna follow the discussion.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Point being Park offers a lot more off the ball than KdB against the players at the highest level and Rooney/Tevez offer a lot more than Fenomeno/Seeler. So Scholes doesn't have the level of support here that he had there. I'd laud the system there against Barcelona, not Scholes' defensive presence.

And two bank of four is not exactly a midfield two. That's be like saying Pirlo won the WC from a midfield two

Well, Scholes is here in a classic midfield three and while my attackers dont offer as much as Rooney/Tevez they dont need to because moby's "front four" offers very little. He isnt facing that Barca team here, they were just used as an example of him putting a great defensive display individually against a top tier of midfielders.

 

[Moby]

I love Falcao just look how i rated him in the play makers list! And i agree he is a threat imo the best CM on the pitch, but you've placed him as RCM so he won't be directly up against Kevin most of the game. Although your point still stands vs Scholes, i don't think KDB is a weakness at all here.

In terms of the graphic, it's a matter of aesthetics that I have placed them like that. I actually first designed it to have Desailly in front of the defense as the shield, with Falcao in the middle as the conductor and Zidane ahead of him as the final ball player. Which is how I expect this midfield to function.

The point of that whole argument is that when we have the ball, we would have Falcao and Zidane playing it between them in the middle with Dzajic and Matthews waiting on the wings, hence Voronin would need serious help from the other two CMs. Which is why one of those CMs should have been a HEAVY defensive presence, not just a good one who does his job. You need two top top notch defenders in midfield to be able to protect your defense against a combo like that, and honestly with Voronin's primary attention being on Zidane, either one out of Scholes or KDB will not be able to contain Falcao for 90 minutes, that's my only point. Not saying they will get rinsed the whole game, but there will be a lot of times when Falcao will be able to get Zidane or one of the wingers free into a great attacking position or make those trademark forward runs breaking defensive lines and create opportunities. He has a great attacking cast in front of him to find enough holes in there and tilt the tide of the game.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

I would say having a ball winner like Desailly as well as Falcao was a proper box to box player, we have a better defensive midfield here which is set to cut off the service to that front three. If we were facing a proper #10 then it would have been different but against a #8 and a DLP Scholes, it completely plays into their zone and like I mentioned, your final third passer in KDB will have a mountain to climb against someone like Desailly who is not only a physical juggernaut but also a fantastic reader of the game and should be able to cut off the final ball which is critical for your attack to function.

Just like having a ball winner like Desailly will stop your midfield being as fluid in possession as you think they gonna be. Desailly will also have his hand full with Fenomeno who will roam all over, i have no doubts in my mind that De Bruyne will find his pockets to deliver his delivery.

 

[Jim Beam]

Prior to his departure from the 1986 squad, it was revealed by Maradona that Passarella, while playing for Fiorentina, would go to Monaco to carry on an affair with the wife of another player, then boast about it in the changing rooms.

This just might give an edge to moby in such a tight game.