Is Pogba as good as gone?

jackal&hyde

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Wonder how much of this is Pogba's fault and how much is the clubs fault for not matching his ambition? I bet he was promised the world when he signed in 2016. 4 years later and we have no CL football again & sit below Sheff Utd in the league with the ex Cardiff and Molde manager in charge.
It's the club and it's failed rebuilding. The same situation as Eriksen, he wants to compete for the biggest trophies and he's not 21 anymore.

If we make a strong end to the season with clear signs of competing much better next season i still think there is a chance he will stay; this is not a "Real is my dream" type of situation, it's just a "i want to win" one. It's just a shame because i think a mid 3 against the "lesser" clubs of Fred, Pogba and Bruno would be fantastic to watch; just hope will see some of that this season.
 

Thisistheone

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Yes, I understand all of what you are saying, but he should be showing some respect to what he is earning
( not earning) here. He knows himself we would have a better chance of winning games with him playing ( Giving all) and we would certainly be in top 4 position now. He is 26 now and if he was to have any chance of the Ballon Dor he needs to be playing. Ok he picked up injuries but it didn't stop him playing a friendly for his brother, and playing basketball while supposedly recovering from injury.
I admit not to know the ins and outs of his injuries or otherwise. Can't be arsed with all the rumours and counter-rumours but yes, he certainly should be giving us 100% until he is gone, thats not up for debate.

Just thinking back to the optimism that surrounded his signing though and it's a gutter. Back then we really thought he'd be the main man in us winning the league again. Not trying to get into the top 4.
 

Bestietom

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I admit not to know the ins and outs of his injuries or otherwise. Can't be arsed with all the rumours and counter-rumours but yes, he certainly should be giving us 100% until he is gone, thats not up for debate.

Just thinking back to the optimism that surrounded his signing though and it's a gutter. Back then we really thought he'd be the main man in us winning the league again. Not trying to get into the top 4.
Your right, and we all thought we were going to win everything when we heard he was coming back. Then all the shite with Mourinho and the never ending hairdo's and twiiter comments, arsed it all up. He won the battle with Mourinho but I don't think he could keep doing it at other clubs.
 

Leroy The Red

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I'm surprised some still expect to see him play for us again this season. When was he 'supposed to be back' again? Do some of you genuinely not see this continuous delay of his return as being obvious? He's basically on strike, sitting the season out so he doesn't get injured and wreck his dream move in the summer. We've just signed his replacement.
The Pogba defenders will be out in force claiming he's still committed to the club and Pogba is the real victim here from nasty fans that have hidden agendas who hate him and want him to fail.

The simple fact is that, like previous players who have left, he could've just kept his head down, shut his agent up (who is his employee) and privately seek a solution away (just like Ronaldo did, or DDG was close to doing). Until then, give the club your full commitment and stay quiet. He would've had the respect of the fans. It's all a big song and dance drama with this guy and his shitmouthed agent.
Yup
 

JPRouve

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Probably because there's not actually that much hype about him as a player, largely down to his own inconsistency. It's crazy how much clubs are influenced by the flavour of the moment, just look at De Ligt's price as an example. Coutinho as another. Unfortunately Pogba hasn't done anything to whip the fans, the media and clubs up in that way, despite doing it in every other way.
It's more that in general CMs do not go for the bigger fees, they don't work in isolation and spending a record fee on them is generally pointless. You would have to be a Matthaus type of player to justify it or Zidane if you consider him as a CM.
 

jackal&hyde

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Probably because there's not actually that much hype about him as a player, largely down to his own inconsistency. It's crazy how much clubs are influenced by the flavour of the moment, just look at De Ligt's price as an example. Coutinho as another. Unfortunately Pogba hasn't done anything to whip the fans, the media and clubs up in that way, despite doing it in every other way.
With 85mil euros that they paid on a youth CD Juve knows they would have to pay a lot more then 100mil for Pogba, they are just playing right now hoping to get a lower price. I wouldn't be surprised if mister con man Raiola is playing a part here trying to save Juve some money so he can get a bigger share.

If we don't get 120mil plus i would rather keep him out of pride alone. He has shown during pre season and this season while fit that he will not rock the boat and sulk, so i see no downsides. Sell him when he's on his last year (that's next summer because we have one year extension option) for 100 and by then we should have replaced him already.
 

kopviolator

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I think we should state our price and indicate a willingness to throw him to the stands for the remainder of his contract, which we can extend by a further year, if his suitors don't want to match our price and see how far he is willing to play his injury card.

With a clear and published price I think other teams like PSG will throw their hat in not these suitors of his who want to fleece us.
I think our position is weakened if we start pushing him towards the door. I'm pretty sure the hierarchy at Trafford understand he's leaving but they play it cool to try and give him a stamp of health to try go up his value. The problem seems to be that no-one is particularly interested. And value is dictated by demand. So anyway, yes I'd be tempted to let him sweat with the reserves for a month or two after he's back but I'm afraid that would ony reduce his value further.
 

Posh Red

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I think our position is weakened if we start pushing him towards the door. I'm pretty sure the hierarchy at Trafford understand he's leaving but they play it cool to try and give him a stamp of health to try go up his value. The problem seems to be that no-one is particularly interested. And value is dictated by demand. So anyway, yes I'd be tempted to let him sweat with the reserves for a month or two after he's back but I'm afraid that would ony reduce his value further.
Why would united send him to the reserves? Have I missed something?
 

VeevaVee

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With 85mil euros that they paid on a youth CD Juve knows they would have to pay a lot more then 100mil for Pogba, they are just playing right now hoping to get a lower price. I wouldn't be surprised if mister con man Raiola is playing a part here trying to save Juve some money so he can get a bigger share.

If we don't get 120mil plus i would rather keep him out of pride alone. He has shown during pre season and this season while fit that he will not rock the boat and sulk, so i see no downsides. Sell him when he's on his last year (that's next summer because we have one year extension option) for 100 and by then we should have replaced him already.
If you really think about it, is he worth 120m? Or are we all just throwing those kind of numbers around because we always have? I'm not sure anyone will pay that, unless it's a sugar daddy club wanting a superstar presence.
 

flappyjay

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Why would united send him to the reserves? Have I missed something?
You have missed absolutely nothing. Just some more hate.
 

kopviolator

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Why would united send him to the reserves? Have I missed something?
I responded to an earlier post where the standpoint was to have his team work on getting him out for a set fee or else put him to the stands. Anyway, I'm saying it is tempting to strip him of any first team duties while either he or his agent is publicly working on sabotaging his relationship with the club.
 

Posh Red

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That's an easy take. I don't hate Pogba. In fact I wish he was committed and we could rely on him. But I do hate the situation surrounding him and his agent.
What has Pogba done to make you question his commitment? Every voice from inside the club, including his fellow players, all say the opposite.
 

Tony Babangida

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What has Pogba done to make you question his commitment? Every voice from inside the club, including his fellow players, all say the opposite.
Then why does his agent brief the press saying he wants to leave? Surely he would fire his agent if he wasn’t happy with that. Plus he already left once!
 

flappyjay

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That's an easy take. I don't hate Pogba. In fact I wish he was committed and we could rely on him. But I do hate the situation surrounding him and his agent.
What situation? He had intentions to leave, which were voiced during the off-season last year. Which is the proper way of doing things. Things fell through he attended pre season, didn't disrupt it and when it was time to play he played.. It's unfortunate that he has been injured but it happens, I know for some of you it's some conspiracy theory about faking injuries in order to avoid playing.
 

Canagel

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83 million is a steal in this market for a player of his ability. I refuse to believe that we wouldn't get 100m+ for him. This will likely be his Euros to dominate, he will be fresh - a lot fresher than most of the players due to lack of football this term and I won't be surprised if he leads the France to another tournament victory and a few clubs start fighting over him. At the moment he is suffering from no football and in this sport people only remember your last games.
 

Posh Red

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Then why does his agent brief the press saying he wants to leave? Surely he would fire his agent if he wasn’t happy with that. Plus he already left once!
Didn’t his agent say that he wants to win stuff and may have to move because of that? Where is the suggestion that he is not giving his all whilst he is here?
 

kopviolator

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What has Pogba done to make you question his commitment? Every voice from inside the club, including his fellow players, all say the opposite.
I think it's pretty clear his agent speaks for him. I think he's trying to force his way out. He obviously spoke of this last summer, Raiola comes out periodically with the same nonsense and I think the club should take a hard stand against these games and set an example. I'm not saying Pogba wont do his best while he's here, I honestly think he will but I think the baggage that comes with Paul Pogba outweigh the benefits of having him here.
 

Rolaholic

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The injury conspiracies would be a bit more easy to buy if just about all our best players bar De Gea hadn't been injured for extended periods of time under Ole as well...
 

Posh Red

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I think it's pretty clear his agent speaks for him. I think he's trying to force his way out. He obviously spoke of this last summer, Raiola comes out periodically with the same nonsense and I think the club should take a hard stand against these games and set an example. I'm not saying Pogba wont do his best while he's here, I honestly think he will but I think the baggage that comes with Paul Pogba outweigh the benefits of having him here.
I guess when you use the term ‘commitment’ it gives me the impression that you don’t think he is giving his all for his current team. If that’s not what you meant then fair enough.

In my opinion we should be hoping he comes back and plays well as soon as possible. That would be best for all parties (except any potential buyer). Talk of sending him to the reserves just seems absurd and childish to me.
 

Forevergiggs1

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I really can't see how the Juve can afford him even giving us a cast off player or 2. Madrid is a pipe dream for him as I don't think Florentino wants him (or his agent) anywhere near the club. The only realistic move I could see happening would be Pogba to PSG if Mbappe goes to Madrid.

Another option would be no club wants to pay stupid money for him, he signs a new mega deal contract with us and then all we'll hear from his supporters is how much he loves the club and he wouldn't play anywhere else.
 

flappyjay

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83 million is a steal in this market for a player of his ability. I refuse to believe that we wouldn't get 100m+ for him. This will likely be his Euros to dominate, he will be fresh - a lot fresher than most of the players due to lack of football this term and I won't be surprised if he leads the France to another tournament victory and a few clubs start fighting over him. At the moment he is suffering from no football and in this sport people only remember your last games.
His value is also more than what he offers on the pitch. I think those that say his value can't be more than 100m+ focus on Pogba the footballer and forget his celebrity or marketability
 

kopviolator

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What situation? He had intentions to leave, which were voiced during the off-season last year. Which is the proper way of doing things. Things fell through he attended pre season, didn't disrupt it and when it was time to play he played.. It's unfortunate that he has been injured but it happens, I know for some of you it's some conspiracy theory about faking injuries in order to avoid playing.
So you don't think there is a situation with Pogba that needs to be addressed? His agent speaking with the press every other month he wants to be elsewhere is not an issue with you? I guess I'm old fashioned but I believe the agents work for the players, in their interest and with their permission. If Pogba wants to he can shut up his agent, of course he can.

Anyway, no conspiracy theory - I believe Pogba is injured. I just don't believe he's worth all this circus and I don't think the club can afford to have such a high profile player player (or his agent) playing games.
 

Posh Red

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So you don't think there is a situation with Pogba that needs to be addressed? His agent speaking with the press every other month he wants to be elsewhere is not an issue with you? I guess I'm old fashioned but I believe the agents work for the players, in their interest and with their permission. If Pogba wants to he can shut up his agent, of course he can.

Anyway, no conspiracy theory - I believe Pogba is injured. I just don't believe he's worth all this circus and I don't think the club can afford to have such a high profile player player (or his agent) playing games.
So the one and only issue for you is the agent comments. Is that fair?
 

kopviolator

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I guess when you use the term ‘commitment’ it gives me the impression that you don’t think he is giving his all for his current team. If that’s not what you meant then fair enough.

In my opinion we should be hoping he comes back and plays well as soon as possible. That would be best for all parties (except any potential buyer). Talk of sending him to the reserves just seems absurd and childish to me.
If Pogba comes back and wants to take part in building a team then I will be very happy. I just don't believe this is the case as the evidence says otherwise (well... to me anyway).

Regarding the reserves, I did say it was tempting - but also it would only limit his value if I remember correct. Bottom line is that the club must have control over their players. If the players/agents are working against the club then I would not want them near the first team.
 

jackal&hyde

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If you really think about it, is he worth 120m? Or are we all just throwing those kind of numbers around because we always have? I'm not sure anyone will pay that, unless it's a sugar daddy club wanting a superstar presence.
I think he is worth it yes. Think about it, he is an established WC player in Italy. Since then he has had hes most productive season ever (last season) and won a World Cup. Players now days go for crazy money just because they had one good season or two. Madison and Grealish are quoted for around that price and they haven't achieved what Pogba did, they have no international experience at all. The sums are insane but adjusting to that, absolutely is Pogba more valuable then Madison for instance.
 

LawCharltonBest

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I still think Pogba and Raiola will be looking for a bumper new contract at United ahead of anything else.

They know they can get more money here than anywhere else would offer him.

From a United perspective, if we really do want to challenge for the PL and CL like Ed Woodward says, then they need to be keeping Pogba, signing Sancho & then we'll really start looking the business again.

................McTominay
.........Pogba ........B.Fernandes
Sancho.....Rashford.........Martial
 

kopviolator

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So the one and only issue for you is the agent comments. Is that fair?
I'm not sure that is the only issue for me (and his own comment of course) but it is the most important one. It just spells out to me he wants to leave. And I don't believe in keeping players that want to leave. That's all there is to it as far as I'm concerned and it doesn't mean I have an agenda or that I hate Paul Pogba or any other nonsense like that.
 

Cantonagotmehere

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I still think Pogba and Raiola will be looking for a bumper new contract at United ahead of anything else.

They know they can get more money here than anywhere else would offer him.

From a United perspective, if we really do want to challenge for the PL and CL like Ed Woodward says, then they need to be keeping Pogba, signing Sancho & then we'll really start looking the business again.

................McTominay
.........Pogba ........B.Fernandes
Sancho.....Rashford.........Martial

Exactly. It may be a pipe dream, but this is my hope for next year. Even though I know it is a long shot....
 

Focusmate

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Pogba and Raiola have put us in a tricky position, devaluing him to try and force a move.
Its a bit of a gamble but do we wait till he turns it on in the Euros to try and push up his value but also leave little time for selling and buying?
Or de we try and get rid at the lower price and give ourselves more time to recruit. (Since Ed cant work on 2 deals at once)
 

Knux

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I dont think he will leave this summer. We dont need the money, we need worldclass players. And I just cant see anyone (except for PSG maybe), fork out the 130+ mill plus 300k/week wages.

Think its more likely we give him a new monster contract and keep him.

Add Sancho + Soumare in summer and maybe a striker and we Good to go next season.
 

Smores

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There's only been a handful of transfers that have gone over 100 million and not many midfielders anywhere near, Coutinho and Pogba the only ones close?

We'd be lucky to get 100 million for him, they'll just wait another season at which point we'll sell to regain some value.