Luke Shaw

King7Eric said:
Are people actually believing this? If he leaves he could do far better than Everton. Christ! People will believe anything on here.

And we want to sell him so as not to hamper Malacia? I mean anyone with eyes should be able to see there's levels of difference between their abilities. If we do move on Shaw, Malacia isn't a replacement.
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He isn’t going to City or Liverpool. Arsenal have multiple players for the LB position. Chelsea are fitting in LBs in a back 3 so he isn’t required there. Spurs? Maybe but whilst Conte is there he’d lose his sh*t with Shaw’s half arsed, part time effort. Newcastle? Maybe. Villa have Digne, so no. For all the hype surrounding the guy it’s Everton levels domestically.

He isn’t going to PSG, Mendes. Bayern? Davies. Madrid certainly isn’t happening & neither is Barcelona. He might get an offer from Italy but doesn’t strike me as a player that would flourish abroad anyway.

He isn’t a player in particular demand, might change if he were free but we’ll activate the clause. The Everton link is exactly the level Shaw should expect.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
He isn’t going to City or Liverpool. Arsenal have multiple players for the LB position. Chelsea are fitting in LBs in a back 3 so he isn’t required there. Spurs? Maybe but whilst Conte is there he’d lose his sh*t with Shaw’s half arsed, part time effort. Newcastle? Maybe. Villa have Digne, so no. For all the hype surrounding the guy it’s Everton levels domestically.

He isn’t going to PSG, Mendes. Bayern? Davies. Madrid certainly isn’t happening & neither is Barcelona. He might get an offer from Italy but doesn’t strike me as a player that would flourish abroad anyway.

He isn’t a player in particular demand, might change if he were free but we’ll activate the clause. The Everton link is exactly the level Shaw should expect.
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So you just make loads of assumptions and maybes and conclude Everton is his level? Fine if that's how you think. There's no way he ends up at Everton. Don't know what on earth people expect from him but he's way down in our list of problems.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
Isn’t saying ‘there’s no way he ends up at X’ an assumption. . .

I think he’ll eventually stay as we’re not in a position to upgrade currently.
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It's based on experience as well. How many Utd players in their prime have moved to Everton in the last 2 decades? Schneiderlein is the only one who comes to mind and he was a massive flop. Think we can all agree, irrespective of our opinions on Shaw, that he hasn't been as bad as Schneiderlein. Shaw is a first choice England international in his position as well. Even if he was to move, Everton would be a hard sell for him.
 
King7Eric said:
It's based on experience as well. How many Utd players in their prime have moved to Everton in the last 2 decades? Schneiderlein is the only one who comes to mind and he was a massive flop. Think we can all agree, irrespective of our opinions on Shaw, that he hasn't been as bad as Schneiderlein. Shaw is a first choice England international in his position as well. Even if he was to move, Everton would be a hard sell for him.
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But Manchester United aren’t in our prime. Our course a starting LB for the current City side or United 2013 wouldn’t be going to Everton but the difference in the circumstances of Shaw versus say Cancelo are vast.

Refer again to the domestic teams I listed, until you reach Newcastle & Everton there’s no room for him. If he leaves [which again I don’t think he will] & he stays domestic his choices wouldn’t currently be at those other clubs.

England squad mainstay Trippier plays where exactly? Pickford? Declan Rice? I’m not sure what being first choice in Gareth Southgate’s England has to do with Shaw getting into Arsenal, City, Liverpool & so on.

I get it mate, in the grand scheme United are far bigger than Everton but when you actually assess our players -along with their careers a number would struggle to go up unless the deal was heavily weighted in the favour of the club they’d be joining.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
He isn’t going to City or Liverpool. Arsenal have multiple players for the LB position. Chelsea are fitting in LBs in a back 3 so he isn’t required there. Spurs? Maybe but whilst Conte is there he’d lose his sh*t with Shaw’s half arsed, part time effort. Newcastle? Maybe. Villa have Digne, so no. For all the hype surrounding the guy it’s Everton levels domestically.

He isn’t going to PSG, Mendes. Bayern? Davies. Madrid certainly isn’t happening & neither is Barcelona. He might get an offer from Italy but doesn’t strike me as a player that would flourish abroad anyway.

He isn’t a player in particular demand, might change if he were free but we’ll activate the clause. The Everton link is exactly the level Shaw should expect.
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If he were to leave he would probably get signed up by some lower level 'top club' like Inter or Spurs or some up and coming oil club like Newcastle.
 
Raven said:
He's one of our best players when fit, hope this isn't true.
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Yep. This is one bizarre thread. I don't think there are 5 better left backs in world football, but when the cafe decides they don't like someone there's no going back.
 
Bilbo said:
Yep. This is one bizarre thread. I don't think there are 5 better left backs in world football, but when the cafe decides they don't like someone there's no going back.
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It's hilarious how terrible some opinions are.
 
Nothing wrong with Shaw asking for a 5-year deal at 27. It's within his rights to go after what will probably be the last big contract of his career. More so when United have been more than generous with the contracts they are handing out in the post-SAF era.

What the club should do is another matter. The money he's asking for and the long-term commitment, he can only get them at United. If United give him what he wants, and i believe they will, they will be projecting how good they think he can be. Not how good he's actually been. Which, and this hasn't to do only with Shaw, is one of the reasons why our wage bill never seems to quite match the quality of our squad.

Then there's also the argument about who are we going to replace him with. Again, it's a valid argument only if you take his supposed ceiling into consideration. The other way around is to look at what we will be replacing. In 11 years and in 217 PL appearances, Luke Shaw has registered 16 assists and 2 goals, and he has created 27 big chances. Trippier, who will start for England on the other flank, has 21 assists, 5 goals and he has created 37 big chances, which is similar, but it took him 90 fewer league games to get there. The established FB with similar stats is Kyle Walker. The difference is that City don't rely on Walker to create chances while United, since the Mourinho days, have always been leaning toward the left-side for chance creation. Walker is there for his recovery runs and midfield security. Shaw doesn't excel at that, either. So, the question is, what do we expect to get in return for making Shaw the best-paid FB in the PL?
 
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Do not give him a long term deal. He needs the motivation of playing for his next pay packet every year.

Once he signs his 5 year, 300k a week contract he'll be done with hard work.

If it were down to me it would be a 2+1 deal.
 
spiriticon said:
Do not give him a long term deal. He needs the motivation of playing for his next pay packet every year.

Once he signs his 5 year, 300k a week contract he'll be done with hard work.

If it were down to me it would be a 2+1 deal.
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I'm sorry, there's no way we should be paying him that much regardless of length of deal. Sort of player that only plays well when he's after a new deal as you say.
 
What i want to know is how we did not attempt to go for zinchenko when he was available in the market. Surely we are a bigger pull than Arsenal and could probably offer him a better contract.

On to shaw, I wouldn’t mind having around as a rotation option if his wages demand are reasonable enough.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
But Manchester United aren’t in our prime. Our course a starting LB for the current City side or United 2013 wouldn’t be going to Everton but the difference in the circumstances of Shaw versus say Cancelo are vast.

Refer again to the domestic teams I listed, until you reach Newcastle & Everton there’s no room for him. If he leaves [which again I don’t think he will] & he stays domestic his choices wouldn’t currently be at those other clubs.

England squad mainstay Trippier plays where exactly? Pickford? Declan Rice? I’m not sure what being first choice in Gareth Southgate’s England has to do with Shaw getting into Arsenal, City, Liverpool & so on.

I get it mate, in the grand scheme United are far bigger than Everton but when you actually assess our players -along with their careers a number would struggle to go up unless the deal was heavily weighted in the favour of the club they’d be joining.
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Sorry I had meant the players in their prime. I mean even in the last decade, I think players like Cleverly and Schneiderlein left Utd for Everton, players who were widely regarded as flops. I don't think Shaw is in that category.

Rice and Trippier are at different stages of their career to Shaw though. Rice is a player on the up who's next move will be a upper trajectory move. Shaw is already in his prime and going to a lower level club will hurt his reputation massively.

Anyway I get the point you are making, and I respect your opinion. Don't want to keep arguing over little points. I do think Shaw is a very good player who wouldn't look out of place in a top side, not to say he doesn't have weaknesses, but I feel he's unfairly treated on here. Definitely feel if he were to move we'd see clubs in the top 6 like Chelsea or Spurs interested. But I do agree with you there that he isn't really going to move so this discussion is kind of moot.
 
Raven said:
He's one of our best players when fit, hope this isn't true.
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The problem of course being that his fitness relies on him remaining professional which history tells us we can’t rely on. People used to make excuses for his weight but look at the difference in his face now versus when he was dropped. He blatantly doesn’t look after himself.

It makes it hard to depend on him and for fans to cut him any slack when it isn’t lack of ability holding him back but his complete lack of professionalism. As has been said before, what are his realistic options? If he leaves it will be a step down. I imagine we will give him a contract and then we have to hope that he doesn’t go back to the old habits that he always goes back to.
 
ZainCRse7en said:
What i want to know is how we did not attempt to go for zinchenko when he was available in the market. Surely we are a bigger pull than Arsenal and could probably offer him a better contract.

On to shaw, I wouldn’t mind having around as a rotation option if his wages demand are reasonable enough.
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Jesus and Zinchenko both would have been solid signings but the City/United link makes any deal difficult and the Arteta / Pep link makes that deal work for Arsenal
 
Svartzonker said:
Yeah me too. Great player when he is fit and firing. Malacia ain’t even close to his level.

4 year deal, get it done. It would be stupid to create a problem at lb. We have enough of problems already.
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It wouldn't be at all easy to find an available and affordable left back as good as Shaw, so a deal would be welcome, yes.

High hopes for Malacia in the future of course, but he's still a second choice for now.
 
Take up the option to extend his contract to 2024 then let him go to Everton.

Imagine trying to use a move to Everton as leverage!
 
King7Eric said:
Are people actually believing this? If he leaves he could do far better than Everton. Christ! People will believe anything on here.
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People believed that the FDJ transfer was this close to completion and talked 1000s of pages about it. So rumours are always discussed here. Nothing new.
 
If he returns from WC and starts to struggle again (I hope not), there's something needs to be done... though he still have a chance to score more goals than our entire attacking lineup.

Ten Hag will simply get sacked if players won't upgrade their attitudes, but so far Shaw is probably our least worry tbh, at least for now.
 
You have to question his motivation if he would rather go to Everton for a longer contract than stay here. He's world class when he can be arsed but shouldn't be getting a 5 year deal.
 
ZainCRse7en said:
What i want to know is how we did not attempt to go for zinchenko when he was available in the market. Surely we are a bigger pull than Arsenal and could probably offer him a better contract.

On to shaw, I wouldn’t mind having around as a rotation option if his wages demand are reasonable enough.
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I would guess because Zinchenko is nowhere near as good as Shaw at LB and honestly is not the quality of player we should be looking at. Zinchenko has repeatedly stated he would rather play in midfield as he generally does for Ukraine and honestly his defensive abilities or lack thereof would suggest he is right.

We have signed Malacia and I am willing to wait and see how ETH can develop him. He flashed early when after a couple of woeful displays by the usual subjects he came in and added some needed energy and aggression but once he had a run of games the flaws became only too obvious and it is clear he needs a lot of development to be a reliable PL starter. Fernandez has been mentioned and his loan spell at Preston is going well but the knock on him has always been the defensive side of his game and his recovery pace, we can hope he develops in these areas but again he is far away from being at the level yet to be a long term starter.

I think the 3+1 option mentioned makes the most sense and despite the stupid headlines about 5 years+ or he is off to Everton I am fairly sure Luke would be happy to sign a shorter extension. If he has anything about him at all he won't see it as a slight but as an opportunity to double dip and get another big contract in 3 years time when he has proven his doubetrs wrong.
 
Seems like some people are more concerned he is going as low as Everton, rather than he is asking for a 5 yr contract. Strange!!
 
I dont particularly believe this rumour, but Shaw doesn't strike me as someone who will be playing past 30 for very long, so it's probably best to cash in now if we can.
 
Raven said:
He's one of our best players when fit, hope this isn't true.
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Yes I love him. Love the way he kept his head down and worked on his game when Malacia came in. It's no easy thing to put a player of Malacia's caliber on the bench.
 
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