LV Monopoly draft - QF2: harms vs Tuppet

[antohan]

Not convinced about that. It looks like that on paper, but I personally always thought that Pirlo needs to dictate the game to really excel and prefers to play with an AM who's more a runner/very direct player rather than a true playmaker. Kaka the obvious example of course, but also Totti's rather reduced role for Italy compared to his influence at Roma. I think that is a huge difference from Pirlo to other playmaking CMs like Bozsik or Xavi, who were still crazy influential when they just kept the game ticking and let others run the main creative show.

I personally can't see Pirlo doing that well in a total football set-up with Cruyff directing the play in attack. He's required to do a lot more off the ball work in possession than he's used to. I happily accept if many disagree though.

Maybe the difference is I don't see it as a total football setup. I gave it for granted the template was more Milan than Ajax the moment Vieira and Tardelli showed up in the middle of that spine.

Yes, Cruyff is there, but I see those three (Ronaldo in particular) being the runners you refer to. Cruyff and Messi will probably serve up some delicious stuff of their own, but to me Pirlo is the primary engine room here, not Cruyff.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Neither has a standard template?

And if it gives an advantage fair fecks for the effort in displaying the goods properly.

Much better than back when I was losing finals because people found the use of arrows too contrived/convoluted.

Thats most of the fun for me. Playing around with my teamsheet in photoshop all draft and trying to visualize. If any opponent feels thats unfair I'l make them a teamsheet with the same care spent on jersey and numbers as my own teamsheet. Or do something like Tuppet and Antohan have done with the silhouettes as I can do that effect with any player in 30 seconds. No need to wait for that website. I have fun doing this mate

Very sad @harms benched this one though

I was talking generally, I lack the photoshop skills so maybe it feels like it just because it's something I can't do, but when one team will look like one of the OP teams and the other will be plain I think the nicer one will definitely be easier on the eye for some scan voters

 

[Annahnomoss]

I was talking generally, I lack the photoshop skills so maybe it feels like it just because it's something I can't do, but when one team will look like one of the OP teams and the other will be plain I think the nicer one will definitely be easier on the eye for some scan voters

Use paint and make it hilariously ugly like me then!

 

[Balu]

Maybe the difference is I don't see it as a total football setup. I gave it for granted the template was more Milan than Ajax the moment Vieira and Tardelli showed up in the middle of that spine.

Yes, Cruyff is there, but I see those three (Ronaldo in particular) being the runners you refer to. Cruyff and Messi will probably serve up some delicious stuff of their own, but to me Pirlo is the primary engine room here, not Cruyff.

Maybe, that's my problem. Can't see that at all.

 

[antohan]

I was talking generally, I lack the photoshop skills so maybe it feels like it just because it's something I can't do, but when one team will look like one of the OP teams and the other will be plain I think the nicer one will definitely be easier on the eye for some scan voters

I don't even have Photoshop. Powerpoint, pile pictures on top of each other, save as jpg. It is as basic as that.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Yeah maybe I look at it too seriously but I guess if it's rather simple its no problem
Get ready for me complaining about it when we get knocked out

 

[harms]

Don't forget to vote, people!
Make drafts great again!

 

[Deleted member 101472]

@VivaJanuzaj hopefully you like my tactics board today

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Maybe, that's my problem. Can't see that at all.

Same here, more or less. More specifically, I can sort of buy it as a theoretical concept but I can't really see it, as in visualizing how they'd actually play together (in an effective manner).

Not a solid argument against the team, mind - it's mostly a personal thing. Some teams I get 100%, others I have a hard time seeing in this way.

It doesn't seem obvious to me at all that Pirlo would shine in that particular configuration, nor that Messi and Cruyff would dovetail nicely. But that is again a question of not quite seeing it - more than it being an obviously poor blend (I don't think it is - it's just a blend that doesn't appeal to me immediately).

 

[Chesterlestreet]

but when one team will look like one of the OP teams and the other will be plain I think the nicer one will definitely be easier on the eye for some scan voters

Yes, I wouldn't rule that out.

It's a pretty small advantage, though, at the end of the day - and perhaps a fair enough one for those managers who make the extra effort.

Personally, I look at whether the illustration is tidy - whether it actually illustrates what the manager otherwise decribes or claims. And sometimes the more elaborate ones come up short in that regard, even though they look better at first glance.

 

[harms]

Well, I'm going out, so I'll just repeat my concerns regarding Tuppet's team and leave it at that, we'll see the result in a few hours.

- Messi and Cruyff are hardly an ideal fit - both Messi and Ronaldo need someone selfless to sacrifice a lot of their game to let them shine. Cruyff was always very dominant and stylistically there are similarities between them. Not saying that they won't be able to play together, but this partnership certainly does not bring the best of them two, unlike Zico - Romario, for example - the most prolific duo in the draft that is easy to imagine dovetailing each other.

- With Vieira and Tardelli, both hardworking box-to-box midfielders, sitting deep, Tuppet loses a lot of their all-round contribution. Plus, he is vulnerable to the long-distance shots, and I have just the men to punish him in Sir Bobby Charlton and Brehme - hell, even Rijkaard or Bozsik (remember his goal vs England?) can score a screamer

- Ze Roberto, who is not a defender but a left midfielder with attacking approach, plays a left back in a back four against one of the best wingers in history. This is suicide, really, and easily the biggest mismatch in the game. Krol will be quite busy covering for him

- Zico - Romario will be devastating, with Krol and Bossis having to keep an eye out for Finney/Brehme and Blanc not having a great acceleration. Look at Romario and Bebeto partnership - and Bebeto himself admitted that he based his game on Zico's playing style - and there isn't a question wherever it's an upgrade or not, he is the third best Brazilian ever, after Pele and arguably Garrincha

- My defensive unit is close to perfect, with Nesta, Brehme and Vogts being one of the best ever in their positions and Hierro being one of a standout defenders of his generation, producing amazing performance against Del Piero in the CL final (who was somehow similar to Ronaldo in his approach, although not as good), and having an experience playing as a DM, which will help with Cruyff. Plus, ahead of them there is simply the best defensive midfielder in history, who will make the life of Messi and Cruyff much more difficult.

- Tuppet is too reliable on his front three to contribute to the attack. Vieira and Tardelli are tactically restricted to be more defensive in this game and, as good as his front three is, it's still much easier to deal with them when I have a numerical advantage over them, along with Nesta and Rijkaard being arguably the best choices to stop them in the all-time pool.

 

[harms]

@Gio @Edgar Allan Pillow @Invictus @P-Nut0712 @Downcast

 

[antohan]

Very tempted to switch and make this a draw, but a late vote would turn the tables unduly. Sorry @harms

 

[harms]

Very tempted to switch and make this a draw, but a late vote would turn the tables unduly. Sorry @harms

feck off

 

[antohan]

feck off

There you go, I knew @Gio would do his usual late show.

 

[antohan]

Oh, there's another hour to go? Mmm...

 

[Gio]

Very hard to call this one - highest quality match-up of the tournament so far. Tuppet won out easily on first glance - a thing of beauty as @Aldo described - but I've given harms my vote. Mostly because I see Zico having a better game here than Cruyff, and Finney getting the better of Ze Roberto more often than not. And with them both playing in the same area, it's a very clear route to goal.

 

[antohan]

Switching my vote

 

[antohan]

Or maybe not

 

[antohan]

Knife edge

 

[Gio]

Re Cruyff - just to clarify. I don't see any real clashes with Messi or Pirlo, it's more about the intimate presence of another tactically perfect player in Rijkaard and another one not that far off in Hierro.

 

[mazhar13]

You're loving this, aren't you @antohan?

 

[harms]

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

What's the score?

My vote would have been for harms, but seems people feel that draft mod should not vote in order to maintain neutrality. So haven't voted for last few matches...

 

[Deleted member 101472]

What's the score?

My vote would have been for harms, but seems people feel that draft mod should not vote in order to maintain neutrality. So haven't voted for last few matches...

14-13

I agree with you though.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Tough luck @harms

Great game @Tuppet

 

[antohan]

You're loving this, aren't you @antohan?

No, was just muddying the waters as I had pretty much given away the score thinking it was almost over and that was unfair on @Tuppet

 

[mazhar13]

No, was just muddying the waters as I had pretty much given away the score thinking it was almost over and that was unfair on @Tuppet

It didn't matter in the end, though. @Tuppet still went through.

Great game, @harms and Tuppet. Either team would honestly have deserved to go through, but I'm kind of sad to see harms' team get knocked out. That team was perfectly constructed!

 

[Raees]

Unlucky @harms you drafted my favourite side in the competition. @Tuppet great performance.. best of luck going forwards.

 

[antohan]

It didn't matter in the end, though. @Tuppet still went through.

Great game, @harms and Tuppet. Either team would honestly have deserved to go through, but I'm kind of sad to see harms' team get knocked out. That team was perfectly constructed!

The teamsheet pedant in me reckons Sir Bobby should have been in the next shade of green and slightly more on the left, with the same arrows and the other midfielders moving up half a layer. Left an unnecessarily large gaping hole in the top left quadrant and it should have been easier for people to reconcile him with the Charlton they know about (maybe, dunno, I'm still wondering what was wrong with that and it's the only explanation I can find).

 

[Annahnomoss]

Congrats Tuppet! Could be one hell of a team with just a few minor adjustments/upgrades.

 

[Enigma_87]

Missed the end of this one. Great game guys. Unlucky @harms you have build a great side, same can be said for @Tuppet of course. Two teams I'd liked to avoid for the quarters.

 

[Tuppet]

Ohh !! Tough luck @harms especially with EAP not voting and all, still happy we avoided the penalty routine, I am getting sick of them. Thanks for contributing guys.

 

[P-Nut]

Sorry boys only just seen this as I've been swamped with work. I'll try and get a vote in on the semis

 

[harms]

What's the score?

My vote would have been for harms, but seems people feel that draft mod should not vote in order to maintain neutrality. So haven't voted for last few matches...

You're telling me that onenil cost me 2 votes in the end? Nice.

 

[antohan]

You're telling me that onenil cost me 2 votes in the end? Nice.

Why 2 votes?

And what is the logic behind that @Edgar Allan Pillow? The mod runs the game, rolls the dice, sets up who plays who... But isn't trusted when it comes to voting? Why exactly? Weird.

 

[oneniltothearsenal]

You're telling me that onenil cost me 2 votes in the end? Nice.

What in the world are you even talking about? I gave my opinion last round and specifically said I can respect it if that isnt the way things are done. I simply shared my personal take which i thought everyone was allowed to do in the next draft thread.

 

[harms]

Good luck going forward @Tuppet
A little more quality in defense and you can go all the way

 

[harms]

What in the world are you even talking about? I gave my opinion last round and specifically said I can respect it if that isnt the way things are done. I simply shared my personal take which i thought everyone was allowed to do in the next draft thread.

I'm not serious

 

[harms]

Why 2 votes?

And what is the logic behind that @Edgar Allan Pillow? The mod runs the game, rolls the dice, sets up who plays who... But isn't trusted when it comes to voting? Why exactly? Weird.

He voted against me and his concern in the other thread lead Edgar to abstaining.