England at Euro 2012

[Cling Bak]

Predicting how England will do at this tournament is a setup for a fall.

On one hand, this looks like a big task given Hodgson has only just taken over and had little time to work with anyone. France look much improved and a youthful exciting team that look technically superior in every department. England rarely beat Sweden and have never done so at a tournament. Ukraine are at home and will be keen to prove themselves and not disappoint their fans.

On the other hand, expectation could be low and the pressure off as nobody expects anything. A new regime could invigorate the players, whilst the groups difficulty is enough to take seriously but not a group of death. Historically, England have struggled more in groups that look 'easy'. That said, Sweden I don't feel are strong and may rely heavily on Ibrahimovic, whilst Ukraine would arguably not have qualified had they not been hosts.

The first warm-up game is this weekend, against Norway. Even predicting the team lineup is difficult.

I think it could look like this:

Hart
Johnson - Terry - Cahill - Cole
Barry - Lampard
Walcott - Gerrard - Young
Carroll​

The good thing is, no player will be too comfortable in their position as a poor performance will see others used in the following friendly (you'd imagine).

 

[Pexbo]

I've got no interest whatsoever. So sick of that group of players, genuinely thought Roy would do something different. I won't be getting behind them, just past caring anymore.

 

[Cling Bak]

I've got no interest whatsoever. So sick of that group of players, genuinely thought Roy would do something different. I won't be getting behind them, just past caring anymore.

Fair play. I don't say its easy with some of them there, but being English and a huge fan down the years I find it hard not to still support my country/team.

I think Hodgson could've taken more risks, but I suppose he opted for a balance of tournament experience and some new faces who haven't been to one, like Welbeck, Carroll, Walcott, Young, Chamberlain, Parker, Cahill, Lescott, Jones, Ruddy... There's still a lot of players new to this and even Joe Hart hasn't played at one. It's definitely a fresher look than the last World Cup, I just hope we use the squad right (and ultimately, that my lineup isn't how we look come the first game!).

 

[Cling Bak]

The first warm-up game is this weekend, against Norway. Even predicting the team lineup is difficult.

I think it could look like this:

Hart
Johnson - Terry - Cahill - Cole
Barry - Lampard
Walcott - Gerrard - Young
Carroll​

Apparently the Chelsea players won't link up with the rest of the squad until after the Norway game, so expect Lescott, Baines and Milner (assuming Parker is still injured?) to be drafted in.

 

[Rood]

I'll be content with quarter finals - anymore is a bonus, any less a failure

Finding it difficult to get excited about it, didnt even realise we had a game this weekend!

 

[Cling Bak]

I'll be content with quarter finals - anymore is a bonus, any less a failure

Finding it difficult to get excited about it, didnt even realise we had a game this weekend!

People will no doubt put pressure on Hodgson, particularly the media, but if England don't get out of the group, I don't think he can be blamed too heavily.

This is a bit of a free pass for him, in fairness.

Quarter finals would be fine though.

 

[Scots Crusader]

France and Ukraine to qualify from the group. England 3rd. I think you will beat Sweden, Loose to France and Ukraine.

 

[Grinner]

I just know that I will get sucked into the vortex of false hope, pain and eventual disappointment yet again...just as it's been since 1982.

 

[Bilbo]

The key is to make us difficult to beat. I don't see many goals in the side without Rooney, so at least one point going into the Ukraine match should be enough if - as expected - we beat Ukraine.

After that who knows. Its cup football after all, and I have a that Hodgson will be a good manager for us.

Having said that, I'm always hopelessly optimistic about England at any tournament. We could lose all three games.

 

[Canuckred64]

Expectations have to be at all time low, so that may actually help and the players might be more relaxed. If they beat the French in the first game watch for the band wagon to take off and the pressure will be back on.

France has a very good team, young, fast, skillful, with practically two good players in every position. They will have a strong bench and there will be quality players coming in to tip the balance if needed if any of the group games are still up for grabs in the last 20 minutes.

Ukraine has the advantage of playing at home. They also have a good midfield, with everyone talking about Andriy Yarmolenko as one of the "new" players to watch at this tournament. They also have Konoplyanka and Gusev in their midfield and England's midfield could have problems getting the ball back. Throw in Shevchenko who is supposed to have regained some of his form and Ukraine won't be a push over.

Sweden like Cling Bak says always gives England a tough game and I don't expect any different this time. The Swedes do play attacking football so Ibrahimovic will get his goals, but like Ukraine they aren't very good defensively.

The French are a very good dark horse to win the competition and I expect them to win this group. It's a toss up who finishes second. Hodgson, I suspect will set England up to play with two defensive midfielders and try to score on the counter. Both Sweden and Ukraine play attacking football and are supposed to be weaker at the back than England, so that maybe the edge that gets England second in the group.

However, with Spain or Italy waiting in the quarter finals, just getting out of the group stage might be as good as England can hope for.

 

[peterstorey]

I think England will get out of the group in second place and that'll be it. Mind you if Terry, Cole and Lampard bring their lucky horseshoe they'll probably go all the way.

 

[KingEric7]

I think it could look like this:

Hart
Johnson - Terry - Cahill - Cole
Barry - Lampard
Walcott - Gerrard - Young
Carroll​

Crikey, how ridiculously underwhelming does that look?

Wouldn't surprise me if we failed to qualify for the group stages.

 

[Grinner]

Indeed...when you see it in front of you like that in black and white, you realise that we're incredibly shit.

 

[Canuckred64]

Does anyone else think that England setting their headquarters up in Poland in Krakow will hurt their chances?

They face a 540-mile trip to Kiev to play Sweden and have to travel 930 miles to Donetsk, to play France and Ukraine. Both France and Sweden are staying in the Ukraine with the French supposed to be in Donetsk.

 

[stubie]

Despite being English I could not honestly give a shit about England this summer.

The Media as usual will hype up England as the favourites

 

[Cling Bak]

Despite being English I could not honestly give a shit about England this summer.

The Media as usual will hype up England as the favourites

No, they won't.

I don't expect us to beat the French, but if - as many others have said - we can prove difficult to break down and beat then taking a couple of points from the first two games would be fine. Hodgson's teams tend to be tough to break down and despite how uninspiring our best XI looks on paper, I am optimistic about Hodgson's record in cups and at International level.

He made Switzerland into a pretty decent outfit, comfortably qualifying for '94 and '96 whilst getting them to third in the FIFA rankings. He's managed Inter and Fulham to UEFA/Europa Cup finals and WBA have been very solid under his tenure more recently.

That said, all this is probably geared to setting us up for the next four years, rather than any expectation that we'll become good overnight. England has had a soft centre for years, whimpering out when the going gets tough so we can't expect anything different immediately. Frankly, Capello was the biggest and best coach we've had for years and he didn't manage anything better than half decent, though its a shame he didn't finish the job going into this tournament.

 

[Grinner]

The Swiss qualification for Euro 96 was fairly underwhelming though. They had the lowest points total of any group winners. I see tight, boring games with 1-0 scorelines as the best we have to look forward to.

 

[Crustanoid]

I'll probably get in the beers and watch the games, with an interest in England winning, but I have no expectations, and fully expect to see them capitulate. It might even be quite amusing seeing the likes of Carroll and Terry spacking around for 3 matches

 

[Grinner]

I'm considering having a bet on the big man getting a red card against the French.

 

[Gazza]

I think we'll play roughly the XI that Cling Bak put in the OP

I don't think we'll get past the group stages. In fact, I could see England coming home with just one point.

 

[Sam]

Was genuinely looking forward to the Euro's, until that squad was announced. Seriously, its just such a uninspiring load of old bollocks again. Barry, Terry, Johnson, Downing, Carroll, Milner etc etc The same old mind numbingly shit football will follow.

Would have loved it if we'd just had some balls and gone with the kids. Like Germany did a few years ago. Send the youngsters and give them the big tournament experience that would be invaluable a few years down the line. Smalling, Jones, Walker, Richards, Welbeck, Barkley, Rodwell, Cleverley, Sturridge, Ox-Chamberlin etc etc. They're not world beaters yet, and they wouldn't win it (neither will the current squad) but it'd give them a far better chance in years to come.

 

[Carl]

That midfield trio of Barry, Lampard and Gerrard just made me shudder.

 

[Randall Flagg]

I have a feeling they will do better than expected.

Out on pens in the semi's

It's a real shame some of you have no interest.

Cannot wait for the Irish games

 

[Gazza]

I have a feeling they will do better than expected.

Out on pens in the semi's

It's a real shame some of you have no interest.

Cannot wait for the Irish games

it might be a shame but it's understandable, given the past record of these players (2008 and 2010 especially).

 

[Pexbo]

In a dream world, with no injuries I'd line this team up pre Rooney:

Hart

Walker - Smalling - Ferdinand - Cole

Carrick - Scholes
Oxcha -------Cleverley------- Young

Welbeck​

I don't even care that Cleverley is unproven and that this is major United bias how much more exciting would that be.

 

[Canuckred64]

it might be a shame but it's understandable, given the past record of these players (2008 and 2010 especially).

For me it's hard getting over Terry's attempted coup last time, but when push comes to shove what can you do if you are English other than back them.

 

[Gazza]

For me it's hard getting over Terry's attempted coup last time, but when push comes to shove what can you do if you are English other than back them.

Back them how? I'll watch the games, and if I was there at the matches in person I'd support them vocally ... but that's not really anything to do with objectively looking at the team and evaluating how worthwhile it's going to be to watch them

 

[Canuckred64]

Back them how? I'll watch the games, and if I was there at the matches in person I'd support them vocally ... but that's not really anything to do with objectively looking at the team and evaluating how worthwhile it's going to be to watch them

I agree, all you can do is watch and hope they do better then most of us expect. No matter how poor you may think they will do, I will still find it disappointing when they are eliminated from the tournament.

 

[Gazza]

I agree, all you can do is watch and hope they do better then most of us expect. No matter how poor you may think they will do, I will still find it disappointing when they are eliminated from the tournament.

Of course. Especially since we often go out in games that are very close and dramatic. The penalty shoot-outs of 1996, 1998, 2004 and 2006 hurt so much because they came at the end of 120 minutes of football at the end of which you'd convinced yourself England might just do it.

However, it's easier to take if England are clearly out of their depth (2010 for instance, or 2000) and you just don't want any more humiliation. And it softens the blow if the teams left in the competition are high quality, means you can enjoy the spectacle as a neutral.

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

In theory international football could be the welcome antidote to some of the excesses of the club game, although this idea is stop cold if consecutive England managers pick 11 egos and teams better suited to paper than grass.

Looking ahead, aim fearful that we are exchanging the decade long problem of Lampard-Gerrard for Lampard-Gerratd-Rooney. Why two people reading on each othef's toes w hen you can have three eh?

 

[Bilbo]

I have a feeling they will do better than expected.

Out on pens in the semi's

It's a real shame some of you have no interest.

Cannot wait for the Irish games

It is a shame. I don't understand the attitude of some England fans, and it makes me wonder how quickly these people would lose interest in United if/when we find ourselves out of the running for a season or three.

Being a non-Manc United fan, watching England in tournaments is probably the best experience I have in football. Everyone pulling for the same team, and the pub is rocking. Sure beats sitting in a pub around a bunch of blokes who just want United to lose, regardless of who we are playing.

 

[Rood]

In a dream world, with no injuries I'd line this team up pre Rooney:

Hart

Walker - Smalling - Ferdinand - Cole

Carrick - Scholes
Oxcha -------Cleverley------- Young

Welbeck​

I don't even care that Cleverley is unproven and that this is major United bias how much more exciting would that be.

Id even play Jones at right back
Cleverley is a pick too far, but stick Rooney back in the team and I guarantee that team would do better than whatever team Roy manages to cobble together

 

[Cling Bak]

Was genuinely looking forward to the Euro's, until that squad was announced. Seriously, its just such a uninspiring load of old bollocks again. Barry, Terry, Johnson, Downing, Carroll, Milner etc etc The same old mind numbingly shit football will follow.

Would have loved it if we'd just had some balls and gone with the kids. Like Germany did a few years ago. Send the youngsters and give them the big tournament experience that would be invaluable a few years down the line. Smalling, Jones, Walker, Richards, Welbeck, Barkley, Rodwell, Cleverley, Sturridge, Ox-Chamberlin etc etc. They're not world beaters yet, and they wouldn't win it (neither will the current squad) but it'd give them a far better chance in years to come.

Thing is, Germany didn't just 'go with the kids'. In 2010, yes they promoted a lot of the successful U21 side, but they also had Wiese, Butt, Lahm, Mertesacker, Friedrich, Schweinsteiger, Podolski, Klose, Cacau, Gomez all there.

As I listed in a previous post, a lot of this England squad have not been to a tournament before and we have promoted lots of U21's over the past 2 years.

For me, more risks could have been taken and Sturridge, Richards, Walker, Wilshere (both those two injured, in fairness) should/could all be involed too. But it's still quite an inexperienced and youthful look.

I'll be getting behind us as after this tournament, many of the older lads will not play much longer anyway, so I'm hoping a semi-decent showing will leave us bright for the future.

That midfield trio of Barry, Lampard and Gerrard just made me shudder.

Indeed. That was only my prediction though, it could be different. If fit, Parker and Wilshere would've played, ideally Scholes wouldn't be retired and Rooney would play off the main striker. So that's not the manager's fault. My prediction was based on Rooney not available so I think he'll pair Gerrard with Carroll rather than play Welbeck, though he still might.

The annoyance is that Carrick isn't seen as first choice. He should be. Again, not Hodgson's fault that he turned down the chance to be in the squad. In the end, with quite a few players not available, leaving Lampard, Gerrard and Barry behind isn't a very clever option. And I'm loathed to say that.

 

[Maciej]

Welbeck missed today's training.

England may start with Carroll and/or Defoe against Norway on Saturday.

 

[kouroux]

So if Carroll starts that friendly there are big chances he might start the Euro 2012.Nice!!

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

Johnson missed training which temporarily pushes Jones up the pecking order at right back.

Carroll and Defoe huh, can we resist catapulting the football up field?

 

[B20]

Johnson missed training which temporarily pushes Jones up the pecking order at right back.

Martin Kelly to start then.

 

[B20]

Again, not Hodgson's fault that he turned down the chance to be in the squad.

Have Carrick or Roy actually said that or is this just the rationalisation people are making? I've seen several people say this, but not any references.

 

[KingEric7]

I hope someone has said it because, if not, failing to take Carrick after his form this year is one of the biggest cock ups Hodgson could've made. It's baffling that Carrick isn't in that England squad...

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

Martin Kelly to start then.

Probably. *cringe*


Re: Carrick

It is partly Hodgson's fault if he persists in maintaining the Gerrard-Lampard-Barry status quo. Which has been ghastly stuff at tournaments time after time.