Is the European super league back? | United Statement: We remain committed to UEFA

[RG77]

The fact that we have Real and Barca fans in here saying this is a great idea (because they'll financially benefit from it), whilst ignoring any comments about how this will feck smaller clubs up, hasn't escaped me. We've been here before with La Liga.

There's no point in debating anyone who has a clear vested interest in this because they've wasted the good times and found their clubs plunged into heavy debt, with no end in sight because they've stripped their own domestic league of any real competitive edge. They'll keep trying to persuade you that this is somehow great for everyone, when it very clearly isn't. Incredibly selfish but not at all unexpected.

I mean, not gonna pretend otherwise. Couldn't care less about the smaller clubs and want what is best for my club. Won't try to persuade anyone how this is great for everyone. It is great for the big clubs and an impossible task for the smaller clubs to get into the highest tier. Very different to the current CL format.

That being said: I don't think this will go through either way. Changes in football are rarely welcomed, let alone a big one like this. And they kinda fecked up first time around with most clubs chickening out after the PR-storm.

 

[Melbourne Red]

No surprise Barca and Real fans are the only positive voices for a super league.

With a predictable disregard for the way this would accelerate the immiseration of smaller clubs and leagues. Never mind though, they're just plankton.

 

[clarkydaz]

Barcelona and Real Madrid will be due a loyalty bonus of £870m should plans for a European Super League finally get the go-ahead.

its pretty much like Donald Trump being in charge of finances, and rules

 

[golden_blunder]

its pretty much like Donald Trump being in charge of finances, and rules

It’s just ludicrous at this point. Funny to see those Madrid fans with no morals and the odd brainless United fan arguing points for

 

[crossy1686]

Sometimes the retro way is the best way. Football doesn’t need more money, it needs to regulate itself and stop paying higher and higher salaries and transfer costs. When they do that they will find that there is money to do other things

Is that really fair for the players though when their images are used to make millions from marketing? If it doesn’t go to them it will end up in someone’s else’s pocket who doesn’t deserve it.

 

[golden_blunder]

Is that really fair for the players though when their images are used to make millions from marketing? If it doesn’t go to them it will end up in someone’s else’s pocket who doesn’t deserve it.

Where does it stop? When the teams go bust? Clubs and players need to start being brought back to reality otherwise more hare brained schemes promising the moon will appear. People will eventually fall to the lure of more, unnecessary money, and football as we know it will change

 

[90 + 5min]

No surprise Barca and Real fans are the only positive voices for a super league.

They've spent decades abusing and draining the value out of la liga instead of ensuring a competitive competition.

Their priority should be to sort their own league out, not create a new one for their shoddy ethics to take them down the same dead end path, this time taking the premier league teams with them.

I’m still waiting for answer why Barcelona or Real Madrid would be in Super League before Girona? If we are talking about sport merits.
Do Real Madrid or Barcelona fans accept Girona getting in before those two clubs?

 

[carvajal]

I’m still waiting for answer why Barcelona or Real Madrid would be in Super League before Girona? If we are talking about sport merits.
Do Real Madrid or Barcelona fans accept Girona getting in before those two clubs?

because they have won 17 of the last 20 ligas and 20 European Cups between both.
The current champions is already here to reward immediacy. 6 games, eliminated and remember the experience.
The super league is supposed to include Girona in a lower division from which it could grow.
Another idea (assuming they win la liga) is a knockout tournament, all against all, one team per country, since if we want to be fair it is not logical to reward the fourth from Italy/Spain/etc while the Latvian champion has to play previous rounds. Latvian fans also deserve to experience magical nights in Europe.

 

[Hugh Jass]

The only certainty is change.

 

[NotChatGPT]

You are privy to conversations behind those doors?

It will be hard / embarrassing for City and Chelsea to walk back the very strongly-worded statements, any time soon. Also, to be fair - both of these clubs have abundance of money and it's understandable why their owners don't care about some joke competition that is only attractive for money.

Our owners, however...

It’s common sense, isn’t it? Everyone knows the political situation in the UK and that it’s more or less impossible for any English side to join in at this moment, any involvement is going to be years and years ahead and they don’t even know if the ESL is going to be a reality or not. At this point there’s no upside whatsoever to stating they’re open to the idea. Meanwhile, if the ESL does become a thing and it ends up involving big clubs, increased revenue, it’s obviously going to be interesting for the big clubs in England. Clubs were keen to join in before the shitstorm, not without reason.

 

[90 + 5min]

because they have won 17 of the last 20 ligas and 20 European Cups between both.
The current champions is already here to reward immediacy. 6 games, eliminated and remember the experience.
The super league is supposed to include Girona in a lower division from which it could grow.
Another idea (assuming they win la liga) is a knockout tournament, all against all, one team per country, since if we want to be fair it is not logical to reward the fourth from Italy/Spain/etc while the Latvian champion has to play previous rounds. Latvian fans also deserve to experience magical nights in Europe.

So talk about merits are nonsens unless we look at history. Looking forward to Super League inviting teams like Sunderland and Everton for their success far back.

We know what this is about. Whole project is about saving Barcelona and RealMadrid from their economic problems. Just look who are founder of project and if there is connection with those clubs.

 

[Don_Johan14]

Well said. The lack of criticism towards their club officials is also impressive. They just accept everything that’s being said to them. I don’t think I know fans of other clubs with as little critical thinking as they have. Especially at Barca. If I were a fan, considering the financial shape of the club, i wouldn’t support any person even remotely associated with the mess. But their fans chose to actively defend the gravediggers.

First of all, I am against the Super League for several reasons, and the main one is that there is no sporting merit.

Secondly, you say that there is no criticism from Barcelona fans of their club officials. Wrong , but a lot.

You'd have to live in Catalonia and you'd change your mind.
I remind you that Laporta was dismissed with a vote of no confidence, a year before the end of his presidential term. Having signed Guardiola, he won a treble, a sextet, the starting eleven full of academy players and for many the best team in history. And yet he was kicked out. Isn't that criticism?

In Catalonia right now mainly, and in part of Spain, many want Laporta out of the club, after his very good management with the debt, the ffp and the management of the new stadium.
By the way, in the last match the fans whistled at the players in the first half because of their discontent with the football they saw. After winning a league, against the odds, with no money and bringing up academy players.

How many times have United fans whistled at their players in these 11 shitty years? Are they critical of the club and the players?

 

[giorno]

Where does it stop? When the teams go bust? Clubs and players need to start being brought back to reality otherwise more hare brained schemes promising the moon will appear. People will eventually fall to the lure of more, unnecessary money, and football as we know it will change

Football as we know it which means ~10 superclubs with all the money and power and the rest fighting for the scraps. Superleague in theory should expand that to 16, which is good for Ajax or Benfica or Milan but worse than ever for Aston Villa, Sevilla, Roma, etc...

Re: players: they deserve to be paid what the market say they are worth. By all means impose financial regulations to save clubs from themselves, but not at the expence of the players

 

[RG77]

Bernd Reichart, CEO of Super League: “One of the clubs that just made a statement against the Super League, called me and said ‘we're saying no in public, but we're with you’.”



Really curious how this develops. Did any of the founding clubs actually withdraw? Like officially? I know the PL teams said so in a statement but iirc there were clausules in place that if they officially withdrew they would be fined and of course that would lead to all sorts of cases in court.

 

[Real Name]

Bernd Reichart, CEO of Super League: “One of the clubs that just made a statement against the Super League, called me and said ‘we're saying no in public, but we're with you’.”



Really curious how this develops. Did any of the founding clubs actually withdraw? Like officially? I know the PL teams said so in a statement but iirc there were clausules in place that if they officially withdrew they would be fined and of course that would lead to all sorts of cases in court.

What, super league will fine the clubs?

And if you can't believe Bernd Reichart who can you believe?

 

[antohan]

Bernd Reichart, CEO of Super League: “One of the clubs that just made a statement against the Super League, called me and said ‘we're saying no in public, but we're with you’.”

It is equally likely that it is true or that it isn't but the guy knows he can throw it out there because everyone will believe it to be true.

We are the supermeme of football.

 

[RG77]

What, super league will fine the clubs?

I recall reports going around at the time, and might be mistaken on this, that the founding clubs couldn’t easily pull out. As a safety net. Which given the circumstances and people involved…would make sense. But could be BS. And there would indeed be a fine. How legal all of that is…no idea.

It is a corporate world and I’d believe in a heartbeat clubs would claim one thing publically whilst having these conversations in private. Another thing to take the word of the CEO who would have a vested interest of course.

A club like Bayern I can imagine staying out of this, not even so much out of principle but because they have a good thing going. But owners like Glazers/Boehly?

 

[clarkydaz]

I recall reports going around at the time, and might be mistaken on this, that the founding clubs couldn’t easily pull out. As a safety net. Which given the circumstances and people involved…would make sense. But could be BS. And there would indeed be a fine. How legal all of that is…no idea.

It is a corporate world and I’d believe in a heartbeat clubs would claim one thing publically whilst having these conversations in private. Another thing to take the word of the CEO who would have a vested interest of course.

A club like Bayern I can imagine staying out of this, not even so much out of principle but because they have a good thing going. But owners like Glazers/Boehly?

Perez said after the failure, the clubs had signed contracts you can't just walk away from, and it will be back in future.

I would love Perez to get his league without the English clubs, it will be a car crash all on his head

 

[DJ Jeff]

Bernd Reichart, CEO of Super League: “One of the clubs that just made a statement against the Super League, called me and said ‘we're saying no in public, but we're with you’.”



Really curious how this develops. Did any of the founding clubs actually withdraw? Like officially? I know the PL teams said so in a statement but iirc there were clausules in place that if they officially withdrew they would be fined and of course that would lead to all sorts of cases in court.

I would imagine there's a lot of truth in what he says. I'm sure the English clubs are paying lip service to being opposed to this while actually viewing it as necessary for their financial security.

 

[RG77]

Perez said after the failure, the clubs had signed contracts you can't just walk away from, and it will be back in future.

I would love Perez to get his league without the English clubs, it will be a car crash all on his head

Prolly, with no English clubs this won’t work at all. Guessing it is also a calculated move to have all of this on Perez. When it goes south, he’ll take the fall, club gets rid of him and gets off (lightly).

 

[NotChatGPT]

I find the hypocrisy a tad amusing. Football is fecked and it needs a hard reset. I’m hardly a fan of the ESL concept, but the current direction of UEFA, FIFA and the Premier League has made me lose most of my interest in football anyway. They are rather large parts of the problem

UEFA and FIFA. The latter, after years of trying, has finally managed to put together a revamped club world cup which will mean more matches, more revenue for FIFA. Both of them try to come up with more national team matches, meaningless tournaments, to increase revenues for their own benefits. FIFA just fecked most top leagues in the world by moving the world cup from summer to winter. FIFA will continue to push for a larger club world cup, as a future rival to the CL.

Meanwhile, in our glorious premier league, we have allowed the introduction of state funded clubs, oligarch ownership, to completely feck over the competition, to the point where even the UK government got involved to increase the chances of the Saudi ownership of Newcastle being approved because of fears it would have a negative impact on the UK’s relations with SA. We already know there’s political concerns, on the highest level, that the charges against Manchester City can have a negative effect on UK’s relations…All for the greater good of smaller clubs, and matchgoing fans obviously, integrity of the league and all that. As for the charges against Manchester City, the Premier League is a product and the overall value of the product is all that matters, the outcome is already written and there isn’t going to be any harsh punishments.

 

[carvajal]

So talk about merits are nonsens unless we look at history. Looking forward to Super League inviting teams like Sunderland and Everton for their success far back.

We know what this is about. Whole project is about saving Barcelona and RealMadrid from their economic problems. Just look who are founder of project and if there is connection with those clubs.

If Everton or Sunderland achieve good results over several years they would surely be in the conversation.
I have not talked about successes from fifty years ago, I have told you that they have won the last 17 of 20 ligas.
A mix of social mass, history and current successes would seem good to me.

The issue is that the same ones always win but in this case you are using the exception ( Girona) to justify the current model.
If I read correctly, in the Champions League in the last ten years, only Benfica, Porto and Ajax reached quarters, the rest of the places have always been for teams from the five major leagues.
The differences between teams are already enormous, it is already a competition for the rich.

People are upset because City have committed irregularities, because Saudi football does whatever it wants, and when there is a control project it is thrown overboard because it is supposedly exclusively to save Madrid.

They will have to put someone related to a fashion team (Leverkusen?) as CEO to see if they gain more followers.
And now is when comes the "la liga has not been managed well", "the premier is very rich", changing the democracy of European football for the unfounded fear that the leagues will die.
The fear of a semi-closed competition when clubs let themselves go, considering being fourth a success, year after year.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

We know what this is about. Whole project is about saving Barcelona and RealMadrid from their economic problems. Just look who are founder of project and if there is connection with those clubs.

Real Madrid's finances are fine.

 

[WeePat]

What can he even do about it?

Tweet

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[RG77]

What can he even do about it?

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Someone mentioned, and I don’t know if this is true, that the UK Government is planning on having some law in place that would basically prohibit the ESL. And unlike in the EU, once passed to law it would not be possible to challenge it in court. Anyone know more about the legality of this?

 

[Red in STL]

What can he even do about it?

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

When a politician wants something badly they usually find a way, I imagine they'd find a creative way to make it not financially worth it via the tax system

 

[golden_blunder]

Bernd Reichart, CEO of Super League: “One of the clubs that just made a statement against the Super League, called me and said ‘we're saying no in public, but we're with you’.”



Really curious how this develops. Did any of the founding clubs actually withdraw? Like officially? I know the PL teams said so in a statement but iirc there were clausules in place that if they officially withdrew they would be fined and of course that would lead to all sorts of cases in court.

He seems a bit of a mouthy knob

 

[crossy1686]

Where does it stop? When the teams go bust? Clubs and players need to start being brought back to reality otherwise more hare brained schemes promising the moon will appear. People will eventually fall to the lure of more, unnecessary money, and football as we know it will change

Well the money obviously exists, it just lines the pockets of executives at the likes of UEFA or in football team boardrooms. The money people will only ever spend what’s absolutely necessary on the actual football side of things to keep the money and sponsorships rolling in.

FIFA have about $4b just sitting in the bank in cash reserves. They’re a non profit organisation…

Surely that money should go to the people that actually make the sport what it is? Not the people that break laws in random countries and force them to host tournaments?

Look at American sports also, baseball and basketball players are earning more than football players and those sports aren’t as popular as football.

Will teams really go bust? FFP has kind of put a stop from teams over spending unless they’re supported by a state. What’s reality? These guys are millionaires by the time they’re 20, how do you bring them back to something they’ve never known?

Football changed years ago, and it’s better than it’s ever been (maybe with the exception of VAR) but there’s absolutely more money and value to be extracted, otherwise you wouldn’t get people like Bohley buying Chelsea and spending a billion £ for fun. They all know something else bigger is on the horizon.

 

[Krakenzero]

The issue is that the same ones always win but in this case you are using the exception ( Girona) to justify the current model.
If I read correctly, in the Champions League in the last ten years, only Benfica, Porto and Ajax reached quarters, the rest of the places have always been for teams from the five major leagues.

Ajax did reach semis though. Plus, Girona IS a team from the five major leagues. As are AS Monaco, Olympique Lyon, AS Rome, Villarreal and RB Leipzig, who did reach semis and final of the UCL in the last ten years. Would you favour Villarreal over Girona to be in the Star League in this case?

 

[Krakenzero]

Well the money obviously exists, it just lines the pockets of executives at the likes of UEFA or in football team boardrooms. The money people will only ever spend what’s absolutely necessary on the actual football side of things to keep the money and sponsorships rolling in.

FIFA have about $4b just sitting in the bank in cash reserves. They’re a non profit organisation…

Surely that money should go to the people that actually make the sport what it is? Not the people that break laws in random countries and force them to host tournaments?

So those would be Pérez, Laporta/Bartomeu and Agnelli?

BTW, who has been forced to host a tournament?Countries happily apply.

 

[Red in STL]

Well the money obviously exists, it just lines the pockets of executives at the likes of UEFA or in football team boardrooms. The money people will only ever spend what’s absolutely necessary on the actual football side of things to keep the money and sponsorships rolling in.

FIFA have about $4b just sitting in the bank in cash reserves. They’re a non profit organisation…

Surely that money should go to the people that actually make the sport what it is? Not the people that break laws in random countries and force them to host tournaments?

Look at American sports also, baseball and basketball players are earning more than football players and those sports aren’t as popular as football.

Will teams really go bust? FFP has kind of put a stop from teams over spending unless they’re supported by a state. What’s reality? These guys are millionaires by the time they’re 20, how do you bring them back to something they’ve never known?

Football changed years ago, and it’s better than it’s ever been (maybe with the exception of VAR) but there’s absolutely more money and value to be extracted, otherwise you wouldn’t get people like Bohley buying Chelsea and spending a billion £ for fun. They all know something else bigger is on the horizon.

,
In the US they are more popular, you can't compare the US sports to anywhere else, it's essentially a closed shop, full of regulations that would never work anywhere else

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

Couldn't care less about the smaller clubs and want what is best for my club.

This is utterly mental.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

This is utterly mental.

It's not, really. Maybe it's more difficult to understand that line of thinking in England where there has never been a handful of clubs perpetually dominating the football scene. But England is an anomaly in this. In most countries, you get 2-3 clubs being the top dogs with no risk of losing their status. For example, i follow the the third biggest club in my country (much, much smaller league) and when they win the title, the fans of the two big clubs make the joke that "these titles don't really count". And, of course, their owners make sure only individual TV deals and sponsorships are possible. They even consider it a travesty when a call goes against their teams (or they don't get a soft one when they need it). This attitude trickles down to the fanbases. Not just the Ultras, the majority of fans. I am not surprised at all that the likes of Juventus and Real Madrid think that they're "owed" their status. It is what it is.

 

[NotChatGPT]

This is utterly mental.

Hardly.

And just because the TV revenue is divided in a better way in England, it’s not as if anyone gives a shit about smaller clubs. Since the arrival of Roman into the league, 12 out of 19 league titles have gone to Chelsea and Manchester City. Polititians happy to weigh in to make sure Saudi’s could take over Newcastle, and then they’re «worried about the fans» in relation to a potential european super league. It’s fairly funny.

 

[Krakenzero]

This is utterly mental.

I think it's just standard tribalism. Align with the ones who are like you. Or maybe full individualism. We see this in politics all the time with people supporting a position for selfish reasons while falling to see the big picture.

Anyway, it's kind of refreshing and somehow better than "this is a great opportunity for small clubs that, now that they won't be able to compete against the big teams (DISCLAIMER: unless they get extraordinary results for several years in a row while avoid collapsing and/or getting dismantled by big teams), surely will get access to more money from private investors to help them grow".

 

[Arios]

I would imagine there's a lot of truth in what he says. I'm sure the English clubs are paying lip service to being opposed to this while actually viewing it as necessary for their financial security.

everyone right now is just scared of pr shitstorm.
And before that they were threatened by UEFA and national Govs

Also let me say that this UK law about not allowing teams to join any tournament that isn't ruled by UEFA is kind of ridiculous.
so they're saying "if you join another international tournament that isn't CL,UL or Conference you'll be excluded from Premier League" right?

Well this looks like a big bluff.
What's gonna happen to PL if suddenly United,City,Liverpool,Arsenal,Chelsea and Tottenham are outed?
Tv rights gonna bust immediatly as those 6 attract like 85% worth of Tv deals

I don't really understand what's UK gov is afraid of.
I mean in the end this SL (which is trasforming into a big bullshit honestly giving how much they're bending to please everyone) would be another name for Champions League, Europa League and Conference League.

Difference? teams from smaller and less relevant clubs are unlikely to be part of it unlike now where teams from Kazakistand and so on get a piece of it

 

[VP]

You'd think of all the football clubs to have an attachment to the European Cup it'd be Real Madrid? A truly spoilt, pathetic fanbase

 

[Arios]

Hardly.

And just because the TV revenue is divided in a better way in England, it’s not as if anyone gives a shit about smaller clubs. Since the arrival of Roman into the league, 12 out of 19 league titles have gone to Chelsea and Manchester City. Polititians happy to weigh in to make sure Saudi’s could take over Newcastle, and then they’re «worried about the fans» in relation to a potential european super league. It’s fairly funny.

you know what?
I'm afraid that after this PR shit storm on Super League

Next step gonna be Arabas pulling their money muscles and literally make the same thing adding 2-3 arabs team and throwing so much money to convince EU teams to join them.

While SL could follow marketing projects and be realistic about earnings and what's not .... Arabs saying "Oh I want this" like they did for world cups and so on
Well they could literally say "OH if you join this new Champions League we're gonna give you 12B/year to divide between those 20 teams"
Those money are nothing for them anyway
And I'm afraid that now that "football is free" after this sentence arabs will jump on it.

 

[Bosnian_fan]

everyone right now is just scared of pr shitstorm.
And before that they were threatened by UEFA and national Govs

Also let me say that this UK law about not allowing teams to join any tournament that isn't ruled by UEFA is kind of ridiculous.
so they're saying "if you join another international tournament that isn't CL,UL or Conference you'll be excluded from Premier League" right?

Well this looks like a big bluff.
What's gonna happen to PL if suddenly United,City,Liverpool,Arsenal,Chelsea and Tottenham are outed?
Tv rights gonna bust immediatly as those 6 attract like 85% worth of Tv deals

I don't really understand what's UK gov is afraid of.
I mean in the end this SL (which is trasforming into a big bullshit honestly giving how much they're bending to please everyone) would be another name for Champions League, Europa League and Conference League.

Difference? teams from smaller and less relevant clubs are unlikely to be part of it unlike now where teams from Kazakistand and so on get a piece of it

But that's precisely the problem, lack of care for teams from Kazakhstan. They wouldn't have been as weak if they were given equal opportunities by UEFA since 90s.

What you will achieve long term is absolute disinterest in your elite clubs in most of Europe and with that, you will start losing appeal and money. I don't watch Champions League anymore, it is borefest, and to me there is equal importance in matches between Copenhagen and Galatasaray on one side, and Milan and Dortmund on the other side. It is all tasteless and boring, I prefer watching league football. If Copenhagen and Galatasaray actually stood chance of making something, than I'd be glad to watch. This way, it's a bloody charade that I prefer not to be a part of.

Super league isn't going to make me consumer, because competitive spirit has long been lost.

 

[RG77]

This is utterly mental.

I don’t see the point in pretending. Happily sacrifice the dreams and hopes of other clubs for more success of my own club. Don’t see that as strange view.

You'd think of all the football clubs to have an attachment to the European Cup it'd be Real Madrid? A truly spoilt, pathetic fanbase

Technically this would be just another European Cup. Just some different flags and names around it.