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2021-22 Performances


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Jordan_mufc

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I still haven't seen a concrete explanation as to why Ronaldo is a problem for the club beyond hypothesising about potential effects on the ego of our other players. Is he responsible for Solskjaer suddenly shifting to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season (and consequently leaving our midfield completely exposed on every turnover of the ball)?

Is he responsible for our defenders failing to push up with the rest of the team and leaving our team with gaping holes for the opposition to play through when we press?

Is he responsible for the form of our most productive players in Rashford and Bruno falling off a cliff from before 2021 had even started?

Or maybe he's responsible for Maguire holding the ball for an eternity and waiting before the opposition is set before he makes a 5 yard pass?

The list goes on, but ultimately there's a number of way more pressing issues that this team has before we look at Ronaldo. He's absolutely not infallible. We've seen misplaced passes, poor touches and some all around sloppy moments, but the bottom line is he's by far our most productive performer this year... in a team that was already disjointed at best.

If you'd paid attention, the cracks in this team have been getting more and more apparent for the best part of 18 months, hence the 'Are we a poorly coached side' thread and many more. This was compounded by Solskjaer taking us on a suicide mission in moving us to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season and leaving us completely exposed. We all watched that Wolves game on GW3 in which they ran through us with alarming ease - by that point the damage was completely done with no Ronaldo in sight.

We're now aiming to look like a modern footballing team for the first time in over a decade. Of course there are going to be bumps in the road, but scapegoating our most productive player while we painstakingly work through a multitude of absolutely glaring issues that existed before his arrival feels so bizarre to me.
Fantastic post
 

Wolf1992

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He is complaining way too much, isn't he?

I know he has standards and can't stand playing with average teammates, but he is starting to sound a little bit whinny.

His teammates aren't gonna get any better just because he complains about them being mentally weak, they probably gonna turn on him for complaining too much.
 

Marwood

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I still haven't seen a concrete explanation as to why Ronaldo is a problem for the club beyond hypothesising about potential effects on the ego of our other players. Is he responsible for Solskjaer suddenly shifting to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season (and consequently leaving our midfield completely exposed on every turnover of the ball)?

Is he responsible for our defenders failing to push up with the rest of the team and leaving our team with gaping holes for the opposition to play through when we press?

Is he responsible for the form of our most productive players in Rashford and Bruno falling off a cliff from before 2021 had even started?

Or maybe he's responsible for Maguire holding the ball for an eternity and waiting before the opposition is set before he makes a 5 yard pass?

The list goes on, but ultimately there's a number of way more pressing issues that this team has before we look at Ronaldo. He's absolutely not infallible. We've seen misplaced passes, poor touches and some all around sloppy moments, but the bottom line is he's by far our most productive performer this year... in a team that was already disjointed at best.

If you'd paid attention, the cracks in this team have been getting more and more apparent for the best part of 18 months, hence the 'Are we a poorly coached side' thread and many more. This was compounded by Solskjaer taking us on a suicide mission in moving us to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season and leaving us completely exposed. We all watched that Wolves game on GW3 in which they ran through us with alarming ease - by that point the damage was completely done with no Ronaldo in sight.

We're now aiming to look like a modern footballing team for the first time in over a decade. Of course there are going to be bumps in the road, but scapegoating our most productive player while we painstakingly work through a multitude of absolutely glaring issues that existed before his arrival feels so bizarre to me.
Yep totally agree.

I've tried to explain this by isolating the figures for the second half of last season. To show the form we're seeing now was well on its way Jan 2021 onwards.
 

Chesterlestreet

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But there’s a minority of posters with a load of posts between them that are every bit as tedious as the sheer fanboy/girls you so rightly call out. Not surprisingly, at least a couple of them are huge fanboy/girls of other players; it seems that these days you can’t adore one player without having to hate another who’s perceived as a “rival”. Social media has a lot to answer for.
Yep, that's true.

United fans being sentimental or overly protective of Ronaldo - that I can take, and even to a degree sympathize with (even if I personally think their fondness for Ronaldo may be slightly more than he deserves). But these fans who obsess over an individual player, who seemingly support him in the way I'd expect someone to support a team, i.e. unconditionally and with strong emotion...and similarly stand firmly against another individual player, in a way resembling how United fans (at least of my generation) regard Liverpool - no, that's just alien to me.

And, as you suggest - it's very tedious. Plus, it tends to ruin threads that might've otherwise been half-decent.
 

Revaulx

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Yep, that's true.

United fans being sentimental or overly protective of Ronaldo - that I can take, and even to a degree sympathize with (even if I personally think their fondness for Ronaldo may be slightly more than he deserves). But these fans who obsess over an individual player, who seemingly support him in the way I'd expect someone to support a team, i.e. unconditionally and with strong emotion...and similarly stand firmly against another individual player, in a way resembling how United fans (at least of my generation) regard Liverpool - no, that's just alien to me.

And, as you suggest - it's very tedious. Plus, it tends to ruin threads that might've otherwise been half-decent.
Absolutely!
 

clarkydaz

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Man's been spitting factos all day long. Came back to find a squad filled with entitled, coddled, whiny, pathetic losers. He is one of the very few with actual "United DNA" in him.
Whether Ronaldo returning has been a good thing or bad thing on the pitch, he has shone the light on the state of things behind the scenes in a matter of months, which i am grateful for. The club only acts when it gets found out
 

Chesterlestreet

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Whether Ronaldo returning has been a good thing or bad thing on the pitch, he has shone the light on the state of things behind the scenes in a matter of months, which i am grateful for. The club only acts when it gets found out
Yes.

If Ronaldo's comments (I don't know if the part about players not hitting the gym after/before training sessions is genuine - but the published interview itself is arguably enough, viz. the comments on younger players and their attitude towards taking advice from seasoned professionals) can highlight a discrepancy between his own standards and whatever goes on at United - then brilliant, yes, absolutely.

You can say what you want about Ronaldo, but he is the antithesis of laziness and groundless entitlement in terms of individual commitment.

Can our younger players (or all our players, for that matter) learn something from him? Of course they can. And they should jump at the chance to do so.
 

genardk

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He is complaining way too much, isn't he?

I know he has standards and can't stand playing with average teammates, but he is starting to sound a little bit whinny.

His teammates aren't gonna get any better just because he complains about them being mentally weak, they probably gonna turn on him for complaining too much.
I feel he is in the damage control mode after his meeting with Mendes as his legacy to an extent is at stake.
 

UnitedSofa

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He is complaining way too much, isn't he?

I know he has standards and can't stand playing with average teammates, but he is starting to sound a little bit whinny.

His teammates aren't gonna get any better just because he complains about them being mentally weak, they probably gonna turn on him for complaining too much.
I feel he is in the damage control mode after his meeting with Mendes as his legacy to an extent is at stake.
Goodness gracious me, what on earth have I just read
 

genardk

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Goodness gracious me, what on earth have I just read
It is all over the press that he held "crisis talks" with Mendes couple of days ago as he was quite unhappy and right after you have this interview, press statements on team culture, mentality etc., I do not think that this is a coincidence especially if you consider the fact that image is almost everything for Ronaldo.
 

Berbasbullet

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I feel he is in the damage control mode after his meeting with Mendes as his legacy to an extent is at stake.
Only by morons on an Internet forum. Anyone sensible will realise he’s 36 going on 37 and anything from now is a bonus. Same applies to Messi to an extent.
 

bakalhau

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Goodness gracious me, what on earth have I just read
Hundreds, thousands of posts on the Cafe every week mentioning how what's going on isn't good enough for Utd's standards, how the club needs to be figthing for league titles, how the upper management cares more about money than the club improving, then Ronaldo aligns himself with every die hard fan's point of view in an interview and "he's complaining way too much" :lol: Makes sense, right? Logic is through the roof here.

I don't know what you guys want, if you don't want someone coming here to give it his all every day, get criticised for not pressing and listening and actually showing improvements in as little as 2 weeks, like a goddamn good professional should, if you don't want someone that isn't happy to come back to the club and see it 3 or 4 levels below where it was on his first stay here and try to fight against it, improve the mentality, the drive, the work rate, the training rate, then call the CEO and ask to fire Ronaldo, and bring another player in like Pogba.

As far as I'm concerned, I would like to have more players with an ounce of Ronaldo's passion, drive, and willingness to give his all for the club, regardless of playing badly or not. But that's just me. The dude wants to see Manchester United exactly where I want, too. As far as I'm concerned, I want a player giving it his all for the club, not taking a vacation or zombiing day in, day out until his contract runs out.

I guess we all have different priorities and views for our club.
 

genardk

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Only by morons on an Internet forum. Anyone sensible will realise he’s 36 going on 37 and anything from now is a bonus. Same applies to Messi to an extent.
Not if he and his fans call his every transfer move a challenge with too ambitious statements like "going back to PL to reconquer the best league in the world". There would be tons of criticisms if that does not happen, so nothing surprising. I think at his age, it is more important to keep a low-key profile to protect his image.
 

Red Shorts

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Since when does demanding the team adopt a winning mentality and work harder equate to whining and complaining in an interview?

We all know Ronaldo's not a pressing forward, and showed that for most of the season so far. What happened when RR came in? His pressing stats increased quite significantly in comparison to the Ole reign. I'd say he is one of the few that looks to be working on the coach's ideas and philosophies.

The guy is one of the most professional athletes in the sports, has more silverware than I have in my kitchen drawer, and has been one of the hardest working players off the pitch for near 2 decades. His interview very much sounds like the younger players know best, and not looking to experienced players like himself to understand how to succeed (except Rashford, who apparently has been asking how hench Ronaldo was at his age...).

Him being in the dressing room would be like Musk or Bezos sitting in an office with you when you are trying to start your own business. You listen and take in every word the wise owls say.
 

Relevated

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Since when does demanding the team adopt a winning mentality and work harder equate to whining and complaining in an interview?

We all know Ronaldo's not a pressing forward, and showed that for most of the season so far. What happened when RR came in? His pressing stats increased quite significantly in comparison to the Ole reign. I'd say he is one of the few that looks to be working on the coach's ideas and philosophies.

The guy is one of the most professional athletes in the sports, has more silverware than I have in my kitchen drawer, and has been one of the hardest working players off the pitch for near 2 decades. His interview very much sounds like the younger players know best, and not looking to experienced players like himself to understand how to succeed (except Rashford, who apparently has been asking how hench Ronaldo was at his age...).

Him being in the dressing room would be like Musk or Bezos sitting in an office with you when you are trying to start your own business. You listen and take in every word the wise owls say.
You either take in what they say and change, or you eventually poison them with your own venom, or you kick em out and dodge accountability for a while longer.

I think our players prefer option 3.
 

Red Shorts

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You either take in what they say and change, or you eventually poison them with your own venom, or you kick em out and dodge accountability for a while longer.

I think our players prefer option 3.
You only get one , short career as a footballer, and more rarely so have someone in the dressing room/on the pitch & training ground that has done more than any of those players could dream of sniffing at.

Amazing if our players think they know best and wont take accountability individually.
 

Acheron

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The dispute on here mainly goes on between posters who feel that a past-his-prime Ronaldo is a potential problem given how he's being utilized - and posters who seemingly can't fathom why anyone would question him in the slightest.
Well if that's the case I still think the take shouldn't be that either. He shouldn't be playing every single game but if he's utilized so much then I think that's a symptom of the team not being good enough. Like a top team shouldn't be relying on him that much and ideally he's someone to give you the edge on a final or important ties in the UCL. Clearly Manchester United isn't in a position like PSG or Manchester City were they can rotate their star players throughout the season but he still chose to come to Manchester United.

It's very apparent there wasn't much thought behind his signing, like where and how he would fit into the team, but the lack of style was a problem prior to his arrival. Anyway that's now the problem of Ralf Rangnick and in the context of Ronaldo as an individual I think he has done ok, to be honest I was expecting him to do worse; but the team as a whole isn't performing like they should. So yeah, he might be the problem and what's holding back the team but from my perspective that isn't the case. Hope the team can turn it around though.
 

Acheron

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True, but I also think the redcafe fan base is probably no different to most other big clubs (or normal club) online fanbases. You'll have the extreme few in either side and then the majority somewhere in the middle not screaming and shouting.
Yeah, the fan base should be something similar specially with the bigger and most popular clubs and Ronaldo in particular he's a very divisive figure. I think there are fair concerns about being against building a team around Ronaldo at this stage of his career but I think he brings a lot of experience, a competitive mindset and a top work ethic, so in that sense he should be a positive influence.
 

Greck

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I think some things can be true at once.
-Ronaldo isn't the problem so far. Our attack had been crap for a while before he came. We do however have issues regarding how to fix it moving forward.
-Ronaldo probably shouldn't start every game (especially if he turns out not to be our best in the lone striker role).
-our tactics shouldn't be built around him.

Woah, how did I do that? 3 opinions that aren't exclusive stacking side by side, Greck for United CEO. But seriously this isn't Madrid Ronaldo, this one mistimes kicks maybe showing declined reaction time and his scoring prowess no longer justifies the drawbacks (to being built around).
 
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Bebestation

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Been thinking about Lukaku and his first touch during the City match and it got me thinking -

How many games has Ronaldo scored against the top clubs so far this season?
 

steffyr2

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Been thinking about Lukaku and his first touch during the City match and it got me thinking -

How many games has Ronaldo scored against the top clubs so far this season?
Give me a hint...what do you consider the 'top teams'. 1 thru 4, 1 thru 6?

Man City just beat Chelsea 1-0, not many goals there. Why, do you think?
 

bakalhau

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Been thinking about Lukaku and his first touch during the City match and it got me thinking -

How many games has Ronaldo scored against the top clubs so far this season?

He "has" a nice one against Liverpool where he ditched the 2 defenders with quick footwork, but it was offside by an inch. Only glimmer of hope in that game too, best not think about it or we all get PTSD. :lol:

How many goals do any of our players have agains top 6 teams? Ronaldo has 2 I think, against Arsenal.
 

RepardReece

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I think some things can be true at once.
-Ronaldo isn't the problem so far. Our attack had been crap for a while before he came. We do however have issues regarding how to fix it moving forward.
-Ronaldo probably shouldn't start every game (especially if he turns out not to be our best in the lone striker role).
-our tactics shouldn't be built around him.

Woah, how did I do that? 3 opinions that aren't exclusive stacking side by side, Greck for United CEO. But seriously this isn't Madrid Ronaldo, this one mistimes kicks maybe showing declined reaction time and his scoring prowess no longer justifies the drawbacks (to being built around).
/Endthread
 

acnumber9

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Been thinking about Lukaku and his first touch during the City match and it got me thinking -

How many games has Ronaldo scored against the top clubs so far this season?
Who counts as the top clubs? He’s scored 4 goals in 5 starts against the current top 6. Lukaku has scored 5 league goals all season. 1 against the other 6 teams in the top 7.
 

Acheron

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I still haven't seen a concrete explanation as to why Ronaldo is a problem for the club beyond hypothesising about potential effects on the ego of our other players. Is he responsible for Solskjaer suddenly shifting to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season (and consequently leaving our midfield completely exposed on every turnover of the ball)?

Is he responsible for our defenders failing to push up with the rest of the team and leaving our team with gaping holes for the opposition to play through when we press?

Is he responsible for the form of our most productive players in Rashford and Bruno falling off a cliff from before 2021 had even started?

Or maybe he's responsible for Maguire holding the ball for an eternity and waiting before the opposition is set before he makes a 5 yard pass?

The list goes on, but ultimately there's a number of way more pressing issues that this team has before we look at Ronaldo. He's absolutely not infallible. We've seen misplaced passes, poor touches and some all around sloppy moments, but the bottom line is he's by far our most productive performer this year... in a team that was already disjointed at best.

If you'd paid attention, the cracks in this team have been getting more and more apparent for the best part of 18 months, hence the 'Are we a poorly coached side' thread and many more. This was compounded by Solskjaer taking us on a suicide mission in moving us to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season and leaving us completely exposed. We all watched that Wolves game on GW3 in which they ran through us with alarming ease - by that point the damage was completely done with no Ronaldo in sight.

We're now aiming to look like a modern footballing team for the first time in over a decade. Of course there are going to be bumps in the road, but scapegoating our most productive player while we painstakingly work through a multitude of absolutely glaring issues that existed before his arrival feels so bizarre to me.
Well summarized and totally agree. He hasn't been starting this week so hopefully when he comes back he's going to be more energetic and super fired up.
 

RepardReece

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I still haven't seen a concrete explanation as to why Ronaldo is a problem for the club beyond hypothesising about potential effects on the ego of our other players. Is he responsible for Solskjaer suddenly shifting to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season (and consequently leaving our midfield completely exposed on every turnover of the ball)?

Is he responsible for our defenders failing to push up with the rest of the team and leaving our team with gaping holes for the opposition to play through when we press?

Is he responsible for the form of our most productive players in Rashford and Bruno falling off a cliff from before 2021 had even started?

Or maybe he's responsible for Maguire holding the ball for an eternity and waiting before the opposition is set before he makes a 5 yard pass?

The list goes on, but ultimately there's a number of way more pressing issues that this team has before we look at Ronaldo. He's absolutely not infallible. We've seen misplaced passes, poor touches and some all around sloppy moments, but the bottom line is he's by far our most productive performer this year... in a team that was already disjointed at best.

If you'd paid attention, the cracks in this team have been getting more and more apparent for the best part of 18 months, hence the 'Are we a poorly coached side' thread and many more. This was compounded by Solskjaer taking us on a suicide mission in moving us to a 4-2-4 at the start of the season and leaving us completely exposed. We all watched that Wolves game on GW3 in which they ran through us with alarming ease - by that point the damage was completely done with no Ronaldo in sight.

We're now aiming to look like a modern footballing team for the first time in over a decade. Of course there are going to be bumps in the road, but scapegoating our most productive player while we painstakingly work through a multitude of absolutely glaring issues that existed before his arrival feels so bizarre to me.
this is what i've been trying to say to many people in this thread all season long. They just don't get it.
 

SonyaCross493

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I'm calling it now.. We won't get Top 4 without Ronny going on a mad run of form.

He was right to call these bottlers out. Lack of steel and weak mentality in this squad.
 

Sandikan

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Dropping that bizarre 4-2-2-2 helped us, as that wasn't helping anything.
But the way we threw the lead away was really worrying.

Hope Ronaldo is back asap, as the last thing we need is him out for long.
 

SonyaCross493

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I hope Ronny is back ASAP we need him as I feel with Ronny in the match tonight we would've won that.. because when we was 2-0 up as Ronny on the break with 2-on-2 or 3-on-3 he is so clinical we would've gone 3-0 up and it's game over. Not saying Cavani isn't clinical but Ronny would've been busting his gut to get in the box (see Arsenal match at 2-0 for proof of that which is where the original injury Ronny now has might stem from and that late run as since that match he hasn't moved as freely) when Greenwood went through when it was 3-0 to either receive a pass or get a spillage by the keeper for a goal. Or to just provide another option to distract the defender or goalkeeper for another player to score.

Sports people.. What exactly is a Hip Flexor Injury (Rangnick said that's what he has) does it require surgery and what is the recovery time? I just put it in Google and says it can be upto 6 weeks.. :nervous: I hope that's wrong as that rules him out the Last 16 Champions League match against Atleti..
 
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RuudTom83

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It was funny how the commentators were criticising Ronaldo after the first and second goals. Yet at 2-2 he wasn’t mentioned.

Funny how Ronaldo is the problem only when United are winning without him…which is once in a blue moon.
 

TMDaines

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It was funny how the commentators were criticising Ronaldo after the first and second goals. Yet at 2-2 he wasn’t mentioned.

Funny how Ronaldo is the problem only when United are winning without him…which is once in a blue moon.
^^
 

AaronRedDevil

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Well at least Ronaldo doesn’t have to take the PL games seriously anymore. He’s not staying when United hit 6th or 7th. Now he can focus on the FA/CL games. He’s not as fit as he’d like to be so United should use him sparingly. Would be nice for him to leave with a trophy but it most likely won’t happen.
 

SonyaCross493

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It was funny how the commentators were criticising Ronaldo after the first and second goals. Yet at 2-2 he wasn’t mentioned.

Funny how Ronaldo is the problem only when United are winning without him…which is once in a blue moon.
Yeah I noticed that. Double standards. You can't have it both ways.

He can't be the problem when United are winning but he isn't the solution when United are not winning.. it should be equal or you say nothing at all.

not once did the commentator mention how sluggish/gassed Cavani was and how his movement wasn't there especially when Greenwood and Elanga was through on the counter attacks having shots on the goal. If that was Ronaldo he would be racing in the box to give another option or to sniff the danger and get a rebound shot goal off the keeper.

not Cavanis fault he's asked to start 3 games in a row with Ronny out he looks knackered.. Greenwood was extremely greedy and selfish too as per usual no end product. I honestly don't see what people see in Greenwood.
 
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SonyaCross493

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Ronaldo is turning into the forgotten man due to his injury. And not scoring the last few games.

the hope and excitement of his first few games was amazing. Even until the Arsenal game in December. Since that Arsenal game he's lost his mojo and needs to get it back. I don't know if it was an injury he was carrying since the Arsenal game (he was substituted with an injury) but after that Arsenal game he doesn't run as freely.

I hope Ronny can get his spark/mojo back. We need him in order to get top 4 and go deep in the CL. It's thanks to him we are even in the CL in the first place.