Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Roboc7]

City have done almost everything right over a long period of time. They have probably the best coach in the history of football and unlimited funds to support him with. That CANNOT be the standard that we hold Ole or any other manager to otherwise we will continue on this cycle that so many fans are currently in, where nothing is ever good enough and fans are never satisfied.

This is why it is imperative that we are patient. All we can do as a club is keep making progress and keep building up this team because we can get closer to them. We have gotten closer to them and we can get closer still, and its also highly likely that once this team wins a big competition we will win more of them because overcoming that mental hurdle is a huge barrier the team at the moment. I see no reason why Ole cannot deliver that. People often remark on our semi-final losses as a negative, but for me its encouraging. If we keep going deep in competitions we will win one very soon and then the team will kick on from that and more will follow. Its unfortunate that our luck in the draws is forcing us to do it the hard way.

Last season we were 15 points behind City, we’re 12 behind already and gap is widening. We’re not closer or getting closer to them, they’ve gone through some transition and remained comfortably ahead of us.

Bridging that gap to City isn’t just about time and patience it’s about competence on and off the field. We need better players of course but the management, coaching and recruitment all need to improve.

 

[OleBoiii]

The difference between City and us isn't just that they spend more money(even if it's just 10-20% more, it's still more). It's the fact that they keep spending money, regardless of whether they've just had a good season or not.

In a post Fergie era that is the only way to achieve consistent success in the PL. 'Consistent' as in winning the league 50% of the time or more.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Not on mondays

Well you should make a triumphant Tuesday return.

 

[FatherWolff]

Last season we were 15 points behind City, we’re 12 behind already and gap is widening. We’re not closer or getting closer to them, they’ve gone through some transition and remained comfortably ahead of us.

Bridging that gap to City isn’t just about time and patience it’s about competence on and off the field. We need better players of course but the management, coaching and recruitment all need to improve.

City are probably the only team playing good football at the moment. And I mean all across Europe! We failed to capitalise when in position, and that holds a wide range of explanation. One of them failure to invest. Some having injuries at the wrong time, and some not being in form when we should be. Remind you, the situation can quickly be reversed end of may. But the reality is, we are not even in the Sam ballpark when it comes to squad depth and ability as City. It hurts, but it’s the truth right now.

 

[Robbie Boy]

You can look at one. While we grinded out some amazing results last season against better opponents, we now have worse results to show for. But take a look at heat maps and stats! We now press much further up the field, and we have bigger numbers on possession. How anyone can say we “parked the bus” yesterday is beyond me! We pressed and retained really well. But our passing and movement was abysmal. We are so vulnerable when we miss a couple of players. These are positive steps and development in our play. But it also show the need for investment. We can’t continue to play with two central mids unable to pass! We loose the ball in bad positions and that is what make us stretched. Not us tactically trying to protect our back four. The moaning is just so logical flaw! Why press so high if parking the bus?

Re yesterday: I thought we played well to a degree. I was actually WhatsApping a friend around 30 minutes in saying how impressed I was with our high press. Granted, it only lasted the first half but we done it well. The second half Chelsea had the better of the ball but only really created one clear cut chance which fell to Ziyech. We really lacked any cutting edge in the final third and Bruno had a stinker. It certainly wasn't a classic but Chelsea needed 3 points more than us so it was a decent enough result. I predicted a draw and that's what we got.

 

[SER19]

We’re still only able to talk about the top four and it’s no different to any other time since SAF left. We’ve got 5 points out of 21 and scored once against the big six, that’s disappointing whoever is manager.

2017/18 we finished 19 points behind City in second place, gap is likely to be similar and best we can finish is 2nd. Ole is likely to have spent 2 and a half years taking us back to where we were less 6 months before he took over.

This is such a simplified take. Why not compare to where we were when he actually took over then? Because that too, would be too simplified.

Rebuilding is complex and has to occur on many levels from players, to culture, to recruitment to off field stuff. We're obviously in better shape than when he took over. Whether it's good enough is more than fair to question, but to reduce it to 'where we were 6 months before he took over' is such simplified, cherry picked nonsense.

 

[Bilbo]

Last season we were 15 points behind City, we’re 12 behind already and gap is widening. We’re not closer or getting closer to them, they’ve gone through some transition and remained comfortably ahead of us.

Bridging that gap to City isn’t just about time and patience it’s about competence on and off the field. We need better players of course but the management, coaching and recruitment all need to improve.

Of course. A lot of that goes without saying. City are a juggernaut right now and they keep on investing heavily in the squad. Ultimately I don't believe that changing managers right now would be a healthy thing to do in terms of our development.

 

[Desert Eagle]

What other club has a ‘manager-in’ section of fans? Really? It’s all come about from the unjust shit that gets pushed our managers way, not just from the media but our own fans. Madness.

Every club where there are doubts about the manager. Arsenal now. Chelsea under lampard etc

 

[FatherWolff]

Re yesterday: I thought we played well to a degree. I was actually WhatsApping a friend around 30 minutes in saying how impressed I was with our high press. Granted, it only lasted the first half but we done it well. The second half Chelsea had the better of the ball but only really created one clear cut chance which fell to Ziyech. We really lacked any cutting edge in the final third and Bruno had a stinker. It certainly wasn't a classic but Chelsea needed 3 points more than us so it was a decent enough result. I predicted a draw and that's what we got.

Agree with most of that! Was looking at their bench and ours, and I didn’t think we had a chance.. But seriously mate! Watch the game again and see where it all went sour! We seriously lack ability in midfield and options up front. Aaron I will give time to develop, because I love him so much

 

[Yorkeontop]

I just feel like the club is in a great place relatively speaking compared to other times post SAF and would benefit from a change. I doubt Ole can improve things further, he's done an admirable job though. There's a synergy here that a certain kind of manager would do well with.

 

[AshRK]

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Again not a defensive performance but more to do with lack of quality in the final third.

 

[Roboc7]

This is such a simplified take. Why not compare to where we were when he actually took over then? Because that too, would be too simplified.

Rebuilding is complex and has to occur on many levels from players, to culture, to recruitment to off field stuff. We're obviously in better shape than when he took over. Whether it's good enough is more than fair to question, but to reduce it to 'where we were 6 months before he took over' is such simplified, cherry picked nonsense.

Can’t call something nonsense because you don’t like reality of it. 6 months before Ole took over we were miles off winning the title and that’s still where we are now, that’s the truth whether people like it or not.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Agree with most of that! Was looking at their bench and ours, and I didn’t think we had a chance.. But seriously mate! Watch the game again and see where it all went sour! We seriously lack ability in midfield and options up front. Aaron I will give time to develop, because I love him so much

We definitely need better options in the middle of the park. I like Fred and McT but they limit our options as to how we play. Pogba isn't perfect but he makes us a better side. AWB really needs to improve his all-round game when he gets into the opposition half. I do think he his made some minor improvements in that regard, though.

 

[Roboc7]

Of course. A lot of that goes without saying. City are a juggernaut right now and they keep on investing heavily in the squad. Ultimately I don't believe that changing managers right now would be a healthy thing to do in terms of our development.

Ole isn’t doing badly enough to be sacked but I don’t see anything to suggest there is more to come or he’s building towards anything in terms of significant improvement. On and off the pitch I don’t see where that big improvement is going to
come from, we just don’t have the right people in the right roles or the willingness to spend more huge sums of money.

 

[Foxbatt]

We definitely need better options in the middle of the park. I like Fred and McT but they limit our options as to how we play. Pogba isn't perfect but he makes us a better side. AWB really needs to improve his all-round game when he gets into the opposite half. I do think his made some minor improvements in that regard, though.

This is the biggest problem. Not our CBs. Fred doesn't know what to do when we have possession. McTominay can't pass either. Fred running around like a mad man is alright when we don't have the ball but the moment we get it, he doesn't know what to do. Most teams play with one up front. If we play as a team our two CBs can handle one man. Yes the midfield should stop those passes to the opposition forwards. Let them play long if they want to.
I want Ole to get top class experienced coaching staff. Surely he can get much better staff than the current lot.

 

[passing-wind]

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I don't agree with the phrases but there's some truth to this. Even with an improved starting 11 I still don't think that Solskjaer has the mentality needed to win major accolades as a manager. There's a profound difference between experiencing this as a player and a coach, this has been aforementioned by ex-player managers.

 

[SER19]

Can’t call something nonsense because you don’t like reality of it. 6 months before Ole took over we were miles off winning the title and that’s still where we are now, that’s the truth whether people like it or not.

Such a simplistic take. Liverpool haven't progressed under klopp by the same standard. After all they're as far away from city as when they took over

 

[GreenHeron]

Are we

1. A squad with some obvious talent but also with some glaring holes - a centre half, a centre midfielder and an entire right side in terms of an attacking threat? Or

2. A really strong and balanced squad that should be competing for honours?

Only one of these statements can be true because we're up against a City team, and Liverpool when they were at full strength last year, that is extremely balanced, extremely talented and has a deep squad.

From my perspective I think point 1 is correct - in which case at worst we are where we should be and at best we are doing very well to be ahead of the rest. I'd probably say somewhere in between, but either way I do not see any reason whatsoever why the manager's job should be under threat or why he should be heavily criticised.

If the board, with OGS's help, provides us with the players we need over the summer then quite rightly the pressure will be on the manager next year to deliver silverware. But I think it's unreasonable to expect silverware with a deficient squad.

 

[Roboc7]

Such a simplistic take. Liverpool haven't progressed under klopp by the same standard. After all they're as far away from city as when they took over

Simple but true, the Klopp comparison was predictable and amusing, I think we’d all take ‘no progress’ if it meant a title and a Champions League.

 

[SER19]

Simple but true, the Klopp comparison was predictable and amusing, I think we’d all take ‘no progress’ if it meant a title and a Champions League.

But that doesn't matter by your measure. You're talking about right now compared to when he took over. It's too simple.

 

[Roboc7]

But that doesn't matter by your measure. You're talking about right now compared to when he took over. It's too simple.

Like I said simple but true, complain all you want but it’s reality, as is fact we’re probably going to finish further behind City this season than we did last season.

 

[united for life]

He may be injured at the moment, but we have had countless opportunities to rest Bruno and play VDB or even Pogba. That's amazing depth right there in that position. 3 players that most teams in the world would have and 2 have sat on our bench most of the season.

Our depth might not be what you'd have on Football Manager, but it's better than practicality every other team bar City.

imagine having that!

So maybe this is why we’re second behind city? Look, we can always put the blame on the manager and sack him every time we don’t win the league. Would that be a good idea? Is that what some fans are cheering for? An alternative is sticking with a manager for a change now and seeing a rebuild through. The team requires lots of work and it’s in progress

 

[united for life]

Work in progress, we have been playing the same brand of football for 2 and a half years now. The same way we played against PSG when Ole was still Interim, counter.
What do I expect? Well I certainly don't want us playing counter attack at home against Newcastle that's for sure.
In principle, Manchester United should be playing that way against 5 maybe 6 teams in the whole of Europe, against the best clubs. But I get it our squad isn't good enough yet.
But our squad is easily the 4th best squad in the league, so we should be taking the game to most if not all teams except City Liverpool and Chelsea specially at home. But we don't, Ole plays the same tactics in every game against all teams, he will play the same against Palace on Wednesday and the same against City on Sunday. 4231 sit back absorb attacks and counter. When teams play a high defence against it works when they don't it doesn't.
Next year Chelsea will be spending big again, this time with a proper manager, Liverpool won't play the whole season without defenders again, and city will be adding to their squad, the best we can hope for again with Ole is top 4 because he's still learning at this level, and that's not good enough for a club of our history.

I’ve seen ole change the team formation several times over the last couple of years. Some were in game changes that won us those games.

I know we tend to play a counter attack football more than we fans would like to, but this is largely because our defense isn’t good enough. I can’t complain about us not having a go at teams, we are the highest goal scorers in the league, yet we are terrible at the back. We conceded twice what City has conceded. That explains the tactic. Unfortunately our CBs are not good enough. That’s why I said, we need a transfer window, maybe 2, still.

 

[SER19]

Like I said simple but true, complain all you want but it’s reality, as is fact we’re probably going to finish further behind City this season than we did last season.

You have an incredibly one dimensional way of seeing things it seems. Good luck to you.

 

[united for life]

I d

I dispute the Pogba being injured excuse. Ole has Donny Van De Beek which he could of used but hasn't. It's bloody awful management playing McTominay and Fred instead.

Not sure what is happening in training. Probably he isn’t performing well. Obviously, from what I’ve seen from Donny when he played, he is lacking confidence. Ole is good at man management, hope he can get Donny past this bad spell

 

[Roboc7]

You have an incredibly one dimensional way of seeing things it seems. Good luck to you.

No worries, you need to learn meaning of nonsense before using it in future.

 

[united for life]

Jose was in free fall and dragging team with him but the idea that this caused some sort of long term damage is nonsense. As soon as Jose was sacked that solves the biggest problem, what Jose left behind was a team that should finish in the top four and that’s what we are now. Our football is better to watch but Ole has tweaked what Jose was doing rather than ripped it up and started again.

As I said I suspect we will finish the season pretty much exactly where we were 3 years ago, we’re going round in circles rather than progressing significantly so far.

Did we want Ole to rip the team apart and spend even more that what was spent so far? What’s the point? The idea is actually tweaking the team to make it better. As a fan, the fact that we are playing better football (we both agree to that at least!) is a progress we need to acknowledge. Why not? I totally understand that we need the results to compliment this, but our results, given the circumstances, are not bad. Second behind a team that is way more established than us is not something you sack the manager for. We want to surpass city, but we’d need time for that.

 

[SER19]

No worries, you need to learn meaning of nonsense before using it in future.

Simplified nonsense was my reading. Sorry it rubs you wrong

 

[VP89]

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Again not a defensive performance but more to do with lack of quality in the final third.

I think that was certainly the case in the first 45 but it was really passive and poor for the second 45. Would be interesting to see the breakdown by halves there.

In any case the intent at kickoff was certainly different to previous big games - if we had played like that in our previous fixtures then we'd have a better return for sure.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

If Ole gets fired if we fail to win the Europa or Fa cup as he should be if we have any ambitions at all beyond top 4.

Then who should we go for? Do not trust the board to identify the right man for the job.

I think my worry with Ole is that he is making us weaker long term with poor transfers that the next manager do not want.

 

[Mainoldo]

Did we want Ole to rip the team apart and spend even more that what was spent so far? What’s the point? The idea is actually tweaking the team to make it better. As a fan, the fact that we are playing better football (we both agree to that at least!) is a progress we need to acknowledge. Why not? I totally understand that we need the results to compliment this, but our results, given the circumstances, are not bad. Second behind a team that is way more established than us is not something you sack the manager for. We want to surpass city, but we’d need time for that.

How did Liverpool do it then? They went toe to toe with this establishment for two years. Even blew them out the water.

Also you call yesterday good football?

 

[Roboc7]

Did we want Ole to rip the team apart and spend even more that what was spent so far? What’s the point? The idea is actually tweaking the team to make it better. As a fan, the fact that we are playing better football (we both agree to that at least!) is a progress we need to acknowledge. Why not? I totally understand that we need the results to compliment this, but our results, given the circumstances, are not bad. Second behind a team that is way more established than us is not something you sack the manager for. We want to surpass city, but we’d need time for that.

Jose’s style of play was horrendous and it would have been hard not to improve on, but improvement is there, the difficult part is being more successful which Ole hasn’t done whether people want to acknowledge that or not.

For me absolutely we did need to rip it up and start again and that’s not just about buying players. It was very clear end of 17/18 season City raised the bar, pragmatism and counter attacking wasn’t the way to catch them, it’s still not now.

 

[united for life]

How did Liverpool do it then? They went toe to toe with this establishment for two years. Even blew them out the water.

Also you call yesterday good football?

Yesterday’s match wasn’t bad. It’s chelsea away, what do you expect? We want to win all game, sure. But surely you’re not basing your conclusions on yesterday’s game. Overall, performances improved; it’s a better football.

Also, it took Klopp 5 years to win the league. Just saying.

 

[Mainoldo]

Yesterday’s match wasn’t bad. It’s chelsea away, what do you expect? We want to win all game, sure. But surely you’re not basing your conclusions on yesterday’s game. Overall, performances improved; it’s a better football.

Also, it took Klopp 5 years to win the league. Just saying.

No I’m not tbh. The football has been poor for ages. So you are right I wasn’t expecting much more than a 0-0 yesterday but I’m a United fan so unfortunately I had to watch. Luckily I’ve been numb to it for a while.

Maybe I’ll love it again once he’s gone.

 

[Zlatan 7]

No I’m not tbh. The football has been poor for ages. So you are right I wasn’t expecting much more than a 0-0 yesterday but I’m a United fan so unfortunately I had to watch. Luckily I’ve been numb to it for a while.

Maybe I’ll love it again once he’s gone.

I used to feel like that through LVG and Mourinho so I feel your pain. Thankfully I enjoy our games a lot more these days and don’t approach them with dread

 

[He'sRaldo]

Are we

1. A squad with some obvious talent but also with some glaring holes - a centre half, a centre midfielder and an entire right side in terms of an attacking threat? Or

2. A really strong and balanced squad that should be competing for honours?

Only one of these statements can be true because we're up against a City team, and Liverpool when they were at full strength last year, that is extremely balanced, extremely talented and has a deep squad.

From my perspective I think point 1 is correct - in which case at worst we are where we should be and at best we are doing very well to be ahead of the rest. I'd probably say somewhere in between, but either way I do not see any reason whatsoever why the manager's job should be under threat or why he should be heavily criticised.

If the board, with OGS's help, provides us with the players we need over the summer then quite rightly the pressure will be on the manager next year to deliver silverware. But I think it's unreasonable to expect silverware with a deficient squad.

Pep has barely played with strikers this season, last season Klopp had no creative midfielders and a non-scoring CF. When Conte won the league his wingbacks were Alonso and Victor Moses. If you look hard enough you can find holes in any squad.

The bottom line is, if you're waiting for us to have the perfect squad full of world class players to challenge you'll be waiting a long time, because that's a rarity in football. Besides, it's not like we're facing City and Liverpool every week. All we needed to do this season is beat the likes of Sheffield and Everton consistently, teams with undoubtedly worse players than us, and we'd have been in it. That's what Ole has failed at doing.

 

[Roboc7]

Yesterday’s match wasn’t bad. It’s chelsea away, what do you expect? We want to win all game, sure. But surely you’re not basing your conclusions on yesterday’s game. Overall, performances improved; it’s a better football.

Also, it took Klopp 5 years to win the league. Just saying.

It did take 5 season and to be fair I’d use the Klopp comparison as often as you can because it will soon be no use. Next season Ole will have to win the Champions League and get 97 points to match Klopp’s third full season.

Stranger things have happened but I wouldn’t bet on it.

 

[AshRK]

It did take 5 season and to be fair I’d use the Klopp comparison as often as you can because it will soon be no use. Next season Ole will have to win the Champions League and get 97 points to match Klopp’s third full season.

Stranger things have happened but I wouldn’t bet on it.

Comparing Ole with Klopp is foolish. Klopp and pep are two supreme managers who unfortunately are managing our two closest rivals.

 

[united for life]

No I’m not tbh. The football has been poor for ages. So you are right I wasn’t expecting much more than a 0-0 yesterday but I’m a United fan so unfortunately I had to watch. Luckily I’ve been numb to it for a while.

Maybe I’ll love it again once he’s gone.

For me, the football is surely better than Jose’s and LVGs. Let’s hope he can prove you wrong. You wouldn’t mind that would you!

 

[united for life]

I used to feel like that through LVG and Mourinho so I feel your pain. Thankfully I enjoy our games a lot more these days and don’t approach them with dread

Makes sense to me. I can totally relate to that!