European Super League

[Classical Mechanic]

I have been reading a lot of about this Super League today and watching a lot of reactions. Some background about where my views are coming from here: I was born in Poland but grew up in America. I followed the World Cup and Euros but that was essentially it. My cousin visited me in the States and began to show me United matches and got me into the club. This was late 2000s. I haven't missed a Champ League or Premier League match since. I fell in love. The passion, the history, the structure, everything. It all meant something. I missed the majority of United's glory years but went back to watch a lot of it. It was incredible.

I was a massive NFL and NBA fan growing up. Once I got into (proper) football, it all seemed pointless. Teams in those two leagues get rewarded for being bad. You get rewarded for losing. Think about that concept. The NBA regular season is largely irrelevant. The NFL season? The best teams do not win. The New England Patriots were 18-0 going into the Super Bowl and lost. The playoffs are one and done. They were by far the best team that season and lost one game and were not champions.

Meanwhile in football, you get the best teams that win the league each season. There are no massive flukes because you cannot luck your way into a title. Even Leicester deserved on merit the season they won because they were the best team that season (maybe not most talented but irrelevant). Even the Champions League you have group stages and two matches for elimination prior to the final.

This Super League is an absolute joke for many reasons I have seen mentioned and someone that rarely get mentioned. The Champions League is something you look forward to during a work day here. I love working from home because I can pull up midweek games and watch them. In the office, I can stream them on my phone and still enjoy. It is an amazing competition and has incredible moments. Sure, the big teams win this. However, you still have great storylines. Giant slayers happen all the time. For a lot of these clubs, those are moments they remember. Scoring against United, beating City at home, going to Real Madrid and playing there. For a lot of teams (Belgian, Swiss, Polish, Ukrainian, etc.) these are the moments they do not forget. Those are now gone. Real Madrid should be absolutely ashamed for doing this. The Champion's League is a competition they are kings in. They are so admired in this competition and they will piss it all away. Disgraceful.

Domestically, what is the point? The second you are out of the title race, why even try? Liverpool would be resting players by New Years this season. Why compete in the EPL when you are still playing so many games in the super league? Getting 2nd, 3rd, 4th in the EPL is irrelevant. So once City or Liverpool or United get a comfortable lead then why keep trying? All 6 English teams will not remain competitive in the EPL so I would guess at least 3 will be resting players by New Years to focus on Super League placement (if they even care about that). It destroys the competition in domestic leagues. What about teams like Leicester, West Ham, Aston Villa? These teams can overtake Spurs easily (or already have) as the consistent top finishers. Now they do it for nothing. What is the point of the season once a team has a somewhat comfortable lead.

There is no risk for the big teams. No reason to push for the league. No reason to compete. The money will constantly come in and it will be mostly the same every season. You will push to win the Super League but once that is out of the realm of possibility, what is the competition? Spurs will be walking through the motions in the Super League within a month. They will not be punished for not being competitive because their owner is on the board. It is a complete joke of a league where teams will not get punished. I hope the Leagues, UEFA and FIFA come down on this. It will ruin mid table clubs and make winning the league even more impossible.

Good post.

 

[Jazz]

There will be a compromise somewhere. I finally read the statement on the app.
Firstly, from a totally objective point of view - it makes sense business wise. Otherwise, they will need to address certain issues which isn't covered by their current plans (but they acknowledge this). (This is just looking at it dispassionately)

However, I felt throughout like it was another European competition - only this time instead of UEFA calling the shots, it is these elite clubs (mostly elite clubs). I dunno. What's the difference between these people? Nothing.
And UEFA has shown in the past that they will punish a non-elite club over FFP issues, yet give a pass to other more 'visible' clubs. So I don't get the outrage - neither party has the moral high ground here.

But like I said, something will be worked out.

 

[Mike Smalling]

People are upset their clubs are increasing their revenue and yet build huge stadiums to increase their revenue. A lot of ivory tower in here

No, you are dead wrong! People are upset because the clubs are trying to increase their revenue at the expense of fair competition. That's the key bit. I am all for getting an official tractor sponsor if it means more money for transfers, wages, etc. But this is a blatant cash grab that damages the integrity of the sport.

 

[Ixion]

People are upset their clubs are increasing their revenue and yet build huge stadiums to increase their revenue. A lot of ivory tower in here

I have literally no club what comparison you're making here. There are lots of ways a club can increase their revenue, it doesn''t mean they're all as right or wrong as each other. Allowing more fans into the stadium to watch the games is not the same as joining some plastic competition where teams can't be relegated.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

This isn't going to help though. UEFA is full of greedy insecure babies.

 

[Ixion]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I want this to happen. If these clubs don't want to be part of the Champions League and Europa League then boot them all out immediately and let other teams take their place next year.

 

[justsomebloke]

Money and quality wise, the ESL is a much better proposition than the fifa/uefa model.

However, the beauty of any competition is having the little teams surprise the big ones.

If they find a way to also invite other teams, like the UCL now does, the current competitions are in trouble.

Other than that, I don't see anything wrong with it. It's not like uefa and fifa haven't been corrupt as feck in the last 30 years.

What's wrong with it is that you don't qualify on merit. The one positive about having billionaire owners is that they actually have to invest huge sums maintaining very good football teams, because otherwise there's an acute risk of missing out on CL qualification. No more. You've got a free ride.

 

[crossy1686]

It's not a competition because it's not based on merit. How can you not see that this is the reason people object to it, and why all the comparisons you want to make to the money in football elsewhere are irrelevant. Yes football may already be a corrupt cash cow but you have to win games to earn a place in the CL and if you don't win games you can be relegated from the PL.

Of course it's based on merit, but it's based on a merit that no one likes. It's based on viewing metrics and popularity of a club, that's what gets you in the SL, something which successful clubs like United have worked hard on for decades. If we all get kicked out of the PL and lets say Southampton go on to win it multiple times, will they grow a bigger following? Will they get access to the SL? Of course they will.

Top 4 isn't a trophy, United aim to win all competitions they play in, that won't change. And the fear of relegation isn't something that's been spurring us on for decades.

 

[HackeyC]

It would also go straight to CAS and I imagine the club's affected have taken robust advice on this.

 

[balaks]

Your team just built a new stadium so more fans could watch them play and therefore increase their revenue. That's okay but playing in a competition is 'sickening'? That's some moral dilemma you've got there

What are you blabbering on about now? You don't have talk some tripe. Is that the best you have? Spurs built a new stadium so thats just as 'bad' as them gutting the Premier League and Champions League? What planet are you on mate?

 

[VorZakone]

All these false comparisons with the problems with UEFA, FIFA, the CL, clubs funded by oil magnates and nation states and all the other things that are problematic about modern football are missing the point.

You do not get into this 'competition' on merit.

There's no way past that, for me. Leicester's league win would not have earned them a chance to play in it. If West Ham get fourth this season, that will not earn them a chance to play in it. Football may have structurally undermined its own meritocracy in a number of ways already but the principle remains that you can play your way to the top. The ESL would end that principle.

Finally someone acknowledging this. It amazes me how many people ignore this.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

If this is UEFA's approach to posturing against the rebels, then the Super League probably kicks off by 2022 with no issues whatsoever.

 

[devilish]

That amazing manager got them nowhere in UCL 2 season's in a row - GS elimination. This season they're only winning the Serie A because of that potato of a manager Juve has

Conte is an excellent manager and he's got a quite an excellent team to work with.

 

[B20]

Surprised that PSG aren't in already.

The three open slots seem clearly designed for bayern, dortmund and PSG to enter as founders.

 

[crossy1686]

What's wrong with it is that you don't qualify on merit. The one positive about having billionaire owners is that they actually have to invest huge sums maintaining very good football teams, because otherwise there's an acute risk of missing out on CL qualification. No more. You've got a free ride.

The teams in it have huge followings and interest outside of the UK. They're being rewarded for winning things and having fans.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

So they want the money from this Super League and the money from the PL. Who'd have guessed. Pure greed.

 

[TMDaines]

Domestically, what is the point? The second you are out of the title race, why even try? Liverpool would be resting players by New Years this season. Why compete in the EPL when you are still playing so many games in the super league? Getting 2nd, 3rd, 4th in the EPL is irrelevant. So once City or Liverpool or United get a comfortable lead then why keep trying? All 6 English teams will not remain competitive in the EPL so I would guess at least 3 will be resting players by New Years to focus on Super League placement (if they even care about that). It destroys the competition in domestic leagues. What about teams like Leicester, West Ham, Aston Villa? These teams can overtake Spurs easily (or already have) as the consistent top finishers. Now they do it for nothing. What is the point of the season once a team has a somewhat comfortable lead.

I’ve seen a few people make this point and I believe it reveals more about them, than it says about the clubs and players. I’m amazed by how many people are now openly admitted that the PL for them is in large part just an extended qualifying competition for Europe.

Give athletes and the sporting departments of football clubs a bit more credit. Most footballers and managers compete for the love of the game and proving themselves. League structures exist in all sports all around the world and are proven as a successful sporting format.

People are genuinely lamenting the death of a top four race, which I am amazed by. This has been the antithesis of what domestic football has been about for over a 100 years.

 

[justsomebloke]

This isn't going to help though. UEFA is full of greedy insecure babies.

Unfortunately, I think you're right. If they throw the clubs out of national competitions and, worse still, ban players from playing for national teams, that just destroys what remains of their own competitions, and turn the SL into even more of a threat. Which the SL clubs have no doubt anticipated.

 

[VorZakone]

People are upset their clubs are increasing their revenue and yet build huge stadiums to increase their revenue. A lot of ivory tower in here

You are missing the point.

 

[Superden]

Can't believe how many are in either in favour or apathetic about this. It reeks of entitlement from elements of our fan base.

And the idea about the entertainment on offer from the 'best playing the 'best' every week ? Those snorefests we had against Chelsea, Liverpool and arsenal at home this season have been washed out from peoples minds.

 

[crossy1686]

Man, you're not getting the point at all.

I am, but there's a lot of people on high horses in here who themselves would sell their granny for the money available in the SL. Football isn't dead, it's going to be fine.

 

[duffer]

I've seen a couple of tweets suggesting that Chelsea and Man City didn't want this and were backed into a corner to "join up or be left out".

Stinks of a club leak to try and paint themselves as victims and only makes them look weak in my opinion. If it's true, Roman and the Man City people should've said "we don't need the money, feck off".

 

[VorZakone]

So they want the money from this Super League and the money from the PL. Who'd have guessed. Pure greed.

It is scandalous stuff.

 

[Brightonian]

Of course it's based on merit, but it's based on a merit that no one likes. It's based on viewing metrics and popularity of a club, that's what gets you in the SL, something which successful clubs like United have worked hard on for decades. If we all get kicked out of the PL and lets say Southampton go on to win it multiple times, will they grow a bigger following? Will they get access to the SL? Of course they will.

Top 4 isn't a trophy, United aim to win all competitions they play in, that won't change. And the fear of relegation isn't something that's been spurring us on for decades.

I'm so sorry, let me clarify. By 'merit', I meant winning football matches. Not winning on social media.

 

[youmeletsfly]

Why?

Because I like to watch strong games and I'd like to watch them weekly if I could.

 

[TMDaines]

So they want the money from this Super League and the money from the PL. Who'd have guessed. Pure greed.

As opposed to money from the CL and PL? Pure greed.

 

[BFernandes]

A lot of over the top outrage with this.

It'll soon become the norm and we'll then wonder how we ever managed without it.

The only thing wrong with it is that Spurs are in it. How can a team that has won just a single trophy in 13 years (and that being the Carabao Cup) be included?

 

[balaks]

I'm ashamed that Spurs are part of this but having said that as all this new league is about money surely people can understand that Spurs who are now in the top 10 most valuable clubs in the world should be in the 12 clubs. This just emphasises what a joke the thing is - your clubs value is based on money not history.

 

[VorZakone]

I've seen a couple of tweets suggesting that Chelsea and Man City didn't want this and were backed into a corner to "join up or be left out".

Stinks of a club leak to try and paint themselves as victims and only makes them look weak in my opinion. If it's true, Roman and the Man City people should've said "we don't need the money, feck off".

It does make you think whether the Americans pushed this through.
(Kroenke, Glazers and FSG)

 

[slored1]

Yep, the mighty Midtjylland and Lincoln Red Imps battling it out in a Champions League final any day now, what a time to be alive.

If you've got to play two qualification rounds to get into a tournament, you've got no business being there.

That is a mindset of someone insanely privileged and spoiled. How many clubs should then realistically exist? 10? What's the point of having millions of professional footballers if only 200 of the best can do the trick? Disgusting attitude.

 

[Kingantti1874]

It's actually the elites saying "we want a fair share of what we actually bring to the table for once" and there's nothing wrong with that.

I know it's trendy at the moment to be all doom and gloom and see this as the death of football but none of that is going to happen. Look around at other sports and tell me where an influx of money has ruined the game? People said exactly the same thing as this when the CL came along, guess the game was ruined and owners made quick bucks a long time ago then?

The self declared elites you mean?

They weren’t the elites until TV arrived, they took the revenue and the fan base grew, the revenue attracted wealthy owners who fancied a slice of the cake and now they fancy an even bigger share of the TV cake. And putting that aside what iselite about Arsenal or Tottenham?

It’s got nothing to do with the best v the best, that should not even be a thing.The pyramid gets steeper every year. Football was far better when the resources were spread evenly.

 

[Eugenius]

The only way this could be stopped is:

All other clubs in the Prem/La liga/Bundesliga/Italian/French leagues decide not to sell players to the Superleague clubs.

In 3 years the SL clubs would be fecked.

No Mbappes, no Bruno, etc.

They could have all the money in the world, yet, they couldn't spend it.
Sure, you could buy brazilians and other South Americans....

They will sign a ton of free agents on stupid money though.

 

[Mike Smalling]

On a lighter note...

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[Annihilate Now!]

The NFL merged with the AFL and it didn't ruin American football. The NBA merged with the ABA and it didn't ruin basketball. The National League and American League started playing interleague games and it didn't ruin baseball.

It seems absurd that some of the best players in the world might go their entire careers without facing each other. I get why traveling fans would be dismayed because it's ruining a culture built up for a century... but just in terms of the football it seems silly that the best aren't always playing the best.

When has this happened in recent years?

 

[JPRouve]

I'm so sorry, let me clarify. By 'merit', I meant winning football matches. Not winning on social media.

Even on social media, I don't really see how Leipzig merits more than Marseille or Ajax.

 

[duffer]

To those people who think it'll be cool to play in big games every week, they won't be big games after a couple of rounds of fixtures.

We'll genuinely be looking forward to FA cup games against Bolton over yet another game against Barca.

 

[crossy1686]

I have literally no club what comparison you're making here. There are lots of ways a club can increase their revenue, it doesn''t mean they're all as right or wrong as each other. Allowing more fans into the stadium to watch the games is not the same as joining some plastic competition where teams can't be relegated.

Why are people obsessed with relegation all of a sudden? We haven't been relegated for decades and now we don't want to play in a competition where we can't be forced to play teams like Granada every week just because we had a bad season last year? From what I under stand the final stages of the SL involve knock out football so there's your 'relegation'.

 

[Brightonian]

The teams in it have huge followings and interest outside of the UK. They're being rewarded for winning things and having fans.

They're being released from the requirement to try and win things. They're being told that the things they won historically are enough and what happens going forwards is no longer relevant. Everyone else is being told that it's too late to play their way to the top - they missed the cut-off.

 

[youmeletsfly]

You don't see anything wrong with teams being exempt from relegation based on their brand? As a football fan that doesn't seem wrong?

And when these games are being played in other countries and the clubs become more and more detached from where they were from, and your season ticket is just access to a streaming service, you'll still see nothing wrong?

As I said above, if they could find a way to get other teams in the competition, I don't see the issue. By other teams I'm referring to inviting them not based on their status and glamour.

As to the ticket holder argument, I do not see its point. United will still play in the EPL.

 

[::sonny::]

The most curious thing is that any player or manager said something about this