David Gill: We offered Pogba what he wanted (and other issues)

FromTheBench

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Well, he left us on June and on September was giving the kinds of performances that our proven players (Cleverley and Anderson) can only dream about. I doubt that during that summer his skills got improved that much.
Firstly he was never giving the kind of performances you are mentioning in September. He took time to adapt to Juve and came more into it in the 2nd half of that season only and that too in a system where others did running for him and a league more suited to him at the time and still his rough edges were visible. It was clear he was gonna leave us before May hence why he wasn't played close to that.

2ndly players at that age improve a lot over 1 year even. Januzaj was struggling against Burnley u18's in the Youth Cup december 2012 and getting a rollicking from SAF apparently, before he began asserting himself more in 2013 and ended the season as U21's main player after struggling there Initially.

By June/July on tour he was amongst our best players and few months down the line before even 1 year was up from December giving sort of performances Young, Nani or Valencia in current state could dream off using the same exaggerated logic.

Now let's assume Janzuaj had left in the summer blaming Sir Alex for not playing him in one end of season game last season where rubbish Young, Nani or Valencia played after the title was won or sm1 else out of position, would people be arguing the same ? I imagine some would but instead he got a big raise at United anyway and established himself as a breakthrough here.
 

032Devil

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Surely they mean we offered him what they perceived he wanted money wise. But what he wanted was a chance which he deserved over defenders playing in midfield regardless of age. Jesus Cesc was playing for Arsenal from 16.
Where did it get them? Good young player but they need more than that to really challenge for the Premiership.
 

MJJ

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"When Cesc Fàbregas was 18, 19, I would play him in a 4-4-2 with Patrick Vieira and I saw it did not work. Then I had the decision to make about letting Patrick go, because Gilberto Silva and Vieira worked, Fabregas and Silva worked, but I could not play Fàbregas and Vieira. But Fàbregas was 19 and if he did not play I knew he would want to go, so we risked destroying everything, all the work we had put into this player."
Thats the right way to bring a youngster that you have taken from another academy through.
 

Suedesi

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If Juve offered him a better deal, and Gill is quoted as saying that wasn't the case, then he must have been offered a guarantee of first team football which United couldn't do.

As you rightly say...shit happens.

Personally I think the lad was incredibly impatient and badly advised. But I'm speaking as a United fan and Pogba was obviously looking after himself which is fair enough.
Agreed. You can't underestimate the role of Raiola in this whole affair. He gets paid every time his client moves, not if he's settled and has a long contract at one club. Look at Zlatan, great player - but how many times has he moved? Don't be surprised if Pogba moves 3-4 times in his career, earning millions to Mino in the process.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Juve matched United's salary and offered him something on the side - like opened an offshore account as a signing bonus or some sweetener like that. And they will cash in if the right offer came in.

Personally, I think we should just let it go.
 

Mr. MUJAC

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Walter Crickmer started it all...
Wasnt park playing as an AM in that game though, with a man-marking job.

Its not about trusting though, its about giving him a chance. Most of us were expecting a transitional period that season so would have been happy rebuilding instead. If we hadnt won anything that season and bedded in morrison and pogba, I would have been happy.

You can say he wasnt ready but then you have to believe that he had a sudden growth in the three months of summer. Either the coaches of Juventus are that good or he was ready and just needed a chance ala cleverley and gibson.






http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/paul...d/3866/saison/2011/verein/9251/wettbewerb/GBR

Thats vastly different from what I remembered so had to go look. As that site shows there were large gaps in which he didnt play at all. Played only twice in august and september, once in october and twice in December. You cant really expect a youngster to shine when playing that sporadically.

I do agree that Morrison out shown pogba at academy level though.
Not sure where that site gets it's stats from but that isn't true.

July - 6 games (Curzon, Shrewsbury, Fleetwood, Edinburgh, Ayr, Tranmere) Started in 4 and was HT sub in other two
August - 8 games (Morecambe, Marseilles, New York Cosmos, Llanelli, Bangor, Arsenal, New Mills, Swansea) started in 4, sub in 2, missed 2
September - 4 games (Bury, Fulham, Rochdale, Norwich) started 3 and missed 1
October - 5 games (Birmingham, Bolton, Blackburn, Altrincham (F), Birmingham) started 4 and sub in 1
November - 4 games (Everton, Walsall, Wigan, Bolton) started all 4
December - 3 games (Sunderland, Liverpool, Blackburn) started all 3

That's 30 reserve games before Xmas!

So, he didn't play in two pre-season friendlies…one of which clashed with the Marseilles first team game.

In September he missed the MSC tie with Bury because he was playing v Fulham two days later and the Bury game was a very young team.

In October, November and December he played every game.

In addition, he featured in 3 League Cup games and also played for the France Youth team

So any notion of not playing games is totally incorrect. In fact he played in more games than nearly any other player.

He was given just as many chances as anyone else…but between September and December something happened. Everyone talks about the Blackburn game as the turning point, but I believe something was up earlier than that. My notes of the games say that he had poor match against Everton on the 3rd of November and in the game v Wigan on the 17th November he had a absolute stinker and was substituted.

In the first two LC ties he came on when we were 3-0 up and did ok. Nothing spectacular, and he certainly wasn't running the game or influencing it in any way. In the last game against Crystal Palace, he got 65 mins on the pitch and had an average game. The United Review noted that he "did himself no harm with a solid if unspectacular show in central midfield". We lost 1-2 to a Championship side and Pogba in his three games against lower league opposition (when we were already winning 3-0 and therefore no pressure) did ok.

So in summary. In his three first team games he was solid. No more no less. At the same time for the reserves he was very inconsistent. What possible evidence do people have for suggesting he should have been the No. 1 choice in a tough Premiership game against Blackburn. Certainly Pogba's performances up until that point didn't suggest it.

Our offer was a good one…the playing time is all smokescreen in my opinion and the facts don't back it up.

Fergie certainly did make a mistake in playing Rafael, but I think Pogba had already made his mind up long before that game.

Hindsight is 20:20. The lad is a cracking prospect and I'm sure he will become even better. Good luck to him.
 

JPRouve

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Not sure where that site gets it's stats from but that isn't true.

July - 6 games (Curzon, Shrewsbury, Fleetwood, Edinburgh, Ayr, Tranmere) Started in 4 and was HT sub in other two
August - 8 games (Morecambe, Marseilles, New York Cosmos, Llanelli, Bangor, Arsenal, New Mills, Swansea) started in 4, sub in 2, missed 2
September - 4 games (Bury, Fulham, Rochdale, Norwich) started 3 and missed 1
October - 5 games (Birmingham, Bolton, Blackburn, Altrincham (F), Birmingham) started 4 and sub in 1
November - 4 games (Everton, Walsall, Wigan, Bolton) started all 4
December - 3 games (Sunderland, Liverpool, Blackburn) started all 3

That's 30 reserve games before Xmas!

So, he didn't play in two pre-season friendlies…one of which clashed with the Marseilles first team game.

In September he missed the MSC tie with Bury because he was playing v Fulham two days later and the Bury game was a very young team.

In October, November and December he played every game.

In addition, he featured in 3 League Cup games and also played for the France Youth team

So any notion of not playing games is totally incorrect. In fact he played in more games than nearly any other player.

He was given just as many chances as anyone else…but between September and December something happened. Everyone talks about the Blackburn game as the turning point, but I believe something was up earlier than that. My notes of the games say that he had poor match against Everton on the 3rd of November and in the game v Wigan on the 17th November he had a absolute stinker and was substituted.

In the first two LC ties he came on when we were 3-0 up and did ok. Nothing spectacular, and he certainly wasn't running the game or influencing it in any way. In the last game against Crystal Palace, he got 65 mins on the pitch and had an average game. The United Review noted that he "did himself no harm with a solid if unspectacular show in central midfield". We lost 1-2 to a Championship side and Pogba in his three games against lower league opposition (when we were already winning 3-0 and therefore no pressure) did ok.

So in summary. In his three first team games he was solid. No more no less. At the same time for the reserves he was very inconsistent. What possible evidence do people have for suggesting he should have been the No. 1 choice in a tough Premiership game against Blackburn. Certainly Pogba's performances up until that point didn't suggest it.

Our offer was a good one…the playing time is all smokescreen in my opinion and the facts don't back it up.

Fergie certainly did make a mistake in playing Rafael, but I think Pogba had already made his mind up long before that game.

Hindsight is 20:20. The lad is a cracking prospect and I'm sure he will become even better. Good luck to him.
Mino Raiola came in.
 

Manucho the boss

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Meh, as long as he's with Riaola, I'll prefer if we don't go anywhere near him.
He's a football agent, it's his job to get his player the best deal possible. What do you think we pay Mendes in rainbows and lollipops?

We have the money, Pogba is one of the best around. Get it done.
 

elmo

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He's a football agent, it's his job to get his player the best deal possible. What do you think we pay Mendes in rainbows and lollipops?

We have the money, Pogba is one of the best around. Get it done.
Mendes actually gives a shit about his players careers instead of Rialo who wants them to move so he can move on to blackmailing another club.
 

Bojan11

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Mendes actually gives a shit about his players careers instead of Rialo who wants them to move so he can move on to blackmailing another club.
Then why did a lot of his clients move to Monaco?

A lot of them could have gone somewhere else. Let's not kid ourselves. Mendes is always after his biggest cheque.
 

alibaba

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Why do you guys keep hankering about Pogba this Pogba that. He's gone and that's that.
Let's move on, he's no more a Manchester United player. Talking about him and the past won't win us games or anything.
Let's just concentrate on our present squad and get behind the team..
The hell with Pogba as far as I am or most of us is concern he is history
 

elmo

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Then why did a lot of his clients move to Monaco?

A lot of them could have gone somewhere else. Let's not kid ourselves. Mendes is always after his biggest cheque.
Because realistically, the likes of Porto and Althetico Madrid would never even be able to afford his players and were being used as a place for them to showcase them before moving on to a club that could actually afford to buy them out from their third party owners.