Endrick

GoonerBear

Full Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2020
Messages
1,858
Supports
Arsenal
As Barca and Madrid, no. For a 16 year old kid, United? Possibly We have been Champions of Europe in the time the kid was old enough to have memories at least.

The Jersey alone is not the magnet it once was. Athletes today, not just in football, do NOT care about the history and “prestige” that history once afforded. I would argue it is dying a bit for Barca now as well, and maybe only Madrid really has IT anymore.

That’s why PSG is n the top 3. It’s about the money, the overall project and the showcase.

Except for Madrid. I truly think they are the only team that can “pull anyone they want” by name alone anymore.

I told you guys we were WAY ahead of many clubs on Endrick in July. We were very close to buying a club with the ability to buy Endrick early and avoid all this for awhile. We’ve eaten in his home a ton, spent time with his family and coaches, put in the work building relationships. Romano isn’t putting us in that top 3 on a lark.

People think these guys would care about things like who George Best played …. And they just don’t.

If you guys were in the position of a City, and could combine that with your name value? That would be a different story. But you aren’t.
Despite you being a bit of a Boehly / Clearlake cheerleader, I think you are correct on a lot of things here.

I don't think it really matters too much that Utd and Liverpool are bigger clubs traditionally than the likes of City and Chelsea for a 16 year old. What matters more is where the club is at now, what you can sell to the player and his family more specifically of where the club is going, how you'll look after the player, what environment you will build round him, how you see him integrating for the first team etc. Ironically, the 1 thing that might influence a 16 year old forward is the presence and influence of 1 of the greatest players ever in Ronaldo, and he's just put a massive negative slant on that.

Unfortunately though, a big part of the decision is how much money the club will throw at the player and his family, and we know Boehlys Chelsea won't be shy at that.

It won't surprise anyone on here to know that from a sporting perspective, I think Arsenal could be 1 of the best options for Endrick. A young team looking on the up, a club and management team that's looking more stable, a Brazilian Sporting Director, a manager that can speak some Portuguese, players such as Jesus, Gabriel, Martinelli and Marquinhos, could even sign his current club mate in Danilo. Not got a lot of depth in the forward areas so a clear path to the first team.
The only thing missing is that Arsenal won't throw money at him and his family. Like you say, theres a reason why Chelsea, PSG and Real are seen as the 3 favourites.
 

ZolaWasMagic

Full Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2018
Messages
2,451
Supports
Chelsea
Despite you being a bit of a Boehly / Clearlake cheerleader, I think you are correct on a lot of things here.

I don't think it really matters too much that Utd and Liverpool are bigger clubs traditionally than the likes of City and Chelsea for a 16 year old. What matters more is where the club is at now, what you can sell to the player and his family more specifically of where the club is going, how you'll look after the player, what environment you will build round him, how you see him integrating for the first team etc. Ironically, the 1 thing that might influence a 16 year old forward is the presence and influence of 1 of the greatest players ever in Ronaldo, and he's just put a massive negative slant on that.

Unfortunately though, a big part of the decision is how much money the club will throw at the player and his family, and we know Boehlys Chelsea won't be shy at that.

It won't surprise anyone on here to know that from a sporting perspective, I think Arsenal could be 1 of the best options for Endrick. A young team looking on the up, a club and management team that's looking more stable, a Brazilian Sporting Director, a manager that can speak some Portuguese, players such as Jesus, Gabriel, Martinelli and Marquinhos, could even sign his current club mate in Danilo. Not got a lot of depth in the forward areas so a clear path to the first team.
The only thing missing is that Arsenal won't throw money at him and his family. Like you say, theres a reason why Chelsea, PSG and Real are seen as the 3 favourites.
I still think Madrid will edge it and sign him eventually. But if we signed him, i dont think itd be a huge surprise. Given Boehly et al's willingness to spend and Thiago Silva spending time with Endrick and his family at Cobham. Again, as you alluded to, he and his family may prefer what PSG offer as a package for example, and they may have a big influence over the players decision

The notion that player X picks Liverpool or Utd over chelsea and City due to history and prestige is nonsense these days. Back in the 90s it was a thing yes, but not in the recent era. A 16 yr old player has only really known City and Chelsea being the most successful in England in his lifetime.
 

Vapor trail

Full Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2022
Messages
771
I still think Madrid will edge it and sign him eventually. But if we signed him, i dont think itd be a huge surprise. Given Boehly et al's willingness to spend and Thiago Silva spending time with Endrick and his family at Cobham. Again, as you alluded to, he and his family may prefer what PSG offer as a package for example, and they may have a big influence over the players decision

The notion that player X picks Liverpool or Utd over chelsea and City due to history and prestige is nonsense these days. Back in the 90s it was a thing yes, but not in the recent era. A 16 yr old player has only really known City and Chelsea being the most successful in England in his lifetime.
Most successful would certainly throw Liverpool into that same argument. There's likely many decisions that factor into a players decision. None of us can give an accurate account regarding the choices that determines a players decision because none of us have the experience. It is therefore mostly assumption.

There's also the purpose behind why the said player is moving for example a young player who has seen Chelsea's record to integrate youth into the first team would be skeptical (alongside academy players sold to find first team football) so almost every club has perspectives that are for and against their propositions.

Ultimately we will have to wait and see what his decisions are and why he made those particular choices.
 

Rnd898

Full Member
Joined
May 7, 2022
Messages
287
Supports
Chelsea
Don't forget the lad in question was born in 2006. :lol:

In his lifetime Chelsea have won the following trophies:

3x EPL
2x UCL
2x UEL
5x FA Cup

That's 12 major trophies plus a few of the minor ones (2x EFL Cup and a Club World Cup) on top. In the same time frame and criteria City have won 8 major trophies, United have 8, Arsenal have 4 and Liverpool with 3.

Now if we're to count the FA Cup and UEL among the minor trophies (should they?) we still have 5 major ones while City and United have 6 each, Liverpool 2 and Arsenal is left with feck all.

So yeah, I don't think it's unfair to say that in the lifespan of someone born in the mid-2000s Chelsea have been among the most successful clubs in England. Whether that has any impact in the boy's decision I have absolutely no idea and even if it does then a club like Real Madrid have a better trophy record and higher 'prestige' anyway.
 

Rozay

Master of Hindsight
Joined
Oct 22, 2012
Messages
24,705
Location
...
If we do get new, wealthy ownership then this is a move we may be afforded the luxury to explore.
 

Bojan Djordjic

Full Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2018
Messages
808
If we do get new, wealthy ownership then this is a move we may be afforded the luxury to explore.
What are the chances United's sale is finalised before Endrick's future is settled? Have a feeling the Glazers will be pinching pennies even more than normal now that they are selling the club.
 

Rnd898

Full Member
Joined
May 7, 2022
Messages
287
Supports
Chelsea
What are the chances United's sale is finalised before Endrick's future is settled?
Low chance, I would think.

Even in unprecedented circumstances and a big rush to finalize the deal due to the sanctions, the Chelsea takeover took almost 4 months from start to finish. The takeover of United is going to be a much higher-value sale and since there's no outside mandate to hurry things up, the bidding process and due diligence will most likely be spread out over a longer time period to attract as many buyers as possible (= potentially more money for the Glazers).

I'd be quite surprised if any United takeover was finalized before the start of the 23/24 season and chances are Endrick's move to wherever he ends up will be fully agreed by then. Of course that doesn't mean you can't still join the race for him under the current Glazer regime but the question is will they want to lock down any big future transfers now that they're already looking to sell the club?
 

Adam-Utd

Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
38,213
What are the chances United's sale is finalised before Endrick's future is settled? Have a feeling the Glazers will be pinching pennies even more than normal now that they are selling the club.
Doubt it'll disrupt the clubs daily running. It's not like the Glazers put a penny in anyway.
 

Trumpeter Whydah

New Member
Newbie
Joined
May 14, 2022
Messages
57
Supports
Full Members
This Fabrizio Romano tweets Xavi and FCB are now after Endrick too. Not long ago he had them not interested, but there you go...

PSG apparently made a bid, FCB and CFC are in talks with him and his family, and Real watching from the side line to step in once all is ripe. I don't see this lad joining United anytime soon.

This lad Estevão however... next big thing to Endrick, certainly.
 

the_cliff

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
3,082
While everyone is clamouring for Endrick. We should really go and snap up Angelo Gabriel who I believe is the more talented out of the 2. More raw but definitely more talented.

Brazil really do seem to have an endless pool of talented attackers. It's actually incredible.
 

Righteous Steps

Full Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2016
Messages
1,550
While everyone is clamouring for Endrick. We should really go and snap up Angelo Gabriel who I believe is the more talented out of the 2. More raw but definitely more talented.

Brazil really do seem to have an endless pool of talented attackers. It's actually incredible.
Why do you think he’s more talented than Endrick?
 

the_cliff

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
3,082
Why do you think he’s more talented than Endrick?
Way more technical. Endrick is a powerful player and a freak at that age and is more polished despite being younger, my personal opinion though is that Gabriel has a higher ceiling.

Again it's my personal opinion but Angelo Gabriel is a top talent in his own right (Last year he became the youngest goal scorer in copa libertadores history at 16) and probably the best dribbler to come out of Brazil since Vini jr and while everyone is clamouring for Endrick we have a high chance of snapping him up. Andre Trindad is another one we should be looking at, although a completely different position.
 

Righteous Steps

Full Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2016
Messages
1,550
Way more technical. Endrick is a powerful player and a freak at that age and is more polished despite being younger, my personal opinion though is that Gabriel has a higher ceiling.

Again it's my personal opinion but Angelo Gabriel is a top talent in his own right (Last year he became the youngest goal scorer in copa libertadores history at 16) and probably the best dribbler to come out of Brazil since Vini jr and while everyone is clamouring for Endrick we have a high chance of snapping him up. Andre Trindad is another one we should be looking at, although a completely different position.
Thanks for the insight, would you say Vini was a better dribbler than Rodrygo?
 

Bluelion7

Full Member
Joined
Aug 27, 2021
Messages
635
Supports
Chelsea
Most successful would certainly throw Liverpool into that same argument. There's likely many decisions that factor into a players decision. None of us can give an accurate account regarding the choices that determines a players decision because none of us have the experience. It is therefore mostly assumption.

There's also the purpose behind why the said player is moving for example a young player who has seen Chelsea's record to integrate youth into the first team would be skeptical (alongside academy players sold to find first team football) so almost every club has perspectives that are for and against their propositions.

Ultimately we will have to wait and see what his decisions are and why he made those particular choices.
Chelsea’s record to integrate youth is better than any of the other teams he’s looking at, so this is frankly an odd statement. Now if you throw in Barca that’s different, but we have more Academy players playing first team than any of those others.

But again, Endrick isnt going to someone’s Academy. I have major doubts as to whether gambling 60 to 90m (whatever it comes to after bidding and agent fees, etc) on a teenager who could completely fail to adjust is a good plan for Barca at this stage. If the rumors about the “total package” being sold to the family are true it also might cause problems with their pay structure.

And yeah….if you ask any of these younger players to check out anything from more than 10 or 15 years ago, they will look at you like you’re crazy. This has already happened in other sports. Rule of thumb: If you lose relevance you have a 10 year window to get it back before you essentially have to build back up from near scratch. If you asked Endrick who his favorite older generation player is, he’d probably say Neymar.

I would rate Madrid the favorite, certainly. But if the kid really does want to play in the PL like we are hearing … you never know.
 

arthurka

Full Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2010
Messages
16,593
Location
Rectum
We haven't got a Brazilian talent since Possebon was a thing. We have an abysmal record with Brazilians.
 

simonhch

Horrible boss
Joined
Aug 17, 2010
Messages
13,251
Location
Yankee Doodle land
Supports
Urban Combat Preparedness
Way more technical. Endrick is a powerful player and a freak at that age and is more polished despite being younger, my personal opinion though is that Gabriel has a higher ceiling.

Again it's my personal opinion but Angelo Gabriel is a top talent in his own right (Last year he became the youngest goal scorer in copa libertadores history at 16) and probably the best dribbler to come out of Brazil since Vini jr and while everyone is clamouring for Endrick we have a high chance of snapping him up. Andre Trindad is another one we should be looking at, although a completely different position.
Thank you. Great to gain some educated insight. Out of the talents coming through, I have only really heard of Gabriel, Estevao, Endrick, and Luis Guillherme, either through this thread or elsewhere. How would you rate each of them in terms of current and past talents? Seen a fair amount of hype about each of them, with Endrick getting the most by far. I’ve heard your thoughts on Gabriel and Endrick but would love to hear what you think of the other two.
 

the_cliff

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
3,082
Thank you. Great to gain some educated insight. Out of the talents coming through, I have only really heard of Gabriel, Estevao, Endrick, and Luis Guillherme, either through this thread or elsewhere. How would you rate each of them in terms of current and past talents? Seen a fair amount of hype about each of them, with Endrick getting the most by far. I’ve heard your thoughts on Gabriel and Endrick but would love to hear what you think of the other two.
To be honest, I haven't seen much of them as they haven't yet played for the first team yet. I usually keep an eye out on the Brazilian Serie A and not youth football there. From what I've heard they are both more physical and more direct than Gabriel, while Gabriel is more of a creative player. Estevao is especially highly rated though, so we should see him make an app for the first team soon. I can't tell you their playing style and how their game will translate to adult football though...

The difference between Endrick, Gabriel and the other 2 you mentioned is that they are both doing it in adult football, Gabriel especially, he's 17 and has 97 apps for the Santos first team, granted a lot of them are sub appearances but it's still pretty crazy if you think about it. He's a natural dribbler with almost perfect close control if he can work on his decision making in the final third and his finishing he's going to be wanted just as much as Endrick if not more. Endrick has took his insane goal scoring record for his youth teams to adult football as well which is the reason why he's so highly rated.
 

Niemans

Full Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2021
Messages
1,103
Supports
Barcelona, Celta de Vigo
While everyone is clamouring for Endrick. We should really go and snap up Angelo Gabriel who I believe is the more talented out of the 2. More raw but definitely more talented.

Brazil really do seem to have an endless pool of talented attackers. It's actually incredible.
Barcelona have a €35M purchase option for Angelo Gabriel.
 

TheReligion

Abusive
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
44,105
Location
Manchester
I still think Madrid will edge it and sign him eventually. But if we signed him, i dont think itd be a huge surprise. Given Boehly et al's willingness to spend and Thiago Silva spending time with Endrick and his family at Cobham. Again, as you alluded to, he and his family may prefer what PSG offer as a package for example, and they may have a big influence over the players decision

The notion that player X picks Liverpool or Utd over chelsea and City due to history and prestige is nonsense these days. Back in the 90s it was a thing yes, but not in the recent era. A 16 yr old player has only really known City and Chelsea being the most successful in England in his lifetime.
I think it’s nonsense to you because your club doesn’t have the history and prestige. That can’t be bought.

Whilst I agree a players view can very much differ depending on their age and what they have lived through clubs like United, Liverpool, Real, Barca, Bayern will always have that romanticism attached given the history and pedigree the clubs have.

It’s equally silly to suggest none of that matters as it is to say current success/potential and financial packages don’t either.

He’ll move to the club that ticks most of the boxes at the end of the day and whilst Chelsea definitely tick quite a few they don’t offer more than any other English team and they also lack plenty.
 

Niemans

Full Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2021
Messages
1,103
Supports
Barcelona, Celta de Vigo
Yes, that was done before Barca went on a summer shopping spree. Barcelona will not spend 35 m on Angelo Gabriel.
The latest news is that Barcelona follows Angelo closely and they see a great future.
Barcelona also had a €20M option for Kayky and eventually signed for Almeria (€7M).
 
X