He should have been sold 2 years ago, for good money and we should have bought a midfielder we needed, instead.
Our recruitment is shambolic.
Paul Pogba / turned down United offer of 300k as “nothing”
- Thread starter MyOnlySolskjaer
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Our recruitment is shambolic.
It's not, it's a popular opinion, it's just a quieter opinion than the vocal Pogba fans.
That's the thing for me, I am nonplussed by Pogba wanting to leave or not. What I don't get is people going out of their way to be upset about things that don't warrant it, like the red card during that last game, if you read people's posts without watching the action you would think that he didn't won the ball and just brainlessly hacked an opponents which is by the way what Ronaldo tried to do earlier in the game.
The reason the club failed to sell him is I believe because they overvalued his market, I think that they tried to sell him at a higher price than he is worth and failed to understand that CMs don't go for that much money because midfield dominance is the most collectively driven ability, you can do it with a range of players that are significantly less expensive than a Pogba or De Jong, the latter being in my opinion a very important example, no one will question his quality but he hasn't really been worth the amount that Barcelona paid, he hasn't given them the added value that an attacker of the same caliber and price would provide.
Call me crazy but I am actually quite looking forward to the post-Pogba era,
Love Paul as a person and personality, his view on life seems overall very positive and i find it hard to have any strong hate or dislike towards him however, the luggage that comes with Paul Pogba has unfortunately overshadowed his career here at United and for the sake of our club and his career he should have left about 2 years ago,
He needs a fresh challenge and we need to move past him and if I was his friend or agent etc i would heavily be recommending he moves away, the criminal part is how we are yet again going to be losing him for a free and further proves how shambolic this club is run, painfully bad.
Love Paul as a person and personality, his view on life seems overall very positive and i find it hard to have any strong hate or dislike towards him however, the luggage that comes with Paul Pogba has unfortunately overshadowed his career here at United and for the sake of our club and his career he should have left about 2 years ago,
He needs a fresh challenge and we need to move past him and if I was his friend or agent etc i would heavily be recommending he moves away, the criminal part is how we are yet again going to be losing him for a free and further proves how shambolic this club is run, painfully bad.
I'm ambivalent to him leaving, but this is what irks me.
Forget 2 years ago, if he was not committing before the start of the season, we should have tried to move him on, get as much money as possible, and buy another midfielder. This was handled very poorly. I'm more surprised that the likes of Woodward and co, who are money men could not see this.
The obvious issues are that you need to have a buyer that is willing to match your asking price, that also meets the player's career choices. For example it's possible that a club like PSG would pay the asking price but that the player wants to join Juventus and unless you are willing to take what Juventus are willing to offer the player is going nowhere.
I think it is time to move on from the Pogba era, it has failed miserably.
I am not saying Pogba has failed, the club has failed to deliver. 5 years ago, Pogba was meant to be the one to help us bring the league back to us. Instead, we are here with Pogba in and out of the team, manager has no idea where to play him and we make signings that do not compliment the current players, and perceived style the manager wants.
All parties will be better off without Pogba IMO.
Yes same with Lingard - and they shouldn't
That is true, it's a risk players going for a bosman face. A bad injury leaves them in no man's land.
But I'm sure Pogba would rather play and be fit for the world cup too.
United should focus on players that have a future at the club imo.
That would be our fault though, wouldn't it? You could argue brining a player to his last year would always lead to this. The selling club would always be in the more difficult position.
At that point, if he rejected our offer, we should have moved him on. Even if it's a lower offer, cause he'd go for free anyway. This is kind of a negative PR, him leaving on a free again.
Yes, I think so. If old reports were accurate then during one of the transfer windows United wanted a world record fee for Pogba and again if reports were accurate Real Madrid, Juventus and PSG were the interested teams. I assume that Pogba could have been convinced to join Real Madrid and Juventus which lead me to believe that the asking price was the issue.
I said it before but I don't think that Pogba is a better player than prime Rakitic or Kroos and neither of these players would be sold for a world record fee. But the club seemingly refuses to accept that they overspent on him.
The decisions of this club are a bit baffling on many levels tbf. It's just that this is a bit more surprising, given that (potential) money was involved. You would think Woodward and co would be more proactive.
But then again, this is the same club which keeps giving 3 year contract extensions to fringe players. They might just be too greedy. Have your cake and eat it too.
It is not a wrong opinion, it is an incomplete one
Just removing Pogba makes us worse, because he is quality (in his best games), but if we remove him AND replace him with somebody who fits us better, who is more consistent - we will be 100% better off. Which is why we should have sold him long ago and used the sales money, instead him leaving for free
I really think Juventus needs two Witsels more than a single Pogba, these days, so I would be surprised in the extreme to see him back in Turin next year, under the new tight chief financial offer and even on a free (aka: Raiola will not have the leverage he still thinks he has, because Agnelli’s spending power is on a diet).
I've never hidden my dislike for Pogba on this forum, personally I hold him in the same regard as Di Maria.
What I'm interested in knowing off people is what is Paul's best position?
I ask this because it's now 5 years and he's played nearly everywhere on the field other than the goalkeeper.
We've bought better players to play with him and he still isn't playing well.
Personally feel he plays for himself, he doesn't play for the team. He's greedy and overrates himself.
What I'm interested in knowing off people is what is Paul's best position?
I ask this because it's now 5 years and he's played nearly everywhere on the field other than the goalkeeper.
We've bought better players to play with him and he still isn't playing well.
Personally feel he plays for himself, he doesn't play for the team. He's greedy and overrates himself.
Nothing like leaking some stuff about Pogba to distract from the club’s failings, and people lap it up.
A handy excuse and a very useful distraction will be gone soon enough. I wonder who it will be next.
A handy excuse and a very useful distraction will be gone soon enough. I wonder who it will be next.
He is a CM and like most players he has strength and weaknesses. His best roles are the ones he has played for France and Juventus where he is an attacking box to box.
He's terrible in CM for United, he's actually a complete liability in the middle.
Whoever plays alongside him goes through hell as he struts around trying to pull off tricks in his own half and half arsing into tackles.
The red card on Sunday is most likely the most robust tackles he's done for United in the five years he's been with us.
I don't agree, I don't think he's a good CM.
So you don't think that he was good for Juventus or that he is good for France?
To be fair I won't lie and say I'd seen lots of games he played for Juve, I'm aware he did well there but he was younger with less of an ego and he was in a pretty special side.
In terms of France I do think think he plays well but I don't think he is expected to do the job he's required to do at United because of Kante and whoever else he has in their with him.
They allow for his luxury style performance which is something we can not.
Pogba has actually improved from his Juventus days and the ego on the field is only in your head. Pogba is simply a player with strength and weaknesses like the vast majority of players, they all need teammates that allow them to play their game that's why Kroos and Modric were a shadow of themselves when Casemiro or Valverde weren't around. While it's fair to make a case about Pogba not fitting United, it's pure lunacy to act as if he wasn't a good player or as if footballers can play any role, with any teammates without a difference in performances, if it was the case, Lampard and Gerrard would have made a great duo for England but we all know how it turned out.
It's not pure lunacy at all, he came with a world record transfer fee and now I'd say the vast majority of fans couldn't care less if he was here or not.
This basically speaks volumes.
I find it completely baffling there are still people like yourself defending him as a player.
But you see that's problem, you told me that you didn't watch him at Juventus when I did, that's why I said at the time that Pogba wasn't worth a world record fee and that he wasn't a good fit for what we have which is why I didn't want him at United. That's the difference between us, you are judging a player that you didn't know based on his fee, I'm judging him based on what he is and was, Pogba is a good midfielder/sometimes very good that is not worth a world record fee and he isn't a complete midfielder, so I'm not going to go around and expect him to be the new Roy Keane.
Why can’t we? Why the feck did we break our transfer record for a player we knew needed top level defensive cover in midfield in order to get the best from him and then partner him with one of McFred or Matic who’s legs had clearly gone?
He’s done if for Juve and he does it for France consistently. Regularly their best player in the most talented national side on earth. Fans are happy to lose that player because we think McFred is the way forward… think about that rationally for a moment.
People hate him because they naively expected him to be a one man midfield and have refused to acknowledge throughout his time here that whilst he is an elite talent he’s always needed top level defensive cover in midfield, especially in a high tempo league like this, and instead of acknowledging that and making the most on our investment in him we’ve claimed he’s shite becuase he doesn’t win us the league when we throw him on the pitch with the likes of Scott and Fred.
I’ve had dozens of conversations here where people have claimed he’s rubbish becuase we need to improve his partners to get the most from him. But we do, we did when he arrived and we still do, other than Paul our midfield is levels below the rest of the squad and it will be the very first thing the new manager will look to address, I guarantee it.
Exactly, Pogba wasn't a good fit for the midfield that we had in 2016 particularly when Mourinho added Mkhitaryan in a 4231, that decision is on the club particularly when you spend a world record fee on a player. But beyond that it's baffling that people watch the team get thumped by Liverpool with McFred and still talk about Pogbanot being good enough, these two can't support anyone in our current system.
Totally agree. The moment we bought him I expected additions to be brought in to make if work and it could have been brilliant.
We’ve done nothing to get the best on our investment and for that reason I don’t chose to blame the player because instead of playing to his strengths it’s like we’ve purposely gone about trying to play to his weaknesses.
When he goes and we have McFred serving up what they have so far this season it will just be another step backwards. Yet some can’t wait.
I said it at the time and @kouroux said the same thing, the press is partially responsible for that they used to hype him as the best all-round midfielder in the world when he wasn't the best all-round midfielder at Juventus both Vidal and Marchisio were better in that department, Pogba was the best creative CM and a unique player in terms of profile. One of my suspicion is that United didn't scout him properly which is a bit of a frightening idea.
I'm not only judging based on fee but obviously he has to be part judged on that because it was the world record fee at that time.
I judge him on what he gives on the field for United and for me that's seriously lacking. I believe the negatives far outweigh the positives and given his profile and fee you'd have expected far more of a complete player.
I also never expected a Roy Keane either but I did at least expect a player that could play in a midfield two and dominate games with his ability and size.
Instead we have a player losing the ball all over the field and making key mistakes throughout each season he's been with us.
Long and short I think he's one of the most overrated played in distant memory.
Exactly that. One of the most outspoken footballers in recent memory and the one thing you need to be doing when being outspoken and demanding. You need to be performing week in, week out.
He doesn't do that.
I don't buy this theory we haven't bought players to assist him, Fernandes was supposed to take away the burden of being our main creative player and yet he still performed average.
Matic was far from finished when we first signed him also.
Mcfred isn't the answer we all know that but we won't be seeing that combo beyond this season I'm sure.
Of course you are, you didn't watch him at Juventus otherwise you would have known that the club overpaid and wouldn't bring the expectations of a world record. Be consistent with your own words.
Indeed it speaks volume, it tells me that you have and still have no clue. Him being overrated is a fact that I shared in 2016 before the transfer happened and it doesn't mean that he isn't a good player.
I judge how I see it and I see a player that is lacking. I'm not alone either.
Let's end it there as I've no interest the debate being reduced to petty insults which you seem happy to engage in..
Of course he is lacking like almost all players that's why all teams try to bring complementary players and of course you are not alone but that doesn't mean that a player isn't good or wasn't good. Pogba who was good at Juventus wasn't more complete than he is today. Kroos is lacking in certain areas but he is still pretty good, adding Casemiro makes him better, try to play Silva and De Bruyne without prime Fernandinho and we will have a laugh because the former two aren't particularly good on the defensive side of things.
And I didn't insult you.
Bruno wasn’t supposed to take away the creative burden, but the fact you mention that shows that when he’s not performing anywhere near as good as he can he was still our most creative player before Bruno.
Matic was the right player at the wrong age, his legs went about 6 months after we bought him, that initial period also unsurprisingly coincided with Paul being great alongside him.
Paul has always been lively and outspoken, he’s a World Cup winner and will go on to be great elsewhere in teams that are willing to accommodate him, as he does now and has always done elsewhere.
This came out of nowhere
I agree, I like the guy but he does need a new challenge. He’s just not that great a footballer despite his talent.
So you being called out on your bs is now petty insult? Enlightening!!
Bullshit?
I don't rate Pogba, I think he is massively overrated. What's to be called out on.
It's called an opinion.
Claimed I haven't got a clue when in reality I was happy to debate opinions without questioning his knowledge.This came out of nowhere
It may have been a slight overeation on my part but it annoyed me at the time.
One thing I'll always find interesting is, in a midfield where there is Fred, McTominay, Matic, and Pogba, some are focused on Pogba as the priority to make an upgrade on. I do think most of the critics of Pogba I've seen here have often added a caveat that he'd probably shine elsewhere, but it won't be here so no big loss, but that is such a strange way of rationalizing bringing back a player for a world-record fee and now facing the prospect of letting him go, for a second time, for nothing. If Pogba can (and has) shined on other teams, then it's unacceptable that it can't happen here, and it's ignoring what the role of a manager has to be and putting the blame mainly on the player.
Contrary to what many want to believe, Pogba loves Manchester United, and I think he would love to stay here. It's not easy to find players who love a club nowadays, and even less so a player as talented as Pogba. Pogba has flaws, he dawdles on the ball too much with a lack of concentration, he's not a very good defensive player, but every player has flaws, and with the right mix of players, and the right coaching, you can mitigate/iron out those flaws and enhance the positives, which get forgotten too often with a player like Pogba, one of the most misrepresented player that I've ever seen at any club.
I am just not seeing, whether it's Mourinho or Ole, players making improvements tactically. I don't see special work being put with Pogba or anyone else to improve them, but there are managers out there that actually can do that for players. They will even bench someone until they figure out exactly what's needed of them and won't play until it's done, and players adapt and improve to reflect their coach's philosophy. Klopp and Guardiola are the two obvious examples, but it's within the reach of any decent manager. But that's never been United's MO in recent times, players are guaranteed starters regardless of their form and if they do get benched as Pogba has recently, it's not to improve them behind the scenes so they can get back on the field with a better idea and tools to execute, it's just because the manager is clueless on how to resolve the situation, clueless about a great many things to be blunt as we can see he has no idea what to do with expensive assets like VdB and Sancho either. You only need to look not just at the coach, but his coaching staff to understand why this is happening. They're all clueless and have little to no credentials in the game of football. United needs an elite coaching staff from the top down, and without that, you can replace Pogba with whoever you want, this team will remain stuck in purgatory.
Contrary to what many want to believe, Pogba loves Manchester United, and I think he would love to stay here. It's not easy to find players who love a club nowadays, and even less so a player as talented as Pogba. Pogba has flaws, he dawdles on the ball too much with a lack of concentration, he's not a very good defensive player, but every player has flaws, and with the right mix of players, and the right coaching, you can mitigate/iron out those flaws and enhance the positives, which get forgotten too often with a player like Pogba, one of the most misrepresented player that I've ever seen at any club.
I am just not seeing, whether it's Mourinho or Ole, players making improvements tactically. I don't see special work being put with Pogba or anyone else to improve them, but there are managers out there that actually can do that for players. They will even bench someone until they figure out exactly what's needed of them and won't play until it's done, and players adapt and improve to reflect their coach's philosophy. Klopp and Guardiola are the two obvious examples, but it's within the reach of any decent manager. But that's never been United's MO in recent times, players are guaranteed starters regardless of their form and if they do get benched as Pogba has recently, it's not to improve them behind the scenes so they can get back on the field with a better idea and tools to execute, it's just because the manager is clueless on how to resolve the situation, clueless about a great many things to be blunt as we can see he has no idea what to do with expensive assets like VdB and Sancho either. You only need to look not just at the coach, but his coaching staff to understand why this is happening. They're all clueless and have little to no credentials in the game of football. United needs an elite coaching staff from the top down, and without that, you can replace Pogba with whoever you want, this team will remain stuck in purgatory.
Not going to be surprised if we have threads like this on our other star players in the future. If they are truly ambitious, they'll only accept this mediocrity for so long.
Btw I think it's a win win scenario for both parties here. At least for the long term. We'll get to build our midfield without the complexity of adding him in, and he might get to go to Madrid or PSG and win things. He's 29 after all, got a couple more years at the top.
Btw I think it's a win win scenario for both parties here. At least for the long term. We'll get to build our midfield without the complexity of adding him in, and he might get to go to Madrid or PSG and win things. He's 29 after all, got a couple more years at the top.
He should have handed in transfer request, if he really wanted out. Short career, etc. and i don't doubt he'd make more money (while winning more trophies) if only he moved out 2 seasons ago.