Maguire needs a partner, Maguire needs a partner!

[MZX7]

Basically, all we heard about our defense last season was Maguire needs a partner. Lindelof was panned left, right and center.

Ok, now that we have Varane, why are we still leaking goals? Our defense looks shocking at times. Caught out of position, still conceding goals from set pieces, making lousy backpasses that catch the goalie off-guard, letting easy through-balls by opponents and scampering behind their wingers or center forwards, hoping to block the pass/shot.

Why is this still happening?

1. Is it because Varane and Maguire need time to strike up a good partnership?
2. Is it because Wan Bissaka and Shaw haven't started as well as they finished last season?
3. Is it because of our shite McFred midfield?
4. Is it because Pogba, Ronaldo and Greenwood don't work as hard as Bruno in defense?
5. Is it our coaching?
6. Is it a combination of all of the above?

Also, the need for a DM was staring us in the face entire last season. Why didn't we go for Declan Rice or some similar dude?

It is frustrating that among the top 4, we have the most goals conceded.

Please help me calm down Caf!

 

[432JuanMata]

Maguire was excellent last season and most felt he was the better player than Victor(he is) so it was obvious he did need a partner.
Unfortunately for us Maguire has been poor this season which isn’t helping

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Maguire was excellent last season and most felt he was the better player than Victor(he is) so it was obvious he did need a partner.
Unfortunately for us Maguire has been poor this season which isn’t helping

He's been poor and I think a lot of it has to do with rushing back to play in the Euros. I wasn't surprised when he picked up another injury on the weekend. He hasn't looked right to me.

 

[Dominos]

It does go to show you that just signing players doesn't solve all your problems, it's a team game and you have to defend and attack as a well drilled, cohesive unit to be an elite team.

The issue this season I think is they're being left horribly exposed. The amount of times we've been caught on the counter attack already is shocking.

1. We lose the ball far too often in easy possession which is gifting the opposition chances to hit us on counters/in transition.
2. We don't utilise tactical fouls well enough so every time we lose the ball we're in deep trouble as they have a free run at our defence, we need to start fouling as soon as there's a turnover in possession the way City do it (early fouls is how you avoid the cards).
3. Our pressing as a collective unit is bordering on laughable. It's a 1 man press every time and teams are just playing around us with ease.
4. Our midfielders do seem to lose a lot of duels that I would expect them to win.

 

[Sviken]

Where do you start? First and foremost, it is the coaching. We're completely disorganized in defense. Obviously, some of that is down to Varane and Maguire being new to each other, but a lot of it is down to the coaching because AWB and Shaw are often caught out of position. Second, Maguire is simply not reliable as of yet. With him you have to expect at least one howler per game. Third, we cannot control the midfield and often due to mostly McFred's mistakes, we lose a ball in very dangerous areas. This in turn starts dangerous counter-attacks in which either one or two defenders are left at all to defend. This is why I said that the West Ham game with Donny was the first time I actually felt comfortable as a United fan despite us losing. It is the first time I wasn't on the edge and felt we had a strong grasp on the game. Unfortunately, Ole doesn't seem to see that for some reason and continues to pick a midfield that gets steamrolled by any half-decent opposition.

 

[edcunited1878]

Harry has started the season slowly, again. He's been very loose with his passing and when in possession. He'll be out for a few matches and few weeks, so hopefully he can come back in better form. He can only go up from here.

 

[RedAlert7]

I don't think it's purely down to one player, rather how a team defend as a unit. Of course a world class centre back will make a sloppy team better but you can also use good coaching and instructions to make a team a good defensive force. Look at chelsea during and after lampard and how the defensive players improved. Rudiger and Christensen have gone up a level since the arrival of tuchel.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

That was also the same reason we were playing a double pivot that sat in front of our defence all the time last year apparently. We needed to play a back 6 to protect our defence because Maquire needed a world class partner.
He now has the best possible world class partner and suprise suprise. Double pivot back 6 again, no matter who we play.
As soon as one of mcfred passes the ball up field they both return to cocoon our defence.

 

[FatTails]

I predict that at some point next season, or even later this season, you’ll start hearing that Varane needs a better partner than Maguire.

It’s the endless cycle with our fanbase. We always need just one more player for just one more position. Then when we do buy the player for that one position, someone else on the field is now shit and needs to be replaced.

I heard AWB, who was considered a very astute signing at some point in the recent past, is now considered by many to be a bit shit.

No thread title on this forum is more accurate than “What do we still need? AKA the never ending story”

 

[432JuanMata]

He's been poor and I think a lot of it has to do with rushing back to play in the Euros. I wasn't surprised when he picked up another injury on the weekend. He hasn't looked right to me.

I don’t know the reason but he looks so off this season and I know Varane is a top CB and rated higher worldwide but the way he has came in and looked levels above is worrying as I felt he would have a period where he would need to adjust but instead it’s Maguire that’s off the boil

 

[432JuanMata]

I predict that at some point next season, or even later this season, you’ll start hearing that Varane needs a better partner than Maguire.

It’s the endless cycle with our fanbase. We always need just one more player for just one more position. Then when we do buy the player for that one position, someone else on the field is now shit and needs to be replaced.

I heard AWB, who was considered a very astute signing at some point in the recent past, is now considered by many to be a bit shit.

No thread title on this forum is more accurate than “What do we still need? AKA the never ending story”

You might hear it here but you won’t in the media. 2 seasons ago the English media were saying he needed a partner yet that season Victor(according to whoscored and most) was having the better season.
Maguire stepped up last season and is obviously a better player than Lindelof but he is our captain and English so he will be defended.
He has the ability but looks so off this season it’s worrying

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

There’s a sizeable contingent here who’ve never acknowledged his suspect performances post-Project Restart [Spurs Away, Southampton Home, Bournemouth Home] & who wanted to blame his questionable performances to start last season [Spurs Home, Basaksehir Away, Leipzig Away, Everton Home] on his arrest. Is he better than Mike Smalling, yes but we never should have spent £80mil on a CB at that time & he’s spent his United career trying to live up to the idea of the player he was advertised as. He was given the run around against West Brom last season & wasn’t particularly talismanic in defence at Roma Away either. Though he did have a bounce back performance against the mighty Newcastle Away. His overall performances have been patchy throughout his time here but people lay most of the blame on Lindelof.

He likes to dawdle on the ball, bringing it forward only to then play a sideways pass to Shaw or ping a pass out to AWB who’s left in acres of space by almost opponents; but is more frequently being pressed by attackers as he’s generally as mobile as a ship at anchor. He’s far from the worlds worst CB, but he’d look far better if he stuck to the basics.

I’m definitely in the minority on this so I’ll take some flack but I’ve never thought we should have bought him when we did. We’ve ‘built from the back’ & last season conceded 44 goals, which aside the season José actively tried to get himself fired [we conceded 54], is the worst we’ve been statistically for some time. The more expansive our attack becomes the less reliable he has been. The topic isn’t particularly Maguire specific but he takes a rather large portion of the responsibility for our defence still being porous imo. He’s too slow and cumbersome for the team to evolve.

 

[RedDevilCanuck]

Our forwards lose the ball and don't work hard. Our midfield can't keep the ball and lose it often.

Our backline is good but let down by midfield and forwards that never look after the ball.

 

[Bondi77]

I predict that at some point next season, or even later this season, you’ll start hearing that Varane needs a better partner than Maguire.

It’s the endless cycle with our fanbase. We always need just one more player for just one more position. Then when we do buy the player for that one position, someone else on the field is now shit and needs to be replaced.

I heard AWB, who was considered a very astute signing at some point in the recent past, is now considered by many to be a bit shit.

No thread title on this forum is more accurate than “What do we still need? AKA the never ending story”

Some on here would like us to buy a new starting 11 every transfer windows.

 

[antohan]

Have we even played a single game with a fit "ideal" back 6 (i.e. last season but with Varane)?

McTominay has been injured. Fred has mostly played all by himself. Both Maguire and Shaw aren't at the same level as last season. Moan all you want about AWB but I'd much rather him than Dalot defending a flank.

Plenty of far more obvious things to consider before you wonder if Varane has made us any better, which I reckon he has. No defender in the world can make up for brainfarts like Jesse's against YBB.

 

[wolvored]

I predict that at some point next season, or even later this season, you’ll start hearing that Varane needs a better partner than Maguire.

It’s the endless cycle with our fanbase. We always need just one more player for just one more position. Then when we do buy the player for that one position, someone else on the field is now shit and needs to be replaced.

I heard AWB, who was considered a very astute signing at some point in the recent past, is now considered by many to be a bit shit.

No thread title on this forum is more accurate than “What do we still need? AKA the never ending story”

Yes but were not winning anything, so one more player one more position! (and it would have been cheaper to bribe the other 19 teams to let us win.)

 

[cyril C]

Villa - set piece, West Ham (league) - may be a better DMF can help, or a CB doesn't turn away. Newcastle - counter-attack, don't blame it on the DMF, it was LB, or LW failed to cover.

When we attack, we often push forward 6-7 players, relying on a few to stop counter-attack. If we failed to score like the Villa game, something bad might happen, although I didn't expect from a set piece. When fullback committed forward, someone need to cover for his space, or worse, commit to shoot on goal without mis-pass. Mis-pass, or gift to the opposition, caused us most problems.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Define leaking.

 

[bosnian_red]

• We leave our back 4 exposed all the time
• Shaw has been terrible
• Maguire has been bad
• Our wingers do a really bad job at tracking back
• Mainly, the coaching leaves too large of gaps between each line for us as a unit, we don't press as a team and we don't sit as a team
• We have had way too many sloppy giveaways leading to the opposition have plenty of great chances
• A few unlucky goals

To be honest, our defending as a team has been pretty much Varane and De Gea bailing us out this season.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

There's a lot more to a defense than a CB partnership or even a back line

 

[432JuanMata]

There's a lot more to a defense than a CB partnership or even a back line

But the MF while being awful is actually ok for shielding the CB so I feel that’s not a excuse.

 

[NewGlory]

Maguire has had dips in form before. In a top club nobody should be irreplaceable. When Maguire is struggling, Lindelof and Varane should start. Except, Ole would never do that because he practices favoritism and has small balls

But the problem is not just two CBs. Two defenders cannot defend alone. Defense is the responsibility of the entire team. When fecking Lingard passes a ball to oppo player in front of the goal, no CB partnership can do shit about that.

Our midfield is spineless in defense. All of them, Bruno and Pogba included. Of course we suffer. We give up midfield without fight

 

[Red_toad]

Villa - set piece, West Ham (league) - may be a better DMF can help, or a CB doesn't turn away. Newcastle - counter-attack, don't blame it on the DMF, it was LB, or LW failed to cover.

When we attack, we often push forward 6-7 players, relying on a few to stop counter-attack. If we failed to score like the Villa game, something bad might happen, although I didn't expect from a set piece. When fullback committed forward, someone need to cover for his space, or worse, commit to shoot on goal without mis-pass. Mis-pass, or gift to the opposition, caused us most problems.

Harry wasn’t even on the pitch for that one, so a bit harsh to include it. In fact a bit harsh by the OP to try and pin our defensive issues on 1 player in a back 5.
When we’re playing crap our defence and striker look crap, so maybe there’s an issue in midfield or there’s an issue with the coaching methods/ tactics.

 

[wise_old_man]

He's been poor and I think a lot of it has to do with rushing back to play in the Euros. I wasn't surprised when he picked up another injury on the weekend. He hasn't looked right to me.

It would be the same story next season as well. We're gonna have a World Cup.

 

[432JuanMata]

He's been poor and I think a lot of it has to do with rushing back to play in the Euros. I wasn't surprised when he picked up another injury on the weekend. He hasn't looked right to me.

Hopefully it’s this but every player played in the Euros so it’s a difficult excuse but I hope you are right as he is looks very poor compared to last season

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Defensive organisation.

 

[tenpoless]

Noone can save him if he keeps making mistakes in his own half,. That and sometimes we are trying to play it from the back too deep when we have no structure to handle it whatsoever.

 

[432JuanMata]

Noone can save him if he keeps making mistakes in his own half,. That and sometimes we are trying to play it from the back too deep when we have no structure to handle it whatsoever.

I actually think him, Shaw and AWB are playing below their standard so far this season

 

[SonyaCross493]

I would love to see Lindelof/Baily and Varene partnership but I think Maguire being club captain makes it almost impossible to drop him, sadly. But with his injury we can see if the leaking of goals stops and we can get some clean sheets consistency.

if we do get clean sheets and defend better than Maguire shouldn't just walk straight back into the team. We are not a charity. We need to do what's best for Manchester United in terms of winning trophies.

Maguire has made quite a few mistakes this season already. Many mistakes that we have been lucky haven't led to goals because his team-mates have bailed him out. But they should've led to goals. If he did those types of mistakes against better teams they'd punish us.

 

[roonster09]

Good teams attack and defend as a team, we don't.

 

[Red_toad]

Noone can save him if he keeps making mistakes in his own half,. That and sometimes we are trying to play it from the back too deep when we have no structure to handle it whatsoever.

Care to state said mistakes that have ended up in goals conceded? I know Varane has 1 so far this season, but not Harry as yet.

 

[patter]

Varane is good Maguire partner. He coming in will bolster the defensive unit. They can learn off each other.

 

[SoCross]

Leaking goals?

We’ve conceded just one more than world class Liverpool with best defender in the world VVD screened by Fabinho over whom the entire Caf creams.

Defence is fine. Both fullbacks pushed so high with a midfield which is better off the ball and a front 3/4 who try risky passes and lose the ball isn’t helping.

Things can be so much better but leaking goals?

 

[Lebo]

That’s because great defence is coached not bought. It doesn’t matter who we sign. Look at Chelsea now vs under Lampard. When Vidic broke the cleansheet record, his partner for most games was Johnny Evans. Italy had a great defence with very old defenders against among others premier league attackers.

By the way we have disjointed attack, disjointed midfield and a porous back line and questionable subs but people are still looking for reasons why?

 

[El General 1994]

Varane needs a partner, Varane needs a partner!

 

[padzilla]

Both Maguire and Shaw have been really poor so far this season, they could be burned out from the Euros.

 

[rron10]

It does go to show you that just signing players doesn't solve all your problems, it's a team game and you have to defend and attack as a well drilled, cohesive unit to be an elite team.

The issue this season I think is they're being left horribly exposed. The amount of times we've been caught on the counter attack already is shocking.

1. We lose the ball far too often in easy possession which is gifting the opposition chances to hit us on counters/in transition.
2. We don't utilise tactical fouls well enough so every time we lose the ball we're in deep trouble as they have a free run at our defence, we need to start fouling as soon as there's a turnover in possession the way City do it (early fouls is how you avoid the cards).
3. Our pressing as a collective unit is bordering on laughable. It's a 1 man press every time and teams are just playing around us with ease.
4. Our midfielders do seem to lose a lot of duels that I would expect them to win.

I completely agree with all the points.
I believe 1 and 4 are true because of the quality of our CDM's. 2 and 3 are on Ole and his coaching staff.
The worrying thing is that our problems are here for a long time and had not been resolved or at least partly resolved.

 

[Siezard]

Most of the goals were not caused by Maguire though. Maguire was already subbed off before Villa scored.

Against West Ham, Telles' poor defending allowed the player to pass through him and gave an assist.

Against Young Boys, AWB was red-carded and Luke Shaw was out of position so they scored. Then Lingard did a poor backpass resulting in Young Boys winning.

None of them are Maguire's faults.

 

[ekestubbe]

In my opinion he has never really been quite as good a CB as people have hoped he was. Previous seasons it's been easy to just blame Victor or whoever else has played next to him becase Maguire is English, cost a fortune and for some reason was made captain nearly immediately. Now with Varane in the team it might be harder to ignore the fact that Maguire is far from the level of other PL top CBs.

 

[TheRedHearted]

In my opinion he has never really been quite as good a CB as people have hoped he was. Previous seasons it's been easy to just blame Victor or whoever else has played next to him becase Maguire is English, cost a fortune and for some reason was made captain nearly immediately. Now with Varane in the team it might be harder to ignore the fact that Maguire is far from the level of other PL top CBs.

He’d be a massive upgrade at CDM.