This whole issue is really fcuking boring.
(Yes boring enough to reply)
(Yes boring enough to reply)
New Gillette ad
- Thread starter R.N7
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Depends what you mean by 'these types" though. Even if guys were more willing to call out their own friends for inappropriate behaviour it would help. The reality is that a lot of people who consider themselves "decent humans" turn a blind eye to behaviour they shouldn't when people they know do it, even if it's relatively minor stuff.
For example, back when I was about 19 I remember a girl I knew asking if she could sit beside me in the cab home as she didn't want to sit beside one of my friends as he was being "handsy". I said yeah and agreed that he was being a creepy feck. I didn't say anything to him about it though, even though this was the third time I'd heard girls mention him being inappropriate.
Calling him out on it wouldn't really have cost me anything and I wouldn't have been at all surprised if having his friends say he was being a creep improved his behaviour, so I really should have spoken to him about it. Immature as I was at the time though I didn't feel comfortable doing so, especially in the midst of a gang of lads who also hadn't said anything. In fact I would have certainly found it much easier to intervene if I saw a stranger doing something wrong, even if that posed actual physical risk, because I was an idiot child.
So yeah, I think the message that "good" men could and should do more to call out poor behaviour in others is a very fair one and I certainly don't feel under attack because a fecking Gillette add pointed it out to me.
Nah, you just love to "pretend" to play Devil's Advocate on these subjects, even when you're completely wrong.
At least the likes of botond and redman are consistently honest with where they stand, rather than pretending to be some imaginary middle ground like yourself.
The commercial doesn't bother me, because stuff like that doesn't bother me. However, if you're one to get upset by stuff like this, I can see why.
The commercial is about as nuanced as everything polarizing is these days. As in, there is no nuance. All men are pigs. All white people have privilege. All government is bad. All left wingers are communists. All right wingers are fascists. If you don't agree with me you're dumb and stupid and shouldn't breath. No you. No you. Nuh uh. I'm rubber you're gl...Shut up. No you shut up. Nuh uh! NO YOU NUH UH.
The commercial is about as nuanced as everything polarizing is these days. As in, there is no nuance. All men are pigs. All white people have privilege. All government is bad. All left wingers are communists. All right wingers are fascists. If you don't agree with me you're dumb and stupid and shouldn't breath. No you. No you. Nuh uh. I'm rubber you're gl...Shut up. No you shut up. Nuh uh! NO YOU NUH UH.
I guess I just don't feel any responsibility around this issue at all.
If women are being harassed, that's what the police are there for. If they can't deal with men who are behaving like arseholes without trying to guilt trip me into policing their world then tough shit.
If any of my friends are behaving badly towards women then why would I keep them as friends? I am surprised by the number of people in the thread who seem to have really shit friends. The best way to deal with people like that is to remove them from your life because it really is too short to spend any time on.
I don't ask women to help me out with other women when they behave badly just because they both have vaginas.
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If women are being harassed, that's what the police are there for. If they can't deal with men who are behaving like arseholes without trying to guilt trip me into policing their world then tough shit.
If any of my friends are behaving badly towards women then why would I keep them as friends? I am surprised by the number of people in the thread who seem to have really shit friends. The best way to deal with people like that is to remove them from your life because it really is too short to spend any time on.
I don't ask women to help me out with other women when they behave badly just because they both have vaginas.
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Third wave feminism is a mental disorder
I’m assuming these are including unsolicited dick pics. In which case it seems entirely plausible.
Great entertainment though. Through one of the Peterson videos in the Peterson\Shapiro thread I stumbled upon the phenonemon of characters such as "triggleypuff" and "big red" on YouTube.
Why's that?
He just heard some alt-right grifter say it and thought it sounded clever.
No, I say it because it’s true.
Feminism is full of hypocrisy and denial of reality. They are idiots.
This is not some kind of unpopular opinion by the way. Not everyone who dislikes feminism is some alt-right grifter. Most of my political views align with the left.
“*some left wing thing I don’t like* is a mental disorder” is literally an alt-right catchphrase.
It’s also ableist garbage.
It’s also ableist garbage.
I had no idea, and who cares.
Anyway, I am not some alt-righter no matter how much you want me to be. My political views lean towards the left. I just think feminists are idiots, which is a fairly popular opinion (yet a politically incorrect one).
What’s your idea of feminism that you hate so much?
Where do I begin.
1. They claim to fight sexism yet it’s blatantly obvious that they hate men. Terms like “mansplaining” is textbook sexism.
2. Want to control free speech. They actively try to stop people with a different opinion from speaking in public settings like universities.
3. They actively try to ban things they dislike, such as video games, grid girls, strip clubs, whatever you can think of. Feminists love to ban.
They are cancerous to society.
You sure those aren’t the extremists of that movement? Lot of the feminists I know are often engaged with abortion rights and equal pay and things of that sort. And of course speaking out against Trump for obvious reasons.
Also how else would you label something like “mansplaining”? Do you think it’s not an issue at all or is the label itself?
I find it difficult to differentiate extremist feminists from normal feminists, since normal feminists regularly defend the actions of extremist feminists and rarely criticize them.
When extremist feminists ban GTA 5 or ban grid girls, the normal feminists usually defend them.
The wage gap is a myth (at least the way feminists explain it). Abortion rights? I'm all for it.
I find the term mansplaining to be unironically sexist.
Feminists often talk about "toxic masculinity" and how men should behave, as if they know what it's like to be a man. That is basically "womansplaining".
Not saying it’s right but this behavior of not calling out extremists in unison isn’t limited to just feminists.
Depends on how you frame wage gap. Some figures I’ve seen that take total averages for a whole nation is skewed because the job types and indistries aren’t all equal. However you could probably show evidence in a specifc job position, though I’m on my phone so I’m not in the mood to search for a citation. But I can say anecdotally that I knew female database managers at a former company who were getting paid just a tad bit more than what I was getting for literally copy and pasting word doc articles into a CMS. It’s more than just a myth if you ask me.
Depends on context. I assume the majority of complaints is against men who try to explain something to a woman as if they’re a little child. Idk man, I’ve seen it plenty and I’ve probably had my fair share of moments in the past doing the same. Hell, I see used to see it all the time with my dad to my mom back when they were still together. To equate it to the same level of sexism that is being brought up seems more like point scoring in semantics.
Fair enough. Let's just agree to disagree.
To be honest I would never have to stop one of my mates from doing this. I'm sure we've all had our stupid moments when younger but certainly not now. I do think it's a problem because our friend group is pretty much 50/50 gender wise and all of the lads have had to step in to stop guys hassling the girls before. I wouldn't be mates with guys like this and to be honest the probably keep very different company too.
I'm glad I defended the shopkeeper but those youths reaction wasn't to self reflect but instead to attack me. Ain't nobody going to reach people like that and it cost me a lot in life. My savings are decimated. Guys can't be expected to put themselves at risk everyday because of the behaviour of degenerates. I'll always stop that behaviour against people I know but it's risky apprehending a stranger.
Saying that though I'm not offended by the ad, I just believe it won't change the mind of the people who do this and I take exception of a company preaching morality to me.
Blind boy has a pretty good take on it on his podcast, focusing on the corporate side of things.
I do agree with you that in the unlikely event of a friend acting this way I would be compelled to stop them. It does annoy me that when my girlfriend is out in the pub without me I feel the need to ask one of the guys to walk her home.
Nah it's not
I didn't think it would go down very well on here, but ah well. Let's agree to disagree.
Sure, but is there any reason to call on all men to sort the rest of our kind out? Why is it somehow the responsibility of innocent bystanders to act as vigilantes, just because we happen to be the same gender? People sexually harass women because they're cnuts, not because they're men. Just like any black person who commits a crime does so because they are a criminal, and not because of their race.
Not sure what you mean?Nah, you just love to "pretend" to play Devil's Advocate on these subjects, even when you're completely wrong.
At least the likes of botond and redman are consistently honest with where they stand, rather than pretending to be some imaginary middle ground like yourself.
You are confusing feminism with a tiny minority that are the feminazis.
Think for yourself man, don't let fake news to dictate your views on social movements.
That's textbook alt-right/MRA stuff. Feminism is an umbrella term for a ton of different thoughts and ideologies. There are some subjects most agree on, but there are a lot of disagreements within the ideology, with incompatible ideas and even ones that contradict each other. Hating feminism, or labeling third wave feminism as a mental disorder is exceptionally childish, not to mention incredibly ignorant. Especially when your basis for doing so seems to be a bunch of ideas not held by a majority of feminists.
Most feminists fight for equality, that includes the fight for fathers to have as much right to be with their children as the mothers following divorces, as well as other issues were men get the short end of the stick.
Literally every group out there does this. Statistically, conservatives are more likely to do it than anyone, so I take it you hate them as well?
Again, it's not like wanting to ban they don't like is unique to feminists. A huge difference is that strip clubs have a huge problem with exploiting vulnerable girls, human trafficking and such, so there's a valid argument for doing away with them. Where's the valid argument for doing away with gay marriage? I take it you go after groups that try to have gay marriage or abortions banned with the same vigor and venom?
I'd argue that the kind of views you're espousing here are a much bigger problem than the fringe views you've decided to attribute to feminism as a whole.
I get being frustrated by some of the shit you hear. I remember some fringe feminists here in Norway taking issue with the proposal to make mandatory military gender neutral. They argued defending the country was the men's job, which was staggeringly ironic, given the general feminist view of eliminating a lot of these gender roles. But it was a small number of radical feminists who held that view, so I wrote them off as just that.
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I really won't spend my Saturday discussing with you, but I just wanted to point out that there is a huge disparity when it comes to sex crimes as well, something that can't be equated to poverty. *
* https://www.ncjrs.gov/App/Publications/abstract.aspx?ID=96748
video games should be band
The racists are really crawling out of the woodwork now.
Yeah, I quoted a factual study from National Criminal Justice Reference Service. I should have remembered that the truth is often racist, my bad. We should edit the study so it becomes less racist.
And btw, I do agree that other crimes such as gun crimes, drugs, gangs etc. is due to poverty and background.
So what do you think that huge disparity is down to then?
No idea. What do you think?
I'm sure you have completely none racist reasons for posting that in response to a post about why black people might have higher crime stats because of poverty with a disclaimer that you aren't actually going to discuss it.
I am sure your initative to discuss with me, when there is nothing to discuss since a claim was posted, and I corrected it, has nothing to do with your political views as well.
I'd presume things like a lack of education among people who are in poverty would be a major factor. Unless you can identify something else, it looks like you're suggesting it's down to race. Which would obviously be...well, racist.
My political view is that I don't like racists, you seem to have just admitted that you were motivated by your racist political views. We aren't going to get far.
Or maybe something to do with different cultures having different attitudes towards women and all that..?
Give it another go, I am certain you can sneak "racist" in there a few more times.
at least rednev was moderately intelligent when he posted his racism. can't say the same for swansonstache, who is just a boring racist dullard
'Culture' is quite arbitrary though - unless you think black Americans can all fit into one, homogenised black culture across the entire country. The culture of groups of people is undoubtedly going to be informed by the circumstances in which those people grow up and the world around them. In America black people have faced systemic discrimination for centuries to the point where it's only a couple of generations ago they were recognised as being equal to white people. If you're systematically discriminated against you're going to find yourself in a position of poverty. If you're in poverty, you're not going to get a good education, or you're much more unlikely to. If you don't get a good education, you're much less likely to have been taught the wrongs of sexual assault.
Obviously that's not to excuse those who have committed assault because it's abhorrent whatever way you look at it. But at the same time it's fairly clear that the environment an individual grows up in is likely to impact their eventual actions as an adult to a certain extent. And again, if you don't believe that social circumstances are likely to skew crime figures at all in cases like this, then it seems fairly clear you're arguing that their racial makeup is what's responsible. Which would make you a racist.
Yeah, you have all contributed with a whole lot of actual factual evidence to solidify your stance here people.
Let me know when you have something actually measurable that can be used for comparison and actual debate in between all the infantile labels.
Let me know when you have something actually measurable that can be used for comparison and actual debate in between all the infantile labels.
Again...if you don't think that social circumstances (like poverty) are somewhat responsible for the figures here, then what do you think? Do you believe that black people are inherently more likely to commit sexual assault? Or would you concede that the circumstances an individual grows up in and the education he receives is likely to impact his/her later behaviour?