I'm not sure. Platini will take the lead of your team and is able to operate as a deep-lying playmaker while Maradona is more 'straight-forward' and will be inclined to look for Pelé-Suarez.VS
............... Team Skizzahnomoss ............................................................ Team Jayvin ............................................
TEAM JAYVIN
My team will play a counter-attacking style in a 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 formation.
Employing a deep defensive line, I will instruct Davids and Keane to pressure the opposition midfield duo relentlessly, trying to win the ball and start counter-attacks while also starving Maradona and Pele of easy possession via quick balls from the midfield. In addition to stifling the passing lanes through to the front 2, by employing a deep defensive line with exceptional quality out wide I hope to limit Maradona and Pele's passing options to the flanks and catch them in between a wall of Baresi/Stam and Davids/Keane rushing back to support from the other side.
LV Monopoly Draft - Finals: Skizzanomoss vs Jayvin
- Thread starter Edgar Allan Pillow
- Start date
I don't think that Suarez provides enough width to justify arrows as much as a note in the tactics. He's not Preben so to speak, he is just a number 9 who makes good runs off the ball in to space and isn't shy to use the channels if space is given there. Which is why he has played out wide at times and is a dynamic and flexible player.
I like and put importance to width myself and there isn't a single striker who can also provide all time level width on the wings. If there were, wingers would have no role in football, but as it is you simply can't replace them yet retain the all time level width. All you can inspire for is that your narrow formation has some way to stretch the pitch and ability to work the wide areas as well.
Maradona in particular provided a lot of threat from wide areas as well and was equally capable to beat someone from out wide as from the centre of the pitch. He's not a GOAT quality width either, but we do have both him and Pele who are great individuals who be a threat no matter where they receive the ball.
It is the younger Pele, dynamic, absolutely brilliant drive and dribbling yet a legendary goalscorer. I see both him and Maradona finding space on the break around the midfield and then bursting forward against a disorganized defense. The only way to stop them is doubling up on them and as they do they release it to the other. With Suarez making a dummy run in the build up, then bursting towards goal so the second the defender decides he has to step against Maradona he can find Suarez behind with a perfectly weighed pass.
Last edited:
Knew you would get involved in this as soon as a German/Munich player was even slightly criticised
. I really don't follow what you're saying here at all by the way - players like Vogts and Bergomi are terrible picks for a right wingback role in an all-time draft. Its irrelevant that other managers have previously played weird fullbacks in wingback roles.. that doesn't make Lahm a better fit for the position.
You seem to be overly defensive to what has been said as well imo, no one has said that Lahm will be poor here and in my post for instance I said that he was "certainly capable of playing the role". He's certainly a much better pick than someone like Bergomi and I think he's comparable to Carlos Alberto and Zanetti - two other balanced fullbacks capable of playing the position but maybe not the most natural of fits.
As as has been mentioned previously, if they had a natural wingback on the left like Facchetti/Carlos then it might not be a problem, but imo they lack that from both sides with Netto/Lahm which in a 3-5-2 I think is a problem. We can agree to disagree anyway.
I don't think Facchetti is a natural wing back in terms of providing width. The man was more of a mystery who had his own interpretation on what a left back did, sort of like Breitner, and you'd find him inside the box as much as you'd find him out wide. But in terms of providing width in a formation that lacks it he isn't a "natural" by any means either to be frank!Knew you would get involved in this as soon as a German/Munich player was even slightly criticised
I really don't follow what you're saying here at all by the way - players like Vogts and Bergomi are terrible picks for a right wingback role in an all-time draft. Its irrelevant that other managers have previously played weird fullbacks in wingback roles.. that doesn't make Lahm a better fit for the position.
You seem to be overly defensive to what has been said as well imo, no one has said that Lahm will be poor here and in my post for instance I said that he was "certainly capable of playing the role". He's certainly a much better pick than someone like Bergomi and I think he's comparable to Carlos Alberto and Zanetti - two other balanced fullbacks capable of playing the position but maybe not the most natural of fits.
As as has been mentioned previously, if they had a natural wingback on the left like Facchetti/Carlos then it might not be a problem, but imo they lack that from both sides with Netto/Lahm which in a 3-5-2 I think is a problem. We can agree to disagree anyway.
Love it
He doesn't have to provide as much with as a true winger would. He's a free roaming forward in a 532 who can connect with Lahm overlapping or Neeskens drifting wide for 1-2s to help get one of those two free for a cross or something like that. Surely he's an excellent choice for that even though he isn't necessarily on an alltime great level. I was just wondering why you found it so massively wrong that he's played on the right instead of on the left. I would have placed Pele and Suarez the same way Skizzo/Annah did.
God, you're so annoying with the constant accusations of people being biased for whatever reason instead of actually discussing the matter at hand. And Lahm has much better attacking output than Carlos Alberto ever had. It's not even particularly close in my opinion.Knew you would get involved in this as soon as a German/Munich player was even slightly criticised
I really don't follow what you're saying here at all by the way - players like Vogts and Bergomi are terrible picks for a right wingback role in an all-time draft. Its irrelevant that other managers have previously played weird fullbacks in wingback roles.. that doesn't make Lahm a better fit for the position.
You seem to be overly defensive to what has been said as well imo, no one has said that Lahm will be poor here and in my post for instance I said that he was "certainly capable of playing the role". He's certainly a much better pick than someone like Bergomi and I think he's comparable to Carlos Alberto and Zanetti - two other balanced fullbacks capable of playing the position but maybe not the most natural of fits.
As as has been mentioned previously, if they had a natural wingback on the left like Facchetti/Carlos then it might not be a problem, but imo they lack that from both sides with Netto/Lahm which in a 3-5-2 I think is a problem. We can agree to disagree anyway.
Did they ever get picked as wingbacks or you just mean on the outside of a back five? As far as I'm concerned a wingback isn't so just because it's a back 5, it's the instructions and ability to execute them. On topic, sure Lahm can play that, but it's underwhelming. For a side with Beckenbauer, Pelé and Maradona to rely on Lahm for width on the right is fecking criminal.
That's just silly. Seriously, did Pep's time brainwash everyone about how Lahm used to play the rightback position between 2009 and 2013? His number of assists from open play in the Bundesliga shit on Kaltz's for example.
On topic, sure Lahm can play that, but it's underwhelming. For a side with Beckenbauer, Pelé and Maradona to rely on Lahm for width on the right is fecking criminal.
I don't understand what you are questioning in Jayvin's statement. Is it Platini's role? Because starting counters from deep is where Platini will trump any of the GOAT #10s in my book.
In your book and every book to be fair.
No, he is just boring mate. In this company he elicits the same reaction as you would get when looking at an Argentina '86 teamsheet and evaluating Olarticochea. He played his role superbly. Nobody remembers, or cares.
Just the feeling that Jayvin would have a higher rate of possession here.
Cheers mate.I seem to be in a minority but this Skizzo/Annah's side is an absolute beauty. I thought they would drop Netto and opt for a more conventional set-up, but this one gets the best out of Beckenbauer and Maradona, but the best selling point for me is those Netto-Edwards and Lahm-Neeskens duos.
I'm usually drooling over my own sides but I can say without hesitation that this is one of my favorite sides on here. The fact that I absolutely didn't expect them to field that way just makes it even better. Plus the unorthodox but surprisingly easy to visualize use of Netto
Jayvin's team (defence and midfield) is a bit boring although it's a scary kind of boring - the kind that'll routinely destroy everything on it's path. Not a fan of a front 3 (probably should name it four with Platini here, but, well), it doesn't really klick for me.
It's definitely a close one.
I think that the high line would've worked better for Jayvin though. In Baresi he has the finest high-line organizer in history, Stam and Facchetti are insanely quick and Thuram isn't a mug either - plus Davids and Keane would've pushed a little further, which is always a plus. I guess this makes my decision final, although mostly I just went with my heart on this one - and even the overcrowding of stars in S/A side doesn't concern me.
That is how I saw the offense work out too, fast direct attacks with Netto and Neeskens making a run straight towards the goal rather than trying to provide width. Edwards can do it as well given the opportunity in which case Netto could stay back. I think Maradona would love it, I hope so, so many great runners who are still absolutely great on the ball and technically capable of linking up with him. Also he has a great play date here in Pele who will make sure that any attempts to double up or congest it around Maradona will just mean Pele has the space himself. The fact that we don't have other outlets means they would be doing this in pretty much every attack for good and bad, but I could see it leading to chances. I also think they'd play some tasty football together, both of them relied on linking up with a partner in crime and together it could turn out beautiful at times.
Ffs if Lahm is struggling to provide width as a RWB and is considered underwhelming, then I'd seriously like to know who are all the other right backs out there who would be 'final-worthy width providing specimens'. Apart from Cafu obviously.
Carlos Alberto - Nope, not a wing-back, although he could provide width and playmaking impetus from the flanks. Lahm's better as a wing back.
Zanetti - More of an engine on him but less end product. Not much difference to Lahm and I'd prefer the German for his attacking output and creativity, although some might prefer Zanetti.
Djalma - Not a wing-back.
Brehme - Versatile enough to play there and pretty damn good but peak came as a LWB.
Sport Amoros, Kaltz, Alves etc and they won't be considered 'final-worthy' and/or be torn a new one by the LWF/LW or LWB.
Carlos Alberto - Nope, not a wing-back, although he could provide width and playmaking impetus from the flanks. Lahm's better as a wing back.
Zanetti - More of an engine on him but less end product. Not much difference to Lahm and I'd prefer the German for his attacking output and creativity, although some might prefer Zanetti.
Djalma - Not a wing-back.
Brehme - Versatile enough to play there and pretty damn good but peak came as a LWB.
Sport Amoros, Kaltz, Alves etc and they won't be considered 'final-worthy' and/or be torn a new one by the LWF/LW or LWB.
Aurier
Thank god for that post. Unless you pick Cafu as a right wingback, you can't play a 532 because everyone else is just flawed. With maybe the exception of Zanetti because the massive hard-on Aldo and antohan have for him will create enough discussion in his favour to deflect from the reality. It's truely ridiculous.
Indeed. It's unbelievable that he'd be dictating play, frequently drop between his midfielders and centre backs to spray passes about, whilst somehow always finding the killer instinct to make his impact in the penalty box. In some of the more tightly contested games, it'd be like he's morphed into a deadly goalscoring Pirlo or something
.Left wing back, with Schwarzenbeck (who has experience covering for a free-roaming Breitner) covering and Edwards dovetailing? Left wing-back is much closer to his left midfield role in which he excelled than to a left back in a back 4 with underwhelming partners at LCB and midfield. You had him in a back 4 with non-existing cover 1 on 1 against freaking Eusebio!
When we are talking about left-ish midfielders like Masopust, Edwards, Netto etc Netto is probably the most natural when we are talking about the genuine wing game (and not just covering like Davids did, for example)
Just not dressing it at something else
How are the twins by the way? Hope everyone is well?
Twins are awesome! Been up for the last couple of hours (i.e. since 6am here) chilling with them while mum sleeps in the room. Now have one on my belly breathing heavily and the other asleep on my left arm as I type with my right. Love it.
Can't fault much Jayvin's team - Davids back in the game, Baresi as an upgrade - hardly you can ask for much else.
Skizzo/Annah left flank is a bit underwhelming and like everyone else I don't rate Lahm all that much in that wing back role in terms of final worthy side. For me he's best with the option to tuck in. I don't rate his attacking contribution more than Zanetti, Carlos Alberto, Dani Alves and the likes.
Skizzo/Annah have the better attack although I can see some overlapping between Maradona and Pele and for me both on the pitch is a no go.
Personally I'd go for @Jayvin for this one.
Skizzo/Annah left flank is a bit underwhelming and like everyone else I don't rate Lahm all that much in that wing back role in terms of final worthy side. For me he's best with the option to tuck in. I don't rate his attacking contribution more than Zanetti, Carlos Alberto, Dani Alves and the likes.
Skizzo/Annah have the better attack although I can see some overlapping between Maradona and Pele and for me both on the pitch is a no go.
Personally I'd go for @Jayvin for this one.
How do people see Platini performing in a team that doesn't cater to him very well? He used to play with strikers who peeled out wide for him to push through and where he was the main goalscorer, diamonds perfectly built around him. Honest question, I can't make my own mind up on that one. Does he still score the goals? If he doesn't, there should be a few more natural fits for the role and it would take away a major part of what has Platini considered a GOAT.
Sounds awesome, congrats again
.Thighs mate, thighs!
Not sure how it is at all relevant when it's obvious that their front trio supposed to be interchangeable, with Suarez playing a supporting role, popping up all around the front like to make space for Pele and Maradona.
Exactly. The sides with Pirlo in them often get painted as having 10 players in them. Well, then the ones with Platini have 12.Indeed. It's unbelievable that he'd be dictating play, frequently drop between his midfielders and centre backs to spray passes about, whilst somehow always finding the killer instinct to make his impact in the penalty box. In some of the more tightly contested games, it'd be like he's morphed into a deadly goalscoring Pirlo or something
He mostly played on the left anyway, he is the best possible choice to cover for Facchetti and Stam is at home at RCB role?
Yeah edited the post later with Cafu in it. Had the same issue in the Billy No Mate draft myself as we had Gerets as the RWB in a back 5. Gio and me only considered Cafu (couldn't pick him iirc), Lahm, Zanetti and Carlos Alberto. Funnily enough, we stuck with Gerets till the end and no one really questioned him as a wing back.(although his quality was brought into question ofc). We were also lucky that we didn't face a Best/Czibor etc. Tbf, Gerets did play as a wing-back before in a back 5, but part of me thinks Lahm is being questioned here whilst Gerets got a free ride, because the Belgian was a more forceful runner with more of an engine on him. Despite being nowhere near as good as Lahm creativity or end-product wise.
I think Gerets is another that is better than Lahm in that wing back position. With 3 man backline I'd have a more attacking wing back even if he's not solid as Lahm defensively. Especially with a narrower core.
It might be personal preference but with 3 man backline and Duncan/Neeskens especially sitting that's 5 men defence most of the time. The wing backs in that formation for me should be much more attacking than balanced or defensive ones. I'd even take Marcelo before Netto, regardless of whether he's inferior player or not.
That's the thing - is Gerets more attacking? Lahm is a better passer, he is a better crosser and is much smarter in his movement (attacking as much as defending). His sheer numbers are also nothing short of amazing. The only thing that Gerets have on Lahm as a wingback is his pace and engine, which doesn't make him more attacking or a better wingback - it just makes him easier on the eye. And when you have freaking Neeskens partnering Lahm it's hardly a problem - you won't find a better engine player, really, and he is a natural at covering the right side
Gerets has the better pace and engine, but that's not the deciding one for me. Gerets will most likely occupy that space better, rather than Lahm who has the tendency to tuck in centrally. IMO Gerets will stretch this one more than Lahm, which is essentially what S/P need.
No idea why you're being so whiney and defensive - nothing out of order has been said here at all. A number of people don't think Lahm is a natural wing-back, not sure what the problem is. People are entitled to have a different opinion.
Disagree Lahm is a better wingback than Carlos Alberto, I would have them in the same tier. If I was making a team I would also pick Zanetti ahead of Lahm as a wingback, mainly because I think he's a better player but imo he was also a better dribbler and is about the best there is in terms of running a flank for 90 minutes.
And the point about Bergomi and Vogts being picked previously did not make sense.
You accuse someone (not the first time and not only him) in being biased, he calls you out on that and he's whiney? He actually provided thoughtful argument btw, while you just said that he's biased because he can't separate his feelings towards his compatriots from the actual football analysis.I disagree with that.
Again, that's clearly not true for his time as a rightback before Pep took over in Munich.
Really? Carlos Alberto was slower but equally cultured on the ball. He didn't provide many overlapping runs but was great in the build-up. He rarely had decisive output in terms of goals or assists and it's no conincidence that he finished his career playing as a centerback.
In general it seems Lahm's pace and stamina gets a bit underrated, I'm not even sure if Gerets had more pace than Lahm. Lahm for example regularly kept Ronaldo quiet, most notably in the CL semifinal against Real in 2012 when Ronaldo then switched sides to get out of Lahm's pocket and Lahm provided the game winning assist in the end.
Despite looking small and thin, I can't remember a single opponent who dominated Lahm physically?
He was still used centrally long before Pep. I'd rate his best attacking season while LvG was in charge and he played as right back behind Robben. Not exactly wing back with one of the best right wingers nowadays.
Doesn't cater to him well? I'm not sure about that, I think Davids and Keane provide a great platform for Platini to perform at his best, while your second statement about strikers peeling wide seems a bit strange since I have Thierry Henry on that side.