Manchester United 0:1 Atletico Madrid (Sat 30th July, 12:45 UK time)

[Anustart89]

Posts that are commenting on Atletico’s fitness level while only referring to how many games they’ve played compared to us seem completely oblivious to the fact that fitness doesn’t start from zero for all clubs when pre-season starts.

Atletico were way fitter than us the previous season, so to expect the difference to be huge between us just because we’re three games further ahead, despite us being one of the least fit teams in Europe over the past three seasons, is just bonkers.

It would be idiotic to expect us to have the same fitness levels as for example Liverpool or any other fit team just based on playing as many pre-season games since it doesn’t start at zero once July 1st comes. Especially since that would lead to the conclusion that a team could max out their fitness by playing games every other day for the entire pre-season.

That being said, yes, we have a bit left before we can compete with the fittest sides in the league but there’s been a massive improvement already while focus has been on implementing a new system with much quicker passing, off-the-ball movement and pressing.

 

[Samid]

Bird's eye view from behind the goal.

DDG trying to be a bit more proactive than usual but you can sense that this isn't his natural game. Poor distribution too. He got a bollocking for booting the ball in one of the earlier games and is now trying to play it short at every opportunity. He is a nervous wreck and it will cost us a goal sooner or later.

Maguire is dreadful in possession. So many times he has an open pass to the RB but he dwells on the ball and puts the team under unnecessarily pressure. He is always looking for the Hollywood pass to the opposite flank when he really should be passing it to the RB who can start the attack.

Several players in possession kept ignoring the attacking runs Malacia was making. Maybe they're not used to those kinds of runs from our full backs but they need to adapt quickly.

Fred won the McFred battle but reality is neither should be starting. We need someone in that position who is press-resistant, drops deep and demands that the CBs play the ball to him.

Bruno sloppy. He is a high risk high reward player and we don't want that part to change but he messes up a lot of basic plays. Needs to sort that out asap.

Rashford has moments of brilliance but apart from that he lacks footballing IQ and concentration. Doesn't make the right runs for most parts and the game seems to pass him by.

Elanga has no technical ability. If we at any point of the season need to rely on him we're in deep trouble.

Martial looks sharp (finishing apart). Makes runs, drops deeper to link up play. Still doesn't have the instincts of a CF but he looks as good as he did in project restart.

Donny is a complete and utter nothing player. Does he wear a cloak of invisibility? He does nothing. No one sees him. If we brought him on to play 12v11 neither the refs nor the opposition would even notice anything sketchy. Just completely pointless.

In general we're way too slow to move the ball around in the build up phase. 50 % down to the guy in possession who doesn't have the passing ability to pick out a teammate. 50 % down to all the teammates who are static and don't make themselves available for a simpler pass. Against parked buses this simply isn't good enough. Intensity has to be a lot higher.

Why are we afraid of shooting? Several chances to shoot from the edge of the box but we rather want to pass it around and walk it in.

We're fecking finally taking inswinging corners! Shame Maguire has a 50p head.

 

[nau05194]

You might want to look at the Felix goal again and look at Lindelof's 'involvement' in the buildup:

What am I looking for?

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

The overall feeling from this match, and where we are generally, is that we’re not ready to go into the new season.

The key signing that Ten Hag wants to build his team around, De Jong is still up in the air. Up front we currently have just Martial, a player that most would have happily let go at the end of last season. We have McFred in midfield. Eriksen is not yet up to speed or integrated into the team. We have Dalot at right back. Overall, we were playing against a low block - a situation we'll find ourselves in regularly once the season starts - and struggled to create any real chances.

 

[Red Dreams]

The man has had 6 weeks with this squad. I cannot recognize the teams he has put out.
We are starting at zero compared to City and Liverpool.
If we get De Jong and a striker we will have an even chance when we play them.

I can see what the manager is trying to instill.
The Ronaldo situation is a huge distraction though.

 

[McGrathsipan]

Bird's eye view from behind the goal.

DDG trying to be a bit more proactive than usual but you can sense that this isn't his natural game. Poor distribution too. He got a bollocking for booting the ball in one of the earlier games and is now trying to play it short at every opportunity. He is a nervous wreck and it will cost us a goal sooner or later.

Maguire is dreadful in possession. So many times he has an open pass to the RB but he dwells on the ball and puts the team under unnecessarily pressure. He is always looking for the Hollywood pass to the opposite flank when he really should be passing it to the RB who can start the attack.

Several players in possession kept ignoring the attacking runs Malacia was making. Maybe they're not used to those kinds of runs from our full backs but they need to adapt quickly.

Fred won the McFred battle but reality is neither should be starting. We need someone in that position who is press-resistant, drops deep and demands that the CBs play the ball to him.

Bruno sloppy. He is a high risk high reward player and we don't want that part to change but he messes up a lot of basic plays. Needs to sort that out asap.

Rashford has moments of brilliance but apart from that he lacks footballing IQ and concentration. Doesn't make the right runs for most parts and the game seems to pass him by.

Elanga has no technical ability. If we at any point of the season need to rely on him we're in deep trouble.

Martial looks sharp (finishing apart). Makes runs, drops deeper to link up play. Still doesn't have the instincts of a CF but he looks as good as he did in project restart.

Donny is a complete and utter nothing player. Does he wear a cloak of invisibility? He does nothing. No one sees him. If we brought him on to play 12v11 neither the refs nor the opposition would even notice anything sketchy. Just completely pointless.

In general we're way too slow to move the ball around in the build up phase. 50 % down to the guy in possession who doesn't have the passing ability to pick out a teammate. 50 % down to all the teammates who are static and don't make themselves available for a simpler pass. Against parked buses this simply isn't good enough. Intensity has to be a lot higher.

Why are we afraid of shooting? Several chances to shoot from the edge of the box but we rather want to pass it around and walk it in.

We're fecking finally taking inswinging corners! Shame Maguire has a 50p head.

Thanks for posting.

Reads like it could be last season.

The obvious things will take time to sort out.
I.e. Maguire and Rashford being replaced and getting a new midfield.

Bruno has been a worry for a good while now

 

[gerdm07]

Bird's eye view from behind the goal.

DDG trying to be a bit more proactive than usual but you can sense that this isn't his natural game. Poor distribution too. He got a bollocking for booting the ball in one of the earlier games and is now trying to play it short at every opportunity. He is a nervous wreck and it will cost us a goal sooner or later.

Maguire is dreadful in possession. So many times he has an open pass to the RB but he dwells on the ball and puts the team under unnecessarily pressure. He is always looking for the Hollywood pass to the opposite flank when he really should be passing it to the RB who can start the attack.

Several players in possession kept ignoring the attacking runs Malacia was making. Maybe they're not used to those kinds of runs from our full backs but they need to adapt quickly.

Fred won the McFred battle but reality is neither should be starting. We need someone in that position who is press-resistant, drops deep and demands that the CBs play the ball to him.

Bruno sloppy. He is a high risk high reward player and we don't want that part to change but he messes up a lot of basic plays. Needs to sort that out asap.

Rashford has moments of brilliance but apart from that he lacks footballing IQ and concentration. Doesn't make the right runs for most parts and the game seems to pass him by.

Elanga has no technical ability. If we at any point of the season need to rely on him we're in deep trouble.

Martial looks sharp (finishing apart). Makes runs, drops deeper to link up play. Still doesn't have the instincts of a CF but he looks as good as he did in project restart.

Donny is a complete and utter nothing player. Does he wear a cloak of invisibility? He does nothing. No one sees him. If we brought him on to play 12v11 neither the refs nor the opposition would even notice anything sketchy. Just completely pointless.

In general we're way too slow to move the ball around in the build up phase. 50 % down to the guy in possession who doesn't have the passing ability to pick out a teammate. 50 % down to all the teammates who are static and don't make themselves available for a simpler pass. Against parked buses this simply isn't good enough. Intensity has to be a lot higher.

Why are we afraid of shooting? Several chances to shoot from the edge of the box but we rather want to pass it around and walk it in.

We're fecking finally taking inswinging corners! Shame Maguire has a 50p head.

I agree with most of this except for "Elanga has no technical ability." Last season I was impressed more often than not with his first touch especially when it was used to create space or go past a defender. His ability to keep a close dribble was also obvious last season. I didn't see the match yesterday so has his ability degraded so much or was I wrong?

 

[criticalanalysis]

What am I looking for?

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/victor-lindelöf-2022-23-performances.471408/page-3#post-29198947

"Gets on the wrong side for no reason, doesn't get a touch on the ball, lets Morata turn and pass, then falls on the floor taking himself out of the play".

He's the player making the 'tackle' on Morata, who makes the final pass to Felix.

 

[AndyMUFC]

Eriksen and Martinez to come on for 20 minutes today and play an hour tomorrow I reckon
.

Absolutely no chance

Was spot on apart from Martinez doing the 20 minutes along with Eriksen

 

[nau05194]

Gets on the wrong side for no reason, doesn't get a touch on the ball, lets Morata turn and pass, then falls on the floor taking himself out of the play.

Thanks for that, I hadn't noticed it while watching the game. I don't think Maguire, Lindelof or Dalot defended that situation particularly well - but you could say that every time the opponent scores a goal. In my view it's a touch on the harsh side to single out Lindelof in this instance.

 

[romufc]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he didn't have much of a choice did he? Will be different now with Martinez and Eriksen, but doubtful they will start EPL games.

I will actually correct you.

ETH had choices in defence in the form of Varane, Bailly.
ETh had choices in midfield with Donny, Elanga and the like

The fact that its a very similar team that started most games, gives you a clear indication of who will start. Pre season is an indication of that.

 

[Borys]

I will actually correct you.

ETH had choices in defence in the form of Varane, Bailly.
ETh had choices in midfield with Donny, Elanga and the like

The fact that its a very similar team that started most games, gives you a clear indication of who will start. Pre season is an indication of that.

Varane isn't fit, Bailly I agree and will most likely be the 4th CB we use now.
Donny has played every other game when McFred was not available, because we needed someone in there. Him and Elanga are not much of a competition for first XI spots.

So yes, ETH had some choices to make (CBs, Shaw vs Telles/Malacia, and van de Beek vs McTominay), but it's clear who is our first XI. Until Martinez finds his feet (most likely as a sub for now), Ronaldo and Eriksen get fit, our starting XI is pretty much the same as last last season as expected really (and hardly exciting).

 

[romufc]

Varane isn't fit, Bailly I agree and will most likely be the 4th CB we use now.
Donny has played every other game when McFred was not available, because we needed someone in there. Him and Elanga are not much of a competition for first XI spots.

So yes, ETH had some choices to make (CBs, Shaw vs Telles/Malacia, and van de Beek vs McTominay), but it's clear who is our first XI. Until Martinez finds his feet (most likely as a sub for now), Ronaldo and Eriksen get fit, our starting XI is pretty much the same as last last season as expected really (and hardly exciting).

How can Varane not be fit? He's been part of pre season.

This is his problem, he can't stay fit for pre season games, why do people (not you) think he should be first choice.

We do need to get 2 first team signings in before this window closes, or else I can sense another bad season.

 

[Borys]

How can Varane not be fit? He's been part of pre season.

This is his problem, he can't stay fit for pre season games, why do people (not you) think he should be first choice.

We do need to get 2 first team signings in before this window closes, or else I can sense another bad season.

I certainly hope Varane isn't fit yet, at least that would explain how poor he looked yesterday.

 

[criticalanalysis]

Thanks for that, I hadn't noticed it while watching the game. I don't think Maguire, Lindelof or Dalot defended that situation particularly well - but you could say that every time the opponent scores a goal. In my view it's a touch on the harsh side to single out Lindelof in this instance.

Maguire was covering a run and was still able to come across to help block Dalot's man.

Lindelof was objectively poor. There's no ifs or buts in what he tried and failed massively to do. Not sure how you can claim that is harsh. Dalot didn't do great either.

If you want to excuse Lindelof's play then go ahead but don't try to make it out like he was hard done by.

 

[nau05194]

Not sure how you can claim that is harsh.

It's just my view that it's a touch on the harsh side to single out Victor Lindelof when there were other team members who it could be argued didn't do a perfect job either. If it had been in training would Christian Eriksen have been doing push ups for losing the ball in the first instance?

 

[criticalanalysis]

It's just my view that it's a touch on the harsh side to single out Victor Lindelof when there were other team members who it could be argued didn't do a perfect job either. If it had been in training would Christian Eriksen have been doing push ups for losing the ball in the first instance?

First off context matters. My original post was quoting someone, who thought Lindelof had performed better than Maguire in the match, which even Lindelof's ardent supporters would find it hard to make that conclusion. I pointed out Lindelof's involvement in the goal because it was the second time he got caught pressing/being aggressive with the first ball and missed completely as there was another incident earlier on in the second half. Lastly, Lindelof has many previous history of this where he is passively weak and very inconsistent when it comes to reading first balls and making first time tackles. Heck it was so recent, it happened in the game against Melbourne Victory, where he was in no man's land caught on the halfway line.

Eriksen did indeed make a poor pass looking for the counter/through ball. As was Dalot, who was very poor too because he really should have been able to block that shot.

Maguire had done everything right by covering the run behind him and then coming across to help Dalot. Perhaps can be 'blamed' for not closing down fast enough but that is very harsh.

Lindelof again I will repeat 'Gets on the wrong side for no reason, doesn't get a touch on the ball, lets Morata turn and pass, then falls on the floor taking himself out of the play.'

It's a genuinely 0/10 defensive attempt. He gambled and failed massively.

Maguire was absolutely fine in that defensive sequence and yet you still somehow managed to find blame for him in that goal. Imagine if that was Maguire, who did was Lindelof did? I guaranteed there would be dozens of more posts highlighting this. Besides, me pointing out Lindelof's mistake doesn't excuse the other players. You've made that assumption as 'singling out'. The fact you've doubled down and found blame for Maguire is a more worrying and baffling analysis.

 

[nau05194]

First off context matters. My original post was quoting someone, who thought Lindelof had performed better than Maguire in the match, which even Lindelof's ardent supporters would find it hard to make that conclusion. I pointed out Lindelof's involvement in the goal because it was the second time he got caught pressing/being aggressive with the first ball and missed completely as there was another incident earlier on in the second half. Lastly, Lindelof has many previous history of this where he is passively weak and very inconsistent when it comes to reading first balls and making first time tackles. Heck it was so recent, it happened in the game against Melbourne Victory, where he was in no man's land caught on the halfway line.

Eriksen did indeed make a poor pass looking for the counter/through ball. As was Dalot, who was very poor too because he really should have been able to block that shot.

Maguire had done everything right by covering the run behind him and then coming across to help Dalot. Perhaps can be 'blamed' for not closing down fast enough but that is very harsh.

Lindelof again I will repeat 'Gets on the wrong side for no reason, doesn't get a touch on the ball, lets Morata turn and pass, then falls on the floor taking himself out of the play.'

It's a genuinely 0/10 defensive attempt. He gambled and failed massively.

Maguire was absolutely fine in that defensive sequence and yet you still somehow managed to find blame for him in that goal. Imagine if that was Maguire, who did was Lindelof did? I guaranteed there would be dozens of more posts highlighting this. Besides, me pointing out Lindelof's mistake doesn't excuse the other players. You've made that assumption as 'singling out'. The fact you've doubled down and found blame for Maguire is a more worrying and baffling analysis.

Sorry, I didn't mean to worry you. It's merely my opinion that it's a touch harsh on Victor Lindelof to single him out. I think he could have done better, but so could several other players in that sequence of play and that's as far as it goes for me.

 

[criticalanalysis]

Sorry, I didn't mean to worry you. It's merely my opinion that it's a touch harsh on Victor Lindelof to single him out. I think he could have done better, but so could several other players in that sequence of play and that's as far as it goes for me.

That's fine, I just think it's a poor opinion as you've continuously ignored all my other points just to defend Lindelof.

You're a better defender than he is and we can leave it at that.

 

[nau05194]

You're a better defender than he is and we can leave it at that.

Cool, happy with that. We've both stated our points of view and come to a point where we disagree so just have to accept that and move on.