Fantasy Draft: NoPace VS Pedro/Balu

Who would win based on their peak?


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Annahnomoss

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Team NoPace
My Path to Victory
: My players will be instructed to press once they get within 10 yards of half. Messi, Suarez, Xavi, Vidal, Simeone, Roberto Carlos and Reuter were all quick and excellent at hassling players, and Busquets, Hansen and Campbell were all world-class defensively in their prime.

I think I can starve Baggio and Van Nistelrooy of the service they need, since my midfield is just better than his. Brady, Seedorf, Sousa and Ancelotti were all good passers, but none of them were so good that they couldn't be nullified by a midfield of the quality I possess.

I think I'd win 2-1, with Messi getting one, Balu's strike pair accounting for another one and a late run from Vidal, Xavi (fantastic in his prime at this) or Roberto Carlos accounting for another, either via an assist or a goal.

Offensively, against Balu I see my team as having 2 main strengths:

(1) The individual skill of Messi and Suarez, an all-time great and a player who is unplayable at his best and has an incredible record both for club (2 in 3 for both Ajax and Liverpool) and internationally (38 in 77). There's no denying that Balu has an incredible defense, but players like Messi and Suarez can trouble anyone due to their dribbling prowess.

(2) The passing ability of Messi, Xavi and Suarez finding the late runs of Vidal, Xavi, Roberto Carlos, Simeone and Reuter. The movement, positional versatility and passing ability of Messi and Suarez means that even Balu's CB's will find themselves exploitable to late runs from Vidal and Xavi centrally and then Carlos and Reuter from wider.

Defensively, I have a centre back pairing with 2 wonderful all-arounders in Alan Hansen and Sol Campbell. The fullbacks are Roberto Carlos, was always an underrated defensive talent and Reuter was technically excellent defensively while being faster than most fullbacks who challenged him. Kopke was a top keeper whose performance at Euro 96 has not yet been matched by a tournament winning keeper, in my view.

More importantly, I have a midfield that I think is the strongest in the draft defensively. Busquets is a fantastic DM, Vidal and Simeone are absolute pitbulls either side of him and Xavi is a solid defensive player who could run for days in his prime and whose ability to get open and collect passes under pressure were vital in Spain's incredible defensive record during their 3 peat.

Baggio and Van Nistelrooy is a nice striker pairing, but I think I can starve them from service with my midfield diamond stopping Balu's midfield from getting them the ball. Balu's midfield is good, but lacking top-end creativity, though Seedorf and Brady come close.


Team Balu & PedroMendez



Formation: 5-3-1-1

The side is build around the famous Baggio. The system is designed to maximize his impact. We pursue a fairly balanced, but defensive approach.

Defense:
The team is build to absorb pressure. The centerpiece of the defense are three all-time great centrebacks. NoPace has two player, that will constantly attack the box. Even so Suarez and Messi are exceptional dribbler, one centreback will always be able to cover for his partner. Its the ideal situation for the defense to play 3v2 in this area. Considering the individual quality, the physical superiority and great tackling skills, it will be very hard for NoPace to break the center.
The center is supported by two of the most versatile fullbacks in the draft. Whenever his fullbacks are going forward, they´ll be picked up. When his forwards are trying to elude the central cover at least one CB can follow them without opening space behind him.
The midfield is shielding the defense against any support from his midfielders. While Sousa will harass Xavi directly, Brady and RvN will try to prevent passes to Xavi. When Vidal bombs forward, Seedorf will pick him up, while Brady does the same, IF Simeone goes forward. Only Baggio gets a "free pass". He wont strain himself on defensive duties.
The sheer amount of bodies and the individual skill will create an almost impenetrable defensive force, that feels comfortable to absorb pressure for 90 minutes.

Defensive transition:
The team isnt build to press the opponents, so they´ll fall back towards their goal. The team wont play a high-line, so the three centre backs will "stay deep" anyway. This will prevent counterattacks and allows the rest of the team to drop back in position after losing the ball. Its very unlikely to be caught off-guard, when Thuram, Bergomi and Kohler are still covering for Preud'homme


Offensive transition:
The offense has several option. Sitting deep with Baggio high up the pitch the first option after winning the ball is to use very direct counterattacks to catch his defense on the break. Bradly, who was a exceptional dribbler and great passer, tries to conquer as much space as possible before sending Baggio on his lethal track to score. RvN will try to join him near/in the box proving passing/scoring alternatives. The fullbacks will only commit forward, if they dont have a direct opponent (e.g. Liza might have space against Reuter). Losing the ball during these counterattacks wont be a problem, because the back5/4 and Sousa are still in place.

Offense:
I)
When counterattacks don´t promise success, the team will slow down, while the fullbacks will go forward providing maximal width and stretching the field. Thuram, Bergomi and Sousa are all comfortable with the ball, keeping possession and playing solid balls to Bradi/Seedorf.
II) Brady is the "heart of the team" and controls the game. He has a similar role (slightly more offensive) like Modric has for Real. He´ll constantly pick up the the ball deep trying to push forward and distribute it. He is a dynamic, complete midfielder with exceptional dribbling skills, close control, passing and vision. With Sousa covering for him, he´ll also constantly join the attack. His dribblings in and around the box and his ability to play the deadly pass allows him to link up perfectly with Baggio and RvN.
III) Seedorf will play the role as a modern versatile b2b player, like in his days at Milan. He´ll join the attack, offering a passing alternative for Bradi and Baggio, while also being a threat on his own.
IV) Baggio has the freedom to roam and to single out the "weakest link". Doing that he´ll escape the marking of Sergio/Simeone. He´ll constantly attack the space around Carlos, who has weaknesses considering his positioning and the defensive tackle.
V) The fullback are a vital part of the offense, both skilled enough to beat men in 1v1s and famous for their great crosses. Especially Amoros will link up with Baggio and Seedorf to outnumber and pressure Carlos. He is the the soft spot in the defense line.
VI) Ruud will stay in the box and convert through-balls, deflections and crosses. His natural ability to score is exactly what the team needs.

Setpieces:
Baggio was on of the best setpiece takers of all time. His free-kicks were incredible and are another goal threat. With the physical presents of Kohler, Bergomi, Seedorf, Thuram and RvN corners are also dangerous.

Routes to goal:
the flexible offensive approach opens various ways to score. The team can score on countattacks (Baggio/Brady), crosses(Liza, Amoros, RvN), setpieces (Baggio) and playing through the middle (brady, Baggio, Seeforf RvN). It will be hard for NoPace to focus on a single area to prevent goals.

Summery: I expect a very physical, lowscoring game. NoPace is forced into possession, but will struggle to do anything meaningful with the ball, while my team has various different ways to score. Once ahead he´ll struggle to comeback.
 
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Annahnomoss

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What a nightmare to have Suarez and Messi around the box when their team has so much possession. Not sure if falling low is the solution to handling them as they don't have to dribble past any of the CB's, just earn one yard to get a free shot at goal from very close.

On the other hand it is possible that the sheer quality of Pedro's centre-backs could make up for it by never being beat, and any time it happens the second centre back is already there with a foot. Seems unlikely though unless they'd actually double up on whoever had the ball, but that would free up chances elsewhere.

Just seems to be a very clear route to goal in a situation which would occur repeatedly throughout the game. Sooner or later one of those shots will bounce in or go in.

On the other side I can't see Baggio having the best of games against such a packed central area. Amoros/Lizarazu's crosses will be the main route to goal for Pedro in my eyes and it will be a perfect game for RVN who is one of the best at turning half-chances to goals.
 

crappycraperson

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Not sure what to make of noPace's formation.

2 things - Suarez upfront with Messi.... Surez likes to be involved in build up play, something that is Messi's domain here. He likes to go wide, here that would be a good thing but then who provides the presence in the middle. He is also not good enough to have an impact against Balu's defense. Not good enough to beat either of those 3 CBs 1 v 1 . A bit redundant.

MF --- Overkill. Don't need one of Vidal/Simeone.. better off with another attacker be it a striker or a winger.
 

PedroMendez

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Busquets, Vidal and Simeone all excel on the defensive end. It looks like Saurez, Xavi and Messi are quite isolated from the rest of the team. They have great quality, but the space will be really tight and there will be a lot of elite-defenders to stop them. Even if Carlos joins them, they are still brutally outnumbered. I just dont see any "clear route to goal" against the central defense.

On the other side, my attack is not focused on his central defense. Baggio or Amoros can easily exploit the space behind Carlos, when he goes forward.
NoPace has a quality midfield, that shields his center, but it looks like "too much of the same type". There dont has to be much activity in this area, if these 3 players hold their position. I pointed out, that especially Baggio can play in different areas. He always excelled, when coaches allowed him to "do his own thing" and roam around. He was absolut worldclass in this role and only struggled, if manager tried to put him in a unflexible system.
Busqets, Vidal and Simeone will struggle to find their men or being dragged out of position, which opens up exactly the room, that Brady or Baggio can exploit.
 
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NoPace

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Basically, I see the solidity of my midfield as winning balls and providing the ball to Messi and Suarez to and allowing themselves to dribble at defenders and know that if they lose it, it won`t lead to a huge threat on the counter, especially with the lack of pace and attacking width on the other team.

Balu can talk about Amoros and Lizarazu being good crossers, and they were, but how often did a cross of theirs lead to a goal, either by assist or a rebound or 2nd assist? Maybe 4-5 assists over a season each? Even with Ruud as a target, 75-80% of games will pass without those fullbacks providing a key cross.

Balu has excellent defenders, but at some point Suarez and especially Messi will go on a run and beat one or two players, since that`s what they do.

He writes that he`ll give me possession and force me to counter, but my team is perfectly set up to deal with counters, with the mobility and tackling aggression of prime Xavi, Vidal, Simeone and my very pacey fullbacks snuffing out counters before they even get to my 3 main defensive players.

I think it`s an ugly game as his counter-attacks die and Messi and Suarez have trouble with the number and quality of central defenders on the other side, but Messi`s dribbling and Xavi`s passing over the top are enough to make me the more likely scorer.
 

Balu

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What a nightmare to have Suarez and Messi around the box when their team has so much possession. Not sure if falling low is the solution to handling them as they don't have to dribble past any of the CB's, just earn one yard to get a free shot at goal from very close.

On the other hand it is possible that the sheer quality of Pedro's centre-backs could make up for it by never being beat, and any time it happens the second centre back is already there with a foot. Seems unlikely though unless they'd actually double up on whoever had the ball, but that would free up chances elsewhere.

Just seems to be a very clear route to goal in a situation which would occur repeatedly throughout the game. Sooner or later one of those shots will bounce in or go in.

On the other side I can't see Baggio having the best of games against such a packed central area. Amoros/Lizarazu's crosses will be the main route to goal for Pedro in my eyes and it will be a perfect game for RVN who is one of the best at turning half-chances to goals.
Come on, dribbling past 2 alltime great centerbacks and then shooting against a brilliant goalkeeper isn't really a 'very clear' route to goal? I give you Messi as a constant danger (obviously), but he will often face Bergomi here with Kohler helping out, that's a brilliant combination to defend against him. And I can't see how Suarez vs Thuram (I expect Suarez to drift more to his prefered left side) is really a big problem for me, when it comes to goalscoring. Suarez' record against the better teams doesn't look dangerous at all. And NoPace's biggest problem is that he can't really use the playmaking of either of his strikers. Both love to drop deeper and get involved, but he already packed his midfield.

I'm also surprised that you see Baggio in a packed central midfield here. When NoPace is playing such an intense pressing high up the pitch, how will he crowd the area around Baggio when I'm counterattacking?


But I leave the discussion to Pedro for now, don't want to make it 2vs1. Good luck @NoPace
 

Balu

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Oh and @Annahnomoss
could you add something like 'Team NoPace at the top of the opening post? It's a bit confusing when you start reading and don't know which team's tactics you actually read in the beginning ;).
 

crappycraperson

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Basically, I see the solidity of my midfield as winning balls and providing the ball to Messi and Suarez to and allowing themselves to dribble at defenders and know that if they lose it, it won`t lead to a huge threat on the counter, especially with the lack of pace and attacking width on the other team.

Balu can talk about Amoros and Lizarazu being good crossers, and they were, but how often did a cross of theirs lead to a goal, either by assist or a rebound or 2nd assist? Maybe 4-5 assists over a season each? Even with Ruud as a target, 75-80% of games will pass without those fullbacks providing a key cross.

Balu has excellent defenders, but at some point Suarez and especially Messi will go on a run and beat one or two players, since that`s what they do.

He writes that he`ll give me possession and force me to counter, but my team is perfectly set up to deal with counters, with the mobility and tackling aggression of prime Xavi, Vidal, Simeone and my very pacey fullbacks snuffing out counters before they even get to my 3 main defensive players.

I think it`s an ugly game as his counter-attacks die and Messi and Suarez have trouble with the number and quality of central defenders on the other side, but Messi`s dribbling and Xavi`s passing over the top are enough to make me the more likely scorer.
Can you highlight a good Suarez performance against defense of this caliber or anywhere close to this quality? What was that stat again.. about half his league goals against bottom 4. He also failed to produce his best against Chelsea who are the only team in PL right now with a solid defense. We will how he does in Europe next season but asking him to dribble past two of Thuram, Bergomi, Kohler is a tough ask. It is one thing for Messi to do it, another for anyone else in your team.

I do agree with you that opposing team could have done with at least one ultra attacking full back.

Also do you really need both Simeone and Vidal in there? Surely another body forward would be a better option. I know Vidal can go forward but not the same against a side built to absorb pressure.
 

crappycraperson

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@PedroMendez - Is anyone gonna step out of your defense when Messi drops deep? As you say Sousa is on Xavi, Seedorf tracks Vidal, Brady picks up Simeone. So does any one stop Messi to pull the strings? I know noPace lacks a proper presence upfront for him to pick up but a running Carlos, Vidal and Suarez are some options.
 

PedroMendez

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Basically, I see the solidity of my midfield as winning balls and providing the ball to Messi and Suarez to and allowing themselves to dribble at defenders and know that if they lose it, it won`t lead to a huge threat on the counter, especially with the lack of pace and attacking width on the other team.

(...)
He writes that he`ll give me possession and force me to counter, but my team is perfectly set up to deal with counters, with the mobility and tackling aggression of prime Xavi, Vidal, Simeone and my very pacey fullbacks snuffing out counters before they even get to my 3 main defensive players.

I think it`s an ugly game as his counter-attacks die and Messi and Suarez have trouble with the number and quality of central defenders on the other side, but Messi`s dribbling and Xavi`s passing over the top are enough to make me the more likely scorer.
Actually Baggio and Brady are the perfect players for counterattacks. Both very fast, very good in 1v1s with great finish. I am not sure if Hansen, Campbell or Carlos are particularly great to stop counterattacks.

If he doesnt commit at least 2-3 more players forward, one of my CBs will follow either Messi or Suarez, because that wont open up space in the central. I really struggle to understand how he wants to score with 3 attacking players. On the other side If Vidal, Carlos and Simeone are also going forward, he opens up acres of space to counter.

edit: I am also not only playing for counters. When he plays cautiously without pressing, I am happy to follow my alternative tactics as I described in the opening post. If he presses against the ball and allows his (defensive)midfielders to join the attack, counterattacks are a very direct route to score. If he doesnt do that, his only way to score is Messi dribbling past 2-4 players, while I can still have to ability to score with crosses and setpieces.
 
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Annahnomoss

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Come on, dribbling past 2 alltime great centerbacks and then shooting against a brilliant goalkeeper isn't really a 'very clear' route to goal?
I don't think he has to dribble past two that was what I meant. Messi just needs to earn enough space to get a shot of which the first defender can't block - he never has to get past the defender.

I think Messi has the dribbling to earn a yard on his defender and get a shot off more often than not.

I am not sure if a three man CB line is the best idea when your opponent has little wide threat and no aerial threat, I don't see the benefit. Having a sweeper behind the two other CB's would have been preferable IMO, who would be ready to handle Messi/Suarez break-throughs.

That way your full-backs could play extremely narrow whenever the opponents full-backs weren't in a position to challenge on the outside.

I agree with some that considering how amazing those three centre-backs are I would have loved to see a more offensive approach in terms of full-backs. To really get the best out of the drafts best defensive line, they needed to be put in a really difficult situation.

Here they have been played in maybe the least demanding way possible, two defensively great full-backs on the outside. I would have liked to see a more offensive approach overall and then relying on those three's excellence to handle the counters that comes.
 
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NoPace

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@PedroMendez - Is anyone gonna step out of your defense when Messi drops deep? As you say Sousa is on Xavi, Seedorf tracks Vidal, Brady picks up Simeone. So does any one stop Messi to pull the strings? I know noPace lacks a proper presence upfront for him to pick up but a running Carlos, Vidal and Suarez are some options.
People seem to overlook this, but Vidal has been a consistent 1 in 3 scorer for multiple seasons now. He gets 10 or 11 goals a year in the league alone.

We each have 2 attackers who got tons of goals, but Vidal has a much better goal record than anyone else out there.

Xavi averaged 9 goals a year over the 5 seasons (all competition, so about 50 games) I would probably call his prime. That`s more of a goal threat than Brady or Seedorf offer either.

So yeah, expect a fair amount of Vidal runs in behind, some well-timed Xavi runs (which he seemed to especially excel in during big matches) and Xavi and Messi`s passes to find Roberto Carlos and Reuter runs out wide, like the kind Alba and Alves have been lucky enough to receive.
 

Balu

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People seem to overlook this, but Vidal has been a consistent 1 in 3 scorer for multiple seasons now. He gets 10 or 11 goals a year in the league alone.

We each have 2 attackers who got tons of goals, but Vidal has a much better goal record than anyone else out there.

Xavi averaged 9 goals a year over the 5 seasons (all competition, so about 50 games) I would probably call his prime. That`s more of a goal threat than Brady or Seedorf offer either.

So yeah, expect a fair amount of Vidal runs in behind, some well-timed Xavi runs (which he seemed to especially excel in during big matches) and Xavi and Messi`s passes to find Roberto Carlos and Reuter runs out wide, like the kind Alba and Alves have been lucky enough to receive.
I'm pretty sure Trappatoni called him the main goalscorer from midfield and playmaker in that Juve side at the beginning of the 80's when they won two consecutive league titles.


It's somewhere in there. And I'm pretty sure that was a far more impressive Serie A than the one Vidal is playing in at the moment. He might not have the numbers if you compare stats, but that has less to do with abilitiy than with the league back then.
 

Annahnomoss

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If he doesnt commit at least 2-3 more players forward, one of my CBs will follow either Messi or Suarez, because that wont open up space in the central. I really struggle to understand how he wants to score with 3 attacking players. On the other side If Vidal, Carlos and Simeone are also going forward, he opens up acres of space to counter.
What do you mean more specifically? 2-3 more players forward? More than just Suarez and Messi?
 

NoPace

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I'm pretty sure Trappatoni called him the main goalscorer from midfield and playmaker in that Juve side at the beginning of the 80's when they won two consecutive league titles.


It's somewhere in there. And I'm pretty sure that was a far more impressive Serie A than the one Vidal is playing in at the moment. He might not have the numbers if you compare stats, but that has less to do with abilitiy than with the league back then.
He scored half the number of goals. Not sure this can be skewed.
 

PedroMendez

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Vidal has so many goals, because he takes pens. More than half of his goals for Leverkusen are pens and I think he scored 14 pens for Juve. Without them his scoring stats would be way less impressive. With Seedorf marking him, who had a equal physical presence, I dont think the is a big offensive threat. Xavi is a great tiki-taka player, but apparently thats not what NoPace wants to play. Xavi never was a very dynamic player whos strength was to dribble past men. His passing and the ability to control the ball (never losing it) are his biggest strength.
On the other side Brady and Baggio were both great goal-threats on their own. Brady was able to play either as CM or as AM and was fantastical in both roles. Both were far better classic offensive player than any of NoPace midfield.
@Annahnomoss: I disagree, that Suarez, Messi and Xavi on their own can do a whole lot. If only Messi and Suarez are going forward they have to play 2v3, while Xavi is constantly pressured by Sousa. Isnt that the dream of every coach? I´d struggle way more if he would only have one forward, but a stronger offensive midfield.
At least NoPace needs the support of Carlos and Vidal to add additional passing options. At this point its getting more important for my CBs to hold position, while following Messi or Suarez is getting less viable.

Edit: I am struggling a bit to answer at the moment, because now I actually have at work.
 
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crappycraperson

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People seem to overlook this, but Vidal has been a consistent 1 in 3 scorer for multiple seasons now. He gets 10 or 11 goals a year in the league alone.

We each have 2 attackers who got tons of goals, but Vidal has a much better goal record than anyone else out there.

Xavi averaged 9 goals a year over the 5 seasons (all competition, so about 50 games) I would probably call his prime. That`s more of a goal threat than Brady or Seedorf offer either.

So yeah, expect a fair amount of Vidal runs in behind, some well-timed Xavi runs (which he seemed to especially excel in during big matches) and Xavi and Messi`s passes to find Roberto Carlos and Reuter runs out wide, like the kind Alba and Alves have been lucky enough to receive.
Sorry mate. Went with Pedro here. It mainly came down to not rating Suarez in this match up and lack of another body upfront. I also rate Baggio a lot so he gets a lot of credit from me.
 

NoPace

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Also do you really need both Simeone and Vidal in there? Surely another body forward would be a better option. I know Vidal can go forward but not the same against a side built to absorb pressure.
I figured in this tournament, with the quality being so high, it was worth it to have 2-way players like Vidal and Simeone out there to maximize Busquets and Xavi`s freedom, as well as free up Roberto Carlos a bit.

I will add, though, that if it became clear that I needed more attacking skill, I do have the option of bringing on Koke, who the best writer in football had in his starting XI for Europe for the season: http://www.zonalmarking.net/2014/06/02/european-team-of-the-season-201314/ He`d provide more creativity while not sacrificing a ton in tackling and running, as he is a beast. If Vidal or Simeone are knackered with 15-20 to go, he`s a logical sub who can play the shuttling roles they`re performing here.
 

Annahnomoss

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@PedroMendez I didn't even mention Xavi, Suarez and Messi and how they'd beat your entire team alone. You must have confused me with someone else.
 

PedroMendez

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What do you mean more specifically? 2-3 more players forward? More than just Suarez and Messi?
@PedroMendez I didn't even mention Xavi, Suarez and Messi and how they'd beat your entire team alone. You must have confused me with someone else.
I just tried to explain in which situation one of the centerbacks is willing to follow either Messi or Suarez, if they drop deeper/leave the center and in which they rather try to hold their positions. If other players (Vidal, Carlos, Simeone = 2-3) starting to contribute offensively especially with runs in the box, they have to stay in position, while else they are able to close down Messi or Suarez very efficiently.
 

Annahnomoss

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I just tried to explain in which situation one of the centerbacks is willing to follow either Messi or Suarez, if they drop deeper/leave the center and in which they rather try to hold their positions. If other players (Vidal, Carlos, Simeone = 2-3) starting to contribute offensively especially with runs in the box, they have to stay in position, while else they are able to close down Messi or Suarez very efficiently.
Alright makes sense. Then I know about it. But don't you consider using one of them as a sweeper as the better option? What does the three man CB line have as an advantage over using a sweeper in this game?

For me the threat of the opponent is nearly only central penetration in which case having a sweeper and more narrow full-backs to counter that is better? Whereas a three man CB line would be superior if the opponent wanted to score through crosses to the box or by beating you down the wings.
 

Annahnomoss

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No pace doesn't have a designated goalkeeper?
I was laughing at it earlier as people had already voted. Shows that we really need a reform regarding goalkeepers like we have been talking about. Playing without one doesn't even make you lose votes.
 

antohan

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I figured in this tournament, with the quality being so high, it was worth it to have 2-way players like Vidal and Simeone out there to maximize Busquets and Xavi`s freedom, as well as free up Roberto Carlos a bit.

I will add, though, that if it became clear that I needed more attacking skill, I do have the option of bringing on Koke, who the best writer in football had in his starting XI for Europe for the season: http://www.zonalmarking.net/2014/06/02/european-team-of-the-season-201314/ He`d provide more creativity while not sacrificing a ton in tackling and running, as he is a beast. If Vidal or Simeone are knackered with 15-20 to go, he`s a logical sub who can play the shuttling roles they`re performing here.
So much expectation... then I read Koke.
 

PedroMendez

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Alright makes sense. Then I know about it. But don't you consider using one of them as a sweeper as the better option? What does the three man CB line have as an advantage over using a sweeper in this game?

For me the threat of the opponent is nearly only central penetration in which case having a sweeper and more narrow full-backs to counter that is better? Whereas a three man CB line would be superior if the opponent wanted to score through crosses to the box or by beating you down the wings.

Well.....I dont disagree. Our plan was to use a sweeper, but we had to change that, because we realized too late, that a sweeper cost more top-player-points than a CB. That said I am pretty happy with the lineup. I think on the defensive end, the difference is marginal. The central player in a 3-men defense is usually pretty flexible, while the offense of the team works well without him.
 

Annahnomoss

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Well.....I dont disagree. Our plan was to use a sweeper, but we had to change that, because we realized too late, that a sweeper cost more top-player-points than a CB. That said I am pretty happy with the lineup. I think on the defensive end, the difference is marginal. The central player in a 3-men defense is usually pretty flexible, while the offense of the team works well without him.
A sweeper would be allowed without changing TP points as he'd operate behind the defense and not everywhere like a libero.
 

Balu

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A sweeper would be allowed without changing TP points as he'd operate behind the defense and not everywhere like a libero.
But what sweeper would do a better job here than Bergomi?

:lol: I sense a rant coming
I knew that. But I don't see a sweeper who's better here than the 3 centerbacks we have? Even someone like Sammer as a pure sweeper not being allowed to step out in midfield would be weaker than Bergomi in the middle of those 3.
 

Balu

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Re the keeper keeper. To be fair to NoPace, he wrote in his write-up about Köpke. Pretty sure he called his performance at the Euro '96 better than Schmeichel's in '92 though, which really is a bit strange.
 

Annahnomoss

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But what sweeper would do a better job here than Bergomi?


I knew that. But I don't see a sweeper who's better here than the 3 centerbacks we have? Even someone like Sammer as a pure sweeper not being allowed to step out in midfield would be weaker than Bergomi in the middle of those 3.
I was thinking more like using Bergomi as a sweeper as he played there in the Catenaccio style defense as well. Which would be really similar to how he'd play here.