How will the league table look at season's end?

justsomebloke

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We're close enough to the end of the season now that it's meaningful to start having a serious opinion about how the PL will end up, taking into consideration form and remaining schedule for the various teams. So what do you all think?

This is my guess:

1. Manchester City
2. Manchester United
3. Leicester
4. Chelsea
5. Liverpool
6. Everton
7. West Ham
8. Tottenham
9. Arsenal
10. Aston Villa
11. Leeds
12. Wolves
13. Southampton
14. Crystal Palace
15. Burnley
16. Brighton
17. Newcastle
18. Fulham
19. West Bromwich
20. Sheffield United

City as champions is a done deal. No reason why they shouldn't break the 90 point-barrier.

I don't see anyone below realistically catching up with United, Leicester and Chelsea for the top 4, and our schedule is decidedly easier than Leicesters in particular - they have remaining games against ALL of the other top 4 teams, while we have only them. We have a pretty good chance to break the 80-point-barrier, which the Foxes will only have a sniff at if they win at least two of their three games against City, us and Chelsea (as well as all of their other remaining ones). Chelsea are five points behind Leicester, but they've not lost under Tuchel, and there's not really that much to separate them. They have City and Leicester left to play. They won't get to 80 points even if they win all of their remaining games.

Below the top 4, it looks like there'll be quite a fight for the EL places, between Tottenham, Everton, Liverpool and West Ham. That's so close you could put them in almost any order, but there are some notable factors that will impact. Liverpool has by, a considerable margin, the easiest remaining schedule among all teams in the league. In fact, they have only three games left against top half sides, and two of those are Arsenal and Aston Villa. If they are now back to anything remotely like their own selves (and early returns from re-inserting Fabinho in the midfield seem promising), then that's a cakewalk. The question of course if is they are. If they're still the team we've seen in the last few rounds, then they can well lose to anyone. And they have very little room for further slip-ups. Everton has a much tougher schedule, with 6 games left against top-half sides. Although they have a game in hand. For them, it seems more likely to come down to whether the margins go their way in games like Villa (twice), Arsenal and West Ham. West Ham has the most points of these four teams currently, but they have been unable to beat top teams all season, and they have remaining games against Leicester and Chelsea. On the other hand, they have five games against lower half teams (of whom none better than Southampton), which they are likely to win. Tottenham has been inconsistent, are seemingly mired in a dressing room semi-crisis, and have a fairly tough schedule - remaining games against us and Leicester, and just two games against weak teams (if we you'd consider Fulham to be that, Sheffield United is the other).

Arsenal at 9th is (other than City at 1st) the easiest top half prediction to make. They no longer have a realistic chance IMO of catching up with those above them, but should be fairly comfortably able to stave off those below. And that's even with a fairly benign schedule - just 3 games left against top half teams, and 4 against teams currently placed 16th or worse.

Villa has dropped too far behind, and are no longer seriously in the EL qualification picture I think. 7 of their remaining games are against top half sides, including us, Chelsea and City. There are really only 3 games left which they can be reasonably confident of being able to win (Fulham, West Brom, Palace). If they manage anything better than 10th, they'll have had an impressive late season.

Just below Villa, there's Leeds, Wolves, Palace and Southampton. Leeds at least have a chance of catching up with Villa. But while their schedule is easier than Villa's, it's not that easy (remaining games against us, Liverpool, Spurs and City), and Villa has a point on them plus a game in hand. Wolves are too far behind, and have a fair few tough games left (West Ham, Spurs, Everton, us). But they also have a run of 5 straight games against teams placed 16th or worse. I think they'll comfortably beat Southampton, who will find it hard to get their momentum going again with a schedule where stronger and weaker opponents alternate. They look better off than Palace though, who have a truly horrible remaining schedule - 8 games remaining against top half teams. They cannot confidently expect to take many more points than they already have, and look set to end up not much above the 40-point mark.

The next grouping would be Burnley, Brighton, Newcastle and Fulham, one of whom will go down. Of those, Burnley has the best schedule, Brighton the worst. But I'm pretty sure Fulham will be the ones to go down - there's just too much ground to make up, and too few games left where sufficient points are realistically feasible.

West Brom and Sheffield United are toast.

Let's see your predictions, and we'll know in a few weeks who got it right. First prize is getting to go out for a meal at your own expense once the lockdown is over, wearing a self-made hat with the inscription "Told you so, didn't I".
 

Bobcat

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1. City
2. United
3. ????
4. ????

Leichester have a pretty nasty fixture list at the end of the season. Palace and Soton are the only "easy games" as they most likely wont have anything to play for when they face them, but the other fixtures are City, West Ham, Newcastle, Man Utd, Chelsea and Spurs.

Chelsea also has a pretty tough run in. Palace, West Ham, Fulham, City, Arsenal, Leichester and Villa

We have Spurs, Burnely, Leeds, Liverpool, Villa, Leichester, Fulham and Wolves. Spurs, Pool and Leichester will be tough games, but the other teams most likely wont have much to play for

Imo its still wide open. If the Scousers get their shit together, i see no reason why they cant get top for, because as @justsomebloke pointed out, their remaning games are pretty easy. Of course it would be absoloutely hysterical if they ended up 7th and qualified for that new tier 3 European comp, but honestly i dont see that happening
 

Ajr

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1) City
2) United
3) Chelsea
4) Leicester
5) West Ham
6) Liverpool
7) Spurs
8) Everton
9) Arsenal
10) Villa
11) Leeds
12) Who cares
19) Newcastle (Hopefully)
 

charlenefan

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I'm still not convinced Leicester will finish top 4

Also feel Fulham might escape relegation and Newcastle drop instead of them
 

Counterfactual

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City
Leicester
United
Chelsea
--
[Others]
--
Newcastle
West Brom
Sheffield United.

I think the Europa matches will see us waver in the league, unfortunately. Our first 11 is running on fumes, and the backups aren't good enough for the sharp end of the season.

If we win the Europa, third will be OK. If we don't, this place will probably erupt.
 

Schmeichel's Cartwheel

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Chelsea will probably overtake us, we’ll finish 3rd & trophyless & the cult of Ole obsessives will call it a successful season & “progress”
 

AgentSmith

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Chelsea will probably overtake us, we’ll finish 3rd & trophyless & the cult of Ole obsessives will call it a successful season & “progress”
You’ve really gone off the deep end recently. Every single post is a regurgitation of the exact same point.

At least before there was some variety and constructiveness to the negativity. Now it’s just a copy and paste job with zero imagination.
 

RashyForPM

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1) City
2) United
3) Leicester
4) Chelsea
5) West Ham
6) Pool
7) Spurs
8) Everton
9) Arsenal
10) Leeds
11) Villa
12) Wolves
13) Brighton
14) Southampton
15) Palace
16) Burnley
17) Fulham
18) Newcastle
19) WBA
20) Sheff Utd

Title is done.

2nd will be decided by the match between us and Leicester at OT in GW36, which I think we will just win.

Chelsea are playing too well to miss out on top 4.

5-9 is incredibly difficult to call, but West Ham are already in 5th and have good fixtures, so they should make it. The rest is basically decided by a flip of a coin, with Arsenal in 9th because the EL will be their primary focus from here on in. Eventually, Everton and Arsenal will miss out on European football imo.

10-15 will just drift along in midtable, with Brighton and Southampton eventually pulling themselves well clear of trouble.

Burnley will never go down until they mistakenly sack Dyche.

Fulham will beat Newcastle on the final day and stay up, with Newcastle finally going down, leaving the progressive, entertaining Fulham in the PL.

WBA and Sheff Utd might as well just play their kids from here on in and let the main men rest for the Championship.
 

Siorac

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City will win it, one of United, Leicester, or Chelsea will finish second.

Yeah, I come from the Michael Owen School of Predictions.
 

Pavl3n

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City will be champions. Chelsea will finish 3rd - they seem like the found new source of energy. They are very resilient and their results speak for it.
Since Tuchel took over - 14 games, 12 clean sheets, 10 wins, 4 draws. Either us or Leicester will stutter at the end and Chelsea will sneak in their place.
I hope it's Leicester.

West Ham won't be able to cope with the pressure that comes towards the end and I think they'll slip behind Tottenham and Liverpool, who will finish 5th and 6th in any order.
Everton and Arsenal will occupy the 8th and 9th spot - also in any order.

Aston Villa will cement 10th place.
Leeds, Crystal Palce and Wolves will stay in their positions, unless one of the three finds an unexpected surge of form and move up a spot or two.

Southampton looked quite decent in the beginning of the season, but they showed they have still some way to go until they show some consistency and settle as mid table team.
Burnley know how to grind a result and Brighton have a spark in them and have dropped a lot of points only because of fine margins and maybe poor finishing.
Those three will be in 14th, 15th and 16th.


Newcastle and Fulham will be the relegation battle this season.
The bottom two will go nowhere, but to Championship.
 

WeePat

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The next grouping would be Burnley, Brighton, Newcastle and Fulham, one of whom will go down. Of those, Burnley has the best schedule, Brighton the worst. But I'm pretty sure Fulham will be the ones to go down - there's just too much ground to make up, and too few games left where sufficient points are realistically feasible.
Newcastle 28 points with 9 games remaining - 7 of those games are vs Spurs, West Ham, Arsenal, Leicester, Liverpool, City and Fulham themselves.
Fulham 26 points with 8 games remaining - have some tough games coming up too but nowhere near as brutal as Newcastle.

My money is on Newcastle going down.
 

Hughes35

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1. City
2. Utd
3. Leicester
4. Chelsea
5. Liverpool
6. Everton
7. Tottenham
8. West Ham
9. Arsenal
The Rest
17. Fulham
18. Newcastle
19. West Brom
20. Sheff Utd
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Having looked at the fixtures I fear a bit for us. We still got Spurs, Liverpool and Leicester left and some other tricky games.
West Ham got really nice fixtures and it was probably good they dropped points vs Arsenal.

I still think everyone else will drop points as well.

If Liverpool beat us I think they sneak top 4 so key for us to win both to help ourselfes and to stop them. If Ole want second spot we might need to beat Leicester too, but would not worry about that.
 

justsomebloke

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Newcastle 28 points with 9 games remaining - 7 of those games are vs Spurs, West Ham, Arsenal, Leicester, Liverpool, City and Fulham themselves.
Fulham 26 points with 8 games remaining - have some tough games coming up too but nowhere near as brutal as Newcastle.

My money is on Newcastle going down.
You could look at that differently though. What may matter most here is not how many tough games the two teams have left, or how tough the tough games are, but the number of not-so-tough games they have left - games where they have a reasonable probability of getting points.

Newcastle has 3 such games - Sheffield Utd, Burnley and Fulham. They also have a 2-point lead and a game in hand.
Fulham has 2 such games - Burnley and Newcastle.

Clearly, anything can happen. But for Fulham, rather an implausibly large number of good things will need to happen, less so for Newcastle. So my money is on Fulham going down. Not going to be a large sum though. :) Also I wouldn't mind very much being wrong.
 

justsomebloke

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Having looked at the fixtures I fear a bit for us. We still got Spurs, Liverpool and Leicester left and some other tricky games.
West Ham got really nice fixtures and it was probably good they dropped points vs Arsenal.

I still think everyone else will drop points as well.

If Liverpool beat us I think they sneak top 4 so key for us to win both to help ourselfes and to stop them. If Ole want second spot we might need to beat Leicester too, but would not worry about that.
Liverpool isn't in a position where beating us or not makes a fundamental difference. The maximum number of points they can get if they win all of their remaining games is 73. That's pretty unlikely to be enough for top 4. Max points for us, Leicester and Chelsea are 84, 83 and 78 respectively. Someone's going to have to drop a lot of points for Liverpool to get top 4, no matter how well they do.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Liverpool isn't in a position where beating us or not makes a fundamental difference. The maximum number of points they can get if they win all of their remaining games is 73. That's pretty unlikely to be enough for top 4. Max points for us, Leicester and Chelsea are 84, 83 and 78 respectively. Someone's going to have to drop a lot of points for Liverpool to get top 4, no matter how well they do.
I can see Chelsea drop out though. I think if Liverpool drops points in only 2 games that could be enough, but yeah given the form they got they probably drop points on more.

Chelsea got tricky fixtures near the end, but many teams may have nothing to play for so they probably get points vs City, Arsenal, Leicester etc.
 

McGrathsipan

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#TeamM.W.D.L.GoalsDif.Pt.
1Manchester City38296391:325993
2Manchester United382211574:443077
3Chelsea FC382011764:372771
4Leicester City38218971:472471
5Liverpool FC381910970:462467
6West Ham United381811961:481365
7Tottenham Hotspur3818101064:412364
8Everton FC371861354:52260
9Arsenal FC381771458:451358
10Leeds United381561760:62-251
11Aston Villa371451850:46447
12Wolverhampton Wanderers3812111541:51-1047
13Crystal Palace381381744:65-2147
14Burnley FC3811131435:49-1446
15Brighton & Hove Albion388151545:52-739
16Southampton FC389101944:67-2337
17Newcastle United38892139:72-3333
18Fulham FC386141832:51-1932
19West Bromwich Albion385102329:75-4625
20Sheffield United38433124:68-4415
 

WeePat

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You could look at that differently though. What may matter most here is not how many tough games the two teams have left, or how tough the tough games are, but the number of not-so-tough games they have left - games where they have a reasonable probability of getting points.

Newcastle has 3 such games - Sheffield Utd, Burnley and Fulham. They also have a 2-point lead and a game in hand.
Fulham has 2 such games - Burnley and Newcastle.

Clearly, anything can happen. But for Fulham, rather an implausibly large number of good things will need to happen, less so for Newcastle. So my money is on Fulham going down. Not going to be a large sum though. :) Also I wouldn't mind very much being wrong.
That's an interesting way to look at it actually.

It would be important note that Fulham have beaten both Liverpool and Everton away in recent weeks. They've shown they have the necessary quality and fighting spirit to win those tough fixtures. Newcastle have too, in fairness (fecking Everton :lol: ) but Fulham also have momentum on their side, having clawed back quite a chunky deficit on Newcastle.
 

justsomebloke

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I can see Chelsea drop out though. I think if Liverpool drops points in only 2 games that could be enough, but yeah given the form they got they probably drop points on more.

Chelsea got tricky fixtures near the end, but many teams may have nothing to play for so they probably get points vs City, Arsenal, Leicester etc.
If Liverpool drop points in two games, that means Chelsea would have to drop at least 10 points for Liverpool to pass them. That's 3 losses and a draw (or five draws) in nine games, for a team that's on a ten-game unbeaten streak. I don't think Liverpool can afford to drop any points at all, if they're going to have any kind of chance at top 4.
 

justsomebloke

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That's an interesting way to look at it actually.

It would be important note that Fulham have beaten both Liverpool and Everton away in recent weeks. They've shown they have the necessary quality and fighting spirit to win those tough fixtures. Newcastle have too, in fairness (fecking Everton :lol: ) but Fulham also have momentum on their side, having clawed back quite a chunky deficit on Newcastle.
Not to mention Newcastle's injury situation. From that perspective, I agree Fulham looks better. The odds are still theirs to overcome though.

It may well not be decided until they play each other in the last round. Almost a pity to be busy watching United - Wolves.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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If Liverpool drop points in two games, that means Chelsea would have to drop at least 10 points for Liverpool to pass them. That's 3 losses and a draw (or five draws) in nine games, for a team that's on a ten-game unbeaten streak. I don't think Liverpool can afford to drop any points at all, if they're going to have any kind of chance at top 4.
Yeah I can see Chelsea potentially getting dull draws against Fulham, Palace etc since they will have focus on CL as well. Liverpool is probably out vs Real so can focus on the league .

Although if I predicted then it is 0 points vs City, 0 vs Leicester, 1 vs West Ham and 1 vs Arsenal.
 
Last edited:

groovyalbert

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Anyone keen can do their calculations here - https://www.worldfootball.net/table_calculator/eng-premier-league/

Here's mine. Some huge games last day of the season - Fulham v Newcastle & Leicester v Spurs!

Pos.TeamPWDLGoalsGDPts
1Manchester City38296381:265593
2Manchester United382212470:373378
3Leicester City38219869:432672
4Chelsea FC382011760:332771
5Tottenham Hotspur38209965:362969
6Liverpool FC38209964:412369
7West Ham United381911859:441568
8Arsenal FC381971255:371864
9Everton FC381871354:49561
10Aston Villa381391650:45548
11Leeds United381451955:59-447
12Wolverhampton Wanderers3811101735:49-1443
13Southampton FC381191845:64-1942
14Crystal Palace3810101836:61-2540
15Brighton & Hove Albion388151538:49-1139
16Burnley FC388141629:49-2038
17Fulham FC388131730:48-1837
18Newcastle United38882234:64-3032
19West Bromwich Albion383102524:74-5019
20Sheffield United38443021:66-4516
 

Smores

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I don't think Chelsea are as safe as many believe. They've got Leicester, Arsenal, City, West Ham and they've shown recently that they're susceptible to a low goal draw (Leeds, Southampton) against lesser teams.

I think we're safe but the rest will be decided on small changes in form. I think anyone down to 8th place has it in them to grab a couple of decent results in big games then smash the rest.

We're fairly safe so it's going to be an exciting end to the season with every game huge. Not many seasons where the top 8 are in with a shout of CL football at this stage.
 

McGrathsipan

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I don't think Chelsea are as safe as many believe. They've got Leicester, Arsenal, City, West Ham and they've shown recently that they're susceptible to a low goal draw (Leeds, Southampton) against lesser teams.

I think we're safe but the rest will be decided on small changes in form. I think anyone down to 8th place has it in them to grab a couple of decent results in big games then smash the rest.

We're fairly safe so it's going to be an exciting end to the season with every game huge. Not many seasons where the top 8 are in with a shout of CL football at this stage.
I think we need 15 points from 9 games to secure top 4. Which is achievable however we have shown a lack of bottle in the CL. So until we are in the places because we cant be caught I would not be counting any chickens
 

Paul_Scholes18

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I think we need 15 points from 9 games to secure top 4. Which is achievable however we have shown a lack of bottle in the CL. So until we are in the places because we cant be caught I would not be counting any chickens
The fixtures open up for us bottling it I think, but I think we will manage partly since I think the teams behind us will drop points as well. Just a bit like last year when we started bottling games, but then Leicester and Chelsea did too. Brighton is a game that everyone expect us to win easily, but last time it was close and Brighton can play good football. Then Spurs last time was horrible and will not be easy even if form suggest we should be favorites to win it.

Burnley should be easy and I think it will be, but like Sheffield United they may cause us problems on set pieces. Leeds is easy too I guess, but they are good in attack so if we have a bad day up front unlike last time it might not be obvious.
 

Dancfc

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The top four race has a potential extra element to it no one is really talking about yet. There's a very real possibility the CL and EL winners will both be PL clubs that don't finish top 4, which will put the 4th placed team in the Europa.
 

WeePat

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Anyone keen can do their calculations here - https://www.worldfootball.net/table_calculator/eng-premier-league/

Here's mine. Some huge games last day of the season - Fulham v Newcastle & Leicester v Spurs!

Pos.TeamPWDLGoalsGDPts
1Manchester City38296381:265593
2Manchester United382212470:373378
3Leicester City38219869:432672
4Chelsea FC382011760:332771
5Tottenham Hotspur38209965:362969
6Liverpool FC38209964:412369
7West Ham United381911859:441568
8Arsenal FC381971255:371864
9Everton FC381871354:49561
10Aston Villa381391650:45548
11Leeds United381451955:59-447
12Wolverhampton Wanderers3811101735:49-1443
13Southampton FC381191845:64-1942
14Crystal Palace3810101836:61-2540
15Brighton & Hove Albion388151538:49-1139
16Burnley FC388141629:49-2038
17Fulham FC388131730:48-1837
18Newcastle United38882234:64-3032
19West Bromwich Albion383102524:74-5019
20Sheffield United38443021:66-4516
I just did one of these.

1. City 89pts
2. United 78pts
3. Chelsea 76pts
4. Leicester 71pts
5. Spurs 67pts
6. Liverpool 66pts
7. Everton 66pts
8. West Ham 65pts
9. Arsenal 62pts
10. Villa 51pts


18. Newcastle 32pts
19. Sheffield Utd 21pts
20. West Brom 18pts.
 

WeePat

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The top four race has a potential extra element to it no one is really talking about yet. There's a very real possibility the CL and EL winners will both be PL clubs that don't finish top 4, which will put the 4th placed team in the Europa.
Absolute fecking scenes if it happens to Spurs again.
 

AgentSmith

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Big fan of all the predictions putting Newcastle in the bottom 3. Fingers crossed you guys are right.
 

Dancfc

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Absolute fecking scenes if it happens to Spurs again.
I've got this sickening feeling that we're owed one at some point, have been paranoid about every year it's been even remotely possible.

The thought of getting 4th and losing our place to Arteta's Arsenal makes me want to throw up, would be unbearable.
 

anant

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I expect the current top 4 to remain as is. If Pool were say 3 points behind CL spots, I would have probably bet on thme to make top 4 over Leicester, however, I just dont see Pool covering a 10 point gap over Leicester or 5 point gap over Chelsea. I think, they'll rest a few players here and there and ty to go for CL win instead.
Spurs - again, I think Mou has lost the dressing room, else there was a chance of them finishing in top 4.
WHU- While they've been the biggest overachievers, dropping points at Arsenal means that we're expecting them to have atleast 3 more points than Chelsea (assuming Leicester dont drop off) which while possible, is still unlikely.

Feel 69-70 points will again get top 4 this season
 

Paul_Scholes18

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The top four race has a potential extra element to it no one is really talking about yet. There's a very real possibility the CL and EL winners will both be PL clubs that don't finish top 4, which will put the 4th placed team in the Europa.
I guess we know what we will have.

City vs Liverpool final and Arsenal won EL over us in the final. City chance to win quadrouble. Although if Liverpool and Arsenal win then we miss CL football since we ended in 4th.

What do you want ladies and gentlemen? The absolute nightmare scenario. Would you watch that game? I really don't want City to beat our record, but Liverpool ruining everything would be very bad.
The only hope is Covid and stuff like that.
 

WeePat

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I've got this sickening feeling that we're owed one at some point, have been paranoid about every year it's been even remotely possible.

The thought of getting 4th and losing our place to Arteta's Arsenal makes me want to throw up, would be unbearable.
I won't bother getting worried unless both Arsenal and Liverpool make their respective finals, and I doubt either will, if I'm completely honest.
 

kaiser1

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I'm still not convinced Leicester will finish top 4
I had this feeling too but when I looked at the current table

Leicester is 7 points ahead of 5th West Ham, 8 points ahead of 6th Spurs and 10points ahead 7th of Liverpool. All with 9 games to go. I dont see West Ham overtaking them, Spurs has like a 30% chance and Liverpool 10% chance

End of season
Citeh
United
Chelsea
Leicester
Spurs
Liverpool
WestHam
Arsenal
Everton
Villa