David Gill: We offered Pogba what he wanted (and other issues)

[SirAF]

The Scandinavian supporter's club has conductet an interview with David Gill & I've, quickly, translated a few segments from it for you guys.

Why did you not offer Pogba what he wanted?

We did. We offered him a very good wage, as well as a very generous fee for his agent. I don't want to go into details, because it was a complex issue. However, what I can say is that we were very disappointed. Whenever a player is determinded to leave and his contract allows it there is nothing we can do about it.
I can assure you that we did not hold anything back, financially.

Will the Old Trafford name ever be sold?

It has never been up for discussion. Ed has also gone out and categorically denied it. I think that the name and history belongs to Manchester United. It is very important for us and it will not happen - that would be too much.

Was there any truth in the Cristiano Ronaldo rumours?

No. That was merely speculation, I was not in Madrid and I haven't been there for quite some time except for the away leg against Real last season.
Alex and Carlos (Queiroz) in particurlar knew Ronaldo's mentality more than anyone else and Carlos told us that we would not be able to hang onto Cristiano for his whole career. He was that type of player and person. We had to make sure that we got the best out of him on the pitch, as well as making sure that we had a contract that made sure that we would get a good price for him. Everyone here knew that he would go sooner rather than later - we envisioned that six or seven years from when we bought him would be realistic. He 's from southern-Europe and very connected to his family. So that was how we viewed it.

I remember an interview I did with Sky Sports right after the Moscow final and I was asked about Ronaldo. I mean we were about to celebrate winning the european cup.. But we were determinded to not let him go that summer. Alex and I, particurlarly Alex had long talks with him. We flew to Portugal and met him during the summer holiday and told him that he would not leave this summer. Obviously we realized that we could not keep a player forever who was not a 100 percent committed. At the other hand we did not clear cut tell him that "if you stay for another season then you can go" - but Ronaldo and Alex had a good relationship and if things worked out and Ronaldo did his job on the pitch, which he absolutely did that following season, then yeah - there was a mutual understanding that he could go.


Perhaps not very groundbreaking - but there you go.

 

[noodlehair]

Yeah. It just backs up Pogba's claim that he left because he didnt feel he was getting enough football...which it would be hard for United to deny when they were picking Park and Rafael in midfield over him.

The Ronaldo one is more interested because it goes directly against what Daniel Taylor claimed in an article near the start of the season, and Taylor's usually semi reliable...when he's not waffling on about Ravel Morrison.

 

[Sky1981]

The Scandinavian supporter's club has conductet an interview with David Gill & I've, quickly, translated a few segments from it for you guys.

Why did you not offer Pogba what he wanted?

We did. We offered him a very good wage, as well as a very generous fee for his agent. I don't want to go into details, because it was a complex issue. However, what I can say is that we were very disappointed. Whenever a player is determinded to leave and his contract allows it there is nothing we can do about it.
I can assure you that we did not hold anything back, financially.

It's just not working imo. One of the players that got away regardless. It's not like we're losing him blindly, he just chooses Juve at the end of the day

Will the Old Trafford name ever be sold?

It has never been up for discussion. Ed has also gone out and categorically denied it. I think that the name and history belongs to Manchester United. It is very important for us and it will not happen - that would be too much.

I hope not, we don't need to sell the naming rights (we're doing fine financially even with the debt)

Was there any truth in the Cristiano Ronaldo rumours?

No. That was merely speculation, I was not in Madrid and I haven't been there for quite some time except for the away leg against Real last season.
Alex and Carlos (Queiroz) in particurlar knew Ronaldo's mentality more than anyone else and Carlos told us that we would not be able to hang onto Cristiano for his whole career. He was that type of player and person. We had to make sure that we got the best out of him on the pitch, as well as making sure that we had a contract that made sure that we would get a good price for him. Everyone here knew that he would go sooner rather than later - we envisioned that six or seven years from when we bought him would be realistic. He 's from southern-Europe and very connected to his family. So that was how we viewed it.

I remember an interview I did with Sky Sports right after the Moscow final and I was asked about Ronaldo. I mean we were about to celebrate winning the european cup.. But we were determinded to not let him go that summer. Alex and I, particurlarly Alex had long talks with him. We flew to Portugal and met him during the summer holiday and told him that he would not leave this summer. Obviously we realized that we could not keep a player forever who was not a 100 percent committed. At the other hand we did not clear cut tell him that "if you stay for another season then you can go" - but Ronaldo and Alex had a good relationship and if things worked out and Ronaldo did his job on the pitch, which he absolutely did that following season, then yeah - there was a mutual understanding that he could go.

Perhaps not very groundbreaking - but there you go.

As for Ronaldo, no way we're going to fork up the crazy sum Madrid would demand, and they're in no position of needing to sell him anyway.

He might be valued for 40-50M (something we can afford), but only if Madrid is willing to sell, and I don't think they want to let him go. We will never going to get him realistically. Not something I hold anyone at our club responsible for not getting him back

 

[Jev]

Could you provide a link to the full article?

 

[Siorac]

No surprises there, really. Hopefully it will end the notion that Pogba was driven away by greed.

 

[kps88]

Even if there was any chance of getting Ronaldo back, it would be foolish of anyone to admit it right now. They would basically be saying "Ronaldo was going to join us until fecking Moyes took over".

 

[Kag]

Even if there was any chance of getting Ronaldo back, it would be foolish of anyone to admit it right now. They would basically be saying "Ronaldo was going to join us until fecking Moyes took over".

Agreed, denying it makes much more sense. Nothing too groundbreaking here from Gill. As for Pogba, I've maintained from the outset that it clearly wasn't the cash. It was his desire for game time, or impatience, depending on which side of the coma-inducing discussion you stand on.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah. It just backs up Pogba's claim that he left because he didnt feel he was getting enough football...which it would be hard for United to deny when they were picking Park and Rafael in midfield over him.

The Ronaldo one is more interested because it goes directly against what Daniel Taylor claimed in an article near the start of the season, and Taylor's usually semi reliable...when he's not waffling on about Ravel Morrison.

You've worded that badly. "They were picking" implies that what you describe was a regular occurrence, as opposed to one fecking game.

 

[sun_tzu]

hang on... didnt pogba want to play??? especially when he saw fullbacks being played in midfield ahead of him?

we didnt offer him games - Juventus did... and its certainly paid off for them

its worked out very well for pogba and fair play to him - given how he signed for us and then left us I can see him doing the same to juve - but till then they have a hell of a good player

 

[Revan]

Good to know that Pogba didn't left for money. It was such an obvious thing from the beginning that he left fot football, not for money. All those who criticized his attitude, go enjoy Cleverley and Fellaini playing.

Interesting about Ronaldo, though it has been rumoured for a long time that something similar happened.

 

[Rado_N]

Pogba's problem wasn't greed, it was self entitlement in thinking he could coast through reserve games and still deserve a spot in the first team. But this issue has been debated to death a million times, and people are never going to change their opinions.

 

[MDFC Manager]

The Pogba thing isn't new info at all. His agent claimed that we offered the same/more money than Juventus. Pogba himself claimed the same thing later on.

The Ronaldo thing is probably referring to the yearly rumors of him returning while David gill was still the CEO rather than the summer gone by.

 

[sun_tzu]

pogba got 3 subs games in the league in 2011-2012 for us

the same as macheda

less games than gibson, fabio, anderson, park and cleverly - even diouff and fryers got more starts than him in all competitions.

the next season he started 27 league games for Juve - who had a midfield arguably better than ours to start with! - I don't blame him for thinking he should have played more as he had the physical strength and has shown he certainly has the skill and attitude to dominate games.

We dropped a b*ll*ck - it happens from time to time (keeping evens over pique was another example though it did seem pique wanted to return but we for sure let the better player go)

 

[noodlehair]

You've worded that badly. "They were picking" implies that what you describe was a regular occurrence, as opposed to one fecking game.

Park played there a number of tiems inthe second half of that season. Basically all of the Europa League games. It must have been farily obvious by that point aswell that he'd be leaving at the end of the season.

Jones had a run of games there. The game directly before the Blackburn one involved a central midfield of Giggs and Gibson.

The most time Pogba got on the pitch was in a Carling Cup game against Crystal Palace where he came on as a sub and was almost immediately moved to centreback for reasons that no one will ever be able to fully explain.

I don't know why people live in this fantasy world where Pogba just decided to leave out of some bizarre, money chasing obsession, or illogical need to disrespect Manchester United. He has stated numerous times that it had nothing to do with money. Manchester United claim it was nothing to do with money. Pogba himself says it's because he wanted to play more football and Juventus were able to offer that (which they have, and which United should have done). It couldn't be more clear cut what has happened. The only mystery part in any of it is why United wouldn't just play him.

You can bet if Juventus have any concerns over Pogba's wage or playing time now, it'll be the fear that they're either not playing or paying him enough.

 

[mic.m]

Pogba did what was best for his career. He wanted to play football and he knew he was good enough and he has shown it at Juventus. I hold Fergie responsible for playing Park and Rafael in midfield then bringing Scholes back. It's one the few mistakes that Fergie made.

 

[SirAF]

Could you provide a link to the full article?

Sorry, it was in the scandi supporter's club magazine.

 

[Moriarty]

Pogba did what was best for his career. He wanted to play football and he knew he was good enough and he has shown it at Juventus. I hold Fergie responsible for playing Park and Rafael in midfield then bringing Scholes back. It's one the few mistakes that Fergie made.

I think his agent had much to do with the move to Italy. With Fergie, it's all about control (see interview with Jon Snow) and there was no way he was going to allow a kid, albeit a very talented kid, to make demands for first team football. If Fergie thought he was teaching Pogba a lesson, it backfired. Pogba would probably have been promoted but was unwilling to wait: that and his agent sensing a fat fee from Juve made up up his mind.

 

[Drifter]

Yep SAF misjudged this one. Move on.

 

[IrishLegend]

No surprises there, really. Hopefully it will end the notion that Pogba was driven away by greed.

That notion has always pissed me off. Usually from the very bitter people who can't get over the fact he left united for footballing reasons and was 1000000% justified to do so and became a damn good player for it.

No right for first team football, money grabbing cnut, blah blah blah

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Gill doesn't come out and actually say that United matched whatever was on offer by Juventus.

He just says we offered a "very good wage" and a "generous fee" to the agent. He's bound to say that, as he has to carry the can if penny-pinching ending up losing us a 30m player. So it's still quite possible that Pogba and/or his agent went with the money.

Let's do the whole Pogba discussion all over again in another thread. Yay!

 

[Dante]

You can’t lose what you never had,
You can’t keep what’s not yours,
and you can’t hold on to someone
who doesn’t want to stay.

Sappy lyrics aside, that's the way I feel about this mess. Pogba was never a United player, he was only ever passing through.

 

[Chabon]

You've worded that badly. "They were picking" implies that what you describe was a regular occurrence, as opposed to one fecking game.

Indeed. The actual problem was bringing Scholes back and playing him every week for the rest of the season. All part of Fergie's late 'experience' obsession which is so central to our current problems.

 

[Plugsy]

Indeed. The actual problem was bringing Scholes back and playing him every week for the rest of the season. All part of Fergie's late 'experience' obsession which is so central to our current problems.

How is Scholes playing last season or whenever central to our current problems? That's absolutely shite. It's like blaming the person to use the microwave before you for your own dinner being shit. This obsession with blaming Fergie is central to what is currently most pissing me off.

Was Ferguson expected to just spend like a slut on heat knowing he'd retire in the near future? If he did I can well imagine this forum being jam-packed with accusations that he was selfish and gave the new manager nowhere to go.

He assembled a team he knew he could be successful with and was, left the league champions and a shit load of money in the bank for the new guy.

 

[Rowem]

Pogba's problem wasn't greed, it was self entitlement in thinking he could coast through reserve games and still deserve a spot in the first team. But this issue has been debated to death a million times, and people are never going to change their opinions.

This, but the plebs will still find a way to martyr him and condemn the club.

 

[Rowem]

Re: Giving him more playing time

It's tough to give him more playing time when he had already decided to leave. It was pretty obvious publicly from about January that he was off, so privately he might well have decided sooner.

 

[RustyS]

This, but the plebs will still find a way to martyr him and condemn the club.

I'd like to see how you feel if you are qualified to be a manager and asked to wait for your chance and bide your time as a part time customer service representative in the meanwhile while less qualified people than you are managers. All that while knowing that you can move to another company, make the same amount of money you are being promised once you get that manager position, and getting a handsome sum of money just for signing up with them.

I'm sure you will just say that you'll wait where you are and prove your worth because possibly they will see that you deserve the chance one day

 

[Chabon]

How is Scholes playing last season or whenever central to our current problems? That's absolutely shite. It's like blaming the person to use the microwave before you for your own dinner being shit. This obsession with blaming Fergie is central to what is currently most pissing me off.

Was Ferguson expected to just spend like a slut on heat knowing he'd retire in the near future? If he did I can well imagine this forum being jam-packed with accusations that he was selfish and gave the new manager nowhere to go.

He assembled a team he knew he could be successful with and was, left the league champions and a shit load of money in the bank for the new guy.

What the everloving Christ is this? It should be clear to anyone with a reading age in excess of six that I was suggesting that Scholes' return killed any chance Pogba had of staking a place in a side crying out for a midfielder. And also that that's just one example of a general trend in Fergie's thinking towards the end which has contributed heavily to our dire situation.

No fecking clue why you're talking about spending, hell, I'm on record repeatedly as saying that RVP was the ultimate example of this problem and that signing was a major mistake.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Re: Giving him more playing time

It's tough to give him more playing time when he had already decided to leave. It was pretty obvious publicly from about January that he was off, so privately he might well have decided sooner.

It was probably also a strategy to pressure him into signing the contract that must have been on the table a long time before the final few months of the season. Make a long-term commitment to the club and you'll get the games you're after. Obviously a high stakes strategy which hindsight has proven to be ineffective but not entirely without logic.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I'd like to see how you feel if you are qualified to be a manager and asked to wait for your chance and bide your time as a part time customer service representative in the meanwhile while less qualified people than you are managers. All that while knowing that you can move to another company, make the same amount of money you are being promised once you get that manager position, and getting a handsome sum of money just for signing up with them.

I'm sure you will just say that you'll wait where you are and prove your worth because possibly they will see that you deserve the chance one day

That's not a very good analogy but - just to follow it through to it's logical conclusion - do you think there's magical solution for all business to avoid ever losing their best employees?

Only there's a lot of people out there earning a living trying to solve exactly that problem and there's still no way of ensuring it won't ever happen.

 

[Ekeke]

We gave Anderson the games Pogba could have had. Anderson.

 

[Rowem]

I'd like to see how you feel if you are qualified to be a manager and asked to wait for your chance and bide your time as a part time customer service representative in the meanwhile while less qualified people than you are managers. All that while knowing that you can move to another company, make the same amount of money you are being promised once you get that manager position, and getting a handsome sum of money just for signing up with them.

I'm sure you will just say that you'll wait where you are and prove your worth because possibly they will see that you deserve the chance one day

Yes, because that is an extremely accurate comparison to an 18 year old being told that he needs to work hard and prove himself in order to make it at Manchester United. How deservedly angry he must have felt witnessing the unqualified Paul Scholes playing before him. I bow to your completely objective insight.

Who promoted this chimpanzee?

 

[RustyS]

That's not a very good analogy but - just to follow it through to it's logical conclusion - do you think there's magical solution for all business to avoid ever losing their best employees?

Only there's a lot of people out there earning a living trying to solve exactly that problem and there's still no way of ensuring it won't ever happen.

Not every employee in this position is "special" enough to have offers coming his/her way from other places. That's what people miss when it comes to Pogba and it's my main point in the poor analogy.

Youth players should be encouraged to try hard and prove their worth and be patient but every now and then you will get one who is head and shoulders above the rest and if you don't act fast, other clubs will quickly take him off your hands. This is especially the case when the player doesn't have strong ties to the club. What makes Pogba's case more infuriating is that we were so bad in midfield that we had to bring Scholes back out of retirement. Yet he was still not getting minutes with the first team.

If I was him I would've left as would 99% of people who are not passionate fans of the club.

 

[RustyS]

Yes, because that is an extremely accurate comparison to an 18 year old being told that he needs to work hard and prove himself in order to make it at Manchester United. How deservedly angry he must have felt witnessing the unqualified Paul Scholes playing before him. I bow to your completely objective insight.

Who promoted this chimpanzee?

Wow. Ignored.

Cheers

 

[Chabon]

We gave Anderson the games Pogba could have had. Anderson.

Anderson at the time was the best he's ever been, and he missed pretty much all of the season from October onwards, when Pogba should have been given a chance in his (and Cleverley's) absence. It was never Ando that kept him out of the team.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Not every employee in this position is "special" enough to have offers coming his/her way from other places. That's what people miss when it comes to Pogba and it's my main point in the poor analogy.

Youth players should be encouraged to try hard and prove their worth and be patient (!) but every now and then you will get one who is head and shoulders above the rest (2) and if you don't act fast, other clubs will quickly take him off your hands. This is especially the case when the player doesn't have strong ties to the club. What makes Pogba's case more infuriating is that we were so bad in midfield that we had to bring Scholes back out of retirement. Yet he was still not getting minutes with the first team.

If I was him I would've left as would 99% of people who are not passionate fans of the club.

(1) He wasn't patient in the slightest, so it's kind of contradicting yourself?

(2) Did you watch him in the reserves? As he put feck all effort in compared with the level of talent he possesses, if he wasn't able to correctly translate this ability at reserve level (Whether it be due to arrogance/ bad games etc), then he won't warrant first team appearances, it's simple.

Hindsight, the player he is now, he wasn't then.

 

[Rowem]

Not every employee in this position is "special" enough to have offers coming his/her way from other places. That's what people miss when it comes to Pogba and it's my main point in the poor analogy.

Youth players should be encouraged to try hard and prove their worth and be patient but every now and then you will get one who is head and shoulders above the rest and if you don't act fast, other clubs will quickly take him off your hands. This is especially the case when the player doesn't have strong ties to the club. What makes Pogba's case more infuriating is that we were so bad in midfield that we had to bring Scholes back out of retirement. Yet he was still not getting minutes with the first team.

If I was him I would've left as would 99% of people who are not passionate fans of the club.

Can we not introduce a demotion option for people like this?

 

[Chabon]

Forget everything else and someone sensibly answer me this. Why the feck was Pogba, at the time one of the most exciting prospects we'd had in years, only on the bench for games against Leeds, Aldershot and Crystal Palace?

Edit: Our midfield pairings for those games were Park-Giggs, Park-Cleverley, and Park-Gibson. I mean, seriously, what the feck?

 

[RustyS]

(1) He wasn't patient in the slightest, so it's kind of contradicting yourself?

(2) Did you watch him in the reserves? As he put feck all effort in compared with the level of talent he possesses, if he wasn't able to correctly translate this ability at reserve level (Whether it be due to arrogance/ bad games etc), then he won't warrant first team appearances, it's simple.

Hindsight, the player he is now, he wasn't then.

I think you misread my post. Why would he be patient if he knows that can go anywhere and be an instant success (in his mind)? And for your second point, he performed well and outshone everyone till the 2011-2012 season when he became uninterested. SAF knew that he was special and said as much on several occasions.

Anyway, I've read several times people's arguments in that huge Pogba thread and I'm not sure if there is any value in resurrecting the same arguments. I think Pogba was arrogant as a lot of people say so in his mind he didn't want to prove himself anymore which, back to my main point, he didn't have to because he had offers elsewhere.

 

[acnumber9]

Indeed. The actual problem was bringing Scholes back and playing him every week for the rest of the season. All part of Fergie's late 'experience' obsession which is so central to our current problems.

Bringing Scholes back is one of my favourite moments as a Utd fan. We should be grateful we got to experience that gift a few more times.

 

[Chabon]

It might well be one of your favourite moments, but it's proven to be a bit of a disaster for the club.