Jose Mourinho - Roma manager (from 2021-22 season)

Irwin99

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So nothing to do with Jose at all:rolleyes:
I personally think Conte's the better manager right now but they're quite similar in some ways. I'm not really fussed either way but I just suddenly got reminded of that match and the Jones errors immediately sprang to mind.
 

Loon

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I thought he had weighed in on the CL. One thing is for sure, he HATES the dippers.
 

Leserafim

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:lol:

I would bet my house on Jose not reaching CL finals. We might have appointed clown but at least we got rid of toxic clown.
This is blatantly that mental Roma fan that joined at the start of the season and got banned for being such an obvious WUM.
Carlo Ancelotti: “I think it helped that Liverpool were easier to decipher than the others, because they have a very clear identity and we could prepare the way that we did. We knew what strategy to take - don’t give them space behind the defence to run into.”

#UCLfinal #UCL

It's ridiculous to think that a manager who spend close to 800m in 7 seasons only to win 4 trophies , with 1 system ,1 tactic, 1 playstyle as predictable af , couldn't adapt to opposition tactic , is better than Jose Mourinho. Then the guy cried on media because he is getting fish instead of meat.

Conte can lift clubs now in a way Mourinho can't.

Takes over Inter when they were finishing 3rd/4th. Very nearly wins the league first season and then does it second.

Takes over Spurs mid season and gets them 4th, Mourinho couldn't quite do it.

His european record is an oddity but will surely have a good run at some stage, perhaps next season at Spurs if they drop into the europa.
Context is needed here , Conte can lifts the club because he got many more players than Mourinho , give jose the same backing he would have won more than conte.
Last 7 years conte won 4 trophies, recruit over 30 players , last 7 years jose won 3 trophies, didn't even recruit half of that. Exactly why your incompetent board doesn't want to hire Conte because they aren't ready of his ridiculous demand of recruitment. He brought in all your deadwood such as Sanchez , Darmian, Young to Inter yet nobody complain , imagine your fanbase reaction if it was Mourinho who shop for other team deadwood , old and finished players ?
 
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roonster09

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Carlo Ancelotti: “I think it helped that Liverpool were easier to decipher than the others, because they have a very clear identity and we could prepare the way that we did. We knew what strategy to take - don’t give them space behind the defence to run into.”

#UCLfinal #UCL

It's ridiculous to think that a manager who spend close to 800m in 7 seasons only to win 4 trophies , with 1 system ,1 tactic, 1 playstyle as predictable af , couldn't adapt to opposition tactic , is better than Jose Mourinho. Then the guy cried on media because he is getting fish instead of meat.
:lol:
 

Zetrio2002

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If spurs had kept Mourinho for a while more, they would have one domestic cup.
 

Fanatic 00237

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If you're claiming something, you're supposed to bring proof to support your claim. Otherwise I can invent anything out of my mind and then say "nah, I'm not arsed to dig up posts for people saying that". What does prevent me from doing that ?

Like, ironically enough, you claimed Mourinho's quote of "one of my best achievements" was about EL win while it was about the 2nd position in the league and you just ignored this point and moved on.
When I made the claim about some fans considering the EL win as an achievement I seemed to understand from your posting that you were included among them. You cleared that up already so, unless you want us debating for the fun of it, if we both agree I don't need to go searching for evidence to prove to you that others think that way.

You really seem to want us to continue debating just for the fun of it. You already responded in the previous post that the claim was made about the 2nd place finish; still a dumb thing to say but well, fair enough.
Yet if you read this article (Jose Mourinho: Europa League win means Manchester United season was a success) he does make ridiculous claims about winning the trophy of a competition where United were vastly superior to all their opponents. And he does mention that it was the most important trophy of his career.


Do you realize that PSG have been mocked for the past several years for winning their league titles while being underwhelming in CL ? That they're always mocked for winning "farmers league" every time they fail in a CL campaign ? No one consider PSG winning their league title an achievement considering the big gap between them and their rivals, and whenever they bottle it in Europe, everyone makes fun of them.

And the argument doesn't work on Bayern, because even though they're indeed much stronger than their domestic competitors and winning their league isn't a big achievement nowadays, they're also a major force in Europe and are always playing in advanced stages in CL and were CL champions 3 years ago.

If Bayern dropped to EL from CL group and lost to Villareal in the final no one will consider this a a good European campaign, unlike what you're trying to force for a team of Man United caliber, whom are supposed to compete in Champions League, not playing regularly in 2nd tier European competition every year while not even being able to win it bar once, and lost the final to a far inferior team to them. Man United shouldn't be playing in Europe League, more importantly shouldn't be playing in it that regularly, the fact we're competing in it alone means we're awful. Dropping to it from CL group means we're godawful.
I agree, no one will consider it as a good European campaign, can you quote where I said the contrary? I don't know why you seem not to get my point, I simply don't agree that you would say we are awful in Europe, having twice got to the QF of the CL and played two EL finals (winning it once) over 10 years. You seem to be considering that every time we played in the EL we dropped into it after failing in the CL, meanwhile we have regularly finished outside CL places in the PL since SAF retired. That in itself is indicative of our general level post-SAF. It's hard to think we should be world beaters in the CL when we have frequently been unable to qualify for it at all. We may have to end up agreeing to disagree here but IMHO it was absolutely disrespectful towards United for Mourinho to bring up heritage or whatever nonsense to justify Sevilla knocking us out (remember that's the debate which brought us here). Sevilla may have won it more frequently recently but that's also because they have played in it way more frequently while we keep yo-yoing between the CL and EL season in season out.



This isn't a Mourinho vs Ole debate. You said we lost the final only due to PKs as if we played a good game, deserved to win and were unlucky to lose. The reality is Villareal played the final with the plan to reach PKs, they had a plan and succeeded in it. Meanwhile we did nothing worthy to note in the 120 minutes, our tactical gameplay and subs were pretty bad and really deserved nothing out of this day. The team with the plan won, we had no plan to win this day and the fact this happened against a far inferior side to us in terms of quality and investment is more of a proof we're awful, rather than a proof we haven't been shit in Europe.

And you're the one who brought the Ajax final into this discussion from the start by the way. You're the one who decided to compare this EL campaign to the one Mourinho brought from the start, not anyone of us, you. Everything after that was me responding to you, and you won't have to "dig up posts", just return few pages back.
Or rather from my perspective, the team with the plan to draw got a draw and then fluked a win after the lottery of pks. I wouldn't normally rely on match statistics as I know stats don't tell the whole story but you just know if we both re-watched the match we would certainly disagree on every subjective aspect so all that's left objectively is match stats. At very least, those show that United dominated the game, by every objective metric.
 
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Leserafim

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Jose Mourinho: Europa League win means Manchester United season was a success[/URL]) he does make ridiculous claims about winning the trophy of a competition where United were vastly superior to all their opponents. And he does mention that it was the most important trophy of his career.
No , you aren't vastly superior , you just have better history than others nothing else . The ajax team you guys beat went into UCL semifinal the next season with very much the same squad , you also lost to Fayenoord at group stage. Some people said Mourinho is finished because he didn't win much for the last 7 years. That logic applies more to a club rather than to a manager .United has been shit for a long time , Mourinho knew how hard it was to win trophies with you. He is spot on once again looking at how you guys has been trophyless for half decade already.
 
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el3mel

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When I made the claim about some fans considering the EL win as an achievement I seemed to understand from your posting that you were included among them. You cleared that up already so, unless you want us debating for the fun of it, if we both agree I don't need to go searching for evidence to prove to you that others think that way.

You really seem to want us to continue debating just for the fun of it. You already responded in the previous post that the claim was made about the 2nd place finish; still a dumb thing to say but well, fair enough.
Yet if you read this article (Jose Mourinho: Europa League win means Manchester United season was a success) he does make ridiculous claims about winning the trophy of a competition where United were vastly superior to all their opponents. And he does mention that it was the most important trophy of his career.



I agree, no one will consider it as a good European campaign, can you quote where I said the contrary? I don't know why you seem not to get my point, I simply don't agree that you would say we are awful in Europe, having twice got to the QF of the CL and played two EL finals (winning it once) over 10 years. You seem to be considering that every time we played in the EL we dropped into it after failing in the CL, meanwhile we have regularly finished outside CL places in the PL since SAF retired. That in itself is indicative of our general level post-SAF. It's hard to think we should be world beaters in the CL when we have frequently been unable to qualify for it at all. We may have to end up agreeing to disagree here but IMHO it was absolutely disrespectful towards United for Mourinho to bring up heritage or whatever nonsense to justify Sevilla knocking us out (remember that's the debate which brought us here). Sevilla may have won it more frequently recently but that's also because they have played in it way more frequently while we keep yo-yoing between the CL and EL season in season out.




Or rather from my perspective, the team with the plan to draw got a draw and then fluked a win after the lottery of pks. I wouldn't normally rely on match statistics as I know stats don't tell the whole story but you just know if we both re-watched the match we would certainly disagree on every subjective aspect so all that's left objectively is match stats. At very least, those show that United dominated the game, by every objective metric.
Did you read the quotes in the link you posted?

"For me, it is the most important trophy of my career because it is the last. That's the way I look at things," he added.

"Of course, Champions League is bigger than Europa League, but that's the last trophy and the last trophy is the one where the feelings are under the skin.
I don't get how you consider cutting statements out of their context and posting it as an evidence of your point a good way of discussion. It would be easier to say that you were wrong and just move. No, at first you mentioned he said it was one of his greatest achievements while this quote was on something else then bring a quote in which he says it's the most important trophy in his career because it was his last one, and just take the first part of the quote ignoring the 2nd part.

Again, really a poor way of trying to force your opinion and not just admitting you were wrong in this particular point.

QF being your best achievement in CL in last 10 years plus winning Europe League only once during this period despite playing in it 4 times, 3 of them were the biggest favorite to win it is a pretty bad record in Europe. Nothing has changed since this press conference. In fact we got worse since then : lost 2 Europe League, got KOed from CL group then 16th round the next year, after barely getting past an moderate group as well.

Also out of the 4 times we played in EL in last 10 years, we dropped to it from CL group twice, in 2016 and last year.

These stats you brought are simply wrong. These are the correct stats from UEFA site, which are also the same on Whoscored by the way, one of the most accurate stats site.

https://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/match/2029909--villarreal-vs-man-united/statistics/

Villarreal had 12 attempts in comparison to United's 14, which is mostly equal. The most damning thing is out of those 14 chances we had, we only had 2 shots on target the entire 120 minutes. For a team who had the majority of the possession in the game, 57%, unlike Villarreal who were mostly defensive, that's a pretty bad stat and a proof that were mostly clueless offensively in this game. Villarreal played the game their own way and it was clear their players were trained very well on pens when they reached them.
 

Fanatic 00237

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Did you read the quotes in the link you posted?



I don't get how you consider cutting statements out of their context and posting it as an evidence of your point a good way of discussion. It would be easier to say that you were wrong and just move. No, at first you mentioned he said it was one of his greatest achievements while this quote was on something else then bring a quote in which he says it's the most important trophy in his career because it was his last one, and just take the first part of the quote ignoring the 2nd part.

Again, really a poor way of trying to force your opinion and not just admitting you were wrong in this particular point.
I don’t know why you keep resorting to ad hominem attacks, it makes the conversation quite unpleasant, you have been doing that repeatedly. I’m just trying to have a civil discussion with you on our differing views.
I didn’t quote his words exactly, guess what, he doesn’t live in my head so you shouldn’t expect me to remember his every quote exactly.

Anyway, taking the full quote still makes little sense. He wouldn’t claim winning the Audi Cup or Community Shield is the most important trophy in his career because it’s the last one so saying that about winning the EL when it was nothing but a nice trophy to win and nothing more than what was expected is rather stupid.

QF being your best achievement in CL in last 10 years plus winning Europe League only once during this period despite playing in it 4 times, 3 of them were the biggest favorite to win it is a pretty bad record in Europe. Nothing has changed since this press conference. In fact we got worse since then : lost 2 Europe League, got KOed from CL group then 16th round the next year, after barely getting past an moderate group as well.

Also out of the 4 times we played in EL in last 10 years, we dropped to it from CL group twice, in 2016 and last year.
I wouldn’t call it a good record, but I wouldn’t call it an awful record either, nor an absolutely shit record, nor even a bad record. Just not good enough. We will surely have to agree to disagree on that.

And even if what he said was eventually valid in the aftermath, it has no bearing on the fact that he wasn’t entitled to say it at the time he did.

These stats you brought are simply wrong. These are the correct stats from UEFA site, which are also the same on Whoscored by the way, one of the most accurate stats site.

https://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/match/2029909--villarreal-vs-man-united/statistics/

Villarreal had 12 attempts in comparison to United's 14, which is mostly equal. The most damning thing is out of those 14 chances we had, we only had 2 shots on target the entire 120 minutes. For a team who had the majority of the possession in the game, 57%, unlike Villarreal who were mostly defensive, that's a pretty bad stat and a proof that were mostly clueless offensively in this game. Villarreal played the game their own way and it was clear their players were trained very well on pens when they reached them.
Your own stats still don’t disprove that we did more to win the game, even if marginally so. And despite their players having trained well on pens like you say, they needed a missed pen from our gk in order to win. That’s a lame plan to win a match if you ask me but good on you if you think they did better, each to their own I guess.
 

Leserafim

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Around the time Jose allegedly wanted Perisic, for similar money Liverpool signed Mané, City got Sané, and Real secured Vinicius.

Those are the kind of left wingers a manager coaching a club of Utd stature should request, and fans eventually regret missing out, not Perisic...
When you back a manager you bought him a certain players he asked for , not other player in similar position. It's the bullshit fanbase of yours who keeps questioning why he wanted this guy , why he wanted that guy is the problem because your clueless board seems to follow majority opinion from the fanbase for the sake of marketing purpose. Meanwhile a manager in his prime Antonio Conte keeps on buying new players even though they are old and pass their prime , he didnt care about trying to get the best out of Dele alli , Harry Winks , Troy Parrot or Ndombele or bla3. Just sit and watch what Mourinho can do with the players he chose himself at Roma while your club is sinking.
 

africanspur

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When you back a manager you bought him a certain players he asked for , not other player in similar position. It's the bullshit fanbase of yours who keeps questioning why he wanted this guy , why he wanted that guy is the problem because your clueless board seems to follow majority opinion from the fanbase for the sake of marketing purpose. Meanwhile a manager in his prime Antonio Conte keeps on buying new players even though they are old and pass their prime , he didnt care about trying to get the best out of Dele alli , Harry Winks , Troy Parrot or Ndombele or bla3. Just sit and watch what Mourinho can do with the players he chose himself at Roma while your club is sinking.
So simultaneously you should back a manager when he asks for certain players (when its Mourinho) but not back a manager when he asks for certain players (Conte)?

Didn't realise Bentancaur and Kulusevski were so close to retirement by the way, their careers were really cut short.

Dele and Winks have been subpar for a long time and we've put up with their crap for too long. Dele was also not played by Mourinho towards the end (and rightly so), Winks was never used regularly by Mourinho (and rightly so) nor was Parrott (who is still not ready for top level football).

N'dombele is probably our worst signing of all time sadly and I wouldn't be surprised if he's with us for the rest of his contract. Was poor even on his return to France on loan, was poor under Poch, was poor under Jose, poor under Nuno and poor under Conte. There's one common theme there.

Stop talking nonsense.
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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Difference is one manager signed the guy at 33 years old. The other one wanted him as his prime but rejected because your board thought they know about football better. You have no problem spending 50m to wank bissaka yet making so much fuss when Jose wanted Perisic because afraid he would threw out your bumboy Martial. Jose was at Roma because he wanted it, Ancelotti agent just said Madrid wanted Jose before they went for Ancelotti because Jose refuse it. Like i said before , he loves a challenging job , turning mediocre club into top one but only if they back him unconditionally. It's just stupid to think Conte is better than Mourinho, one work with Chelsea and Inter, won 4 trophies in total after signing like over 30 players at both club , couldn't even win conference league because he lost to farmers at group stage.Mourinho worked with shit United , Spurs and Mediocre Roma , barely get backed and still win similar amount of trophies. Chelsea was 5th when he was sacked from , threw tantrum at Inter because they no longer back him after making them broke , mostly will be trophyless at Spurs.
Can we please ban this guy. Chats nonsense and who can really be arsed to read it?
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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Mourinho fanboys are geuinely some of the biggest not jobs known to the human race. I imagine they are also the same people who love a conspiracy theory.
 

el3mel

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I don’t know why you keep resorting to ad hominem attacks, it makes the conversation quite unpleasant, you have been doing that repeatedly. I’m just trying to have a civil discussion with you on our differing views.
I didn’t quote his words exactly, guess what, he doesn’t live in my head so you shouldn’t expect me to remember his every quote exactly.

Anyway, taking the full quote still makes little sense. He wouldn’t claim winning the Audi Cup or Community Shield is the most important trophy in his career because it’s the last one so saying that about winning the EL when it was nothing but a nice trophy to win and nothing more than what was expected is rather stupid.
There's nothing "civil" about this discussion when you're so stubborn to admit you were wrong at an obvious point to the point of saying the bold part.

You brought a link, took one line out of context from it, posted it to prove your point, then when faced by it, you bring this gem "he doesn’t live in my head so you shouldn’t expect me to remember his every quote exactly." You are the one who brought the link with the quote, remember ?

Ever since this discussion starter, you have been claiming things, refusing to bring a proof on them, and taking quotes out of context or on different subjects trying to prove your points then reply by saying "I'm not arsed" whenever you're countered. How am I supposed to take this discussion seriously after this ? You tell me.

Your own stats still don’t disprove that we did more to win the game, even if marginally so. And despite their players having trained well on pens like you say, they needed a missed pen from our gk in order to win. That’s a lame plan to win a match if you ask me but good on you if you think they did better, each to their own I guess.
We have two shots on target, one of them was our goal, that means we created one more good chance to win the game in the entire 120 minutes. The number of attempts created by both teams is nearly identical 14 to 12. They have more blocked shots 5 to 4, both teams have same number of off target shots 7 and United have only one more on target 2 to 1. If anything, these stats prove the match was mostly even on the pitch and considering that we were the team with more possession, it reflects poorly on us that with 57% ball possession, we only managed 2 shots on target, our goal and one more. You would expect us to have more chances to win if we deserved it but these stats just show what we all witnessed that day : we were clueless and couldn't create anything for the majority of the game.

And a lame plan is better than no plan.
 

Fanatic 00237

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There's nothing "civil" about this discussion when you're so stubborn to admit you were wrong at an obvious point to the point of saying the bold part.

You brought a link, took one line out of context from it, posted it to prove your point, then when faced by it, you bring this gem "he doesn’t live in my head so you shouldn’t expect me to remember his every quote exactly." You are the one who brought the link with the quote, remember ?

Ever since this discussion starter, you have been claiming things, refusing to bring a proof on them, and taking quotes out of context or on different subjects trying to prove your points then reply by saying "I'm not arsed" whenever you're countered. How am I supposed to take this discussion seriously after this ? You tell me.



We have two shots on target, one of them was our goal, that means we created one more good chance to win the game in the entire 120 minutes. The number of attempts created by both teams is nearly identical 14 to 12. They have more blocked shots 5 to 4, both teams have same number of off target shots 7 and United have only one more on target 2 to 1. If anything, these stats prove the match was mostly even on the pitch and considering that we were the team with more possession, it reflects poorly on us that with 57% ball possession, we only managed 2 shots on target, our goal and one more. You would expect us to have more chances to win if we deserved it but these stats just show what we all witnessed that day : we were clueless and couldn't create anything for the majority of the game.

And a lame plan is better than no plan.
For starters it’s a blatant lie that I said I can’t be bothered whenever you’ve countered my arguments. I said so only just once and that was concerning the fact that you (like I) didn’t think Mourinho winning the EL was an achievement. Once I realised we both agree it wasn’t one, the point was closed. I’d be happy for you to quote any other case where I responded that way.

And if you’re unable to have a civil discussion here for whatsoever reason then I think it’s better we move on.
 

DatIrishFella

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I was just going over the league tables from previous years due to the "Can we score 80 goals this season" thread and it reminded me that Jose's Chelsea only conceded 15 goals that season (04/05). Ridiculous.
 

Red the Bear

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I was just going over the league tables from previous years due to the "Can we score 80 goals this season" thread and it reminded me that Jose's Chelsea only conceded 15 goals that season (04/05). Ridiculous.
Yeah, that's one record we won't see broken any time soon.
 

Dave Smith

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I hope he doesn't go, he's doing a great project at Roma.
Probably depends on how much power the players actually have at PSG. Looking in from the outside it looks like a lot, so I can see him turning it down. The only issue may be money as he is likely to get a lot
 

tentan

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Probably depends on how much power the players actually have at PSG. Looking in from the outside it looks like a lot, so I can see him turning it down. The only issue may be money as he is likely to get a lot
he doesn't need it
 

Lay

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Not impressed by the signings so far
 

Markolan

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Matic, Celik, Solbakken are close and will improve their depth.

I think they'll make one big signing in the midfield (Ruben Neves is heavily linked) and if Zaniolo leaves I'm pretty sure Goncalo Guedes will join Roma (Both Jorge Mendes players of course, Roma might be the new "Valencia" or "West Ham")
 

roonster09

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Matic, Celik, Solbakken are close and will improve their depth.

I think they'll make one big signing in the midfield (Ruben Neves is heavily linked) and if Zaniolo leaves I'm pretty sure Goncalo Guedes will join Roma (Both Jorge Mendes players of course, Roma might be the new "Valencia" or "West Ham")
Wolves not West Ham, if you meant Mendes club.
 

SCP

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Matic, Celik, Solbakken are close and will improve their depth.

I think they'll make one big signing in the midfield (Ruben Neves is heavily linked) and if Zaniolo leaves I'm pretty sure Goncalo Guedes will join Roma (Both Jorge Mendes players of course, Roma might be the new "Valencia" or "West Ham")
As someone said previously it’s Wolves, West Ham has nothing to do with it.

I suspect Guedes and Neves might be too much for them, the other day he was asking Porto to reduce the price of Oliveira, but who knows.

Tbh at this stage Matic and Svilar won’t add nothing to what Roma needs.
 

André Dominguez

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As someone said previously it’s Wolves, West Ham has nothing to do with it.

I suspect Guedes and Neves might be too much for them, the other day he was asking Porto to reduce the price of Oliveira, but who knows.

Tbh at this stage Matic and Svilar won’t add nothing to what Roma needs.
Those two are clearly comission transfers: one half-retired midfielder and a keeper who was once considered a young with lots of potential but simply stalled.
 

Bastian

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I know he had a major injury at the Euros, but Spinazzola was fit by the end of the season wasn't he? Was it due to lack of fitness that Mourinho started Zalewski ahead of him?
 

Foxbatt

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The Italians league is a lot slower than the PL so he may get an year or two out of Matic.
 

TenonTen

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This might be a bit controversial but thoughts on this rule on players representing the national team of their origin?



 

::sonny::

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In Italy all the papers talking about Ronaldo, because of Mourinho and Mendes is offering him to italian teams

Roma fans are convinced that Ronaldo will be unveiled on 29th june in stadio olimpico




 

Wednesday at Stoke

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Surely United, as bad as it is now, is still better than Roma from a sporting sense?

I’d much rather sell him to Chelsea, they’ll offer good money. These Italians are bitterly tight and they’ll offer a loan to buy or 12M euros rising to 20M with a hundred add ons.
 

Adisa

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Surely United, as bad as it is now, is still better than Roma from a sporting sense?

I’d much rather sell him to Chelsea, they’ll offer good money. These Italians are bitterly tight and they’ll offer a loan to buy or 12M euros rising to 20M with a hundred add ons.
How much do you think Chelsea are going to offer for a 37 year old on £450k a week?
 

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Copenhagen
Supports
Time Travel
How much do you think Chelsea are going to offer for a 37 year old on £450k a week?
How much are they going to offer a 25 goal a season striker who physically looks like he’s still 30 in a market void of strikers? I wouldn’t settle for anything less than 40M.