Mourinho marginalised our scouts

[Josep Dowling]

If the below article from Simon Mullock is true, then that explains why there was issues regarding certain transfers. Our scouts and Mourinho'a scouts had a difference of opinion it seems. Woodward had to back our scouts.

"United’s scouting network has come under scrutiny following Mourinho’s departure. The club now have 60 scouts at their disposal around the world.

But chief scout Jim Lawlor and head of development John Murtough were marginalised by Mourinho during his two-and-a-half year reign in Manchester.

The Portuguese preferred to use his own trusted network of scouts and agents when it came to recruiting players.

That led to a difference of opinion on the players Mourinho felt were required and those the United board were willing to buy.

An Old Trafford insider said: “The club has a vast army of scouts, but they were frustrated by Mourinho’s refusal to listen.”
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/inside-story-jose-mourinhos-man-13770482

Keep trying to blame Mourinho all you want but the board decided to hire him. They knew exactly what they were hiring. Everything he does is short term fixes and he likes total control with transfers . It was obvious he would trust his own guys. I still think he’s a good manager but he wasn’t right for this club.

The stories supposedly coming out of the manager is just the media putting 2 plus 2 together and making a story that sounds like it could be true. I can’t believe how many people think the media have inside knowledge from within the club.

 

[Acole9]

Idk, it's mirror.

Anyhow, I think our scouts are fine. Not their fault if the one in charge are not interested in their scouting reports. I don't get the blame and criticisms our scouts receive from our fans, just because Mou blame them, shifting responsibilities.

Pretty sure the players we signed are mostly Mourinho's personal scouting.

• Zlatan -- definitely Mou.
• Bailly -- very likely Mou, his performance in Spanish league especially vs Ronaldo is impressive.
• Mkhitaryan -- impressive form best player at German league the previous season? Mou's team always seem to have that at least one good fast flair energetic attacker but with good defensive workrate. He just couldn't predict Mkhi can't adapt to his defensive demands. This is also may be the first bargaining chip to get to Pogba's agent good side. It's like 2-in-1 supposedly the plan is.
• Lindelof -- Portuguese league, Mou, he watched him play.
• Dalot -- same.
• Joel Pereira -- same.
• Matic -- yeap, totally Mou.
• Lukaku -- same, we need a 20+ goals EPL striker at that time. His physique, heights and all is a personal fav of Mou.

Special case,

• Pogba -- likely a combination of both Mou scouting him and our scouts, bet our scouts have been keeping tab on Paul always ever since he left. Mou's team always have at least one quality playmaker. Even more tempting is Pogba's physique, heights and strength.

---

I highly doubt this is totally Mou's selection, more like Mou's demand + our scout's recommendations.

• Sanchez -- Mou, he have been complaining all half of months long on getting a shiny new toy as an attacker. Mkhi fail and Perisic bid fail. Mou over the moon with this one at first. Terrible contract negotiation, but whatever. A good golden opportunity to steal a fantastic player from City at that time, so at least they won't improve with a darn good EPL proven quality player.
• Fred -- wanted a brazilian player, and a new midfielder to complete his midfield selection (he made noises about it) and he got a 2-in-1 brazil national team player from a small league fish. Bet our scout recommend him. Supposedly we can milk the deal and save money with this but for some reason, the ones who do the negotiation is shit? or lose under pressure to Mou's demands, wasting more money. Mou over the moon with this one at first.
• Grant -- english keeper. Likely Mou told our scout to get him a good 3rd choice keeper, because of Romero's injury and J. Pereira needed loans.

Joel Pereira wasn't signed by Mourinho.

As for Mkhitaryan I think he'd been on our radar for a while, I believe van Gaal had the opportunity to sign him but turned it down.

 

[redshaw]

Mkhitaryan and Fred were strange in that Jose benched them when they arrived and didn't seem to have a plan for them, more so Mkhi.

 

[Drainy]

However, how comes we havn't signed the new Messi yet with this army of 60 scouts? What are day scouting for then? We should have atleast the new Messi and the new Ronaldo in our books by now.

The majority of our scouts focus on youth football. Also world class players are a) rare b) easy to spot c) difficult to sign

 

[Eric's Seagull]

They knew exactly what they were hiring. Everything he does is short term fixes and he likes total control with transfers . It was obvious he would trust his own guys.

This above is a problem they knew the circus surrounds him but still hired him.

I can understand a manager wanting full control of transfers and I think some managers deserve the right to do this as long are the transfers are successful and the team is progressing but that has not been the case.

I think the reason we were willing to put up with his crap football was as long as it brought us a Premier League title to Champions League.

 

[red thru&thru]

This, if true, justifies his "Einstein of football" comment. This man think he knows better than anyone else. I hated him even more the day he criticized Shaw saying that Shaw was playing with his brain. The man lives in his own world were he's the president of football confederation.

However, how comes we havn't signed the new Messi yet with this army of 60 scouts? What are day scouting for then? We should have atleast the new Messi and the new Ronaldo in our books by now.

How do you know we haven’t got the next Messi or Ronaldo? We will not know we have him when a manager doesn’t trust the youth to play!

 

[Nick7]

Idk, it's mirror.

Anyhow, I think our scouts are fine. Not their fault if the one in charge are not interested in their scouting reports. I don't get the blame and criticisms our scouts receive from our fans, just because Mou blame them, shifting responsibilities.

Pretty sure the players we signed are mostly Mourinho's personal scouting.

• Zlatan -- definitely Mou.
• Bailly -- very likely Mou, his performance in Spanish league especially vs Ronaldo is impressive.
• Mkhitaryan -- impressive form best player at German league the previous season? Mou's team always seem to have that at least one good fast flair energetic attacker but with good defensive workrate. He just couldn't predict Mkhi can't adapt to his defensive demands. This is also may be the first bargaining chip to get to Pogba's agent good side. It's like 2-in-1 supposedly the plan is.
• Lindelof -- Portuguese league, Mou, he watched him play.
• Dalot -- same.
• Joel Pereira -- same.
• Matic -- yeap, totally Mou.
• Lukaku -- same, we need a 20+ goals EPL striker at that time. His physique, heights and all is a personal fav of Mou.

Special case,

• Pogba -- likely a combination of both Mou scouting him and our scouts, bet our scouts have been keeping tab on Paul always ever since he left. Mou's team always have at least one quality playmaker. Even more tempting is Pogba's physique, heights and strength.

---

I highly doubt this is totally Mou's selection, more like Mou's demand + our scout's recommendations.

• Sanchez -- Mou, he have been complaining all half of months long on getting a shiny new toy as an attacker. Mkhi fail and Perisic bid fail. Mou over the moon with this one at first. Terrible contract negotiation, but whatever. A good golden opportunity to steal a fantastic player from City at that time, so at least they won't improve with a darn good EPL proven quality player.
• Fred -- wanted a brazilian player, and a new midfielder to complete his midfield selection (he made noises about it) and he got a 2-in-1 brazil national team player from a small league fish. Bet our scout recommend him. Supposedly we can milk the deal and save money with this but for some reason, the ones who do the negotiation is shit? or lose under pressure to Mou's demands, wasting more money. Mou over the moon with this one at first.
• Grant -- english keeper. Likely Mou told our scout to get him a good 3rd choice keeper, because of Romero's injury and J. Pereira needed loans.

Joel Pereira has been at the club since 2012.

 

[LoveFootball]

The majority of our scouts focus on youth football. Also world class players are a) rare b) easy to spot c) difficult to sign

Yeah but under SAF we had no problem finding them. Ronaldo, Giggs, Vidic, Evrar, Scholes, Chicharito, Zaha,....

Under Mourinho we had zero inspiration. We only seams to sign star names.

How do you know we haven’t got the next Messi or Ronaldo? We will not know we have him when a manager doesn’t trust the youth to play!

We have some good academy talent, maybe we already got the next Messi.

 

[Buster15]

Jose has moved on so should we.
Let's stop blaming him for everything and look forward not backward.

 

[Eric's Seagull]

Yeah but under SAF we had no problem finding them. Ronaldo, Giggs, Vidic, Evrar, Scholes, Chicharito, Zaha,....

Under Mourinho we had zero inspiration. We only seams to sign star names.

We have some good academy talent, maybe we already got the next Messi.

Personally I thinkn Sir Alex was so good at his job that is why we never needed a DoF.

When I first heard about such a role I thought it was just a way to undermine the manager but I've realised Manchester United is so big we need as meant people in as possible to get us challenging for top honours.

 

[barros]

Yeah but under SAF we had no problem finding them. Ronaldo, Giggs, Vidic, Evrar, Scholes, Chicharito, Zaha,....

Under Mourinho we had zero inspiration. We only seams to sign star names.

We have some good academy talent, maybe we already got the next Messi.

Is no comparison, at the time we didn’t have mega rich teams like City, PSG, Chelsea and Madrid only when florentino was the prez, he bought Ronaldo for 18 million and if was today a young ronaldo would cost way more than that. The problem with the fired one is the fact he’s Mendes bitch and Im guessing not too many good young players on the list. He can go to Setubal or Porto or better to China so we don’t have to listen to his bull shit complaining the reason he lost was because the players/board/global warming

 

[pocco]

Our scouts also wanted De Ligt and De Jong a year before they became hot property.

One did but Woodward wasn't interested. Think it may have been before Jose was here.

 

[pocco]

Woodwards damage control. Everyone taking it hook, line and sinker

I suppose Jose was to blame for the even worse signings that came before him?

 

[Ramshock]

Keep trying to blame Mourinho all you want but the board decided to hire him. They knew exactly what they were hiring. Everything he does is short term fixes and he likes total control with transfers . It was obvious he would trust his own guys. I still think he’s a good manager but he wasn’t right for this club.

The stories supposedly coming out of the manager is just the media putting 2 plus 2 together and making a story that sounds like it could be true. I can’t believe how many people think the media have inside knowledge from within the club.

Another turd of a story by the Mirror

 

[sunama]

It's one thing to have a wide range of scouts...it's another thing to be able to coalesce that information in order to make good decisions. That article specifically mentions Jim Lawlor ("Chief Scout") and John Murtough (Head of Football Development) being marginalized. If he didn't feel like they provided good input, that's not an unreasonable thing for him, as the manager, to do.

Lawlor's a relic from the Fergie era and Murtough was a Moyes hire. To add to the confusion, you also have Marcel Bout (brought in by LVG) who's the "Head of Global Scouting" and you had Javier Ribalta (brought in by Woodward) in all this mess until recently as "Head Scout". Honestly the whole scouting setup sounds like a fecking Frankenstein's monster shit show so I really don't blame Jose for choosing to just go with people that he knows.

Agreed.
Some people on this forum want to blame all our problems on Jose. Our playing style and the match day squad selection was Jose's choice. But to blame the poor performance of our scouts, on Jose is lunacy.

As others have pointed out, we have bought plenty of duds, in Fergie's era, as well as LVG and Jose.
The head/chief scout should work more closely with the manager to identify targets.

Our scouts (regardless of who is to blame) have been an absolute disaster over the last few years. Nobody could possibly argue against this.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

At worst, the scouting set-up described would have contributed to the division between Mourinho and the board, leading to the usual meltdown.

 

[hobbers]

Most of the worst signings have been manager-driven rather than club-scouting-network-driven. Whereas the "Galactico" signings are more influenced by Woodward and the commercial team, with the manager's approval.


Moyes signing: Fellaini
Club signing: Mata


LVG signings: Schweinsteiger, Blind, Rojo, Schneiderlin, Darmian (probably)
Club signings: Herrera, Shaw, Martial, Depay, Romero
Galactico (Woodward) signings: Di Maria, Falcao


Mourinho signings: Dalot, Matic, Lukaku, Lindelof, Bailly (probably), Mkhitaryan (probably)
Club signings: Grant, Fred (probably)
Galactico signings: Pogba, Ibra, Sanchez


Honestly broken down like that the whole thing looks even more of a mess. Nobody had a clue what they were doing except whoever it was who recommended Martial.

 

[JPRouve]

Woodwards damage control. Everyone taking it hook, line and sinker

I suppose Jose was to blame for the even worse signings that came before him?

It's the Mirror so I don't know if we can say that it comes from the club. But if the content of the article was true then our ire should target the club, Mourinho is only an employee if he had a disruptive attitude the club should have acted sooner and it also makes you wonder why they would extend him. I do believe that he is at fault for a lot of things but letting him do it for a long period of time, points to a criminal level of mismanagement by the club executives.
If some of the reports are true then Woodward is simply too weak to be at the head of a top club.

 

[Eric's Seagull]

Most of the worst signings have been manager-driven rather than club-scouting-network-driven. Whereas the "Galactico" signings are more influenced by Woodward and the commercial team, with the manager's approval.


Moyes signing: Fellaini
Club signing: Mata


LVG signings: Schweinsteiger, Blind, Rojo, Schneiderlin, Darmian (probably)
Club signings: Herrera, Shaw, Martial, Depay, Romero
Galactico (Woodward) signings: Di Maria, Falcao


Mourinho signings: Dalot, Matic, Lukaku, Lindelof, Bailly (probably), Mkhitaryan (probably)
Club signings: Grant, Fred (probably)
Galactico signings: Pogba, Ibra, Sanchez


Honestly broken down like that the whole thing looks even more of a mess. Nobody had a clue what they were doing except whoever it was who recommended Martial.

Woody did trying morphing into Super Ed: FlorEdtino Perez

 

[The holy trinity 68]

This just sounds like another of numerous excuses blaming Mourinho for everything and removing any blame from the club.

Literally all we have been seeing lately is that everything is Mourinho’s fault.

 

[rpitchfo]

Please tell me they aren’t full time or on the payroll. 60?! Really! For what?

 

[Kostov]

Were Darmian, Rojo, Schneiderlinm, Mata, Fellaini, Di Maria and Depay also recommended by Jose's scouts? I don't think so. Our scouts and decision makers have been terrible even before Jose was here.

 

[wolvored]

Jose has moved on so should we.
Let's stop blaming him for everything and look forward not backward.

Thats the most sensible thing said on this thread. Hes gone. The toxicity has gone. leave it in the past.

 

[Johan07]

So it looks like not getting a DoF before booting out the dullard was a good call after all. If the scouts were being undermined, what better would the DoF fare?

Wonder if he was the real cause behind Ribalta's departure.

Why is everyone harping on about Ribalta? He was not even close to be head honcho in the scouting department. Man must have a hell of an agent....

 

[Greck]

Woodwards damage control. Everyone taking it hook, line and sinker

I suppose Jose was to blame for the even worse signings that came before him?

Jose had actually been taken jabs at our scouts this season. This one isn't completely farfetched

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Just so I know the rules here, the tabloids make shit up when we don’t agree with it, but when we do agree it’s gospel? Is that right?

He’s gone, time to let it go.