A single game, really.
We didn’t concede and beat a team we have had a history of struggling against for a while.
We didn’t concede and beat a team we have had a history of struggling against for a while.
Our window isn’t the great success many claim
- Thread starter Plant0x84
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It's a bit like going to the supermarket and ending up with a massive bill, but when you look into you cart you are not really sure why?
I don't think there is anybody who didn't think we needed 5 or 6 players this window to progress.
We have done the absolute bear minimum this window so far.
We have done the absolute bear minimum this window so far.
Mount is new and i can understand that even if you move from Chelsea to United, you have a change of system, management, getting used to the way we play etc etc, so he has brought time for himself. The window in general was geared towards a striker and while we have brought him, he seems to be an understudy. I am still happy and feel he will contribute well this season.
I am more worried about the usual fair weather players like Rashford, Casemiro and Shaw. Casemiro takes 4-5 games to set in, shaw and rashford both do not contribute unless the whole team is playing well, which again we did for some months last season. Non consistency is a bigger factor than the transfer window and this season will ultimately be a write off due to that.
I am more worried about the usual fair weather players like Rashford, Casemiro and Shaw. Casemiro takes 4-5 games to set in, shaw and rashford both do not contribute unless the whole team is playing well, which again we did for some months last season. Non consistency is a bigger factor than the transfer window and this season will ultimately be a write off due to that.
Good analogy. I'd say it's like going to the supermarket with the fridge, freezer and cupboards empty, and walking back home with another television. One worse than the one you've already got.
Yeah! And then the wife asks what I paid for this Mount and I say I think three-fiddy and she says THREE-FIDDY!? And I say yes and realise it shouldn't be costing three feckin fiddy
We should have Jamie and Gary grill Erik like they did at the beginning of last season. Get him to explain himself again.
Yous are all mental on here. The reactions after one game says a lot about some folks mental and emotional states.
Yous are all mental on here. The reactions after one game says a lot about some folks mental and emotional states.
Maguire, Wan Bissaka, Dan James.
It was 2019, not 2018, I haven't noticed the typo in the original post.
I feel underwhelmed to be honest. My only hope is that Ten Hag is the one.
Oh yeah. Jaysus.
I’d be surprised if there was universal praise for those signings then.
From my perspective, I was happy enough to sign Maguire but thought he was over-priced. AWB was ok but we already knew his technical side was a bit questionable and Dan James was a punt. The main issue, as it was for most of the last decade, was that we needed to sign a midfielder and didn’t do so, hence having to buy Bruno in January 2020.
The recent transfer window which really did look like it might be putting us genuinely in with a shot at a title challenge was the 2021 window. Varane, Sancho and Ronaldo, to supplement the squad that had finished 2nd, looked like it really could make a difference.
As for this transfer window, I thought generally it was acknowledged it was a bit meh so far?
Onana is a good signing but the other two are both extremely high risk and not the type of signings I expected us to make. A proper B2B number 8 and a (currently) world class CF was what I thought we would get in, with the world class CF being a complete non-negotiable.
Onana is a good signing but the other two are both extremely high risk and not the type of signings I expected us to make. A proper B2B number 8 and a (currently) world class CF was what I thought we would get in, with the world class CF being a complete non-negotiable.
If we get Casemiro backup then the bare minimum is achieved. Bare minimum mostly because I assume Hojlund will struggle in first season in EPL and will frustrate us quite a lot. So it's more like we signed somebody to perform the striker role but I don't think he will have much impact apart from releasing Rashford from CF role.
Imo If we get Casemiro cover then we've done just enough to be in top 4 race with Liverpool and Chelsea.
Mount is a mystery to me and we have not solved any issue with this transfer so it doesn't make the window better in my view.
Problem is we're not buying enough tier 1/potential to be tier 1 players. Only Onana and Casemiro fall into that category in last 2 windows. We are falling behind Chelsea and Liverpool (if they get Lavia) IMO in terms of squad.
I also think this team has potential to play much better, we're not getting anywhere close to 100% from those players.
Imo If we get Casemiro cover then we've done just enough to be in top 4 race with Liverpool and Chelsea.
Mount is a mystery to me and we have not solved any issue with this transfer so it doesn't make the window better in my view.
Problem is we're not buying enough tier 1/potential to be tier 1 players. Only Onana and Casemiro fall into that category in last 2 windows. We are falling behind Chelsea and Liverpool (if they get Lavia) IMO in terms of squad.
I also think this team has potential to play much better, we're not getting anywhere close to 100% from those players.
Most of Caf was delighted by those 3 signings to be fair. But to be fair, most signings in Caf gets applauded at the beginning, even Darmian was universally praised (I was one of the culprits, so shoot me).
In hindsight, it was an awful awful transfer window. Maguire has been one of the worst transfers of all time, AWB was overpriced by 30m and James was shockingly bad albeit we got our money back.
Then he should be a squad player. He does not have the quality of a player to be a starter at a club in the size of Manchester united if we aspire to win the league.
We beat them 4 times in the last 5 times. We do not struggle against them.
Only time will tell. But yeah yesterday felt like we're pretty much the same. Feels like if Hojlund doesn't work out we're fecked.
I can remember numerous draws or losses that I attended personally, maybe that’s more away.
You mean 2021 when we got Varane, Ronaldo, and Sancho? You can’t mean 2019, I don’t think we were wetting ourselves over Dan James, Maguire, and Wan-Bissaka, even if Maguire wasn’t a meme then.
I remember a lot of praise on how we are finally going for Fergie-like players, British players that are young, great and hungry for success instead of foreign mercenaries. Caf was happy especially after that 4-0 trashing of Chelsea.
Ironically, the Brexit FC became a meme after the signings backfired.
2021 was also heavily praised. To be fair, every summer (except the Moyes one and the Fred one) we praise to death signings, and then we shit them when 3 months later we realize that we got screwed again.
I'd give it maybe a 5/10.
Onana's a good signing, big upgrade on De Gea in possession...although his overall passing % will be way down because he's no longer passing to Dumfries, Dzeko and Lukaku, instead he's hitting Bissaka, Hojlund and Rashford who all have low aerial duel win %, with Rashford barely even bothering to compete for headers most of the time. He also doesn't have Brozovic and Barella offering mid-range passing options through the middle, now he has Casemiro and nobody.
Mount was always a silly signing. Positionally and tactically not the right fit and absolutely not the right player to throw into an already physically weak midfield. He works hard, intelligent presser but our biggest weaknesses in midfield are ball retention, first phase progression, lack of a single ball carrier in the entire midfield rotation (come back soon Kobbie) and physicality. Mount solves none of those issues and makes a couple worse.
Hojlund I'm actually pretty optimistic about.
Onana's a good signing, big upgrade on De Gea in possession...although his overall passing % will be way down because he's no longer passing to Dumfries, Dzeko and Lukaku, instead he's hitting Bissaka, Hojlund and Rashford who all have low aerial duel win %, with Rashford barely even bothering to compete for headers most of the time. He also doesn't have Brozovic and Barella offering mid-range passing options through the middle, now he has Casemiro and nobody.
Mount was always a silly signing. Positionally and tactically not the right fit and absolutely not the right player to throw into an already physically weak midfield. He works hard, intelligent presser but our biggest weaknesses in midfield are ball retention, first phase progression, lack of a single ball carrier in the entire midfield rotation (come back soon Kobbie) and physicality. Mount solves none of those issues and makes a couple worse.
Hojlund I'm actually pretty optimistic about.
Which explains the hibernation phase.
Correct on every count. I remember those summers well.
A lot of the earlier positive views on our window haven't been limited to the names we've brought in to address deficiencies, but have been lauding our different approach to transfer dealings. We've moved away from marquee sugar-rush signings with one/two-season value, to signing players targeting chronic issues in the team.
Have we filled all the positions we ideally want to target? Not quite. But there are two weeks remaining in the window and recent history shows us that that's the period in which the majority of our activity is done. To me, the fact that the most serious deficiencies in the squad have already been addressed earlier in the window, with the remaining targets being less urgent, is a sign that this window marks a pronounced shift away from past practices. Sure, this may be considered the bare minimum, but it's still worthy of hailing as a success in its own right.
Have we filled all the positions we ideally want to target? Not quite. But there are two weeks remaining in the window and recent history shows us that that's the period in which the majority of our activity is done. To me, the fact that the most serious deficiencies in the squad have already been addressed earlier in the window, with the remaining targets being less urgent, is a sign that this window marks a pronounced shift away from past practices. Sure, this may be considered the bare minimum, but it's still worthy of hailing as a success in its own right.
Onana is the only signing that you can argue was both necessary and will almost certainly prove to be an unequivocal success with time.
Højlund is a striker who - even if he was available to play - can't be expected to score at a rate that a top CF would, given that he's one for the future. You could nonetheless make the argument that even right now, injured, he is proving his worth by taking the place of EtH's buddy Wout, and thus depriving us of the sight of the lumbering oaf wandering on to the pitch (or worse starting). In a way, he was signed to save EtH from himself.
Mount is perplexing to say the least. Not as good as Bruno, not as creative as Eriksen and (painful as it may be for some) less immediately equipped to partner Cas as a true midfielder than Fred was.
This may prove to have been a brilliant window if Mount adapts quickly to his new role and thrives there and if Højlund comes into the team and drastically improves it.
But in many ways for this season, despite spending big on a CF, we are still reliant on Rashford carrying our goalscoring threat on his own (and we're fecked if he's injured or off form). Despite spending big on a midfielder we are still reliant on Casemiro holding together our midfield on his own (and we are just as fecked if he gets injured/suspended as we were last season).
In order to improve this season, we needed a Kane & Caicedo sort of window but we wound up with Højlund and Mount.
And if Rashford has a less than superhuman season, we're not going to make the CL, let alone dream of greater success.
Højlund is a striker who - even if he was available to play - can't be expected to score at a rate that a top CF would, given that he's one for the future. You could nonetheless make the argument that even right now, injured, he is proving his worth by taking the place of EtH's buddy Wout, and thus depriving us of the sight of the lumbering oaf wandering on to the pitch (or worse starting). In a way, he was signed to save EtH from himself.
Mount is perplexing to say the least. Not as good as Bruno, not as creative as Eriksen and (painful as it may be for some) less immediately equipped to partner Cas as a true midfielder than Fred was.
This may prove to have been a brilliant window if Mount adapts quickly to his new role and thrives there and if Højlund comes into the team and drastically improves it.
But in many ways for this season, despite spending big on a CF, we are still reliant on Rashford carrying our goalscoring threat on his own (and we're fecked if he's injured or off form). Despite spending big on a midfielder we are still reliant on Casemiro holding together our midfield on his own (and we are just as fecked if he gets injured/suspended as we were last season).
In order to improve this season, we needed a Kane & Caicedo sort of window but we wound up with Højlund and Mount.
And if Rashford has a less than superhuman season, we're not going to make the CL, let alone dream of greater success.
What need is a manager that will stay here a couple of years even if things get bad. The answer is not spending 300 million on Mbappe or getting superstars, the answer is consistency in management.
Might be controversial but I was against sacking Ole. What we need is a team built with a vision, not a team assembled by 4 different managers with different philosophy and ideas. It will also send a clear message to the players that the manager is here to stay so you have to improve or get out, not cross your fingers hoping the coach get replaced by a fellar who prefers you.
The truth is it is going to take years to get to the level we all want us to be at. It’s going to take even longer if we keep sacking and hiring different personnel who have conflicting ideas, ending up with a messy team and a lot of pressure and negativity from the fan base.
Might be controversial but I was against sacking Ole. What we need is a team built with a vision, not a team assembled by 4 different managers with different philosophy and ideas. It will also send a clear message to the players that the manager is here to stay so you have to improve or get out, not cross your fingers hoping the coach get replaced by a fellar who prefers you.
The truth is it is going to take years to get to the level we all want us to be at. It’s going to take even longer if we keep sacking and hiring different personnel who have conflicting ideas, ending up with a messy team and a lot of pressure and negativity from the fan base.
I feel like the first issue is to truly overhaul or squad we need 5-6 players - this something we have needed for few windows and will probably need in future windows if a radical overhaul doesn’t happen.
Onana is the significant upgrade, Mount is a squad player (which we shouldn’t overlook the importance of) and Rasmus could go either way but at least gives us one proper option up front.
We still find ourselves needing a top level midfielder (I’d be dramatic enough to say we even need two, one to backup/replace Casemiro and one to start alongside Bruno), another option at number 9 (preferably an experienced goal scorer) and more CB cover.
If we don’t bring anyone else in, which we know is entirely possible for this club, then I’d be worried for the rest of the season but more so worried about the same situation next summer where we need to strengthen the same positions plus a few others that have reared their head over the course of the season. It’s feels like a vicious cycle we seem to have been in for about a decade.
In all honesty, as silly as the fees were we really needed to be in the mix for the big summer deals like Kane, Caicedo and Rice etc. if we want to transform this team. I know we are fecked financially but we should be able to compete with anyone in the league in that regard.
The bottleneck now is having to sell players to finish the rest of our business, a position which a club of our size shouldn’t have to find ourselves in. It’s looking likely that the players we are trying to offload are going to stay, and the ones we are interested in will go elsewhere or price us out of a move.
Onana is the significant upgrade, Mount is a squad player (which we shouldn’t overlook the importance of) and Rasmus could go either way but at least gives us one proper option up front.
We still find ourselves needing a top level midfielder (I’d be dramatic enough to say we even need two, one to backup/replace Casemiro and one to start alongside Bruno), another option at number 9 (preferably an experienced goal scorer) and more CB cover.
If we don’t bring anyone else in, which we know is entirely possible for this club, then I’d be worried for the rest of the season but more so worried about the same situation next summer where we need to strengthen the same positions plus a few others that have reared their head over the course of the season. It’s feels like a vicious cycle we seem to have been in for about a decade.
In all honesty, as silly as the fees were we really needed to be in the mix for the big summer deals like Kane, Caicedo and Rice etc. if we want to transform this team. I know we are fecked financially but we should be able to compete with anyone in the league in that regard.
The bottleneck now is having to sell players to finish the rest of our business, a position which a club of our size shouldn’t have to find ourselves in. It’s looking likely that the players we are trying to offload are going to stay, and the ones we are interested in will go elsewhere or price us out of a move.
Last seasons team were very good and ran out of steam due to the scheduling and the crazy amount of games.
Look at our squad at the end of the 21/22 season, and look at who we have now.
We’ve added -
Onana
Malacia
Martinez
Eriksen
Casemiro
Antony
Mount
Hojlund
that’s a miles better squad overall than when we ended the season with Rangnick.
Onana is a great signing. The Mason Mount signing was always a head scratcher and anyone shocked by his performance last night clearly hasn't watched him for Chelsea, we will see more of the same everytime he plays.
You are basically saying that City should buy Paqueta because he's inferior to their starting midfield (kdb injury apart).
You seem to be happier having no one as a replacement for Bruno.
Having an expensive options or interchangeable positions for players are what big teams do.
Some here want to spend like West Ham and at the same time compete like City.
Most were predicting us to finish 7th+. Most thought we were total idiots not buying a couple of midfielders. Most thought we were mental relying on Martial and Rashford alone for goals. And that was before Pogba got injured. People might have been relatively happy with the individual players but outside of a few headcases no one thought it was a good summer.
Its far too hasty to judge any of the signings. Our display last night was awful.
I think it was as much a question of tactics than ability
There are obvious issues with the players too
Bruno is the perfect example. A really top player but provides no control in games.
It falls on the manager. How can a team like United with our budget aim to be a great transitional team? We need to be able to control games first and foremost against 15 of the sides we face in this league.
Ten Hag needs to fix it.
I think it was as much a question of tactics than ability
There are obvious issues with the players too
Bruno is the perfect example. A really top player but provides no control in games.
It falls on the manager. How can a team like United with our budget aim to be a great transitional team? We need to be able to control games first and foremost against 15 of the sides we face in this league.
Ten Hag needs to fix it.
Surely its too early to judge?
For it to not be a disaster we have to sign Amrabat. Replace Maguire with Todibo. And possibly sign another forward.
It is just one game. I remember Chelsea looking absolutely rank against us in their first game under Jose when we had literally half our team out injured and they went on to be one of the strongest teams in the premier league's history. Not saying we will win the title but you get the idea.
I guess my real worry is how this team evolves into a title winning side when on paper the core of it looks a very competent top 4 side but just lacks a bit of a star factor. Maybe Hojlund will be that player but it's asking a lot of a kid at this moment. Even with a new right back next season and maybe another right winger i'm still struggling to see an elite team as opposed to a very good one. Happy to wait and see though.
I guess my real worry is how this team evolves into a title winning side when on paper the core of it looks a very competent top 4 side but just lacks a bit of a star factor. Maybe Hojlund will be that player but it's asking a lot of a kid at this moment. Even with a new right back next season and maybe another right winger i'm still struggling to see an elite team as opposed to a very good one. Happy to wait and see though.
I've always been a pessimistic on our window.
I've never rated Mount and been pretty critical on him so it's hard to just do a 180 on that now that he's our player.
Onana I like, but he wouldn't have been my first choice (would have preferred Raya for £15m less to be totally honest)... Hojlund is a gamble obviously, and I'm always weary of these big spends. I do have hope's he'll work out, but not sure it'll be this season, and we need a goalscorer now .
I've never rated Mount and been pretty critical on him so it's hard to just do a 180 on that now that he's our player.
Onana I like, but he wouldn't have been my first choice (would have preferred Raya for £15m less to be totally honest)... Hojlund is a gamble obviously, and I'm always weary of these big spends. I do have hope's he'll work out, but not sure it'll be this season, and we need a goalscorer now .
Our window isn’t finished yet. Yesterday was an absolutely horrendous game for most of our players and our manager. But it’s far too early to judge. We looked miles off the pace in all areas of the pitch and I think that can only improve. Mount will prove to be a good signing, I expect Bruno to play on the right a lot more often this season
I’d actually purged this from my brain. God.
But yeah the window is still a bit lacking. Onana changes our style of play hugely, but we’ve basically replaced De Gea and Eriksen, and signed an unproven centre forward. We need a combative centre mid at the very least before the window closes.
Bruno Fernandes was one, was he not? I think it's prety hard to argue (though the caf tries it's best!) that he, at least, has been a success? I'd say easily our greatest signing post-Fergie. Admittedly a January signing but still has to count.