France Football's Ballon D'Or Dream Team Nominees

[united_99]

These lists are usually - apart from obvious exceptions like Best, Messi or Ronaldo - heavily in favour of those who have won world cups.
This is unlucky for some players but still I can understand it.

 

[The White Pele]

I hate the modern categorisation of midfielders into either being “defensive” or “attacking”. It means that some great players get criminally underrated in these discussions because they didn’t score as many goals as player x and they don’t fit the description of “defensive” as well as player y. Certain formations require midfielders to be good at both and it does not do justice to true “engine-room” midfielders like Keane and Vieira to classify them as “defensive”. There are very few “defensive” midfielders in my view.

 

[TMDaines]

Interesting sets of nominees, but aside from the goalkeepers each seems ludicrously biased against England-based players. The only defenders and midfielders nominated who played meaningfully in England are Moore, Gerrard, Alonso and Charlton. Also Gullit in his twilight years.

 

[Infordin]

I only just noticed that they classified Pele as a midfielder but not Cruyff

 

[Marcosdeto]

why messi or ronaldo arent there?

 

[Lay]

why messi or ronaldo arent there?

Not good enough.


Or they’ll be in the strikers list

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Too many brazilians in that list if they included Alves.

I haven't seen a better attacking full back from over the last 2 decades.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

Cannavaro, Guardiola, Totti and Gerrard do not belong on that list.

I understand people don't rate Ramos that highly but he has to be there based on how significant he was to a team that achieved so much.

 

[Marcosdeto]

Not good enough.


Or they’ll be in the strikers list

ooops, no striker list yet, my bad

"not good enough"

 

[Paula]

I haven't seen a better attacking full back from over the last 2 decades.

Philipp Lahm?

 

[Gio]

I hate the modern categorisation of midfielders into either being “defensive” or “attacking”. It means that some great players get criminally underrated in these discussions because they didn’t score as many goals as player x and they don’t fit the description of “defensive” as well as player y. Certain formations require midfielders to be good at both and it does not do justice to true “engine-room” midfielders like Keane and Vieira to classify them as “defensive”. There are very few “defensive” midfielders in my view.

Agree. There is a mix in there between deep-lying playmakers alongside a handful of proper box-to-box midfielders (Matthaus, Neeskens, Tigana, Tardelli, Rijkaard). But it seems to be skewed towards the former given the inclusion of Guardiola, Alonso and Busquets, who in my view should be behind the likes of Breitner, Schweinsteiger, Davids, Keane and Vieira in any combined ranking.

 

[giorno]

Having Messi competing with Maradona wouldn't make much sense unless you're using the current version of Messi. Both of Messi's peaks were clearly in forward positions – as a false 9 and as a right forward, while Pelé, Maradona etc. usually had at least one player playing directly in front of them (usually two). Cristiano's peak was, again, as a left forward. They're competing with the likes of Rummenigge & Stoichkov in terms of their roles; for Messi a case can be made for him to be competing with Cruyff as both were at their best as false 9s. Pelé only played as a clear forward in his younger days – most notably during his breakthrough 1958 World Cup campaign.

But not really. The difference between Messi, Pelé and Maradona(and Cruyff) is in how their teams were set up around them. They played virtually the same roles, occupied the same areas of the pitch, and played in pretty much the same way, too

 

[Redplane]

At least the goalie list is close to perfect. Kahn is indeed a surprising omission but that's about what I wouldve picked otherwise as well.

 

[RoyH1]

These kinds of list will never make everyone happy and there will always be glaring omissions and headscratching additions. That said, I think that this is a pretty good list. Very balanced overall.

 

[Hammondo]

Missing people like Kroos, Ramos, Irramendyy, Irramendi

Ramos is there, Kroos isn't available hat good.

 

[Hammondo]

Missing Nesta and Keane.

 

[Bebestation]

Why would Keane get in to the best midfielders of all time?

Sure there is some questionable entries and omissions but Keane isnt going to get in to this best XI of all time stuff.

Just my opinion.

 

[harms]

Why would Keane get in to the best midfielders of all time?

Sure there is some questionable entries and omissions but Keane isnt going to get in to this best XI of all time stuff.

Just my opinion.

Because he is one of the best midfielders of all time. There are a few better than him, like Matthäus, Rijkaard and Neeskens, but that list is very short. Shorter than France Football's shortlist of nominees.

 

[GifLord]

They're not picking players based on their quaity but by how much they've won as footballers
But then again there's Gerrard and Totti...

 

[JJ12]

Could Totti be the most overrated player ever

 

[giorno]

Could Totti be the most overrated player ever

No

 

[JJ12]

No

He’s vastly overrated so yeah

 

[Fortitude]

Why would they go from 10 nominees for the defenders to 20 for the midfield?

I can understand being stuck between a rock and hard place with someone like Koeman, as he's close to the pinnacle of what a ball-playing CB is, but to put him and also Ramos in in lieu of CB's like Nesta and Kohler makes the list redundant. Even then, putting Cannavaro in over Nesta makes no sense as the criteria shuffles from one place to another to make that so.

There are other obvious omissions already mentioned by others, but it's hard to get past the glaring errors at CB. They should have just expanded the list to 20 across the board for the outfield positions and have 10 of one type to go with 10 of the other. That way, you have the best of both worlds which can be combined as the voters view fit.

I'm betting the final vote will pair two ball-players together: Baresi and Beckenbauer, and that'll be that.

 

[giorno]

He’s vastly overrated so yeah

He's not. One of the 3 best italian players of the last 50 years, and that's not really up for debate by anyone with a bit of sense and objectivity

 

[GifLord]

He’s vastly overrated so yeah

Nope. In his prime easily a top 10 player in the world. A joy to watch

 

[JJ12]

He's not. One of the 3 best italian players of the last 50 years, and that's not really up for debate by anyone with a bit of sense and objectivity

What on earth would I have against Totti to not be objective.

Buffon, Nesta, Pirlo and Cannavaro all better for a fecking start.

Top 20 attacking player of all time - as if.

 

[JJ12]

Nope. In his prime easily a top 10 player in the world. A joy to watch

Top 20 attacking midfielder of all time - no chance.

overrated, and that’s not to say he wasn’t good.

 

[GifLord]

Top 20 attacking midfielder of all time - no chance.

overrated, and that’s not to say he wasn’t good.

I meant during his prime in early to mid 00s he was easily a top 10 player in the world and Italy's best player.

 

[Bobski]

Most of the names are perfectly fine, and those not included illustrate the incredible historic depth of quality that sets football apart from other sports. That quality is why I find the GOAT arguments so tedious, perhaps it is a worthwhile argument when discussing a sport like Basketball with the much smaller player base and restrictive physical requirements to reach the peak, but in a worldwide sport like football there are so many great players to look back on.

Totti is an odd one, he was talented and an iconic figure but he didn't reach the heights of his contemporaries in that list. Gerrard has no argument being selected as a DM, though he could easily knock Totti out of that list as an attacking midfielder.

 

[GifLord]

Most of the names are perfectly fine, and those not included illustrate the incredible historic depth of quality that sets football apart from other sports. That quality is why I find the GOAT arguments so tedious, perhaps it is a worthwhile argument when discussing a sport like Basketball with the much smaller player base and restrictive physical requirements to reach the peak, but in a worldwide sport like football there are so many great players to look back on.

Totti is an odd one, he was talented and an iconic figure but he didn't reach the heights of his contemporaries in that list. Gerrard has no argument being selected as a DM, though he could easily knock Totti out of that list as an attacking midfielder.

Based on what? His fluke UCL win?

 

[giorno]

What on earth would I have against Totti to not be objective.

Buffon, Nesta, Pirlo and Cannavaro all better for a fecking start.

Top 20 attacking player of all time - as if.

Not even close, feck me as if a goalkeeper, two centerbacks and a midfield playmaker could be better than an all time great #10

Him not being a top 20 all time #10 is debatable, but as i said it doesn't really matter. That list stops at Pelé, Maradona and Di Stefano

 

[JJ12]

Not even close, feck me as if a goalkeeper, two centerbacks and a midfield playmaker could be better than an all time great #10

Him not being a top 20 all time #10 is debatable, but as i said it doesn't really matter. That list stops at Pelé, Maradona and Di Stefano

feck me only attacking players matter? What a waste of my time you are.

Totti, you are proving is incredibly overrated.

 

[giorno]

feck me only attacking players matter?

No, just significantly more valuable. There's a reason most of the best player ever discussions are largely about great #10/forwards. They are generally the best, most important players around

I also find it weird that Totti is the one you'd zero in out of that list considering who else is on it

 

[Bobski]

Based on what? His fluke UCL win?

I don't think Gerrard should be in the list but if it is a choice between he and Totti, 2 players i consider fairly flawed, then I would probably go for Gerrard.

Totti is one of those players, everyone has one, that for all the hype and praise, I never seemed to catch him playing well.

Just on some pf the recent comments, is Totti considered to be better than Baggio or Del Piero in Italy? That would surprise me, especially given how mediocre Totti was at international level.

 

[JJ12]

No, just significantly more valuable. There's a reason most of the best player ever discussions are largely about great #10/forwards. They are generally the best, most important players around

I also find it weird that Totti is the one you'd zero in out of that list considering who else is on it

That doesn’t mean Totti was better than any of them. He absolutely wasn’t. To suggest he was the best Italian player in 50 years absolutely summarises my point anyway.

 

[JakeC]

I'm sorry, but Koeman and Ramos over Rio and Nesta? Gerrard as a DM? This list is a travesty.

I bet the caf can come up with something that is miles better than this...

Unforgivable, Nesta not being in there is absolutely shameful.

Yashin
Schmeichel
Buffon
Casillas
Van Der Sar
Neuer
Kahn
Zubizarreta
Zoff
Maier

Top 10 GKS for me, with Banks and Cech just missing out.

 

[giorno]

I don't think Gerrard should be in the list but if it is a choice between he and Totti, 2 players i consider fairly flawed, then I would probably go for Gerrard.

Totti is one of those players, everyone has one, that for all the hype and praise, I never seemed to catch him playing well.

Just on some the recent comments, is Totti considered to be better than Baggio or Del Piero in Italy? That would surprise me, especially given how mediocre Totti was at international level.

Better than Del Piero, absolutely. Only Juventus fans would tell you Del Piero was better, and then not even all of them. There's more of an argument for Baggio, though part of it is romanticism. Baggio though i think is generally considered either the best or second best italian player since Valentino Mazzola. The other one is Gigi Riva

 

[Vooon]

Desailly was no where good enough to figure on that list. He was a good CB, but no way he was better than Nesta or Rio. Hell, I'd rank Jaap Stam above him as well.

And what's this about Pep? He doesn't belong in that company does he?

 

[Bebestation]

Because he is one of the best midfielders of all time. There are a few better than him, like Matthäus, Rijkaard and Neeskens, but that list is very short. Shorter than France Football's shortlist of nominees.

Well I'm okay with the opinion and theres a lot of people echoing what you say, so your most probably right.

To me though just off the top of my head I pick Schweinsteiger, Seedorf, David's, gullit, Kroos, Modric, Xavi, Pirlo,scholes, zidane, Gattuso that have been atleast equal to him in ability and success.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Midfield list is digrace for football.
Guardiola, Redondo, Busquets??

And where the feck is Modric?