How much has football changed in the last 20 years?

[Righteous Steps]

I don’t think there’s a big difference between the old 9.5 or 10 in a two-man strike partnership and a modern false 9 in a front three. It’s basically the same gig but with two outlets bursting through instead of one. Bergkamp often played that role when he arguably hit his peak earlier in his career. Totti made the transition from 10 to false 9 during his own career and probably also hit his highest level in that role.

Agreed and I think even Arsenal had those two outlets in Henry and Lljunberg players who would make runs beyond Dennis and break through defensive lines.

 

[Marwood]

No Kane Aguero and Ronaldo aren’t similar players, Kane was the player with the most assists last season, he is far more than just out and out striker. Pep was actually benching Aguero till he bought into his ethos, Kane was the first target and not current day Ronaldo for him for that reason, Kane presses, score goals, drops deep into the number 10 position, while also being a physical presence.

Bergkamp and Cantona were much more similar to that sort of player, they’re both 6ft, strong technically gifted while also being able to play make and both have had seasons where they’re prolific particularly in their earlier years, Zola is different due to his lack of physicality and height he would probably be a wide forward/10 hybrid in modern day times.

I know Kane can do more than score and yeah he dropped deeper last season and how he's viewed shifted as a result.

But Cantona only score more than 20 once in his career. Bergkamp only did it once after he'd left Holland. Kane hasn't scored LESS than 20 since his breakthrough season. I don't need to go into Ronaldo and Aguero's goalscoring.

The old number 10 is very different from the current 9, even if the 9 is capable of dropping deep. Very different role.

We don’t have to guess at this, how Bergkamp or Cantona would be olayed higher up. We see today with Bruno, we've tried him as the false 9. Yeah it might sometimes work, give us something. He has moments in that. But we all know where he belongs, in that classic No.10 spot.

 

[Harry190]

It's the same game, but worse.

 

[Righteous Steps]

I know Kane can do more than score and yeah he dropped deeper last season and how he's viewed shifted as a result.

But Cantona only score more than 20 once in his career. Bergkamp only did it once after he'd left Holland. Kane hasn't scored LESS than 20 since his breakthrough season. I don't need to go into Ronaldo and Aguero's goalscoring.

The old number 10 is very different from the current 9, even if the 9 is capable of dropping deep. Very different role.

We don’t have to guess at this, how Bergkamp or Cantona would be olayed higher up. We see today with Bruno, we've tried him as the false 9. Yeah it might sometimes work, give us something. He has moments in that. But we all know where he belongs, in that classic No.10 spot.

But what about Firmino? Havertz? Bruno is not comparable to Bergkamp or Cantona in that he doesn’t provide the physical attributes these players did, both Bergkamp and Cantona were 6’0-6’2 of Bruno was the same height he would be a better option for that position himself. Both were far more of a number 9 than Bruno, I mean Dennis played loads of games as an actual number 9 for Ajax and Netherlands, Bruno hasn’t.

 

[Marwood]

But what about Firmino? Havertz? Bruno is not comparable to Bergkamp or Cantona in that he doesn’t provide the physical attributes these players did, both Bergkamp and Cantona were 6’0-6’2 of Bruno was the same height he would be a better option for that position himself. Both were far more of a number 9 than Bruno, I mean Dennis played loads of games as an actual number 9 for Ajax and Netherlands, Bruno hasn’t.

Take your point on them being more physical and more suited to that role. That's true. That's why I think they could do that role more comfortably than play like B Silva or KDB in a midfield three.

But Firmino has to put a proper shift in doesn't he? His role isn't the equivalent of that luxury, No 10 type. He isn't a creator, a goalscorer. He has a very specific role that allows others to shine. I don't think he's anything like the guys we've mentioned really.

Anyways that's my opinion, those old maverick 10's would have to change position and alter their game a fair bit to fit into todays system heavy approach. Which I think is a bit shit.

 

[giorno]

Anyways that's my opinion, those old maverick 10's would have to change position and alter their game a fair bit to fit into todays system heavy approach. Which I think is a bit shit.

You mean, like they already had to 25 years ago? Do you know why Zola moved to Chelsea in the first place? In Italy they kept shunting him off to the wing!

 

[abundance]

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I guess that to gen. alphas growing up this is gonna look like gaelic football or something

 

[Blackwidow]

Take your point on them being more physical and more suited to that role. That's true. That's why I think they could do that role more comfortably than play like B Silva or KDB in a midfield three.

But Firmino has to put a proper shift in doesn't he? His role isn't the equivalent of that luxury, No 10 type. He isn't a creator, a goalscorer. He has a very specific role that allows others to shine. I don't think he's anything like the guys we've mentioned really.

Anyways that's my opinion, those old maverick 10's would have to change position and alter their game a fair bit to fit into todays system heavy approach. Which I think is a bit shit.

I think that unconventional no. 10s are the thing. Did you know that it was Rangnick's sons that discovered Firmino on youtube?

https://www.transfermarkt.de/1899-r...h-wegen-firmino-verpflichtung/view/news/50324

2 years before that he was heavily interested in getting Thomas Müller from Bayern's second team - that was before van Gaal gave him his role. And when he was coach in Leipzig he persuaded Kimmich to leave Stuttgart after he did not get into Stuttgart's U23 but was to play another year in the U19.

 

[Marwood]

I think that unconventional no. 10s are the thing. Did you know that it was Rangnick's sons that discovered Firmino on youtube?

https://www.transfermarkt.de/1899-r...h-wegen-firmino-verpflichtung/view/news/50324

2 years before that he was heavily interested in getting Thomas Müller from Bayern's second team - that was before van Gaal gave him his role. And when he was coach in Leipzig he persuaded Kimmich to leave Stuttgart after he did not get into Stuttgart's U23 but was to play another year in the U19.

Yeah a few cited Firminho as evidence of the classic No.10 working today.

Do you think Firmino is similar to Cantona?

I know they occupy roughly the same space but to me it's like drawing a similarity between Scholes and Butt. Just because they play in roughly the same position.

 

[giorno]

Yeah a few cited Firminho as evidence of the classic No.10 working today.

Do you think Firmino is similar to Cantona?

I know they occupy roughly the same space but to me it's like drawing a similarity between Scholes and Butt. Just because they play in roughly the same position.

Not that much. Cantona is closer to Benzema