Is there a way back for Real Madrid and Barcelona?

carvajal

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Carvajal/Odriozola
Militao/Nacho
Varane/Alaba
Mendy/??
Casemiro/??
Kroos/Modric
Valverde/??
Vini/Rodrygo
Benzema/Jovic
Asensio/Odegaard

Plus: Ceballos, Vallejo, Kubo, Reinier, Brahim, Mayoral coming back from loans

Hazard, Bale, Isco, Marcelo, out of the project

Promising youngsters who had minutes this season, Blanco(DM), Arribas(Mid), Miguel(LB)

We need a dynamic midfielder, a RB(if you really don't renew Lucas), a LB, and a star in attack to partner Benzema

Odriozola, Ceballos, Vallejo, Brahim and Mayoral are all players we should be trying to sell. If we sign a forward, at least one of Jovic/Odegaard/Asensio/Vini/Rodrygo should be sold as well

2 years from now we might need a more in depth rebuild, but for now, we need 4 players. Perhaps fewer
I agree on almost everything. I would add a creative midfielder (regardless of whether they sell Odegaard)
If getting rid of Bale was difficult despite his curriculum, I don't know how anyone is going to risk with Hazard and his 14 net.
Not sure if a loan would make sense either since it's not entirely a lack of involvement / bad relationship issue (and I am assuming Zidane leaves)
 

Daysleeper

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It's not about who has the most fans though. If pretty much everyone you play is shit, then the football isn't any fun to watch. You know before you start who is going to win. The ESL nonsense was clearly a late realization of this, from people who refuse to accept the truth of it in their own leagues.
what kind of rubbish nonsense is this? La liga has had more competitive title races than the epl in recent years.


epl only has one more league winner than la liga in the last ten years. Leicester was a 1 in a million outlier. City has been laying waste to the EPL and will continue to do so.

Point gap in prem 18/19 1st to 20th was 82 points. In la liga it was 55. 19/20 in prem it was 78 points. In la liga it was 62. Man city alone had more in league wins by 4+ goals than Barca, atleti, and real combined last season. Right now just 3 points separate the top 4 in la liga while city are 19 points up on fourth place Chelsea. As the money gap widens the EPL will become a 1-2 horse race similar to la liga with City leading the way
 

Daysleeper

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Courtois
Carvajal/Odriozola
Militao/Nacho
Varane/Alaba
Mendy/??
Casemiro/??
Kroos/Modric
Valverde/??
Vini/Rodrygo
Benzema/Jovic
Asensio/Odegaard

Plus: Ceballos, Vallejo, Kubo, Reinier, Brahim, Mayoral coming back from loans

Hazard, Bale, Isco, Marcelo, out of the project

Promising youngsters who had minutes this season, Blanco(DM), Arribas(Mid), Miguel(LB)

We need a dynamic midfielder, a RB(if you really don't renew Lucas), a LB, and a star in attack to partner Benzema

Odriozola, Ceballos, Vallejo, Brahim and Mayoral are all players we should be trying to sell. If we sign a forward, at least one of Jovic/Odegaard/Asensio/Vini/Rodrygo should be sold as well

2 years from now we might need a more in depth rebuild, but for now, we need 4 players. Perhaps fewer
It’s funny, like people have ignored how badly you guys have been decimated with injuries this season. If you add Mbappe that’s going to be scary once you get your health back
 

Djemba-Djemba

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what kind of rubbish nonsense is this? La liga has had more competitive title races than the epl in recent years.


epl only has one more league winner than la liga in the last ten years. Leicester was a 1 in a million outlier. City has been laying waste to the EPL and will continue to do so.

Point gap in prem 18/19 1st to 20th was 82 points. In la liga it was 55. 19/20 in prem it was 78 points. In la liga it was 62. Man city alone had more in league wins by 4+ goals than Barca, atleti, and real combined last season. Right now just 3 points separate the top 4 in la liga while city are 19 points up on fourth place Chelsea. As the money gap widens the EPL will become a 1-2 horse race similar to la liga with City leading the way
Last ten years Utd City Chelsea Leicester and Liverpool have won the title.
 

Kentonio

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what kind of rubbish nonsense is this? La liga has had more competitive title races than the epl in recent years.


epl only has one more league winner than la liga in the last ten years. Leicester was a 1 in a million outlier. City has been laying waste to the EPL and will continue to do so.

Point gap in prem 18/19 1st to 20th was 82 points. In la liga it was 55. 19/20 in prem it was 78 points. In la liga it was 62. Man city alone had more in league wins by 4+ goals than Barca, atleti, and real combined last season. Right now just 3 points separate the top 4 in la liga while city are 19 points up on fourth place Chelsea. As the money gap widens the EPL will become a 1-2 horse race similar to la liga with City leading the way
You've had 3 different champions in the last 16 years. We've had 5 in the last 8 years.
 

Pretzels81

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A way back? :lol:Both fighting for the Liga title, UCL semis (Madrid) and (domestic) Cup champions (Barca). Hardly a decline.

People keep comparing Madrid/Barca with the PL clubs. Only Bayern can compare. And to a lesser extent, Juventus.
 

giorno

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You've had 3 different champions in the last 16 years. We've had 5 in the last 8 years.
Also 5 in the last 16

Point was about tightness of title race, not variety though
 

Daysleeper

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You've had 3 different champions in the last 16 years. We've had 5 in the last 8 years.
one of which was such an outlier it wouldn’t happen again for another 100 years. Barely a difference in champions, and city look to turn the epl into a one horse league.

and 5 in the last 16 for la liga
 

Kentonio

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one of which was such an outlier it wouldn’t happen again for another 100 years. Barely a difference in champions, and city look to turn the epl into a one horse league.
Ah yes, a one horse race that they didn't win last year.

and 5 in the last 16 for la liga
Are you following some Alternate La Liga or something? Last time someone other than Barca, Real or Atletico won La Liga was 2003-04 which was 16 full seasons ago.
 

SCP

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It's not about who has the most fans though. If pretty much everyone you play is shit, then the football isn't any fun to watch. You know before you start who is going to win. The ESL nonsense was clearly a late realization of this, from people who refuse to accept the truth of it in their own leagues.
I sincerely doubt the mid table clubs in England are particularly better than the mid table clubs in Spain. The top clubs yes, the mid table ones? I sincerely doubt. The difference is on the financial resources, and the signing of Guardiola, Klopp, now Tuchel added quality to the management of those clubs. 5/6 years ago the level of English clubs in Europe related with the amount of money they invested was pretty bad, it was even worse than the Bundesliga.
 

Daysleeper

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Ah yes, a one horse race that they didn't win last year.



Are you following some Alternate La Liga or something? Last time someone other than Barca, Real or Atletico won La Liga was 2003-04 which was 16 full seasons ago.
yes, in the most lopsided title race in epl history with a team couldn’t get past the quarter finals of UCL.
 

Redlyn

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Real came out at the SF stage. Won 3 of last 5. Too early for a eulogy.
 

stefan92

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I do not know what is more concerning for Barca, that they have secured even more debt, or that they owed their players €100m.
This doesn't change their debts, just who they owe it to (their players vs the bank). But the fact that they need to discuss about such a loan should concern them, that's true
 

Tallis

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I recall reading that they have a €250m loan coming due in June’s. Their issues seem quite deep. Billion plus in debt plus unpaid wages. Should really try to flog their expensive deadweight.
 

Dave Smith

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I recall reading that they have a €250m loan coming due in June’s. Their issues seem quite deep. Billion plus in debt plus unpaid wages. Should really try to flog their expensive deadweight.
Well the problem they have is that dead weight is just that. No way do they get rid of those players unless they pay up their contracts.
 

RoyH1

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What’s an extra 100m when you’re already in nearly a billion worth of debt? :wenger:
Even more scary is that they actually got 500 million as the entire line of credit. The 100 million is for spending here and now.

Laporta must have a plan for doing something pretty drastic at some point. They're going to have to sell some of their assets and cut spending.
 

Dave Smith

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Even more scary is that they actually got 500 million as the entire line of credit. The 100 million is for spending here and now.

Laporta must have a plan for doing something pretty drastic at some point. They're going to have to sell some of their assets and cut spending.
Ignore the papers, their signings this Summer will be the likes of Depay and Garcia. They'll extend Messi but that'll be it.
 

kingwaynerooney

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A way back? :lol:Both fighting for the Liga title, UCL semis (Madrid) and (domestic) Cup champions (Barca). Hardly a decline.

People keep comparing Madrid/Barca with the PL clubs. Only Bayern can compare. And to a lesser extent, Juventus.
Madrid legends are getting older Ramos, Kroos and Modric. Semi finals was their last effort at winning with the old regime. It will take at least 2-3 for the two spanish teams to get back to being a serious threat for the champions league. But of course if Madrid luck out on Mbappe and Barca on halaand it will be much quicker.

Barca's already lucked out on few promising young players. Madrid has one more year with Benz Kroos Modric. Ramons repalced by alaba,
 

Pep's Suit

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Sounds like Laporta wants 13 players gone this summer incl. Pique, Alba, Busquets, Pjanic Dembele, Giezmann and Coutinho.
 

Dave Smith

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Sounds like Laporta wants 13 players gone this summer incl. Pique, Alba, Busquets, Pjanic Dembele, Giezmann and Coutinho.
He can want them gone all he wants but he needs to find some crack head to take their wages on. Not going to happen.
 

RoyH1

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He can want them gone all he wants but he needs to find some crack head to take their wages on. Not going to happen.
Busquets or Griezman might find some takers, but no way the rest do at their wage level.
 

Dave Smith

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Busquets or Griezman might find some takers, but no way the rest do at their wage level.
Griezmann is on €800k a week. Who is paying that? They may get a loan where they only have to cover part of his wages but that is it. The difficulty Barca have is the wages their players are on as no one else is going to come close in matching them.
 

RoyH1

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Griezmann is on €800k a week. Who is paying that? They may get a loan where they only have to cover part of his wages but that is it. The difficulty Barca have is the wages their players are on as no one else is going to come close in matching them.
Are you sure about the amount? Seems absurdly high to me.
I think if Mbappé leaves PSG, Griezmann could be a fit there.
 

Kentonio

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Griezmann is on €800k a week. Who is paying that? They may get a loan where they only have to cover part of his wages but that is it. The difficulty Barca have is the wages their players are on as no one else is going to come close in matching them.
He's on what now?!
 

Robertd0803

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The fact that this was to cover outstanding debt to players should be even more of a concern considering the players get paid every month.

And regarding Greizmanns wages, he really is on something insane per week isnt he? Not sure if the regularly mentioned 800k is right or before tax (in which case hes still coming in at 500/600k a week) but they are going to find it impossible to get someone to take that on.
 

Gonçalo Motta

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I think it really is the end of an era for Barcelona and it's gonna take a long time until they climb back to the top.

They are way too deep in their debt and need to offload a lot of players and that still won't be enough.

But tbf, they kinda deserve it. They kept Messi (and his massive wage) when he wanted to leave, they gave massive contracts to players that barely had/have any impact on the team, they invested way to much in the wrong players, etc.

Top Barça wages:

• Messi - 1.3M/week
• Griezmann - 880k/week
• Frenkie - 400k/week

You could pay a top level full 11 with those wages alone.

Everything about the management of the club in the last years sounds so amateurish
 
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Dave Smith

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The fact that this was to cover outstanding debt to players should be even more of a concern considering the players get paid every month.

And regarding Greizmanns wages, he really is on something insane per week isnt he? Not sure if the regularly mentioned 800k is right or before tax (in which case hes still coming in at 500/600k a week) but they are going to find it impossible to get someone to take that on.
What is even more scary is that they have secured a €500m line of credit but have to cover the following:

€100m wages
€100m in fees amortisation
€265m bank loan maturing on 30 June

That is before you get to any other costs that they're behind on. It is absolutely bananas.

However, whilst that is scary, what I find even more so is that people think Barca can still go out and buy Håland or Mbappe if they want too. :lol: :lol:
 

dinostar77

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Unfortunately for Barcelona as a club, the chairmen both previous and current don't want their legacy tainted with "the chairman who sold messi", even though for the club the best thing would be to let him go.

Barcelona will definitely have a few barren years by their lofty standards as it will take years to get out of the debt and recycle the playing squad.

Madrid definitely dont have the same level of problems. Though i think they have reached an end of a cycle with their current squad.

If the advisors for Mbappe and Haaland had any brain cells, they'd advise their clients to steer clear of Barcelona and Madrid for a few seasons.
 

cyberman

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No chance. Well, Barca may have a glimmer but Madrid have relied on the big money signings for too long now, i dont know if they know how to compete on a budget.