He's wanted by Zidane and has won a world cup. I wouldnt be so confident. Anyway, time will tell. I hope he stays.
No value in the transfer market
- Thread starter Enigma_87
- Start date
The fact is that we have spent an absolute zilch between 2005 and 2013, that is the main reason why we’ve been a disaster since SAF retired.
The club was doing fine because we’ve had SAF, yea I find it very difficult to believe that SAF gladly passed on some of the fantastic players that were around, for the mighty Obertan and Michael Owen.
The only summers we’ve spent what a club of our stature should be spending on transfers was 2007, 2014 and 2016.
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Didnt smalling only cost about 12mil? Anyone criticising that buy is deluded
Wow. That is a very fair point my friend.
I would take Kompany over both of them even now.
A fantastic servant to him club and country.
I actually think we will start to see the market even out more, financial regulations need to be met and as seen with City / Chelsea investigations into dodgy dealings have more prominent punishments compared to when things such as FFP were originally sanctioned.
Not saying there won't be ridiculous fee's but I cannot see another Neymar scenario happening again, think UEFA and other footballing bodies are finally clamping down. The new wave is for players to ultimately run down their contracts and thus they have more bargaining power regarding moving clubs.
Not saying there won't be ridiculous fee's but I cannot see another Neymar scenario happening again, think UEFA and other footballing bodies are finally clamping down. The new wave is for players to ultimately run down their contracts and thus they have more bargaining power regarding moving clubs.
I think the transfer market has value in it if you have the right scouts and people. We have a board whom in my opinion cannot even do simple business. They tie young / jones / smalling to big contracts, sign sanchez when we had enough talent in that position?
Every club in the world knows if manutd come for a player add £50m to the tranfer fee.
Fred £50 from a Russian league?
Lukaku £75m
Even City and Chelsea seem to get better deals than we do.
Manchester United cannot conduct any transfer activity correctly at the moment.
Real Madrid have signed Jov for 50m Euros
Some fans will think this is not fair, but if we look at our selling profits as well.. very poor again.
There are reports that United will accept £138m for Pogba? On his stats, stature, marketing potential, we should be quoting £220m
When Hazard on final year will go for £90m, and liverpool sold coutinho for £150m
Every club in the world knows if manutd come for a player add £50m to the tranfer fee.
Fred £50 from a Russian league?
Lukaku £75m
Even City and Chelsea seem to get better deals than we do.
Manchester United cannot conduct any transfer activity correctly at the moment.
Real Madrid have signed Jov for 50m Euros
Some fans will think this is not fair, but if we look at our selling profits as well.. very poor again.
There are reports that United will accept £138m for Pogba? On his stats, stature, marketing potential, we should be quoting £220m
When Hazard on final year will go for £90m, and liverpool sold coutinho for £150m
One down.
Julian Brandt just signed for Dortmund for little over 20m pounds.
Julian Brandt just signed for Dortmund for little over 20m pounds.
No value in the market
Obertan
Owen
Valencia
Bebe
Our decline started the year Ronaldo and Tevez left, it's just been downhill since.
Obertan
Owen
Valencia
Bebe
Our decline started the year Ronaldo and Tevez left, it's just been downhill since.
Oh well, we will sign him in 2 years for 80mil and we will say that is a good price.
Do you think we would have just got him if we said we wanted him ?
And we are planning on paying around 15m for a championship player, great business.
Dortmund know how to play this game.
This phrase has to be the most bone-headedly misrepresented phrase on this forum.
No value in the market represents not paying insane amounts for players before they've actually done anything for the club to deserve it. The only recent example of a player actually fitting his value is that of Van Persie because he actually offered leadership and the pedigree for his wage bracket when he signed for the club. That was something Sir Alex was an absolute master at identifying and keeping the continuation of the core of the squad. Knowing that the high earners would be well respected veterans who the team would look up to and want to be like. If they weren't then they were boned out quick smart.
This phrase has been completely butchered on this forum and Ed's lack of ability to understand value in the market is one of the main reasons why we are in a huge mess.
No value in the market represents not paying insane amounts for players before they've actually done anything for the club to deserve it. The only recent example of a player actually fitting his value is that of Van Persie because he actually offered leadership and the pedigree for his wage bracket when he signed for the club. That was something Sir Alex was an absolute master at identifying and keeping the continuation of the core of the squad. Knowing that the high earners would be well respected veterans who the team would look up to and want to be like. If they weren't then they were boned out quick smart.
This phrase has been completely butchered on this forum and Ed's lack of ability to understand value in the market is one of the main reasons why we are in a huge mess.
Yup. Probably the best team to follow in terms of value. They've been very smart in their strategy as well - IMO all down to Zorc who has amassed great experience in the role.
Take Paco Alcacer. He wasn't going to get minutes at Barca so they loaned him with option to buy. 24m EUR and he has been big success for them this season.
Paid the release clause for Witsel (less than 20m pounds) and again big success for them.
Now they exercised the same option on Brandt. He'll no doubt cost twice as much as early as next year.
Arsenal and Spurs triggered the clause in his contract apparently, but he doesn't want to leave Germany, so I don't think any PL team would have got him this summer anyway.
This is so true,
Same with Jones.
Huge potential - never improved on the potential.
Both have been over relied on and stagnated for 3-4 seasons too many.
Both excellent signings at the time
Chelsea was willing to pay the same price for Lukaku but he chose United. City were going to pay the same price for Fred but Shaktar didn't want him to leave in January.
The lowest rumored price I've seen for Jovic is 60m Euros. Even still nobody know how much Madrid will pay because the transfer hasn't been completed...
United can quote whatever they want, but there has to be a willing buyer on the other end willing to pay that amount. What clubs are willing to pay 200m+ for Pogba?
They were willing to pay same price, but not same wages - he felt he had unfinished business at Chelsea. City were willing to pay for it but didn't, they didn't pay the wages for Alexis?
So are you trying to say, we sell our most talented player for £120m just because that is what Real Madrid will offer?
Liverpool are linked with Memphis for £35m, Rabiot is available on a free, Julian Brandt signed for BVB for 25m Euros.
We always pay a premium when signing players for transfer fee and wages and that is the only reason some players come to United.
Declan Rice £50m.... really ? that is not value.
Clubs know we are desperate. If we put in a bid for someone like Koulibaly for £80m and they reject it stating they want over £100m, move on forget about him. We need to show to teams we are willing to walk away, that is what a true business minded person would do.
You information is inaccurate. It wasn't about wages for Lukaku or Fred.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/man-utd-transfer-romelu-lukaku-13367672
https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...er-news/man-utd-fred-manchester-city-15088897
Not saying that at all. I'm saying you can quote whatever you want but there has to be a willing buyer to actually come to an agreement. Period.
United actually had Memphis and bought him for less, so this is irrelevant.
Rabiot can probably sign with a team in the CL but again he hasn't decided yet
No PL team was obtaining Brandt and you have no idea what assurances BVB gave him.
This is not true. There is no such thing as a "United price". There is certainly a big club price, but it's not exclusive to United and it's foolish to think so.
Rumors and they would probably quote any top 6 side the same figure
Any half organized team would be loving the value of some of the players in the market this season:
Brandt went for 25m EUR
MdL is expected to be sold at 75m EUR which is probably a huge bargain considering he will sort out the defence for the next 12-15 years
Tierney is being quoted for 25m GBP
Rabiot, Herrera on a free
Cancelo might be going for 60m EUR which IMO is a great deal for one of the best RBs right now
Sarabia having a 18m EUR release clause is a fantastic deal
Ziyech is available for 35m EUR IIRC
Alderweireld has a 25m GBP release clause
AWB might be coming for 50m, which isn't such a bad deal as our RB position would be sor,ted for next 10 years if he clicks in our system
I'm not sure about asking price of Rice but if it is 50m or less, we should be all over that
The problem has never been lack of good value deals in the market, it has always been that we have pursued some hopeless deals on players who are on their decline or bought players primarily for their commercial value and then cried about the United premium and all that
Brandt went for 25m EUR
MdL is expected to be sold at 75m EUR which is probably a huge bargain considering he will sort out the defence for the next 12-15 years
Tierney is being quoted for 25m GBP
Rabiot, Herrera on a free
Cancelo might be going for 60m EUR which IMO is a great deal for one of the best RBs right now
Sarabia having a 18m EUR release clause is a fantastic deal
Ziyech is available for 35m EUR IIRC
Alderweireld has a 25m GBP release clause
AWB might be coming for 50m, which isn't such a bad deal as our RB position would be sor,ted for next 10 years if he clicks in our system
I'm not sure about asking price of Rice but if it is 50m or less, we should be all over that
The problem has never been lack of good value deals in the market, it has always been that we have pursued some hopeless deals on players who are on their decline or bought players primarily for their commercial value and then cried about the United premium and all that
there is always value to be found, Fergie was just benchmarking because his budget had been restricted
Ed has basically done the opposite by telling every cnut we're minted and ready to splash the cash
Ed has basically done the opposite by telling every cnut we're minted and ready to splash the cash
Tbh, I don't see so much value in the market. Sure, there are always few shrewd signings pulled again by the likes of Dortmund or Juventus who were great in the last few years also. Considering how many players are out there you can always find some gems and talents which will be considered as a "steal".
But, I think that team identity, playing style and development within that style started to be by far the most important thing when it comes down to transfers and their success at the club. It was always important, but I do not feel it was as important as it is today. And players who look absolutely brilliant in one system, can look pretty underwhelming in another. On the other hand, a Hazard type of player who look independent whether you put him in the counter-attack or possession based system is very rare.
And that's where we mostly fail behind the likes of City and Liverpool at this point in time imo. No clear system and progressive development of a player within.
But, I think that team identity, playing style and development within that style started to be by far the most important thing when it comes down to transfers and their success at the club. It was always important, but I do not feel it was as important as it is today. And players who look absolutely brilliant in one system, can look pretty underwhelming in another. On the other hand, a Hazard type of player who look independent whether you put him in the counter-attack or possession based system is very rare.
And that's where we mostly fail behind the likes of City and Liverpool at this point in time imo. No clear system and progressive development of a player within.
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I wouldn't be surprised.
And regarding our scouts - our entire club is under performing, by their own standards. When Jose was here he under performed. The coaches (Carrick, McKenna) have been disastrous (how the hell are they still employed as coaches)? Our players, scouts, our DoF (Wooddward), our physios (who can't keep our players fit), the sports doctors (who should never allow players like Lukaku or Rooney to get so fat).
From top to bottom, every staff member is under performing. For a while, only De Gea could be excluded, but this season, even he under performed. Sanchez was a Galacttico class player who could run our attacks and create goals out of nothing. The guy joins us and turns to shit.
It is staggering how badly everybody is performing at their jobs, by their own standards.
There's probably value out there. I'm sure in 2021 we'll be looking at so and so going for 120 million yet cost 20 million in 2019.
Sancho recently went to Dortmund for 8 million.
The current standstill suggest we have to look at getting players early. We used to always do this, we made stars at the club and complemented them with a big signing but now we're trying to get a quick fix and it's very hard to not get quoted with silly prices.
What also comes with an inflated fee is inflated wages and we get stuck with rubbish or have to take a heavy loss.
Sancho recently went to Dortmund for 8 million.
The current standstill suggest we have to look at getting players early. We used to always do this, we made stars at the club and complemented them with a big signing but now we're trying to get a quick fix and it's very hard to not get quoted with silly prices.
What also comes with an inflated fee is inflated wages and we get stuck with rubbish or have to take a heavy loss.
You’re generally right, but Sancho isn’t a good example.
City were never going to let him go to Manchester United.
Agree, but it is also fair to ask would you see the same Sancho in United that you saw last season in Dortmund?
There’s plenty of value if your willing to take a chance, half of these kids playing in the u21 Euros would walk into our team.
Not sure I agree it's a fair question or even relevant, as value in the market is the topic ultimately. Every player for every fee you could apply your question, it's pointless, not to mention the different leagues and club situations. Do we see the same Di Maria, do we see the same Coutinho, we may or may not.
You could argue that there hasn’t been a summer In a long time where there are so many players that would improve us seemingly open to moves, from low end to high end to young players to experienced options.
It is such an open transfer window. If we don’t make it count there’s nothing more than can be said about how we are run.
It is such an open transfer window. If we don’t make it count there’s nothing more than can be said about how we are run.
The answer to everybody's questions is: Because the board has no idea what they're doing
Sadly...
Sadly...
According to Transfermarkt.com he cost 7.2million pounds. Great piece of business.
Was implying that value in the market is ultimately relative and will mostly depend on club's ability to use that player to his potential targeting the players that fit their playing style. Specifically when we talk about United it is obvious we didn't get our value for money in these last 6 years. Not even close as you can argue that we didn't lift the value of a single player we bought based on their performances while pretty much most youngsters stagnated.
Not the reason to not target the obvious talents and bargains in the market, quite the opposite. Just that we need to make better conditions for them to be a success.
Whether there's value out there and whether United for example has the ability to utilize said value are two different things.
I've not seen evidence we can and players would be wise to look elsewhere unfortunately.
The lack of alternative options killing us.
AWB for 55m? Everyone sees through United's incompetence. They know we only have 1-2 names for each position and can squeeze every penny out of us.
AWB for 55m? Everyone sees through United's incompetence. They know we only have 1-2 names for each position and can squeeze every penny out of us.