Ole doesn't rate him, we should have sold him to make room for a new signing, it's not rocket science.People kicking off in one thread we haven't signed a midfielder and others kicking off in here that we haven't let one go.
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You need a squad don't you? He played around 1500 mins last season. He may get more minutes this season. We can't rely on Matic as the sole backup to Fred and McTominay and we already let Garner go.
Not been given a chance here, should be allowed to move on for both parties. We're a great team at cutting the price of our assets when they're not needed.
I have no doubt thag he can be a decent player for us but the manager obviously can't be that keen on him, considering the underwhelming performers getting regular starts.
I have no doubt thag he can be a decent player for us but the manager obviously can't be that keen on him, considering the underwhelming performers getting regular starts.
Yeah, his 5 minutes cameo every game is so valuable for us.
I feel for Donny - after that shit show midfield performance at Wolves if he can’t get a chance in the team after that then god only knows…..
Jesus Christ, we've played 3 games lads, chill the feck out. Donny will get minutes this season and loaning him to Everton when we could get no one in, would have been straight up moronic.
It's up to him to take his chance when he does get an opportunity.
It's up to him to take his chance when he does get an opportunity.
You're speaking to a brick wall when you're dealing with these Ole die-hard fanboys, they won't accept for a second that he ever does anything wrong.
In their mind it's perfectly logical to
1. Spunk 40m up the wall on a player that you don't rate
2. Refuse to play him
3. Refuse to sell him, so you can keep him around and not play him.
It's shambolic.
Donny featured in 36 games last season. He's a squad player who's waiting for his chance to solidify a slot in the team. I know that Caf has some sort of victim complex towards this player, but he's not been that great when he's had the chance.
If you're not going to give him any minutes at least fecking stop calling him "Donny".
That is a perfectly sane perspective to have but is it not also possible that Ole won't sanction him moving because he has been told that he cannot bring anyone in even if he goes. I mean, if I am with a girl who is a 2/10 but the only other option is the palm of my hand I am not going to dump her.
You must have forgot last season happened also..
The point is, if he couldn't get any game time in the first 3 matches given the circumstances, then he isn't getting a look in for the rest of the season except for League Cup games.
1. We were 5-1 up agaisnt Leeds and Matic came off the bench ahead of him.
2. Southampton - Mctominay injured, and Matic got the start ahead of him.
3. Pogba has 5 assists in 2 games from the left, so there's every reason to keep him there and that frees up more opportunities for VDB in midfield. What does Ole do against Wolves? Moves Pogba back to midfield so he doesn't have to play VDB, and plays Dan James out wide instead (who was sold 24 hours later for not being good enough). Mctominay still injured.
Why can't people just accept Ole fecked up massively in his decision to sign him, and compounding that by refusing to sell.
He works if we use two 8's, which we haven't been able to do formation wise at any point. We try to fit a square peg in a round hole routinely with Pogba, so when we aren't playing Pogba as one of the 2 holding midfield in a 4-2-3-1 we just play a more defensive mid like Matic, Fred and McTominay.
I dont want you to be anywhere near my team, but I will not let you go. 50m well spent.
This is unbelievable... we could have loaned him out to Everton, and bring Saul on loan with OPTION to buy. Saul would play more games than Donny...
He's the number 5 option in the double pivot, and the number 3 option behind Bruno...
What bothers me most, is that those 36 games he played, most of them were dead rubbers where he had 5-10 min cameo, or games where we were a completely changed team, basically the "B" team. He never had a chance to have a run with the starters. Playing occasionaly a few minutes with the bench is completely different than playing with the starters.
Scott is injured, probably trough all september. Give Donny a chance with the starters, and if he fails, then ok, he's a flop and the club should sell him next summer.
He's the number 5 option in the double pivot, and the number 3 option behind Bruno...
What bothers me most, is that those 36 games he played, most of them were dead rubbers where he had 5-10 min cameo, or games where we were a completely changed team, basically the "B" team. He never had a chance to have a run with the starters. Playing occasionaly a few minutes with the bench is completely different than playing with the starters.
Scott is injured, probably trough all september. Give Donny a chance with the starters, and if he fails, then ok, he's a flop and the club should sell him next summer.
We don't know the Ole doesn't like him. All we know is that he keeps saying really positive things about him and then doesn't start him. Maybe it's to do with Donny himself in training? Or maybe its that whenever he's been played he's been usually awful (his best game was a half against Everton in the pre season). Maybe Ole sees the potential and is being patient?
Or Ole is some evil killer of world class Dutch talent and wants to keep him liocked up in a dungeon and is refusing to play him for sheer laughs. I know you have to be seriously warped in your opinion of Ole to believe that but it seems to have become the norm in our fanbase.
It's just really cringey to act all matey with the name while pretending he's a meaningful squad player when he got half the minutes of Matic and a whopping 4 starts all league season, one of which ended with him getting subbed at HT.
Sorry. I meant "half the minutes of Nemanja"
Ummm why do people care so much about VDB. I don't remember people feeling bad for the like of Quinton Fortune when they didn't play. It's on VDB to impress. He's at a club where the midfield is the weakest position and yet he still can't break through. It's not like he was completely hidden either, we saw him have matches, he looked poor yet people have managed to convince themselves that he's shown signs. It reminds me of Andreas Pereira. It was only when we were forced to consistently play him due to lack of options that people could admit those lack of opportunities were for a reason. Look at Angel Gomes, how much noise do you hear about him now?
I just don't see how 3 games is anything to base what's going to happen for the rest of the season. He'll most likely start against Young boys, he'll probably play against West ham in the EFL - heck he may even get a go against Newcastle. If he cant make an impact in those games, that's his own fault.
He was pretty mediocre when he did come on last season, so he's got a fair bit to prove and I don't see why Ole should be playing him in the games you mention above yet. He hardly set the world alight in pre season either. If he doesn't get starts in a minimum of two of the games above, then I agree there was little point in keeping him.
Basically this.
I do think we'll see a better Donny this year simply because he'll have a player with similar traits with him in Sancho.
Pogba not leaving and potentially staying might mean we'll have to let him go, or that he reinvents himself as a 6/8 hybrid, but until we get that clarity on Pogba's future, then I can't see him leaving unfortunately.
If he's not performed well enough to get any game time, that's not Ole's fault. It's kind of Ole's fault for signing a player who isn't good enough though, and kind of his fault for holding on to him indefinitely when he doesn't rate him.
Mr Van Der Beek esq. presumably.
I wonder if we will see him in the league cup vs West Ham. Either that or I guess he might be a Euro specialist in the CL. Odd to block his move when we’re not using him. Especially if it really was Ole who veto’d it.
McFred were fit to play v Leeds. The reasons given were pretty fair for Southampton (Matic having a longer and better preseason). And Traore would have eaten VdB alive on the counter on Sunday. If Pogba couldn't keep a handle on him, no way could Donny have.
Actually it’s Neema to his friends. Or Uncle Matic.
Not been that great is a gross understatement. He has been awful when given the chance. However, if someone says he's been given a fair chance (which you tried to imply by focusing on 36 games rather than minutes) then that's just a flat out lie.
Why is it Ole's fault? Real wanted him, I'm sure most of us thought he was a very talented player at Ajax, many players just can't make the step up. Feck me, indefinitely?! He's been here one season mate.
You're right that it's all speculation because any way it's sliced or diced, spending 35 million on a guy that gets so few chances is bizarre and naturally prompts guesswork as to why. Usually managers are fairly stubborn in giving chances to new signings, this seems to be the opposite.
However, I can't fathom that it would be that he was always bought for this particular backup/Bruno injury role. I think if they thought he was good enough to step into the breach if our key player became a long term casualty then I find it hard to think he would get minimal appearances in other situations, such as a proper sub (not 10 mins) or rotated in. Something about that just doesn't add up.
I think the training theory is the only thing making any sense. That he has been out of his depth and he's been hard to pick and retain credibility for the manager among the squad. If a guy is the worst midfielder in training then how do you say to the others you're coming out for Donny today? It's possible, but would suggest a grave misjudgment from our recruitment team. Also, the fact he's been fairly awful in his limited opportunities does not help and at the very least doesn't make the training idea less plausible.
Either he plays in the next 4 months or he will be sold in January.
I never said McFred weren't fit for Leeds so not sure why you're mentioning that they were.
Basically, he's 5th choice in that double pivot even behind old man Matic and can't be trusted to play against Wolves because Ole thinks he's too shit to play against a lower half team - if this is the case then Ole has made a massive cock-up in signing him, and we should cut our losses now and bring in a replacement.
What the Ole-can-do-no-wrong fans don't seem to understand is no one really feels that strongly that VDB should be starting games as if he's earned it, they do feel strongly that Ole has spunked 40m up the wall and is holding on to a player he doesn't rate for no good reason.
How in gods name is it cringey to act all matey when adressing people by their damn names???? Do you not call people by their names if you don't know them? Do you sign language and hope to god the bouncer understands you're trying to ask where the toilet is and not challenging him to a game of murder-my-face-with-your-fist?
I got to see him in the behind closed doors friendly vs Burnley -long story - and he played badly in that match tbf. Ole obviously doesn’t trust him from what he’s seen thus far - and that’s not going away until he puts in a performance when given the chance. He’s looked scared stiff to play his ‘natural game’ - for some players United is just too big - I remember birtles/davenport from back in the 80s suffering the same stage fright - but they won’t let him go just yet incase he does come good - long season ahead so let’s hope so….
Your take makes a lot of sense, but if VDB can literally carry Holland against Italy and Spain in October by scoring the only goals for Holland and by being the second highest rated player on the pitch against a full strength Italy, surely that would warrant more chances than he's been giving upon his return, despite his (hypothetical) underperformance in training. (De Boer wanted to use him as a starter but his continued lack of minutes made him get dropped for subsequent international breaks, where he was still a good sub). Something still doesn't add up.
It isn't rocket science and had this been a transfer offer made a few days ago I would probably agree. As it is, it's a loan offer seemingly made within 3/4 hours of the window closing. It would have been fecking insanity to accept that.
You asked why he wasn't being played, no? I just gave you the potential reasons as to why.
He's 5th choice in the pivot because, and wait for it because I'm sure you'll be astounded, HE'S NOT A PIVOT PLAYER. You wouldn't play Zidane at CB, so why are you trying to fit in someone who isn't a 6 into that role?
We bought him because we were expecting Pogba to be gone. He hasn't and as a result Donny is in a sort of purgatory. That's nobody's fault and it's pretty rotten luck. To compound matters, he has two of the very best attacking midfielders around in front of him. No one is dropping either of them for VdB, with all due respect...
My biggest question is: Why is it so important for so many caf posters that we remove a player from the club when he could be useful down the line? He has been promised playtime by the manager as recently as last week.
Don't you want a large squad?
Don't you want a large squad?
I saw one highlight clip from that game, but it's a clip so I obviously didn't see his entire performane. But essentially Dragonsworth McIntyre (not Donny, too buddy apparently) receives the ball in the 16m box and receives it with the dampening force of two loaded springs and runs after the ball out of the box again, then loses the ball in the following sequence. Maybe he made a series of great plays before and after, but that clip was not indicative of someone who's going up in the pecking order.
This is just the most bizarre signing and handling of a signing I can recall. I was a fan of DvB at Ajax and was really excited when we signed him. Such a waste of time for the player and the club. And I can’t recall such a fee literally yielding no difference on the pitch whatsoever. Shambolic.
The reason I feel sorry for him is because he scored a goal on his debut.
I felt like we played him more like his ajax way earlier on and slowly started turning him to a player he isn't.
I hope still that we are just waiting for that CDM that enables us to play someone like him more.
I felt like we played him more like his ajax way earlier on and slowly started turning him to a player he isn't.
I hope still that we are just waiting for that CDM that enables us to play someone like him more.
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