Greatest goal creators

[Demyanenko_square_jaw]

Here's some data for Bundesliga creative players i had saved from Kicker assist ratings if anyone is interested. They started collecting them from the 88/89 season. League only.

Thomas Häßler:

Koln:
88/89 = 33-3
89/90 = 34-5

Karlsruher:
94/95 = 33-13
95/96 = 34-10
96/97 = 17-5
97/98 = 34-12

Borussia Dortmund:
98/99 = 18-1

1860 Munich:
99/00 = 33-9
00/01 = 32-7
01/02 = 29-12
02/03 = 21-4

Andreas Möller:

Borussia Dortmund:
88/89 = 29-7
89/90 = 32-14
94/95 = 30-9
95/96 = 23-13
96/97 = 26-14
97/98 = 26-4
98/99 = 30-9
99/00 = 18-3


Eintracht Frankfurt:
90/91 = 32-8
91/92 = 37-10
03/04 = 11-0

Schalke:
00/01 = 32-11
01/02 = 32-3
02/03 = 22-4

Stefan Effenberg:

Borussia Monchengladbach:
88/89 = 29-5
89/90 = 29-2
94/95 = 30-11
95/96 = 31-6
96/97 = 29-6
97/98 = 28-8

Bayern Munich:
90/91 = 32-4
91/92 = 33-7
98/99 = 31-5
99/00 = 27-12
00/01 = 20-5
01/02 = 17-3

Wolfsburg:
02/03 = 19-4

Olaf Thon:

Bayern Munich:
88/89 = 32-11
89/90 = 20-3
90/91 = 25-5
91/92 = 24-6
92/93 = 32-1
93/94 = 15-2

Pierre Littbarski:

Koln:
88/89 = 30-11
89/90 = 34-11
90/91 = 15-6
91/92 = 36-13
92/93 = 26-10

Uwe Bein:

Hamburg:
88/89 = 28-7

Eintrach Frankfurt:
89/90 = 33-11
90/91 = 31-15
91/92 = 34-16
92/93 = 25-17
93/94 = 27-6


Mostly good productivity for what are more midfield oriented players, usually not having the benefit of greats (or even very goods) in front of them. Littbarski was a side-midfielder at that time, but still obviously very directly creative. Thon moved to the sweeper role by the end of his Bayern stage, so i didn't bother with his Schalke stats; he suffers from his initial Schalke period, where he was the young phenom of the league being absent. His career incidentally reminds me of Mario Gotze, though Thon's faded through injuries before his sweeper revival with Schalke, where Gotze had a specific debilitating condition.

 

[Demyanenko_square_jaw]

31 assists in all competitions in 2008/09 according to transfermarkt. Juan Mata actually surpassed that with 35 assists for Chelsea in 2012/13. He did play an unusual amount of matches and minutes (65 and nearly 5000 respectively) but that's a prodigious number nonetheless.

I think that late 00s-early 10s time is a good starting point for seeing the increasing chances of someone racking up big numbers, with the increasing concentration of talent in fewer clubs and the amount of games bigger CL level clubs could potentially play. What would have been in the 15-20 regions in the 90s and earlier in europe has a greater chance of going 10-15 better now.

 

[Gio]

@Demyanenko_square_jaw Those Uwe Bein figures are majorly impressive. He was such an incisive passer in congested central areas.

 

[Demyanenko_square_jaw]

yeah, he's an interesting player, probably one of the more underrated/forgotten creative midfielders of that era as far as status outside of his own league. Various injuries in the mid-80s and then not fitting in as well as others for the midfield partnership with Matthaus just as Germany were producing a great midfield generation seems to have cost him internationally. He was a more dominant, traditional 10/8 hybrid than the other younger emerging talents that were comfortable with the sidekick supporting midfield playmaker role like Hassler and Thon.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

yeah, he's an interesting player, probably one of the more underrated/forgotten creative midfielders of that era as far as status outside of his own league

Ha, I dont think I even recall his name even though have seen 1990 WC games

Having played so many drafts now, its amazing how little we know outside the big names.

 

[General_Elegancia]

Gianni Rivera is one of the best passers and creators of all time,he was like Xavi mixed with Iniesta but played at cam.
He is my favourite player,his imagination was out of this world(vs Ajax 69).

 

[General_Elegancia]

Johann Cryuff 74 had the most number key passes in world cup,in clubs he showed a lot of creator role especially during FC Barcelona days.
Messi-perfect attacker
De Bryune-arguably one of the best passers in 10 years
Zico-the best through ball passers that I've ever seen in my life.
Platini-one of the best long passers
Prime Xavi-he maybe a bit system player but the Barcelona's platfrom made him shine brightest
Michael Laudrup-through ball master
Ronaldinho
Diego Maradona-the greatest all around passers
Raymond Kopa
Gianni Rivera-my favourite,In my country webboard(soccersuck),I use him as a profile picture.
Peak Ozil can be in this list too.
Pele

This list wasn't arrange in order.

On Baggio and Totti number of assists

As a wide rule Baggio's number of assists were not sure
but they are 3 theories that I think can affected some of his numbers

1.His early career he was a pure secondary striker who focused more on dribbling and scoring than passing,so his numbers of assist didn't surprise me,if it a bit low.He went to play more playmaker at the late of 90s and 00s

2.Sirie A especially in 80s was a low scoring league.

3He was injured a lot of times,had many inconsistent(Inter and AC Milan) in his career plus he had a lot of problems with coaches too.

I guess it would be around 150-170 assists in his career,maybe 160-165 assists.
He played less than Francesco for 145 games and even Francesco assists,I have tried a lot of sources and it's look different every sources

1.222 assists
2.210 assists
3.201 assists (I trust your source and clip)

On Baggio I have talked to some Italian people in Italian webboard and they tell me Baggio had 165 assists in his career
The sources that I have found about him
first source is 160 assists
and another is 162 assists

I doubt that the number of assists he had was during 155-165 assitsts
for Totti,It would be 201 to 222 assists.

Difference would be 50-65 assists per game on 144 games difference
Totti had estimate 0.25 assists per game.
Baggio had estimate 0.23 assists per game.

Diego Maradona number of assists

Only in league
Argentinos Juniors
76 5 assists in 11games
77 16assists in 49games
78 11assists in 35games
79 13assist in 26games
80 20assists in 45 games

Boca Juniors
81 17assists in 40games

FC Barcelona

82-83 10assists in 20games
83-84 4assists in 16games

Napoli
84-85 5 assists in 30 games

At 25 years Diego already had 100 assists in league competitions.

85-86 4assists in 29games
86-87 3assists in 29games
87-88 10assists in 28games
88-89 10assists in 26games
89-90 13assists in 28games
90-91 3asisits in 18games

Sevilla
92-93 9assists in 26games

Newell's old boys
93-94 1assist in 5games

Boca Juniors
95-96 8assists in 24games
96-97 1assist in 1game
97-98 No assist in 5games

Overall in league platform he had estimated 163 assists in 491games

Other competitions
Copas(all countries) 33assists in 39games
Internacional 15assists in 33games

In club carrer he had overall 208 assists

In Argentina
He had 29assists in 91games .
In sub20 he had 22assists in 25games

Overall(Argen+club) he had estimated 259 assists in 705games

 

[Gio]

Thinking about that spectrum between a goalscorer and a creator, I've set one up based on the 'known' assist data out there. It charts the assists to goals ratio amongst second strikers and no10s, with Muller/Cristiano and Giggs/KDB included for illustrative purposes.

 

[duffer]

1st assist in here is sexual.

 

[Isotope]

Thinking about that spectrum between a goalscorer and a creator, I've set one up based on the 'known' assist data out there. It charts the assists to goals ratio amongst second strikers and no10s, with Muller/Cristiano and Giggs/KDB included for illustrative purposes.

That's an interesting take, and pretty easy to follow.

So just to give credit to best players by including their number of assists. Maybe have an XY graph, with Assists on Y axis, and Goals on X. I can see the like of Messi and Pele on the upper right corner.

If we want to be more pedantic, we can use the Assists/Game to Goals/Game ratios graph, to neutralize the influence of number of games played (more games, most likely more assists).

If you want to, I can setup ones, if you can give me the data, Gio.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Maybe have an XY graph, with Assists on Y axis, and Goals on X. I can see the like of Messi and Pele on the upper right corner.

If we want to be more pedantic, we can use the Assists/Game to Goals/Game ratios graph, to neutralize the influence of number of games played (more games, most likely more assists).

If you want to, I can setup ones, if you can give me the data, Gio.

That is a nice idea

 

[Physiocrat]

That's an interesting take, and pretty easy to follow.

So just to give credit to best players by including their number of assists. Maybe have an XY graph, with Assists on Y axis, and Goals on X. I can see the like of Messi and Pele on the upper right corner.

If we want to be more pedantic, we can use the Assists/Game to Goals/Game ratios graph, to neutralize the influence of number of games played (more games, most likely more assists).

If you want to, I can setup ones, if you can give me the data, Gio.

That would be cool, especially with the assists and goals per game numbers.

 

[Gio]

@Isotope Will send what I have over. Some of it is quite patchy, but the ratios are there to get a 'per game' picture.

 

[General_Elegancia]

@Isotope Your idea are very superb so I will send as much as informations as I have.

Juan Roman Riquelme number of assists

137 assists in League
2 assists in cup
47 assists in Continental
30 assists in Argentina(U20+U17+main)
Overall he had 216 assists in his 673 games career.

he had 0.25 assists per game.

Zinedine Zidane number of assists

125 assists in League
14 assists in cup
46 assists in Continental
42 assists in France(including U17,18,21 and b)
Overall ha had 227 assists in his 845 games career

he had 0.27 assists per game.

Ricardo Kaka number of assists

112 assists in League
9 assists in regional(Brazil's cup)
7 assists in cup
31 assists in Continental
29 assists in Brazil(including U20 and U23)

Overall he had 188 assists in his 762 games career

he had 0.25 assists per game.

Luis Figo number of assists

176 assists in League
21 assists in cup
41 assists in Continental
88 assists in Portugal(including U17,18,20 and 21)

Overall he had 326 assists in 983 games career

he had 0.33 assists per game.

Xavi number of assists

184 assists in FC Barcelona
28 assists in Al-saad
24 assists in Spain

Overall he had 236assists in 1051 games

he had 0.22 assists per game.

Ronaldinho number of assists

109 assists in League
14 assists in regional
16 assists in Copa
27 assists in Continental
63 assists in Brazil(including Olympic,U20 and U17)

Overall he had 256 assists in 858 games career

he had 0.3 assists per game.

Carlos Valderrama number of assists

152 assists in League
7 assists in cup
8 assists in Continental
41 assists in Columbia(including U20)

Overall he had 218 assists in 797 games
he had 0.27 assists per game

These are the case that I think I'm sure about informations 80 percents.
@Gio @Physiocrat @GodShaveTheQueen

 

[Isotope]

need goals per game also, if possible @General_Elegancia

 

[harms]

1st assist in here is sexual.

He was pretty great for you guys as well but early Arsenal Fabregas was so good... Insanely creative from those deeper positions, would've easily hit 20+ assists every season if not for their appalling finishing.

 

[General_Elegancia]

Difficult cases and I'm not sure about that too.

Johann Cryuff number of assists

He played in high scoring Dutch league so his number may be very high.

Ajax
64/65 3assists in 10games
65/66 8assists in 23games
66/67 18assists in 41games
67/68 16assists in 40games
68/69 23assists in 43games
69/70 34assists in 46games
70/71 15assists in 37games
71/72 29assists in 45games
72/73 19assists in 34games

Ajax and Barcelona
73/74 20assists in 28games
74/75 18assists in 38games
75/76 18assists in 38games
76/77 17assists in 36games
77/78 14assists in 42games

US Time(LA and Washington)
79 and 80 31assists in 54games

Ajax
81/82 11assists in 16games
82/83 14assists in 30games
83/84 17assists in 44games

Netherland
26assists in 48games

Overall he had 353 in his 710games
He had 0.50 assists per game.

Cryuff's goal contribution overall was 42.52 percents.

Alfredo Di Stefano

"The hardest one"
River Plate

45/46 8assists in 28games
47 16assists in 32games
48 10assists in 31games
49 5assists in 11games

Real Madrid
53/54 11assists in 28games
54/55 14assists in 32games
55/56 17assists in 32games
56/57 17assists in 43games
57/58 19assists in 44games
58/59 19assists in 43games
59/60 18assists in 34games'
60/61 18assists in 36games
61/62 18assists in 41games
62/63 11assists in 24games
63/64 13assists in 34games

Espanol
64/65 6assists in 27games
65/66 7assists in 33games

Overall he had 240assists in his 595 games.
He had 0.40 assists per game
The number of assists are estimated.

Di Stefano's goal contribution was 44.28 percents.
Di Stefano number of assists are estimated from a lot of sources.
I will continue tomorrow(in Thailand's time GMT+7)
This thread will have a lot of pages for sure.

 

[Isotope]

Data source: @Gio

Spoiler: Stats

Player	Goal Ratio	Assist Ratio	Notes
Puskas	0.99​	0.48​
Pele	0.92​	0.42​	RSSSF goals, games totals
De Bruyne	0.25​	0.41​
Ozil	0.16​	0.38​
Riquelme	0.26​	0.38​
Maradona	0.51​	0.37​
Neymar	0.59​	0.37​
T Muller	0.38​	0.34​
Beckham	0.17​	0.34​
Messi	0.80​	0.34​	Club and country
Zidane	0.21​	0.33​	Champions League and Real Madrid only
GIGGS	0.17​	0.32​	Ms Smoker Redcafe data
Silva	0.18​	0.31​	08/09 onwards
Figo	0.18​	0.31​
Ronaldinho	0.36​	0.30​
Fabregas	0.17​	0.30​
Laudrup	0.26​	0.30​	European Cup and international tournaments only
Mata	0.22​	0.28​	08/09 onwards
Kaka	0.30​	0.28​
Valderrama	0.11​	0.27​
Baggio	0.46​	0.27​
Robben	0.35​	0.27​
Hazard	0.28​	0.26​
Totti	0.39​	0.24​	All club
MULLER	0.85​	0.24​	Bundesliga only
Rivaldo	0.43​	0.22​
Scholl	0.24​	0.22​
CRISTIANO	0.73​	0.21​
Hassler	0.17​	0.20​	No Serie A

Note: Might be different if we only pick 3 best seasons.

 

[General_Elegancia]

Data source: @Gio

bellissimo lavoro(beautiful work)



@Gio @Isotope

 

[Isotope]

Puskas will be my first pick in every Draft.

 

[Isotope]

bellissimo lavoro(beautiful work)



@Gio @Isotope

I will include yours later, mate.

 

[Lay]

Riquelme.

 

[Physiocrat]

Great work @Isotope

Puskas wow!

DIdn't think Neymar would be so high

 

[harms]

bellissimo lavoro(beautiful work)



@Gio @Isotope

Puskás

 

[Isotope]

A bit discrepancy between @Gio and @General_Elegancia . Which one to use?

 

[Isotope]

Source: @Gio @General_Elegancia

Spoiler: DATA, see Note for explanation

Source	Player	Assist	Game	Assist Ratio	Notes
Elegencia	Cruyff	353	710	0.50​
Gio	Puskas	341	714	0.48​
Gio	Pele	355	840	0.42​	RSSSF goals, games totals
Gio	De Bruyne	188	458	0.41​
Elegencia	Di Stefano	240	595	0.40​	Assists number are estimated
Gio	Ozil	217	569	0.38​
Elegencia	Riquelme	256	673	0.38​
Gio	Neymar	165	443	0.37​
Gio/Elegencia	Maradona	259	705	0.37​
Gio	T Muller	230​	679​	0.34​
Gio	Beckham	283	844	0.34​
Gio	Messi	315	940	0.34​	Club and country
Gio	Giggs	310	963	0.32​	Ms Smoker Redcafe data
Gio	D Silva	177	575	0.31​	08/09 onwards
Gio	Figo	283	921	0.31​
Elegencia	Ronaldinho	256	858	0.30​	including Olympic,U20 and U17
Gio	Fabregas	214	722	0.30​
Gio	Laudrup	26	88	0.30​	European Cup and international tournaments only
Gio	Mata	155	550	0.28​	08/09 onwards
Gio/Elegencia	Valderrama	218	797	0.27​
Gio	Baggio	165	604	0.27​
Gio	Robben	191	702	0.27​
Elegencia	Zidane	227	845	0.27​	including U17,18,21 and b
Gio	Hazard	154	598	0.26​
Elegencia	Kaka	188	762	0.25​	including U20 and U23
Gio	Totti	186	785	0.24​	All club
Gio	Muller	101	427	0.24​	Bundesliga only
Elegencia	Xavi	236	1051	0.22​
Gio	Rivaldo	232	1037	0.22​
Gio	Scholl	129	594	0.22​
Gio	Cristiano	227	1085	0.21​
Gio	Hassler	124	618	0.20​	No Serie A

 

[Isotope]

- Cristiano is as good as Xavi, eh?

- also need more data on Laudrup. He looks lonely there. Just like Lukaku under Mourinho.

- Having Giggs and Beckham is like having two Messi lay off the ball.

 

[Gio]

@Isotope The only quibble I have is the Zidane data looks like it includes his Ligue Un and Serie A time where the assists aren't accurately recorded (unless someone has manually recorded them retrospectively). There's a big discrepancy between his assist ratio in the Champions League - basically the highest of anyone post 1992 - his Real assists (which are quite high) then compared with what is shown for Bordeaux and Juventus domestic games. The problem with Transfermarkt for a lot of their 1990s data is that the assists are only populated for a handful of games.

 

[Isotope]

@Isotope The only quibble I have is the Zidane data looks like it includes his Ligue Un and Serie A time where the assists aren't accurately recorded (unless someone has manually recorded them retrospectively). There's a big discrepancy between his assist ratio in the Champions League - basically the highest of anyone post 1992 - his Real assists (which are quite high) then compared with what is shown for Bordeaux and Juventus domestic games. The problem with Transfermarkt for a lot of their 1990s data is that the assists are only populated for a handful of games.

Make sense. I always think Zidane is one of the greatest goal creator.

Been searching any reliable source for assist, pre-2000 era. Those eras only care about goals, which is insane.

 

[General_Elegancia]

This thread is not gonna be finished yet,since I have more than 10+players to continue in this thread.
If I have time,I will continue this great thread.

There are a lot of players and great playmakers that we didn't add them to our list.

 

[General_Elegancia]

Michel Platini

Arguably one of the most famous name when it comes in term of "goal creators".
Let's look at his stats(the number of assists are estimated from a lot of sources)

Nancy
1972/1973 1assist in 5games
1973/1974 6assists in 23games
1974/1975 12assists in 38games
1975/1976 9assists in 38games
1976/1977 11assists in 39games
1977/1978 11assists in 45games
1978/1979 8assists in 23games

Saint-Eteine
1979/1980 15assists in 46games
1980/1981 16assists in 51games
1981/1982 13assists in 46games

Juventus
1982/1983 15assists in 52games
This season he was the top assister of the league.
1983/1984 10assists in 43games
1984/1985 7assists in 47games
1985/1986 11assists in 41games
1986/1987 15assists in 41games
This season he was the top assister of the league.

French
20assists in 71games

Overall he had 180assists in his 650games.
He had 0.28 assists per game.
The number of assists are estimated.

Platini's goal contribution was 44.50 percents.

Zico

Flamengo1
1971 2assists in 15games
1972 1assist in 6games
1973 6assists in 35games
1974 10assists in 46games
1975 13assists in 56games
1976 15assists in 47games
1977 14assists in 47games
1978 8assists in 22games
1979 16assists in 51games
1980 10assists in 45games
1981 16assists in 54games
1982 13assists in 50games
1983 9assists in 29games

Udinese
1983/1984 (played a lot at forward/ss) 6assists in 33games
1984/1985(Flamengo and Udinese) 6assists in 27games

Flamengo2
1986(got injured)1assist in 4games
1987 3assists in 17games
1988 5assists in 20games
1989 9assists in 27games

Brazil
20assists in 71games

Overall he had estimated 183assists in 702games.
He had 0.26assists per game.
The number of assists are estimated from a lot of sources/some of my informations.

Zico's goal contribution(goal+assists) was 48.82 percents.

Marco Van Basten

He had 117assists in 431 games(0.27 assists per game).

His goal contribution was 47.95 percents.

Ajax
1981/1983 8assists in 26games
1983/1984 6assists in 31games
1984/1985 20assists in 38games
1985/1986 4assists in 34games
1986/1987 16assists in 43games

Milan
1987/1988 3assists in 19games
1988/1989 13assists in 47games
1989/1990 6assists in 40games
1990/1991 10assists in 35games
1991/1992 13assists in 38games
1992/1993 5assists in 22games

Hollanda
13assists in 58games

KDB

Genk
2009/2010 4assists in 40games
2010/2011 17assists in 35games
2011/2012 15assists in 36games

2012-2016
2012/2013 10assists in 34games
2013/2014 8assists in 27games
2014/2015 28assists in 51games
2015/2016 15assists in 45games

Man City
2016/2017 21games in 49games
2017/2018 21games in 52games
2018/2019 11assists in 32games
2019/2020 23assists in 48games
2020/2021 17assists in 40games

Belgium
40asissts in 88games

Overall he has 230assists in 577games.
He has 0.40 assists per game(probably the best ratio ever,even better than Laudrup for sure).
His goal contribution is 34.74 percents.

@Gio @Isotope

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Nice info @General_Elegancia

Can update the image to the OP once we have a final one from @Isotope

 

[General_Elegancia]

Gerd Muller

Only scorer......nah man
Bayern
1965/1966 5assists in 39games
1966/1967 8assists in 45games
1967/1968 9assists in 46games
1968/1969 5assists in 35games
1969/1970 10assists in 38games
1970/1971 21assists in 47games
1971/1972 24assists in 48games
1972/1973 11asssists in 44games
1973/1974 13assists in 48games
1974/1975 17assists in 43games
1975/1976 5assists in 35games
1976/1977 6assists in 36games
1977/1978 9assists in 41games
1978/1979 no assist in 25games
USA
1979 17assists in 27games
1980 8assists in 35games
1981 2assists in 17games

West Germany
5assists in 62games

Overall he had 175assists from his 711 career matches.
He had 0.25 assists per game.
His goal contribution was 49.04 percents.

RIP Gerd

 

[Šjor Bepo]

@General_Elegancia can you do Thomas Muller?

 

[General_Elegancia]

@General_Elegancia can you do Thomas Muller?

Ok,mate
Tommorow I will do him.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Ok,mate
Tommorow I will do him.

<3

 

[Isotope]

I'll update it later, @General_Elegancia . I'm in super lazy mood. Which graph do you prefer? Assist ratio vs No. of game, or assist ratio vs goal ratio?

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

I'll update it later, @General_Elegancia . I'm in super lazy mood. Which graph do you prefer? Assist ratio vs No. of game, or assist ratio vs goal ratio?

I like the both a lot, I would suggest/request you take your own sweet time and do both (like @harms is doing with the draw in the draft)

 

[Isotope]

I like the both a lot, I would suggest/request you take your own sweet time and do both (like @harms is doing with the draw in the draft)

 

[harms]

I like the both a lot, I would suggest/request you take your own sweet time and do both (like @harms is doing with the draw in the draft)

It's not all on me! But it's a complicated system.